Anyone else abandoning ship?

[j_in_tx]

Well, I love macOS and I am gonna stick with it as long as I can. But I'm still a realist, so I also don't like the direction where the Mac is going. I need a reliable machine. I could even get use to the gimmicky touchbar, but I could not live with that badly designed keyboard and all those other issues. The keyboard fail rate is much more than 2%. I believe that if you use those 2016+ MBP on daily basis, the keyboard will sooner or later fail.

Apple needs more product focused people, those who really want to build the best products. You know why all those people praise Steve Jobs? Because they know he cared. It was his company and he put everything in it. He made mistakes, many mistakes, but he cared and he was always there to fix those mistakes and learn from them. Cook is just an employee.

I’m not understanding all the complaining. Doesn’t everyone remember the alternatives??? I use those alternatives for work purposes. It’s just as you probably can imagine. 100x worse.

I wanted to comment on the gimmicky touchbar. I never used it for 2 yrs, but then started to realize what it could do for the masses (like me). It’s the same as the autocomplete/fill-in for logins on the ipad. I love using it to auto fill in the email address, name, address fields. I’m sure when the MacBook gets Face ID, it’ll be even better. These subtle helper assistantants has become surprisingly useful.

 

[leman]

You conveniently missed my quote that this behavior can easily be turned off in the settings.

Yes, it can, if you can find the switches (they are hidden across different panels and the setting names are not obvious). I do not understand how this fact can be used to justify an intrusive business practice like this. I am not even sure that it's ok to have ads on an OS as opt-in feature for privacy considerations, and here we are talking about opt-out. The average user will probably never do this because they wouldn't bother or even know that it's possible.

And frankly, I never got this "well you can tweak it then its really good" argument. I'm not interested in tweaking a system. I don't want to disable/enable/sidestep system components to have a usable tool.

This gives me the impression that you are not here for an open minded constructive discussion, but simply to make your point whatever it takes.

My point is that Windows 10 has been designed as an advertising platform. Which I find very worrying, since it designates privacy and data safety concerns as lower priority. I understand that adds can be a very lucrative business model. I just don't see why I would want to use an OS that is based around the idea of integrating (targeted!) ads into its interface, especially if this OS is not even free.

 

[jerryk]

My point is that Windows 10 has been designed as an advertising platform. Which I find very worrying, since it designates privacy and data safety concerns as lower priority. I understand that adds can be a very lucrative business model. I just don't see why I would want to use an OS that is based around the idea of integrating (targeted!) ads into its interface, especially if this OS is not even free.

What ads are you referring to? Ones that come up in a browser? Those are the only ones I see on any of my computers, Windows 10, MacOS, Linux, phone ....

 

[MBAir2010]

During the day the pc pops promotions about securing data with a dell external drive that is available in more colors than a peacock , having the proper toner with HP plus will give my photos of my backyard picnic more vibrancy and how microsoft office can make me productiver by the pop up!
Iknow, iknow
These can be turned off, but why do we get these in the first place?

 

[leman]

What ads are you referring to? Ones that come up in a browser? Those are the only ones I see on any of my computers, Windows 10, MacOS, Linux, phone ....

The ones that appear at Windows lock screen and Windows start menu. This article is a bit old for example, but its still relevant: https://www.windowscentral.com/how-remove-advertising-windows-10

 

[Martyimac]

I think there is a big difference between seeing ads in a dedicated app that serves as a store, and seeing (unsolicited) ads in your app menu, on your lock screen and in other places.

Not to mention that they are actually collecting information to serve you targeted ads, and they were (and probably still are) also playing with ideas to add ads to stock apps, e.g.: https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/ne...off-ads-in-windows-10-mail-app-after-outrage/
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You mean like these ones? https://nexusconsultancy.co.uk/blog/got-edge-faster-chrome-popup-whats-fastest-browser/

I have no idea whether MS still does popups like these — I don't use that OS too often, but I do notice that my start menu is littered with app ads.

