Another Report Says Second-Generation iPhone X and iPhone X Plus Will Support Apple Pencil

[LovingTeddy]

As you say, looks are subjective and you seem to dislike anything apple does. So there is that. The pop-up camera is something to jam and I want a face id implementation. Different strokes for different folks.

You Samsung folks like to discuss how android has everything and apple is late to the game. Not having wireless charging is a serious omission by android folks standards, when lesser android phones have included it. You android folks ought to get together and at least get your story straight.

You don't know if it will be jammed. You are just claiming it without prove.

And yes. Apple is very disgenious company and I don't like this company at all

 

[FFR]

You don't know if it will be jammed. You are just claiming it without prove.

And yes. Apple is very disgenious company and I don't like this company at all

Then doesn’t really matter if Apple has a notch or removed the headphone jack.

Since you don’t like Apple at all, posting on an Apple based forum.

 

[I7guy]

You don't know if it will be jammed. You are just claiming it without prove.

And yes. Apple is very disgenious company and I don't like this company at all

There will be at least one report of the pop-up jamming or other issue. I don't need proof with an opinion, because at times common sense prevails.

 

[sinsin07]

No no no. It is Apple folks believing the company is leading the pack and everyone is copying Apple as demonstrated in this thread.

Not clear this entirely accurate.
Search terms used:
apple always copies samsung
why does apple always copies samsung
ways in which apple copies android
It would appear more than just people in this thread think the same.
Whether it is true or not I am not debating.
Of course you can randomly assume that all articles in links are just rabid Apple fanboys to fit any narrative that pleases you.
[doublepost=1534692769][/doublepost]

snip...Vivo Nex has no notch and headphone jack. This beats iPhone X hands down.

Well that'd be an opinion.
And the only opinion that matters in the real world is how many devices get sold.
In order to beat iPhone X in any meaningful way it needs to sell.
Peoples dollar dollar bill is what speaks on what the majority prefer.
Why?
Blackberry, Nokia, Palm and it looks like the Essential.
Not enough people preferred those Brands/Phones.

 

[LovingTeddy]

Not clear this entirely accurate.
Search terms used:
apple always copies samsung
why does apple always copies samsung
ways in which apple copies android
It would appear more than just people in this thread think the same.
Whether it is true or not I am not debating.
Of course you can randomly assume that all articles in links are just rabid Apple fanboys to fit any narrative that please you.
[doublepost=1534692769][/doublepost]
Well that'd be an opinion.
And the only opinion that matters in the real world is how many devices get sold.
In order to beat iPhone X in any meaningful way it needs to sell.
Peoples dollar dollar bill is what speaks on what the majority prefer.
Why?
Blackberry, Nokia, Palm and it looks like the Essential.
Not enough people preferred those Brands/Phones.

Apparently Apple fanboys are not only active in this forum. Apple fans are known to be notorious double standard and flip flop.

Large screen, wireless charging just examples of Apple fanboy think useless until Apple gets one.

And don worry. Vivo and Oppo (same company) are doing just fine. Not all company need to be compete with Apple globally.
[doublepost=1534695471][/doublepost]

There will be at least one report of the pop-up jamming or other issue. I don't need proof with an opinion, because at times common sense prevails.

Using Apple folks logic, there are bonds to be problem when new product release. One out of whatever is none issue.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

It does crack me up how seriously some of you take owning a particular smartphone brand like it’s a competition between average people lol.

The fact is, if anybody is happy with the phone they have bought, they wouldn’t need to criticise and belittle those who may may bought a different phone. The mind boggles.

 

[sinsin07]

Apparently Apple fanboys are not only active in this forum. Apple fans are known to be notorious double standard and flip flop.
Large screen, wireless charging just examples of Apple fanboy think useless until Apple gets one.

So you choose the latter. Make up your own narrative.
In order for the above to be true you would need to show posters who said one thing and then flipped the script later.
Could it be possible there were Apple fans who always wanted larger screens and wireless charging?

Apple seemed to think so.

"Something we hadn't seen in the preceding legal tussles however, and presented by Recode, was a handful of slides from an Apple internal meeting in April 2013 regarding its plans for 2014. Alongside the slowing growth of iPhone sales, the research noted that overall smartphone growth was from cheap and large (well, larger than the current iPhone) devices -- both of which Apple had nothing to compete with. As the slide put it: "Consumers want what we don't have.""

And don worry. Vivo and Oppo (same company) are doing just fine. Not all company need to be compete with Apple globally.

