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I guess they have that reputation but it isn't always true. iOS 7 is a direct result of competing with Android. And the things Apple wants to do with TV are probably impossible because the studios have all the power. So in the end it will be difficult to be a major game changer in the TV space. That is probably what is taking them so long to update Apple TV (just can't release what they want).

Ok I know that was a blanket statement and people can come up with things Apple lifted from competitors. But in the broadest sense my point still stands. If Apple was all about following the competition they'd be selling a large screen iPhone and a touch screen MacBook *right now*. Apple beats to its own drum and basically does things on its own timetable. In my twitter feed I saw a tweet from someone who said they don't want another box, they want the box they have to give them the content they want. That's why I'm guessing the delays in ATV updates are due to content negotiations and Apple wanting something "killer" for when they do announce.

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It will need worldwide content for it to be another game changer.

What worldwide content does Amazon's box have?
 
I think the article headline is post bait. Since no one knows what Apple is really doing with their Apple TV, Amazon released a product and Apple TV will likely be similar to Amazon's.

Give credit to Amazon. It's highly likely this has been in the works for longer than the rumors speculating what Apple TV would be (especially since so many pegged it as an actual TV). Further - what Amazon did is not revolutionary. They simply expanded on the idea of a streaming box by enabling gaming as well + voice search. It's an extension of Google TV. Amazon-style.

I'd give more credit to Apple TV users who have been begging for apps to come to the TV. Apple wasn't delivering that to customers (yet) - Amazon has.

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Ok I know that was a blanket statement and people can come up with things Apple lifted from competitors. But in the broadest sense my point still stands. If Apple was all about following the competition they'd be selling a large screen iPhone and a touch screen MacBook *right now*. Apple beats to its own drum and basically does things on its own timetable. In my twitter feed I saw a tweet from someone who said they don't want another box, they want the box they have to give them the content they want. That's why I'm guessing the delays in ATV updates are due to content negotiations and Apple wanting something "killer" for when they do announce.

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What worldwide content does Amazon's box have?

It's a matter of guesswork and semantics to say that Apple follows their own timetable vs follows the market. All companies have a timetable they, themselves follow. Some are faster than others. Some are reactionary vs proactive. And Apple did increase its phone size. And is likely to do so again shortly.

Second - I don't believe the previous poster mentioned Amazon as having worldwide content. But more importantly - he didn't say Amazon's box was a game changer. He said Apple's new box will need "worldwide content for it to be another game changer."
 
The average Apple user. I don't think there is such a thing and even if there is, since when has it been a metric for creating an app?

Plex (as far as I remember) started as an OS X app and that's where they built their audience. They slowly added other platforms but the early adopters and power users were OS X users.

Possibly, Plex isn't something the 'average' Apple user would use, but I think the average Plex user may well be an Apple user.

As for the fire, it's a nice device. I run an old Mac Mini in my bedroom, primarily for Plex alongside my Apple TV. I'd consider picking up a Fire when it gets a UK release and selling my Mini.

Totally agree. When I first started using PLEX it only ran on Apple platform.

IT is really quite remiss of Apple that the Plex Client runs on the Iphone and Ipad but is not natively supported on the Apple TV. It is also a joke that after so many years they still do not support Iplayer and ITV player.

Personally, I no longer use Apple TV or any other external Box. I have a Smart TV that Supports all the apps I need including Plex and more recently DSVideo which connects directly to my NAS it also supports most of the video streaming services. It is well supported with its own app store.
 
Set top boxes like ATV, the new Amazon, Chromecast, and Roku have a few basic areas of things they want to do:

1. Video from services like Netflix, Hulu, You Tube, etc
2. Purchased video from services like iTunes, Amazon, and others
3. Games
4. Actual live content TV like CNN, ABC, NBC, CBS, FOX, etc.
5. DVR capability

All of them do 1, which is also supported by many modern TVs without anything extra added. Most of them do 2, which is also supported by TVs as well.

3 is a new area that Amazon is taking on. So far no one is really doing 4 or 5 yet… Content is the key for 4 and 5, which rumor has Apple working towards.

