Adobe and Avid Target Final Cut Pro Users With 'Switcher' Discounts

[phpmaven]

Be really interesting over the rest of the year to see how Apple fairs in the professional video arena, looks like their market share is set to drop considerably... I believe it was about 45-50% of the pro editing market...

I doubt it will be that big of a deal. There are always a minority who make a lot of noise about things and you would think that a product is doomed if you just focused on the negative comments. I'm sure Apple will address the shortcomings in the months ahead and people will then be singing their praises. They might lose a few users, but I don't think there will be that many people who will jump ship to the competition. Those that do were probably already thinking about switching.

I think that the average FCP user will adopt a "wait-and-see" attitude. With the negative press swirling, you can bet that Steve and CO will put put a priority on fixing the shortcomings. Not that they will make every pro happy, but I think most will come on board.

 

[Rodimus Prime]

They allow you to do all the other things FCPX is missing today, and allow you to buy additional licences, unlike FCP7, so if you're in any kind of business at all where you need that flexibility they still remotely work.

Very clever move from both companies. I suspect FCPX's marketshare will collapse.

Phazer

I think it is more that Final cut market share in the pro world will collapse. FCPX will get a lot of sells to prosurmers and people who want to play around with it but lets face it Apple is leaving the pro market.

 

[tbrinkma]

Sorry, I'm just a bit confused at this point. Wasn't Rosetta supposed to use Carbon libraries? And Lion would have drop those and that is the reason why FCPX has been rewritten in Cocoa and also take advantage of 64bit and GCD and such?

No, but you're close. Rosetta used *PPC* libraries, and Lion has dropped those. FCPX was rewritten (in Cocoa) to take advantage of new features that don't exist in PPC versions of OS X, like GCD and such.

 

[handsome pete]

If FCP 7 keeps working and they like it then many won't change anything for now.

That's the problem. FCP7 does still work, but its progress has been pretty stagnant over the past several years while competitors have grown leaps and bounds. A lot of people were expecting this update to take FCP to a new level and not only catch up, but to surpass the others. In some ways it has. But it's simply not suitable in its current state for the professional broadcast market. Because of that, this release has unveiled the suggestion that Apple is now solely focusing on the prosumer/consumer customer. That's all fine and good, but since FCP7 was getting pretty old in the tooth anyway, it's time for a lot of studios to map out their upgrade path. As of now, FCPX won't cut it and Apple has left doubts as to if it ever will. So while no one was ever going to just switch overnight, this release has given a lot of people reason to shift their plans to Adobe or Avid. And now both companies have given them even more incentive.

So, you are asking me to switch for $1000 which includes the 50% discount and in the future will be paying over $1000 for upgrades when Final Cut Pro costs $300 and Apple has stated they will have updates to bring back the missing functions.
Where is the logic in that?

The FAQ Apple published was a joke. It was all workarounds and claims that things will be coming. But a lot of that might just be through 3rd party support. So despite the little bit of information Apple has put out there, there is still too much unknown.

Exactly, the only real issue is that you can't legally get more copies of FCP 7 if you need to expand. Apple should really address that issue and then probably everything would be just fine unless FCP X never gets new features.

There are still vendors out there that can get you FCP7. We just added 2 seats this past week.

When a Pro video application does not support an EDL or an external broadcast monitor, you have a tool that cannot be used in a professional workflow. It does not take more than 15 minutes to realize that.

Few pros "jumped" as you say.. they are simply dismayed that they will be forced to leave an EOL product for a competitor.

Precisely. Even if there are no immediate plans to jump ship, these discounts from Adobe and Avid are enough where some might just purchase anyway to have another tool in their arsenal. And that alone will make any transition easier once the future of FCP is more fleshed out.

 

[*LTD*]

It doesn't seem that FCPX sucks enough to get users to switch en masse. There are some users that appear to *want* to use it and are trying to find reasons to just stick with it. It's interesting.

Then again, I'm not a Pro (when it comes to video editing, that is) so I really can't comment on features and what's lacking.

However, consumers and prosumers are very well served by all this, that's for sure. It does seem that Apple is bringing previously or currently "Pro" tools into the consumer realm as if to say "here, you can be a star, too." No one else seems to care to do this but Apple. It's an absolutely brilliant move and the advantages certainly outweigh the disadvantages, but it does come with a little bit of sacrifice, sadly: the top-end of the Pro market.

EDIT:

That's right folks, keep voting this down. The truth can be frightening. It's perfectly understandable.

 

[NAG]

I don't understand the people who switch over to a new program so quickly (FCP X or Premiere). Heck, you should even be careful when upgrading versions of Microsoft Office.

 

[till213]

Can the Adobe solution import FCP7 files? If it can't what is the point?