However when you have this many competitors the final outcome is not so clear:
Android fragmentation: There are now 24,000 devices from 1,300 brands
Those companies you mentioned don't affect me but with numbers like that perhaps they are the ones who do need to worry.

HTC comes to mind.

 

[I7guy]

Apparently Apple fanboys are not only active in this forum. Apple fans are known to be notorious double standard and flip flop.

Large screen, wireless charging just examples of Apple fanboy think useless until Apple gets one.

And don worry. Vivo and Oppo (same company) are doing just fine. Not all company need to be compete with Apple globally.
[doublepost=1534695471][/doublepost]

Using Apple folks logic, there are bonds to be problem when new product release. One out of whatever is none issue.

Like the spen that broke the phone when inserted incorrectly. The pop up will jam or otherwise malfunction. It’s a bad design decision waiting to break.

Using Android folks logic, that type of engineering is okay because the phone costs less than an iPhone X with less features.

Not worried about vivo or oppo. Samsung should though.

 

[tipoo]

120hz screen refresh to go with it too, I hope

 

[I7guy]

Not all pencils come with erasers, and even pens come with erasers these days.

And for the past two years, I have only charged my Apple Pencil via my iPad’s lightning port. It’s convenient, requires no additional accessories and works way better than many critics give it credit for, IMO.

I really don’t understand the criticism surrounding this.

It’s actually an ingenious solution. The critics point to the probability of breaking something. It’s not a mobile phone, imo, the chance is far greater a user will damage the pop up camera than damage the Apple Pencil charging in the Lightning port.

 

[Hitrate]

Let's get this straight. You don't like the notch, and therefore the consumer mass is "brain and eye washed" into thinking it's cool? That is sure some sound logic right there.

Ever seen a display produced before that, like a TV, laptop screen, camera display, 99.9% of all smartphones, tablets, wacoms etc. with a notch? No, because back then you at least had some respect for customers who do have their logic intact. Sadly, people like you, and many more in the modern world fail to comprehend obvious design mistakes , and fail even harder at voting with your dollar and not purchasing said devices, rather you mistake it for a "feature" and something "cool looking" that obviously other people just "don't get" right? LOL

The notch is about as obnoxious as people defending it, so I'll just let it rest there.

 

[LovingTeddy]

So you choose the latter. Make up your own narrative.
In order for the above to be true you would need to show posters who said one thing and then flipped the script later.
Could it be possible there were Apple fans who always wanted larger screens and wireless charging?

Apple seemed to think so.

"Something we hadn't seen in the preceding legal tussles however, and presented by Recode, was a handful of slides from an Apple internal meeting in April 2013 regarding its plans for 2014. Alongside the slowing growth of iPhone sales, the research noted that overall smartphone growth was from cheap and large (well, larger than the current iPhone) devices -- both of which Apple had nothing to compete with. As the slide put it: "Consumers want what we don't have.""


However when you have this many competitors the final outcome is not so clear:
Android fragmentation: There are now 24,000 devices from 1,300 brands
Those companies you mentioned don't affect me but with numbers like that perhaps they are the ones who do need to worry.

HTC comes to mind.

Apple folks always claimed the large screen phone is the gimmick and phone should be used by one hand. Apple top executives believed so. Then Apple comes up a phablet phone. Then Apple folks wants big phone now.

Then Apple folks comes up with all the excuses to dismiss wireless charging when Android manufacturers include with their phone. Calling it gimmick and Apple will never release product like that. Then when Apple includes wireless charging, all the sudden, it is important.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

Ever seen a display produced before that, like a TV, laptop screen, camera display, 99.9% of all smartphones, tablets, wacoms etc. with a notch? No, because back then you at least had some respect for customers who do have their logic intact. Sadly, people like you, and many more in the modern world fail to comprehend obvious design mistakes , and fail even harder at voting with your dollar and not purchasing said devices, rather you mistake it for a "feature" and something "cool looking" that obviously other people just "don't get" right? LOL

The notch is about as obnoxious as people defending it, so I'll just let it rest there.

I don’t like the notch personally but whether you do or don’t is all subjective and I think you need to realise that. Neither one of us can state anything is fact when it’s a personal opinion on whether we like or dislike something.

 

[Hitrate]

I don’t like the notch personally but whether you do or don’t is all subjective and I think you need to realise that. Neither one of us can state anything is fact when it’s a personal opinion on whether we like or dislike something.