The key is where is the $. No one is going to get rich selling a $100 box. I suspect Apple and Amazon expect to make $ through 2 and 3 (for Amazon).

The real $ is likely in 4, where the provider takes a cut of the monthly subscription fee. If Apple were to get 30%, their standard take today, that’s in the range of $10 a month forever. That adds up to real money.

The fly in the ointment for 4 is ISP data caps. Those that do all their TV over the web will see their monthly data usage soar…right into the range of data caps for their ISP. They will get letters and requests to upgrade their Internet for the increased data usage. That’s a real issue for many.
 
If this Fire TV can run Stock Android, I'm in.

I primarily want to use it as DLNA streamer. If android is available, I definitely will use it as Thin Client.

Now just thinking how to make Amazon to ship it to here.
 
Because we literally "HAVE" to buy the damn thing. I have 200 digital copy movies that I can only watch on the stupid Apple TV. So I was forced to purchase 2 of them - even though I think the streaming sucks on it. If there was a way to view it through other devices I certainly would have one. And don't even get started on Airplay - it SUCKS and is USELESS for me.

I think the nice little app "Beamer" is a good investment for you. I've bought it and it works flawlessly for most popular video containers. http://beamer-app.com/
 
Nice little box. It really shows that Apple TV either has fallen behind or lacked real attention by Apple.

Apple's been adding content left and right, to the point where the once-simple interface is now a cluttered mess of icons. I wouldn't say they haven't been giving it attention, it's just that the real "meat" behind the apple TV (or any streaming box) is content, not so much the hardware.

The FireTV looks really good, and has some stuff that's missing in the AppleTV: Amazon instant video, PLEX support being the top 2 for me.

But, AppleTV has Airplay, HBOGO, and iCloud Photostream. Amazon could add HBOGO in the future but it's missing now. I'm using iTunes Home sharing but I'd rather be using Plex media server.


The controller is a non-issue because I can use the Remote app on my iPhone and search using the virtual keyboard.

So, while the FireTV has better hardware, feature-wise it seems kind of a wash.
 
Apple is definitely just kicking back seeing their competitors release all these products, while I'm sure the competitors are just as scared for when Apple announces a keynote event and readys to impress everyone.

This Fire TV from Amazon can essentially be a software update from Apple.

Theres a reason why Apple has remained quiet in recent times concerning this space...

It's because they're preparing to strike.


Can't wait for the new Apple TV. :D
I disagree. I don't personally believe that Apple has "struck" in years. The exception perhaps could be the new MP but even that so-called strike has been priced well above what it should have been priced at.

Either way, this Fire TV looks like a pretty nice device.
 
bird in the hand vs. two in the bush

When it's Apple vaporware vs. some hot release like this, the overwhelming spin is "just wait" (for Apple's version).

When it's the other way around, we'll bash the vapor to no end.

It's like there's a chunk of this crowd that still sees Apple as this tiny, struggling company that needs every user working (complimentary) PR (spin) to try to keep it going.

Apple is a MONSTER-sized company now. They could have had 2X this Fire years ago. All they needed to do was focus some of their multitudes of internal talent on it. Look at Roku. Relative to Apple, they are a TINY company. But their talent is focused on their version of an :apple:TV. Roku is not making phones, tablets & computers. They are just focused on one thing. Have they got deals done on considerably less leverage? Have they got deals done with considerably less subscribers to lure in partners? Have they got deals done without the whole iTunes ecosystem juggernaut? Have they got deals done without the promise of the halo by simply being associated with Apple? Could Apple do what they've done? Of course, just assign Roku-like talent to focus on doing the same for Apple. And Apple has the great advantage of a mountain of cash so they could easily afford 2X, 3X, 10X the talent pool & focus of a Roku… and grease the wheels with some of that cash to get deals done faster than a Roku… and own this particular space (years ago, before there was a Roku box, long before Amazon Fire, Chomecast, etc.). Instead, Apple has repeatedly deemed it a "hobby," neglected it for seemingly long periods of time and allowed these other guys to see the opportunities and take some good bites into them.