I am not a pro (FCP user), but to my understanding FCP can export to XML and Premiere can import this (maybe with some loss, e.g. "plugin compatibility")?

 

[AaronEdwards]

I think being able to slash 50% off your original selling price really says something about just how much you (over)value your product.

It says a lot about how many Adobe would prefer that former FCP users chose them and not Avid, and vice versa.

Both companies know that FCP users are going to jump ship, get them now and they will hopefully stay for years. I mean they have been very faithful to Apple despite the current history of FCP.

 

[reel2reel]

Screw Avid.

I've never ever seen a compelling reason to suffer through their software. I'd rather go to Adobe or even Sony's NLE before giving Avid a penny of my hard-earned money.

Apple's gonna come through, though.

 

[vartanarsen]

Can someone please tell me, in laymans terms and in a nutshell, what the difference is between iMovie (free with mac) and Final Cut Pro?

 

[ryanw]

I think your post is spot-on and, in my opinion, a good number of the people making a huge stink about FCPX are coming out of the woodshed just to complain. Not all of them...but most.

It's amazing to me to see a product, not even one day old!, get shunned off by "every pro who has kept Apple afloat". I really want to question what the hell these "pros" are doing moving from a version of software that has been several years solidified to a day-one release. Lot of bandwagon jumpers, me thinks.

Really? It doesn't seem that hard to understand. FCP7 is no longer for sale. There are no more upgrade cycles to it. It's not being maintained for even a minute longer. Apple has deemed it DEAD, unable to purchase, the only thing legally available to load for a new user is FCPX.

FCPX is NOT an upgrade to FCP7. It's an entirely new product. Apple should maintaine support and update codecs in "Final Cut Pro" in tandem with this new product line FCPX until it is ready to be "PRO".

PRO Users are NOT consumers. Consumers flock to whatever the latest and greatest hot now thing is. PROs have take years of building up their work streams and building entire shops built around FCP. Any shop editing with legacy software will slowly but surely die a horrible death. It is important to be at the cusp of the cutting edge when working in the trenches in the pro circles. The shop would be dead in the water if the producers move to the new camera XYZ but the workflow is 10x slower because the codec isn't supported by he legacy software....

PROs have been knee jerked around by apple all these years and taken it. Thrown around between different processors having to buy all new plugins and upgrade whem perhaps they might not have had to upgrade "everything". Apple got rid of Shake, tons of pros knew shake and owned shake and wanted to continue to use shake, but just got thrown away. And now they're seeing that they are completely at the mercy of apple with their #1 software (Final Cut Pro) that they use on a daily basis. Apple could all of a sudden decide to just axe FCPX all together and stick with iMovie. Will that happen? Apparently it depends on what side of the bed Steve wakes up that morning.

Any "RATIONAL SOFTWARE COMPANY" would sell software and maintain software as long as it's in demand. If the general community wants specific features, they will work towards implementing those features. Apple is not a rational software company. They're a forerunner, forward thinking company. Great! Awesome! Amazing! But when working with Pro's, they need to handle things a little differently. "Think Different" Apple! Don't treat your pros like consumers. They will flock in droves to a more secure environment if they're afraid of loosing all their time invested in learning and integrating a software into their workstream. It's not that easy to just flip and switch to new stuff. No matter how much better it is, the professional world needs options and a transition period.

 

[israelagm]

"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex... It takes a touch of genius - and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction."

- Albert Einstein

 

[rmwebs]

I think being able to slash 50% off your original selling price really says something about just how much you (over)value your product.

Yeah sure....just like how OS X dropped from $120 to $25 when Snow Leopard was released.

 

[nerdo]

Avid Mediacomposer 5.5 crossgrade: check
Adobe Prodution suite premium CS5.5 upgrade: check
Apple Final Cut X appstore impulse buy: Check

Riiight, guess now I need to shoot something I can edit in all three and see what fits my way of working best....

Let me whip out the 5D, 7D, LX3, iPhone and TZ20 and see how we can get this "modern" workflow to break.

Any ideas?

 

[AaronEdwards]

For Premiere 7 (aka CS1) they dropped Mac support, blaming the presence of FCP being too much competition for them. I believe Macs got OS X support with CS3, four years later. So yeah, no company is a saint here.

Major difference here is that Adobe dropped support for Mac, Premiere users who needed the software could move to Windows. Adobe crippling Premiere for every OS would have been comparable to what Apple has done to FCP.

 

[AaronEdwards]

I'm in no position to judge any of it.

I just wonder why the pros now "have to" update (to FCPX or to Adobe or Avid). Just for the sake of it and boredom? Doesn't FCP 7 do it anymore?

Why all this?

FCP 7 has been lacking a big update for a while. Then came FCPX. The writing is on the wall, there's no reason for staying with software that is dead.