That's where, fundamentally, you are very wrong. Why do you think we have beauty pagents, super models, expensive designs, vintage designs, I could go on. Again, try and educate yourself and use your brain to look at the world from above, taking in all factors. There are so many reasons why displays have the look they have, notchless. Sure we have handicapped olympics too, but the iPhone shouldn't be handicapped, which it currently is. So there are like 10000 reasons for displays to never have had a notch before. And virtually no reasons why it should, other than to "save space" and because it's all "personal opinion" and "it looks cool" right?! LOL

Oh and btw. I know, I know, I'm sorry it's called "Special Olympic's" just like the iphone X is so special LOL

 

[sinsin07]

Ever seen a display produced before that, like a TV, laptop screen, camera display, 99.9% of all smartphones, tablets, wacoms etc. with a notch?

Ok didn't realize the following:
Edge/Bezeless display TV with camera built in
Edge/Bezeles Laptop with camera built in
Camera Display wouldn't need a built in camera, but I could be incorrect. Please correct me.
If you have examples of above, would be interested in seeing such.

What the other 99.9% of phones have is irrelevant.
Until the iPhone of 2007 what where 99.9% of smartphones phones like?
Depending on where you live you may never see anyone using a flip phone in public.

No, because back then you at least had some respect for customers who do have their logic intact.

This is an assumption on your part, can be safely ignored.

Sadly, people like you, and many more in the modern world fail to comprehend obvious design mistakes , and fail even harder at voting with your dollar and not purchasing said devices, rather you mistake it for a "feature" and something "cool looking" that obviously other people just "don't get" right?

It can also be said that sadly, some small percent of people here and many other in the modern world, post things on the internet that cannot be backed up.
Feelings, thoughts, intuition, anecdotes, what the pizza delivery man told them, a friend of friend etc. is presented as fact or evidence of something being true.

The notch is about as obnoxious as people defending it, so I'll just let it rest there.

Usually don't put personal preferences on the net however also not a fan of the notch, face ID either or the new trend of elongated phones.
Have you ever consider you may also fall in the obnoxious category, sort of a pot kettle type scenario?

 

[Hitrate]

Ok didn't realize the following:
Edge/Bezeless display TV with camera built in
Edge/Bezeles Laptop with camera built in
Camera Display wouldn't need a built in camera, but I could be incorrect. Please correct me.
99.9% of smartphones with Edge/Bezeless displays.
If you have examples of above, would be interested in seeing such.

This is an assumption on your part, can be safely ignored.

It can also be said that sadly, some small percent of people here and many other in the modern world, post things on the internet that cannot be backed up.
Feelings, thoughts, intuition, anecdotes, what the pizza delivery man told them, a friend of friend etc. is presented as fact or evidence of something being true.

Usually don't put personal preferences on the net however also not a fan of the notch, face ID either or the new trend of elongated phones.
Have you ever consider you may also fall in the obnoxious category, sort of a pot kettle type scenario?

Sorry you just wasted everybodys life with nothing to back up your gibberish.

 

[limo79]

"Here is a new, revolutionary and amazing iPhone X Note "

 

[sinsin07]

Sorry you just wasted everybodys life with nothing to back up your gibberish.

I'll admit there is gibberish here just not where you think.

That's where, fundamentally, you are very wrong. Why do you think we have beauty pagents, super models, expensive designs, vintage designs, I could go on. Again, try and educate yourself and use your brain to look at the world from above, taking in all factors. There are so many reasons why displays have the look they have, notchless. Sure we have handicapped olympics too, but the iPhone shouldn't be handicapped, which it currently is. So there are like 10000 reasons for displays to never have had a notch before. And virtually no reasons why it should, other than to "save space" and because it's all "personal opinion" and "it looks cool" right?! LOL

sub·jec·tive
səbˈjektiv/
adjective
adjective: subjective
1.
based on or influenced by personal feelings, tastes, or opinions.
"his views are highly subjective"
synonyms: personal, individual, emotional, instinctive, intuitive
"a subjective analysis

Oh and btw. I know, I know, I'm sorry it's called "Special Olympic's" just like the iphone X is so special LOL

And with that comment folks the show is over.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

That's where, fundamentally, you are very wrong. Why do you think we have beauty pagents, super models, expensive designs, vintage designs, I could go on. Again, try and educate yourself and use your brain to look at the world from above, taking in all factors. There are so many reasons why displays have the look they have, notchless. Sure we have handicapped olympics too, but the iPhone shouldn't be handicapped, which it currently is. So there are like 10000 reasons for displays to never have had a notch before. And virtually no reasons why it should, other than to "save space" and because it's all "personal opinion" and "it looks cool" right?! LOL

Oh and btw. I know, I know, I'm sorry it's called "Special Olympic's" just like the iphone X is so special LOL

I’ve been a designer for nearly 20 years and am fully aware all design is subjective, especially in consumer markets. ‘Educate myself and use my brain’? That sounds very condescending and far too much like a personal remark to me.