Amazon was books. Then, they were retail et all (eWalmart). Then, they decided to try to make a little Apple-like hardware. Then a little more. And now they've done something that "we" have been longing for Apple to do to :apple:TV for years. App store. Third party Apps. SDK. Games. Game controllers. They've even got "thinner" by a long way (like thin is really some benefit) but not a word from "us" about the wonder of that much thinner shell. If this was Apple's show for :apple:TV, "we" would be having Apple orgasms gushing at the wonder of so many (very) long-term wishes fulfilled. Instead, it's another competitor so we have to bash away at it and cling to the "just wait" argument (which we never do the other way).

We'll spin "Apple isn't first but they do it best" and yet "we'll" also poke at Fire by comments about Apple being first in 2007 with gen 1 while Amazon is "very late to this game." So only Apple can be NOT first but do it best?

So what do "we" do? We spin vapor. Just wait. Apple's forthcoming :apple:TV 4 will blow this thing out of the water. And on and on. Like Apple faithful spending $99 on Fire (or any of the others) might bring Apple to it's knees? Like we're clinging to Apple in 1997 with all hands on deck trying to save a company that might be bankrupt in 6 months. Last I checked, Apple is bigger than just about everybody. They don't need "all hands on deck" anymore. What they do need is to get with it by focusing talent on opportunities beyond the current big 2 or 3 (iPhone, iPad and maybe computers).

I've owned each :apple:TV myself and love them. But I'm not so Apple-centric that I can't appreciate good competition and long-wanted innovations showing up in the other guy's little boxes. The complimentary PR team is hard at work but the consumer that they really are should recognize that good competition is good for (complacent) Apple on "hobbies" like this. It's past time for Apple to get with it. I hope they show us something great soon. But I'm glad the competition is ever evolving where "we" wish :apple:TV would go. Personally, I hope this Fire sells like crazy in hopes that it wakes up Apple when it comes to their version. Apple should have dominated this space years ago. A kick in the pants (I mean wallet) might finally get them moving.
 
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a subscription for unlimited streaming of a huge library of programming, that would still put it just under Amazon's device. (That unlimited streaming subscription has other benefits, like free 2-day shipping.)

I'd love to see a TV Internet box that features channels (and series?) a-la-carte. Like not just HBO Go, but also HBO itself through only the TV device. It's crazy to have to pay $50+/month for dozens of channels laden with commercials, watched rarely if ever, just to qualify to pay an extra ~$12/month for HBO (for example).

1) I have Amazon Prime and get good use out of the $79 price BUT the "Prime" video selection is very thin on quality. It's a throw-in so I'm not complaining but my point here is if one's objective is a video subscription then Netflix is the better option by far. I would not buy Prime for its video offering. I doubt many do. Also "Prime" is a loss leader for Amazon not a money maker like Netflix must do w/ it's offering.

2) Prime does not offer "free" shipping. It offer's a free 2day upgrade. But even that's not accurate since most packages ship ground. What Prime really offers the customer is immediate shipping and avoiding snail services like UPS Innovations or FedEx Smartpost. Amazon offers "free" shipping on most items $35+ sold by Amazon to anyone.

3) A la carte would be great but isn't happening anytime soon, not that Apple or Amazon or Roku wouldn't love to offer it. Reality is the major content providers are economically tied to cable/satellite because they don't just own one channel, but a entire stable (Time-Warner, CBS/Viacom, ABC/Disney, NBCUniversal) so it gets complicated.
 
What worldwide content does Amazon's box have?

I wouldn't class Amazon's box as a game changer. In some ways it's a step up from the current Apple TV but I've yet to see a TV device from any company that will have a similar impact as the iPod, iPhone and iPad.

I think a Apple TV App Store would have a much bigger impact than any deal with the US cable networks and would open the box to content providers throughout the world.
 
Hopefully they add a mini keyboard on the back of the Apple TV remote. Trying to use up,down,left,right to navigate and select each letter for a title search is as much fun as putting your hand in a blender. Of course Siri via the remote for voice searches etc is needed also.
 
Main things I want in a streaming device:

  • iTunes Streaming (local libraries, podcast app, iTunes U app, music, etc.)
  • HBO Go
  • Showtime Anytime
  • Plex
  • YouTube (with a solid interface)
  • Watch ESPN

No single device currently does all of these things. Hopefully Apple brings in those missing features soon.

