Anyone else abandoning ship?

[StuKatz1]

True, but I can go to Lenovo, Dell, HP and pretty much any brand on the planet except Apple and have a choice. Apple tar everything with the same brush and for many that just doesn't work.

Lenovo, Dell and HP are computer companies, not lifestyle companies.
They are clearly trying to offer computers for people who know what is inside the computer, and many of their clients actually go to them precisely for that ability - choice and optimization.

Apple tars everything up with the same “ideological brush” very similarly to how the majority of leather goods from Louis Vuitton and Gucci have historically dawned their respective incessant monograms or logos.

In fashion, you are buying into what the designer’s personal view and preferences are, not about what makes the most sense.

Hope this helps put things into perspective.

By the way, I very much agree with your personal sentiment.

 

[shaunp]

Lenovo, Dell and HP are computer companies, not lifestyle companies.
They are clearly trying to offer computers for people who know what is inside the computer, and many of their clients actually go to them precisely for that ability - choice and optimization.

Apple tars everything up with the same “ideological brush” very similarly to how the majority of leather goods from Louis Vuitton and Gucci have historically dawned their respective incessant monograms or logos.

In fashion, you are buying into what the designer’s personal view and preferences are, not about what makes the most sense.

Hope this helps put things into perspective.

By the way, I very much agree with your personal sentiment.

I get the perspective, and thanks for the sentiment. Today will be interesting.

 

[MrGunnyPT]

See, I think two faulty keyboards is just entirely unacceptable. We aren’t talking about the logic board... we’re talking about the KEYBOARD. I mean, come on. That should never break for the VAST majority of people.

A friend of mine is a developer, and his company actually keeps spare MBPs in their office because of the number of issues their keyboards have. They keep spares so they don’t lose productivity while the keyboards are being replaced.

I just started to use a Magic Keyboard when I'm at the desk to avoid getting problems... It is frustrating when you are travelling for work and one of the keys goes boom.

 

[kazmac]

Not yet apparently; but I am an iMac user not MBP (as much as I'd love to go MBP, the issues (especially keyboard) and the price points are a big old no).

That said, when I am ready to jump I will do so. Lots of great hardware coming from the PC end of things.

 

[Howard2k]

It’s taking a long time to mount and search files. If you hit command K and have Mac mount the drive with library, it’s really slow. My library has several thousand files

I thought I read somewhere it’s due to the mounting protocol (CIFS vs Samba)

CIFS is SMB1. Samba supports multiple versions of SMB, up to 3.1.1. I did use an older NAS with TM on a CIFS based NAS and it worked ok, but it's an insecure protocol and it has some issues.

My library is 6,900 songs. It works great. I'm not using SMB though, I changed to AFP. But it did work ok even on CIFS. It might be that you have a configuration or network issue somewhere?

I considered moving my actual library files back to my local machine and just keeping the mp3/aac files on the NAS. I might do that in my next data re-org, but right now I have all of my library files on the NAS. I even open it over VPN remotely sometimes and that can be a bit taxing, but it works.

 

[CE3]

I am not quoting some generic laundry list of issues that reads like a page from Web MD drug side effects.

So I guess the general consensus from the Surface owners in this thread is that he's not being truthful. I've never owned a SurfaceBook, so I'll leave it alone now.

I am genuinely happy for you that things are working out. I don't wish anyone bad luck. However it is because you haven't had issues is why you feel so defensive of Apple. As I stated earlier if you had been the person presented with the $700 bill and accused of breaking a device, when you know that you have been careful... I think you would feel differently. My niece was an Apple fan, but she feels differently now and so does Dad $700 bucks later. He is now working to get a refund now that Apple has finally admitted to the Stage Light issue.

I actually agree with many of the criticisms in this thread. SSD and RAM upgrade costs for Macs are ridiculous and Apple's computers should be more serviceable and user upgradeable. But I also think there's still a lot to love about the Mac experience and don't find the alternatives to be so much better. In many cases they're not much cheaper either. Yeah, you can spend a crazy amount of money on a MacBook, but you can also find really good deals online all the time. Clearly they've had some problems with the butterfly keyboard, or there wouldn't be repair program in place. I've not had any issues yet and enjoy the typing experience.