I also think you’ll find ‘Paralympics’ is the term you were looking for.

 

[I7guy]

Ever seen a display produced before that, like a TV, laptop screen, camera display, 99.9% of all smartphones, tablets, wacoms etc. with a notch? No, because back then you at least had some respect for customers who do have their logic intact. Sadly, people like you, and many more in the modern world fail to comprehend obvious design mistakes , and fail even harder at voting with your dollar and not purchasing said devices, rather you mistake it for a "feature" and something "cool looking" that obviously other people just "don't get" right? LOL

The notch is about as obnoxious as people defending it, so I'll just let it rest there.

A tv is not meant to be carried in your pocket and used in two orientations.

What is “sad” about this post is the holier than thou attitude about something that is so clearly subjective.

You are welcome to whatever you think, but this thinking is just as obnoxious as you “claim” the notch is?

Apple folks always claimed the large screen phone is the gimmick and phone should be used by one hand. Apple top executives believed so. Then Apple comes up a phablet phone. Then Apple folks wants big phone now.

Then Apple folks comes up with all the excuses to dismiss wireless charging when Android manufacturers include with their phone. Calling it gimmick and Apple will never release product like that. Then when Apple includes wireless charging, all the sudden, it is important.

What’s this universe of people “you apple folks”? Do you know all of them personally to speak for them? Or is this some nonsense?

I think you android folks ought to figure out why these manufactures excluded an android feature that “you guys” deemed indispensable. Has nothing to do with “Apple folks”.

That's where, fundamentally, you are very wrong. Why do you think we have beauty pagents, super models, expensive designs, vintage designs, I could go on. Again, try and educate yourself and use your brain to look at the world from above, taking in all factors. There are so many reasons why displays have the look they have, notchless. Sure we have handicapped olympics too, but the iPhone shouldn't be handicapped, which it currently is. So there are like 10000 reasons for displays to never have had a notch before. And virtually no reasons why it should, other than to "save space" and because it's all "personal opinion" and "it looks cool" right?! LOL

Oh and btw. I know, I know, I'm sorry it's called "Special Olympic's" just like the iphone X is so special LOL

You’re entitled to your opinion but the universe has disagreed with you based on the success of the iPhone X. Long live the notch.

 

[sinsin07]

Apple folks always claimed the large screen phone is the gimmick and phone should be used by one hand.

There are still some Apple folks like that.
There are some Apple folks who wanted larger screens.
Both of these groups existed before 2014 (check MR back post if you need confirmation)
Both of these groups exist now (Check MR iPhone SE rumors this year if you need confirmation.)
Guess who eventually got what they wanted.

Apple top executives believed so.

Some probably still do.
However believes are funny, they can change over time for various reasons.
Santa Claus, Easter Bunny, Lock Ness Monster etc..

Then Apple comes up a phablet phone. Then Apple folks wants big phone now.

The above would be your anti Apple fantasy.
The chart and article came out before iphone 6 Plus.

Then Apple folks comes up with all the excuses to dismiss wireless charging when Android manufacturers include with their phone. Calling it gimmick and Apple will never release product like that. Then when Apple includes wireless charging, all the sudden, it is important.

Again, need to show if same Apple folks who were against wireless charging are now championing wireless charging.
Without that the point your are trying to make is meaningless.
The threads here on MR show Apple fans for and against, but somehow you leave that out.

This is the recurring problem with these type of comments, seldom do these Apple critics ever have anything to backup their rhetoric.
There are a few that do and deserve some credit, but apparently not in your current posts.

 

[zuiram]

You don't know if it will be jammed. You are just claiming it without prove.

You're not an engineer, are you?

Moving parts, especially exposed moving parts, are subject to wear and tear, as well as contaminant ingress. The latter, in particular, is important in this context, with a critical part quickly sliding through a cutout in the chassis, as a speck of dust in the wrong spot can cause a jam if the tolerances are tight (which is an expensive prospect for mass manufacturing, as you have to buy machinery that can deliver on your requirements, hire people qualified to operate and maintain them well enough to keep delivering, and apply more stringent QA, with lower manufacturing yields as a result; these costs are then amortised over expected sales, which- at any level of performance- aren't going to be anywhere close to how many bricks Apple would sell if they just put their logo on them and said they're the bestest bricks ever), and if they're not tight, more dust gets inside, accumulating so the risk of a jam increases faster over time than it otherwise would.