 

[reel2reel]

Amongst all the outrage about missing FCP 7 import is childish complaints from Pros who refuse to learn the FCPX UI. Don't expect to believe these bunch of egomaniacs have no issues with learning new software.


Apple spent years to re-architect FCPX so they can actually provide cutting edge performance for years to come, and enabling faster and more productive editing sessions, and this is "plain and simple" that Apple is not interested in their line of professional tools?

In a year or two, nobody's going to care. The whiners here are right to be upset that they can't have the new features today, but to shout "Apple doesn't care about us anymore, Boo hoo!" is ridiculous. The missing features will come back, whether from Apple or a third party plugin.

And if third party plugins aren't good enough, well tough. Pro video editing is already a niche market. Expecting Apple to support one small subsection of a niche is silly. Wouldn't you rather Apple concentrate on the core editing features rather than import and export features that only a small section of the market uses? That's a perfect opportunity for third parties. Not everyone needs the same set of features. No you can use FCPX and buy a set of plugins you need, and another editor can buy a different set of plugins, freeing Apple's development resources up to concentrate on the core functionality. Apple even reduced the price so you'll be able to afford to buy the third party plugins you need.

This is another case of the vocal minority getting their say. I'd wager that most FCP users are not upset, it's just that their opinion doesn't make headlines, because that's not controversial or exciting.

Ah man, five paragraphs of nonsense. Nothing you've said has any bearing on reality.

Do everyone a favour....if you're going to rant on about something you know nothing about, at least read what's come before and educate yourself a bit. You're missing every point and making a big stink about issues that don't even exist.

 

[ericmooreart]

The most compelling reason for my company to switch to Premiere is we already have a site license for 100+ (Production Suite) seats.

And...

Adobe is so much more reliable then Apple

 

[Consultant]

I don't understand the people who switch over to a new program so quickly (FCP X or Premiere). Heck, you should even be careful when upgrading versions of Microsoft Office.

Exactly. Final Cut Studio 3 and FCP 7 won't stop working.

 

[AaronEdwards]

I suspect that most people here spewing hyperbole don't understand the term "vocal minority."

Professional FCP users are a minority in the way that they will not just take what Apple is doing sitting down, they will not just applaud Apple and praise about how they are changing how we do things.
And yes, they are vocal about it.

They aren't sheeple.

 

[igazza]

...and there goes another one of Apple's pro products. What's left now? They've only got Logic Pro to **** up and they are totally an average-joe based company.

I doubt logic will even get updated. apple probably make more money selling garageband for ipad.

 

[Popeye206]

I think it is more that Final cut market share in the pro world will collapse. FCPX will get a lot of sells to prosurmers and people who want to play around with it but lets face it Apple is leaving the pro market.

Disagree. Their statement earlier this week shows this. They obviously were under a development deadline and had to make cuts to hit their release date.

FCPX was a huge change from what I can see, and because of that, had to take a step backwards for a bit.

I don't think they're out... just regrouping on new code.

 

[winston1236]

I don't understand the people who switch over to a new program so quickly (FCP X or Premiere). Heck, you should even be careful when upgrading versions of Microsoft Office.

yea remember when they took away the toolbar and nobody could find anything

 

[skellener]

Funny, this is exactly how I started using Final Cut.

I don't remember the details, but I think it had to do with the OS9 - OSX switch and Apple offered steep discounts for the new Final Cut if you turned in your Adobe Premiere disks to them.

I don't remember the exact reason...maybe Adobe was being slow to adapt to OSX?...but I took the offer and have been on Final Cut ever since through many versions.

So...I guess this kind of thing does work.

I did the same thing. Sent in my old Premier CD to Apple and got Final Cut Express (for free I believe). I think I only upgraded once to FCX4. Still works fine. I'm not going to tape or anything. Still looking at FCPX. I think for me it would be fine. For the Pros who need the things Apple left out/weren't ready, they should either stick with FCP7 and wait and see how FCPX shapes up, or have a look at one of these new switcher options.

 

[handsome pete]

That's right folks, keep voting this down. The truth can be frightening. It's perfectly understandable.

Hilarious. I thought I even made a coherent and objective statement and saw that I had a negative vote. I'm wondering what point the voting serves. Seems like people just like to troll the boards and vote down any opposite opinion.

"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex... It takes a touch of genius - and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction."

- Albert Einstein

Great quote, but it doesn't apply here.

There's nothing genius about stripping away necessary tools without providing an alternative to get things done. That's stupidity.

Exactly. Final Cut Studio 3 and FCP 7 won't stop working.

Again, that's not the point. FCP7 was getting old already. It still works, but many were already planning out their upgrade road map. FCPX would have been the logical next step. That's not an option in its current state, and it might not be 6 months to a year from now. So now people have to strongly consider alternate options.