 

[cram501]

My library is 6,900 songs. It works great. I'm not using SMB though, I changed to AFP. But it did work ok even on CIFS. It might be that you have a configuration or network issue somewhere?

I have a similar problem with a Netgear ReadyNAS. Even with AFP it is incredibly slow. With windows, works like a champ. I'm still trying to figure out why it doesn't play nice with the MBP and iMac Pro.

I think ARM will eventually push me out of this ecosystem or if I have an urgent need for another laptop before things improve.

 

[SDColorado]

So I guess the general consensus from the Surface owners in this thread is that he's not being truthful. I've never owned a SurfaceBook, so I'll leave it alone now.

I don’t know, it just has the appearance of a “who’s who” list of various problems and complaints found on reddit it a Google Search.

If someone said they had a MBP that had
- Staingate
- Flexgate
- T2 Issues
- Audio Popping
- Unresponsive Keys
- Double typing keys
- Keyboard Chipping
- Display Color Shift
- WiFi issues
- USB-C ports loose/disconnecting
- Bluetooth issues
- Overheating/Throttling
- Sound not working after waking from sleep
- Touchbar blinking
- Touchbar went black
- Trackpad unresponsive

Would you at least question if I hadn’t compiled the list from Reddit? (I did )

 

[shaunp]

I have a similar problem with a Netgear ReadyNAS. Even with AFP it is incredibly slow. With windows, works like a champ. I'm still trying to figure out why it doesn't play nice with the MBP and iMac Pro.

I think ARM will eventually push me out of this ecosystem or if I have an urgent need for another laptop before things improve.

Use NFS if you don't want to use SMB. Most NAS support NFS as they are Linux based. It's pretty quick.

 

[eltoslightfoot]

Anybody changing their mind after the announcements today? Personally, I was probably always going to be in the iOS world for my phone. Otherwise? I wasn’t really impressed. 6k is overkill for the new Mac Pro. The Mac updates and iOS updates left me meh.

Still staying with my hackintosh mostly in windows 10 and my surface pro.

Oh and I forgot how ridiculously overpriced the monitor and stand were as well. When we said we wanted pro equipment, we didn’t mean go WAAAAAY over the top and charge like it.

 

[pshufd]

I'm just going to keep using my old Apple stuff until it dies or until I have a need for more. I expect my old hardware to be good for another 4-5 years.

 

[LeeW]

That new Mac Pro is designed for one purpose, racking in a data center, not sitting at home or in an office.

 

[maflynn]

Anybody changing their mind after the announcements today?

Not for me. Here's my $.02, first the hardware is still over priced, Apple's track record with the keyboard is still abysmal and while there is a repair program, I'm not really jazzed up about the risk of multiple repairs.

The Mac Pro while impressive, though I hate the look, is very over priced though I have no need and I'm sure for the market its directed towards people will buy it.

macOS Catalina - the updates seem to be mostly oh hum, the activation lock is a plus and I suppose for some running iPad apps, but I wonder if this will have a chilling affect on developers (macOS developers), that is people may be more inclined to stick with writing iOS apps and/or avoiding macOS since their iPads apps will run on macs now.

Overall, I have a much less TCO on a faster more stable, more upgradeble laptop. I know I'm on a mac forum, my opinion is in the minority and i'm not trying to convince anyone but rather point out that I found a solution that works best for me.

 

[LeeW]

If nothing else the announcement will stop people's expectations that the new Pro would be an affordable home system.

Although I can guarantee they will start hoping for a more affordable mini version of the mac pro, that will be the Mac Mini then!

Ultimately though, nothing announced is making me change my current views.

 

[maflynn]

that the new Pro would be an affordable home system.