A rigidly fixed mechanism is far more precise, reliable, durable and manufacturable.

Don't get me wrong, it's possible to "engineer to perfection", and that happens regularly at NASA, Lockheed-Martin and a number of universities and research institutions around the world, but they can't supply millions of units per year, which is what you're looking at if your smartphone isn't crap. So you need to manufacture rationally. Rails, bearings and actuators capable of performance, reliability and durability comparable to a rigidly fixed mechanism aren't available in the quantities needed, and the companies that have the expertise to manufacture them won't scale up to supply that many parts unless they're partnering with someone who can afford to invest a billion dollars up front in a joint venture. So you're stuck with inferior solutions, like simple cutouts and bearing surfaces.

I'm happy to roast Apple for yanking the headphone jack, but a pop-up camera is just a bad idea.

Better to just have a brow/notch or a forehead to hide the components in.

And yes. Apple is very disgenious company and I don't like this company at all

That much is obvious.

There's lots I don't like about them, but it's hard not to like a $1T company you can point at when someone claims you can't be environmentally conscious and turn a profit at the same time.

 

[ROGmaster]

I don’t agree with that premise. The original Note arrived to close to an era where the stylus was already popular and mainstream on smartphones to be considered any sort of progenitor to the concept. But I will give credit to Samsung for carrying the torch over the last decade.
As for gestures. First ‘I’ wouldn’t credit Apple with creating the idea. Though it is hard to argue that Apple didn’t popularize and mainstream them.
Don’t get me wrong. I do miss a stylus from my WinCE PDA days. This has made the Note tempting to me for a long time. Therefore I would be excited to see more manufacturers pick it up.

Of course you would, but they are far from being the ones that created the gestures on a phone idea.
Anyway thank you from proving my point.

 

[Calebt59]

I hope this really happens, I'm one who thinks iPhone should have had a stylus right from the jump. I'll definitely upgrade from my current X if it's not backward compatible, which it probably won't be.

 

[LovingTeddy]

You're not an engineer, are you?

Moving parts, especially exposed moving parts, are subject to wear and tear, as well as contaminant ingress. The latter, in particular, is important in this context, with a critical part quickly sliding through a cutout in the chassis, as a speck of dust in the wrong spot can cause a jam if the tolerances are tight (which is an expensive prospect for mass manufacturing, as you have to buy machinery that can deliver on your requirements, hire people qualified to operate and maintain them well enough to keep delivering, and apply more stringent QA, with lower manufacturing yields as a result; these costs are then amortised over expected sales, which- at any level of performance- aren't going to be anywhere close to how many bricks Apple would sell if they just put their logo on them and said they're the bestest bricks ever), and if they're not tight, more dust gets inside, accumulating so the risk of a jam increases faster over time than it otherwise would.

A rigidly fixed mechanism is far more precise, reliable, durable and manufacturable.

Don't get me wrong, it's possible to "engineer to perfection", and that happens regularly at NASA, Lockheed-Martin and a number of universities and research institutions around the world, but they can't supply millions of units per year, which is what you're looking at if your smartphone isn't crap. So you need to manufacture rationally. Rails, bearings and actuators capable of performance, reliability and durability comparable to a rigidly fixed mechanism aren't available in the quantities needed, and the companies that have the expertise to manufacture them won't scale up to supply that many parts unless they're partnering with someone who can afford to invest a billion dollars up front in a joint venture. So you're stuck with inferior solutions, like simple cutouts and bearing surfaces.

I'm happy to roast Apple for yanking the headphone jack, but a pop-up camera is just a bad idea.

Better to just have a brow/notch or a forehead to hide the components in.



That much is obvious.

There's lots I don't like about them, but it's hard not to like a $1T company you can point at when someone claims you can't be environmentally conscious and turn a profit at the same time.

Everything will eventually fail. It doesn't matter if it is Apple designed or NASA designed. It is about working at expected usage life.

Now, for smartphone, it is about 3-5 years. If it is not fail within 3-5 years, then it is acceptable. For this particular phone, the camera can handle at least 50,000 movement. How many time do you need to have front camera pop up per day? This thing can easily last you at least 3 year. Also the front camera can handle at least 45KG of pressure before it snaps off. I won't worry about pop up camera. Specially, there is no notch on that phone.

You say it is bad idea, but I say it is good idea. At least someone is trying to find a solution for all screen phone without that stupid notch.