In the Q&A Steve was asked this and he said the Apple Store return rate was lower than AT&Ts.
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
0.55% figure misleading
- Thread starter Bodhi395
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
In the Q&A Steve was asked this and he said the Apple Store return rate was lower than AT&Ts.
Fair enough, but I'd think the return line at the Apple store would be much, much longer if it were a defect across the board.
Or it'd be unaffected because people now realize there was no defect in the first place, just a bad batch of phones.
Did you pull that out of your a$$?
A lot of people did not call Apple Care because they considered the antenna issue a non-issue, like me.
I put the phone in a case within an hour of getting it and had to take it out to test for the dropped bars. Therefore I solved my issue myself when I put the phone back in its case.
The number of people out there who are as intelligent as me, and fixed their phone this way, is astronomical while the number of people who sit around and whine on a forum about a non-issue is quite small in comparison.
I put the phone in a case within an hour of getting it and had to take it out to test for the dropped bars. Therefore I solved my issue myself when I put the phone back in its case.
The number of people out there who are as intelligent as me, and fixed their phone this way, is astronomical while the number of people who sit around and whine on a forum about a non-issue is quite small in comparison.
Someone may have said this already, didn't read the entire thread, but:
With the numbers they gave, the return only encompassed AT&T's return rate, and their was not mention of Apple's. There are multiple ways to view that selection of data.
I agree with what others said about not bothering to call about it (as I was in that very same boat) because of reading about it online, and knowing that it was going to be addressed. Perhaps that was a mistake, perhaps not. Either way, I'm sure it isn't quite over, and that there will be at least one more uproar lol.
With the numbers they gave, the return only encompassed AT&T's return rate, and their was not mention of Apple's. There are multiple ways to view that selection of data.
I agree with what others said about not bothering to call about it (as I was in that very same boat) because of reading about it online, and knowing that it was going to be addressed. Perhaps that was a mistake, perhaps not. Either way, I'm sure it isn't quite over, and that there will be at least one more uproar lol.
That's not consistent with what's written on the keynote slide "Percent of all iPhone 4 users who have called about antenna or reception."
Watch the presentation again. At 14:52, steve says.... "Whats the percent of all iPhone 4 users who have called Applecare about issues relating to anything about the antenna or reception or anything even near about the antenna or reception."
I'd say regardless of whatever you factor in, it's probably accurate. That is .55% of anyone calling with signal/antenna issues. If you factor in people who drop one or two calls and call in, its probably flush with people who never bother to call. In the end, I don't think the number is misleading.
I know 22 people here in Vegas that purchased iPhone 4's in the first 3 days of availability (mine was delivered on the 23rd and I still have it and all the problems associated with it; iOS 4.0.1 is useless). Of those 22 people, 17 had the same or similar issues that I and the people reporting problems have (reception, antenna issues, some had the green tint thing, several had the yellow spots thing, etc).
Of those 17 that reported issues, 16 of them returned their phones and got replacements. The 17th decided to stick it out till the "fix" but has since changed his mind, especially after today's "press conference" aka "we throw a lot of statistics at consumers who we're confident are too stupid to understand them but they'll give us the benefit of the doubt anyway". But, he returned his about 2 hours ago and bought a Droid X.
Anyway... of those 16 that got replacements, only 1 of them still owns an iPhone 4 - the replacement he got hasn't caused him any problems at all so he's "happy" with it.
15 of those iPhone 4 owners tried replacements and were not satisfied with the replacement units and have since returned them outright and now own other products by other companies. A few EVOs, a few Droids, one Nexus One that I know of, two HD2s, and I think one or two got Droid X's yesterday. 15 of those iPhone 4 owners said "Ok, enough with this BS, we need something that works, reliably, 24/7, and the iPhone 4 simply isn't it for us."
So of the 23 that I know of (myself and 22 others), 18 of us have had issues, 2 of us still own our phones (even in spite of mine being basically an iPod touch 4 SuperMegaHella Edition), and those 15 now own phones from the "competition."
Basically 66% of this small sample group have moved on to better products - and yes, since they work far more reliably they are by definition "better products," like it or not.
Spin that, Apple...
Of those 17 that reported issues, 16 of them returned their phones and got replacements. The 17th decided to stick it out till the "fix" but has since changed his mind, especially after today's "press conference" aka "we throw a lot of statistics at consumers who we're confident are too stupid to understand them but they'll give us the benefit of the doubt anyway". But, he returned his about 2 hours ago and bought a Droid X.
Anyway... of those 16 that got replacements, only 1 of them still owns an iPhone 4 - the replacement he got hasn't caused him any problems at all so he's "happy" with it.
15 of those iPhone 4 owners tried replacements and were not satisfied with the replacement units and have since returned them outright and now own other products by other companies. A few EVOs, a few Droids, one Nexus One that I know of, two HD2s, and I think one or two got Droid X's yesterday. 15 of those iPhone 4 owners said "Ok, enough with this BS, we need something that works, reliably, 24/7, and the iPhone 4 simply isn't it for us."
So of the 23 that I know of (myself and 22 others), 18 of us have had issues, 2 of us still own our phones (even in spite of mine being basically an iPod touch 4 SuperMegaHella Edition), and those 15 now own phones from the "competition."