LOL, indeed. Back in the day, people bought power macs, for their desktop needs. Now if you want to stay in the ecosystem, you're forced to get an iMac (a nice computer don't get me wrong), or a Mini There's always been a desire of a desktop mac that isn't an iMac but has more power and upgradeability then the mini

 

[Howard2k]

If nothing else the announcement will stop people's expectations that the new Pro would be an affordable home system.

Who expected that?! Seriously? Did anyone actually think that the new Pro was to be an affordable home unit?

 

[eltoslightfoot]

Not for me. Here's my $.02, first the hardware is still over priced, Apple's track record with the keyboard is still abysmal and while there is a repair program, I'm not really jazzed up about the risk of multiple repairs.

The Mac Pro while impressive, though I hate the look, is very over priced though I have no need and I'm sure for the market its directed towards people will buy it.

macOS Catalina - the updates seem to be mostly oh hum, the activation lock is a plus and I suppose for some running iPad apps, but I wonder if this will have a chilling affect on developers (macOS developers), that is people may be more inclined to stick with writing iOS apps and/or avoiding macOS since their iPads apps will run on macs now.

Overall, I have a much less TCO on a faster more stable, more upgradeble laptop. I know I'm on a mac forum, my opinion is in the minority and i'm not trying to convince anyone but rather point out that I found a solution that works best for me.

And, see that is where I am at. I want more stability than the macbook pros if I am stuck with a laptop. I also don't want to have to carry around an iPad for a Pencil and touch in addition to my laptop and an iPhone. Instead I have to go with a Surface Pro that meets that need.

So now to my desktop. At the time the iMacs were very underwhelming so I built an i7 decent gaming machine that could, uh, boot into multiple operating systems. I need power and expandability in a desktop. I don't render 6k video or anything, but I game and create art. I do render things occasionally. I DO NOT NEED XEON AND INCREDIBLY EXPENSIVE RAM. I need a decent machine that costs around $2k (including a real GPU) to build. Apple clearly doesn't want to meet this need. Which is unfortunate.

EDITED TO ADD: the new regular iMac actually isn't a bad deal nicely equipped for $2100 but I already have a fairly nice 4k monitor and that is still several hundred more than I spent because I can be choosy on parts. Also it isn't expandable at all.

There are those that say, well, get a gaming machine for windows instead of a hackintosh and then get an iMac or Mac Mini. What a waste. Okay, so to meet my relatively simple set of needs/wants, I have to have the following:

iPhone, iPad (so I can do art and take notes), Macbook Pro, Gaming Desktop - $6k

Or I could go with: iPhone, Surface Pro, Gaming Desktop - $4k

Again, I don't give a flying fig if the Mac Pro is a big hit. I really hope it meets everyone's needs. For me, however, it is a big miss.
[doublepost=1559651961][/doublepost]

Who expected that?! Seriously? Did anyone actually think that the new Pro was to be an affordable home unit?

We expected something between the consumer and this beast. Something in between. But touche. I was wrong and you were right.
[doublepost=1559652014][/doublepost]

LOL, indeed. Back in the day, people bought power macs, for their desktop needs. Now if you want to stay in the ecosystem, you're forced to get an iMac (a nice computer don't get me wrong), or a Mini There's always been a desire of a desktop mac that isn't an iMac but has more power and upgradeability then the mini

This is my feeling exactly. I want more than the iMac and less than the Mac Pro.

 

[Queen6]

I'm just going to keep using my old Apple stuff until it dies or until I have a need for more. I expect my old hardware to be good for another 4-5 years.

Professionally I made the change in 2016 and have yet to regret, as per another thread I needs tools not lifestyle statements. I now have a vast array of hardware open to me, I don't love W10 by any means, equally it has yet to fail me once. To me that's far more meaningful than anything Apple is currently doing as lost work costs time.

I would consider a Mac if they made sense, they just don't. I'm even favouring Linux more, as again I can pick and choose the hardware and not suffer Apple's take or leave it attitude and countless extended repair programs due to not getting it right in the first place...