We/she has never had that popup. And yes when we first got it the MacAfee ad came up but that was one of the bloatwares that we uninstalled the very first day. Nothing since then.

Now what I do agree with is that EVERYBODY is tracking us and selling info to companies. And even though  says privacy is a primary concern, apps other than 's do track us even while using Mac OS's. We are, after all, the product in todays internet connected world.

 

[leman]

Now what I do agree with is that EVERYBODY is tracking us and selling info to companies. And even though  says privacy is a primary concern, apps other than 's do track us even while using Mac OS's. We are, after all, the product in todays internet connected world.

Yeah, which is urgently need some legislations to enforce certain reasonable rules about all this mess. But that's a different topic

Anyway, I am not all irrationally agains data collection, its a great tool that can used to build some remarkable things and truly improve our lives, but there are some things which are good taste and bad taste in my opinion. Making an ad-supported OS to me personally, is really bad taste. That shouldn't be the OS manufacturer's business model.

 

[Queen6]

You conveniently missed my quote that this behavior can easily be turned off in the settings.

Also you decided to add some extra goal posts about collecting information.

This gives me the impression that you are not here for an open minded constructive discussion, but simply to make your point whatever it takes. I am not playing your game. Have a nice day.

Colour me surprised. Since I switched back to Windows in 2016 I've had no issues; no AD's, no crashes, no jamming keyboards, no throttling, no stage lighting, no mandatory AppleCare required due to poor design, no paying out for additional warranty coverage as the hardware came with a 24-36 warranty from the OEM in the first place. If Apple tried as half as hard as it's defenders do, then something might actually happen to improve it's computing line up...

Q-6

 

[Mendota]

Wait what? How can you be using Windows but not be aware of the fact that’s it’s a huge advertising platform for MS? Why do you think there are hundreds of Web sites along the lines of “how to disable annnoying ads in Windows 10”?

Okay I did a search and to give you benefit of the doubt, there is a setting that you can turn on or off in Windows that is not on by default in the signature edition but OEM's can toggle it. Mostly it is a part of the help feature for new users. As someone as experienced as you, I don't see that as much of a problem... But your mileage may vary.

 

[jerryk]

The ones that appear at Windows lock screen and Windows start menu. This article is a bit old for example, but its still relevant: https://www.windowscentral.com/how-remove-advertising-windows-10

I see. On my Windows 10 system I found one item, but none of the others. It was an game that was pre-installed, Mindcraft.

I don't view this as any more intrusive than the things that MacOS came with (from google search).
-iMovie
-iPhoto
-GarageBand
-iTunes
-Safari
-iMessage
-Mail
-iCal
-Contacts
-Reminders
-Notes
-Game Center
-Photo Booth
-Time Machine
-Terminal
-Dictionary
-Calculator
-Chess
-FaceTime
-Preview
-QuickTime
-Stickies
-TextEdit
- Pages
- Siri
- News

The only ones of these I use is Time Machine and Terminal so I removed all of the others from the dock.

 

[Mendota]

IMHO you are exaggerating greatly. It is very easy to disable these 'suggestions' in Windows settings and they are not nearly as intrusive as you make them seem to be. There are no irritating popups or messages in this respect (where previous posts where complaining about).
The Apple store in iOS or in MacOS is a huge advertisement platform as well. The pot calling the kettle black comes to mind here.
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A Dell I bought around 4 years ago was installed with a trial version of McAfee Antivirus and that kept asking me (about once a day) if I wanted to upgrade to the 'pro' version. Until I uninstalled it of course.
Also a HP I had kept me asking about taking a subscription on a printer service (from HP itself) to automatically get printer cartridges send every month. No biggie also, I just uninstalled it.
You mileage can vary of course.
It does not keep me from using Windows at all. It is simply what happens if an OS can be installed by multiple OEMs on multiple platforms including multiple programs.

As I also said in a couple of posts ago: This has nothing to do with Windows itself but with OEMS installing irritating software on it.