Add Amazon Prime streaming to your list and I agree. My Apple TV would be perfect if it had your list plus Prime. It looks like Prime is unlikely now.
 
This is exactly what AppleTV should be like. Love the voice feature and gaming support. Do it with apples ecosystem, siri, and an A7 processor for $99 and its going to sell like mad.
 
My guess is we haven't seen a new ATV yet because Apple has been trying to get some major content deals. First we heard the rumor about a Time Warner, then Comcast. I suspect a new ATV will be announced at WWDC and then I don't think Amazon's two month lead will mean that much. I mean Amazon had a 7" tablet out at least a year before Apple did and that didn't stop the iPad mini from being a huge seller.
.
I hope Apple learned from their experience with iTunes Match. Remember how they delayed it until they signed agreements will major labels? It wasn't even necessary since both Amazon and Google beat them to the punch, and added features later on. Nowadays all three services use the same model.
 
Must be US only as I can't see anything about it on the Amazon UK website.

I'd prefer if Apple went down the plug-in stick rather than separate box route. The less clutter under my TV the better.
 
bird in the hand vs. two in the bush

When it's Apple vaporware vs. some hot release like this, the overwhelming spin is "just wait" (for Apple's version).

When it's the other way around, we'll bash the vapor to no end.

It's like there's a chunk of this crowd that still sees Apple as this tiny, struggling company that needs every user working (complimentary) PR (spin) to try to keep it going.

Apple is a MONSTER-sized company now. They could have had 2X this Fire years ago. All they needed to do was focus some of their multitudes of internal talent on it. Look at Roku. Relative to Apple, they are a TINY company. But their talent is focused on their version of an :apple:TV. Roku is not making phones, tablets & computers. They are just focused on one thing. Have they got deals done on considerably less leverage? Have they got deals done with considerably less subscribers to lure in partners? Have they got deals done without the whole iTunes ecosystem juggernaut? Have they got deals done without the promise of the halo by simply being associated with Apple? Could Apple do what they've done? Of course, just assign Roku-like talent to focus on doing the same for Apple. And Apple has the great advantage of a mountain of cash so they could easily afford 2X, 3X, 10X the talent pool & focus of a Roku… and grease the wheels with some of that cash to get deals done faster than a Roku… and own this particular space (years ago, before there was a Roku box, long before Amazon Fire, Chomecast, etc.). Instead, Apple has repeatedly deemed it a "hobby," neglected it for seeming long periods of time and allowed these other guys to see the opportunities and take some good bites into them.

Amazon was books. Then, they were retail et all. (eWalmart). Then, they decided to try to make a little Apple-like hardware. Then a little more. And now they've done something that "we" have been longing for Apple to do to :apple:TV for years. App store. Third party Apps. SDK. Games. Game controllers. If this was Apple's show for :apple:TV, "we" would be having Apple orgasms gushing at the wonder of so many (very) long-term wishes fulfilled. Instead, it's another competitor so we have to bash away at it and cling to the "just wait" argument (which we never do the other way).

Of course, the real issue is not simply "did they technically include the features people wished for", but rather do those features really deliver the content and functionality that is required to satisfy the customer. For example, what is the Fire TV doing in regards to Android games that's different from the failing Ouya set top?
 
Must be US only as I can't see anything about it on the Amazon UK website.

I'd prefer if Apple went down the plug-in stick rather than separate box route. The less clutter under my TV the better.

Not sure about ATV but I velcro'd my Roku 3 to the back of my LED TV.
 
And Plex from what I've seen looks a whole lot nice on the Fire TV than it does on the Roku where they are constrained by Roku's limited interface. I want to wait, because if the new ATV gets access to the App store there's already a great version of Plex there too, plus I find games and apps on IOS are just a little better than their Android counterparts. So I'll wait and make my decision when both are out.
 
Where does this say it streams MKV's?

Just bought one. I've been waiting far too long for a low cost, high performance device that would readily allow me to stream MKV's across my local network. I really wanted it to be the next apple TV but I can't wait any longer, sorry apple.
 
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