Q-6

 

[LeeW]

Who expected that?! Seriously? Did anyone actually think that the new Pro was to be an affordable home unit?

Yeah, people all over this site. Most were hoping for a $1 - $2k base unit they would then kit out themselves with user-replaceable components with an end price around $3k.

 

[Nugget]

The Mac Pro announcement yesterday bought me at least one more iteration with a Mac desktop. I may or may not buy a MP7,1 but the announcement itself and the nature of what they've built gives me renewed confidence in Apple's commitment to the platform. I'll wait to see how the final pricing works out before I decide what will replace my 6,1 trash can.

 

[Queen6]

Yeah, people all over this site. Most were hoping for a $1 - $2k base unit they would then kit out themselves with user-replaceable components with an end price around $3k.

Agreed, Apple's not about that, never has been, never will be. New Mac Pro is targeted at a specific audience and likely wont disappoint as these companies will have the budget for multiple high end units and be in a position to lever the power of the hardware.

It's just part and parcel of Apple, I do very much appreciate that many an enthusiast and or independent professional was hoping for more or in this case less on the pricing. Hard truth is Apple doesn't care as it knows it will sell the Mac Pro in adequate numbers to customers that it prioritises.

Q-6

 

[LeeW]

I said all along that if you set hopes and dreams aside, the iMac pro starts at 4,899 so there is no way the new Mac Pro will be any cheaper.

Having said that, for the target audience it is probably an amazing unit.

Thankfully I am now split between macOS and W10, everything I need macOS for can be done with ease on my Mini, for everything else I switch to a W10. This is the beauty of not having an AIO.

At this moment I am using the Mini, in about an hour with a quick switch of the Keyboard and mouse, I am using my self-built PC powerhouse. Happy

 

[idark77]

Just my experience:
I tried to abandon the ship... I tried, tried, tried and tried but... After you used Apple products for 20 years, after you used macOs, iMac, Macbook Pro, iPad... believe me if you need to be productive and just focus on your work you simply cannot jump the ship...

I used Linux time ago and after all these years it is a very good OS ( also more stable) but again it is not mature, you need to fight with bugs, drivers and lack of software.

Sure there is Windows 10 but did you really use Windows? I used it and continue to use it also for my daily work. It is another good OS, it is so good that it destroys itself just installing Microsoft updates... For sure all kind of software is available for Windows but... Sometimes after an update something goes wrong and you need to format and reinstall it, without any reason...

Some months ago I jumped the ship and after reading a lot of online reviews about laptops I bought one of the best laptop in the world: The Dell XPS 15 9570 i7 16GB-Ram 512GB-SSD bla bla bla.... but it was the worst laptop that I have ever owned... I don't understand how people can write this kind of reviews... It is was not my unit faulty but All XPS 9570 customers had these issues (just read Dell or XPS9570 forum).
XPS 9570 Bug list:
- Audio crackling and popping ( after 6 months they released a working Realtek driver)
- Backlight bleeding
- Coil Whine
- Starting with 1.7.0 Bios version the dGPU polls trigger fans to spin for 9 seconds also if temperature is 40C...
- GPU Performance Drop after BIOS 1.6.0 Update and Dell downgraded the 1050Ti GPU temp limit from 78C to 74C.
- Windows 10 Fast boot didn't work 70% of times
- If you contact customer service they always say to uninstall and reinstall drivers, uninstall and reinstall, unionstall and reinstall...
- DPC latency issues
- Arrogant managers
-...

I sold it and again I am here to use an expensive Macbook Pro, for me it just "works"...
For sure I continue to use Windows 10 and Linux ( I like Ubuntu and Manjaro ) but macOs is the peace of my mind.

 

[LeeW]

I tried to abandon the ship... I tried, tried, tried and tried but... After you used Apple products for 20 years, after you used macOs, iMac, Macbook Pro, iPad... believe me if you need to be productive and just focus on your work you simply cannot jump the ship...