Basically 66% of this small sample group have moved on to better products - and yes, since they work far more reliably they are by definition "better products," like it or not.
Spin that, Apple...
I just to know one thing: 0.55% of people complaining in what period of time ? for all I know their surveys would have been based on the number of complaints per hour..
That's different from "What's the percent of all iPhone users calling Applecare who have complained about issues relating to anything about the antenna or reception or anything even near about the antenna or reception." Don't you think?
Let me guess, you all live in the same area with poor at&t reception? I take it they're mostly new iPhone users if 66% of them now own phones from the competition rather than go back to their reliable 3G/3GS with loads of apps that they've purchased.
Posting issues to others doesn't help.
To all those that have issues and didn't call, shame on you. Were you waiting for Apple to call you? What a joke.
We all live in Las Vegas and Henderson, NV, and AT&T has this entire metropolitan area blanketed with coverage - the issue isn't with AT&T, it's with Apple's defective phones. I live almost throwing distance from the primary cell site covering the entire downtown Vegas area and vicinity, line-of-sight of it, no obstructions, doesn't help me at all when I've got the phone in my hand...
As for the iPhone 3GS, 5 of them did own those but they sold them to get the money together for the iPhone 4... didn't work out quite as well as they'd planned, it seems.
Sorry, nice try.
Hard Data trumps personal/anecdotal experience.
So I guess you fall in that 0.55% now?
Why is Apple instantly taken at their word when they spew out statistics, as if it's some higher truth?
Microsoft or anyone else (for example) saying such things would get called to the carpet instantly over it, accused of making bloated exaggerations of facts, etc, but Apple?
Man, the Kool-Aid River runs deep...
So that is 66% less people that you know that are going to stop complaining about the iPhone 4 and start complaining about their Android devices.
It could be anything from stolen personal data because they loaded an app that contained a virus, to the new DroidX feature that will disable your phone if you load an non official bios to the EVO with their screens that are peeling off on the bottom of the Phone, to the crappy battery life and how they always have to keep their droid phones plugged in to recharge them a couple times a day.
It could be anything from stolen personal data because they loaded an app that contained a virus, to the new DroidX feature that will disable your phone if you load an non official bios to the EVO with their screens that are peeling off on the bottom of the Phone, to the crappy battery life and how they always have to keep their droid phones plugged in to recharge them a couple times a day.
Do you or anyone else have any other numbers that can be used to prove they are wrong ?
But at least they can call someone who cares because their phones actually work as phones...
Yeah, the earth... it was flat once till people learned better. Same principle. Just saying something doesn't make it true, not even when the great Steve Jobs spews it direct from his lips...
Reading all these responses, I draw some (unscientific) conclusions:
1) people suck at maths and have no problem flaunting their ignorance
2) if one has made up his/her mind, no amount of data will change their minds
3) people don't understand that anecdotes cannot be generalized
4) if you are a conspiracy theorist/or disenfranchised you shout/post louder/more than rational/happy people
5) the media, in fact humans in general, love a good toppling from the pedestal story and will attack like pirañas
6) the iPhone 4's biggest problem for me:
It has ruined my enjoyment of the MacRumors forum
1) people suck at maths and have no problem flaunting their ignorance
2) if one has made up his/her mind, no amount of data will change their minds
3) people don't understand that anecdotes cannot be generalized
4) if you are a conspiracy theorist/or disenfranchised you shout/post louder/more than rational/happy people
5) the media, in fact humans in general, love a good toppling from the pedestal story and will attack like pirañas
6) the iPhone 4's biggest problem for me:
It has ruined my enjoyment of the MacRumors forum
The best post in this thread.
I dont know about MacRumors, but it has definitely ruined the iPhone forums.
Probably should have read the thread then. Might have saved you from posting. Steve was asked that question in the Q&A and said the Apple return rates were LOWER than AT&T. So you want to blame them for cherry picking data, yet they picked the worst data. How do you explain that in your conspiracy theory?
I already mentioned anyone who claims to have had a broken phone and did not call support is stupid... so take that how you want.
You know you are proving you are wrong right? Everyone who disagrees with you agrees with the above statement. Your comments previously do not agree with that. Notice you are leaving out a comma or two, and that changes everything. "What's the percent of all iPhone 4 users, who have called Applecare, about issues relating to anything about the antenna..."
If it read like you keep trying to make it sound, it would mean even less people have problems with the iPhone 4. Essentially it would mean nobody had a problem.
If .55 percent of ALL Applecare calls about the iPhone 4 were antenna related it would mean essentially nobody had called Apple with a problem about the iPhone 4 antenna. I won't argue that, but that is not what they said. Just understand by taking the position you are taking you take the number down from like 16500 to probably a couple hundred or even less.
They are saying .55% of ALL iPhone 4 owners have called and logged an issue that was related to the antenna in some way shape or form. What time frame? From the day they existed until now.
Unfortunately, I still see differences even in the area that at&t labels "good" and "excellent." Some are way better and others pretty much useless, so much that you'd think it's "moderate" or "no service available." And I live in the LA area.
So that's 5 out of 22 who were existing iPhone users? That's a lot of new people trying out the iP4. No different from the many people who had to return the original iPhone because they found it unusable with at&t.