If it works for you then there is no need to jump off. I am not giving up my Mac Mini or iPad, everything else, meh.

t is another good OS, it is so good that it destroys itself just installing Microsoft updates... For sure all kind of software is available for Windows but... Sometimes after an update something goes wrong and you need to format and reinstall it, without any reason...

Never had that issue so can't comment.

he Dell XPS 15 9570 i7 16GB-Ram 512GB-SSD bla bla bla.... but it was the worst laptop that I have ever owned... I don't understand how people can write this kind of reviews.

It happens with all brands to be honest, the thing is though, almost every review I see of Dell or Lenovo is generally good these days so they must be decent in the main.

Almost every MBP review I see these days says the same thing, in conclusion, can't recommend them, but, if you need to have one, what options do you have? None.

Price is less of an issue for me with tech that works and if the MBP did its job, I would still have the first one and be happy with it. is the MBP decent in the main? Not so sure given the reported issues as well as my own troubles with it. But there are plenty out there getting along with it just fine. In your case, it just works so run with it.

 

[Queen6]

Just my experience:
I tried to abandon the ship... I tried, tried, tried and tried but... After you used Apple products for 20 years, after you used macOs, iMac, Macbook Pro, iPad... believe me if you need to be productive and just focus on your work you simply cannot jump the ship...

I used Linux time ago and after all these years it is a very good OS ( also more stable) but again it is not mature, you need to fight with bugs, drivers and lack of software.

Sure there is Windows 10 but did you really use Windows? I used it and continue to use it also for my daily work. It is another good OS, it is so good that it destroys itself just installing Microsoft updates... For sure all kind of software is available for Windows but... Sometimes after an update something goes wrong and you need to format and reinstall it, without any reason...

Some months ago I jumped the ship and after reading a lot of online reviews about laptops I bought one of the best laptop in the world: The Dell XPS 15 9570 i7 16GB-Ram 512GB-SSD bla bla bla.... but it was the worst laptop that I have ever owned... I don't understand how people can write this kind of reviews... It is was not my unit faulty but All XPS 9570 customers had these issues (just read Dell or XPS9570 forum).
XPS 9570 Bug list:
- Audio crackling and popping ( after 6 months they released a working Realtek driver)
- Backlight bleeding
- Coil Whine
- Starting with 1.7.0 Bios version the dGPU polls trigger fans to spin for 9 seconds also if temperature is 40C...
- GPU Performance Drop after BIOS 1.6.0 Update and Dell downgraded the 1050Ti GPU temp limit from 78C to 74C.
- Windows 10 Fast boot didn't work 70% of times
- If you contact customer service they always say to uninstall and reinstall drivers, uninstall and reinstall, unionstall and reinstall...
- DPC latency issues
- Arrogant managers
-...

I sold it and again I am here to use an expensive Macbook Pro, for me it just "works"...
For sure I continue to use Windows 10 and Linux ( I like Ubuntu and Manjaro ) but macOs is the peace of my mind.

Sorry don't agree, it solely down to the user and their willingness to research and learn. I just took my primary notebook down after over 3 weeks up as I had opportunity and time to upgrade from W10 Pro 1809 to 1903.

I switched from OS X in 2016 for my professional needs as Apple simply wasn't cutting it. Barring the first few weeks of becoming accustomed to the OS I've had zero issues across multiple systems. Never needed to reinstall the OS, had a crash or an application fail on me.

Both ASUS and Acer have issued firmware updates that bolster security and improve on performance. One of the reasons I switched or at least initially looked at W10 was stability as lost time costs. Currently 100% W10 professionally with a keen eye on Linux as the OS is becoming more acceptable for mainstream work.

Currently I'm more productive with faster hardware than Apple can provide. I've never owned an XPS or likely will as they are not what they are cracked up to be and seen my fair share of issue with Dell when I was an employee in a major multinational. Dell's Precision line are the only hardware I'd personally consider, even then I'd be cautious...

I've said it before and I'll say it again if Apple offered the best, most reliable computing experience I'd be replying on Apple's hardware, I'm not and for good reason...

Q-6