What Leman is talking about is something completely different. Those are suggestions (as MS calls them) you see once in a while in a tile in the Windows menu about new software available in the MS store. This behavior can easily be switched off in the Windows settings.

Actually I use the HP subscription. It really does work well, saves money and time. Only $5 a month. My gosh @leman has me becoming an ad.

 

[jerryk]

During the day the pc pops promotions about securing data with a dell external drive that is available in more colors than a peacock , having the proper toner with HP plus will give my photos of my backyard picnic more vibrancy and how microsoft office can make me productiver by the pop up!
Iknow, iknow
These can be turned off, but why do we get these in the first place?

Virtually any site (this includes searches on your phone, or in apps) you visit today tracks you. And one of the big thing they track is your searches. Look for toner or printer reviews on Cnet and you are going to get related adds. Look for Word features on a tech site and you are going to get office ads. Watch a YouTube video on solar for your home, and you are going to get solar ads, and emails. Selling your information is a big part of these "free" sites revenue streams. And then these search aggregators and ad placement companies use this information so that sites like this (and almost every other site) show you ads targeting you.

 

[Mendota]

Well I have a Mac, albeit 2012 (can't upgrade to new ones due to issues) and I enjoy using it from time to time. The problem as far as hate from others, is in part because Apple themselves haven't been so nice. Remember those Mac vs. PC ads? It not only made fun of the PC, but also PC users. We were uncool losers.

And then the attack on Android, which was just an effort to get rid of the competition and force everyone to use iPhones with the ridicules patent wars. Every company is proud of itself and it's products and believes it is the best, but Apple is the only one that openly derides others and encourages it's uses to do the same.

Snippy little girls on iPhone called Android users "ghetto" people when Instagram first came to Android. And even today Apple users will try and imply that people who don't like Apple can't "afford" it.

 

[AndyMacAndMic]

During the day the pc pops promotions about securing data with a dell external drive that is available in more colors than a peacock , having the proper toner with HP plus will give my photos of my backyard picnic more vibrancy and how microsoft office can make me productiver by the pop up!
Iknow, iknow
These can be turned off, but why do we get these in the first place?

If you allow your internet browser to generate popup messages and if you allow a site to send you messages as well you can expect this. Turn browser messages off in the Windows settings. What I don't understand (if this is a work issued laptop) why it is given to you this way. You would expect that your systems guy would set it up in a proper manner. I don't remember Windows behaving that obtrusive out off the box.

Also it wouldn't hurt if you dive in the settings yourself. Added benefit is that you learn to know Windows along the way

 

[EdwardC]

Actually I use the HP subscription. It really does work well, saves money and time. Only $5 a month. My gosh @leman has me becoming an ad.

I use it as well for my home office, saves a ton of money!!!

 

[SweWriter]

Wait what? How can you be using Windows but not be aware of the fact that’s it’s a huge advertising platform for MS? Why do you think there are hundreds of Web sites along the lines of “how to disable annnoying ads in Windows 10”?

It seems a lot easier to disable the ads in the peon versions of Windows than to ”get used to” a new keyboard that breaks every now and then.

 

[c0ppo]

Wait what? How can you be using Windows but not be aware of the fact that’s it’s a huge advertising platform for MS? Why do you think there are hundreds of Web sites along the lines of “how to disable annnoying ads in Windows 10”?

That guy asked you for a screenshot. I would like one as well, with macrumors on this thread opened.
Either prove your point, or stop trolling.

Funny thing is, I can list a few things Windows does really poorly from objective stand point. That means that everyone except complete MS fanboys would agree with them, because they are easily proven, and there are way better solutions out there.

But since you don't know anything about Windows, you can't even list those, but you have to resort to made up things?

P.S.
Just to be clear, I can list annoyances and stupid things with a lot of Linux distros, and with mac OS as well.
I use them all. Daily.

 

[leman]

That guy asked you for a screenshot. I would like one as well, with macrumors on this thread opened.
Either prove your point, or stop trolling.

Please just google for "how to disable windows 10 ads" and you will get thousands of screenshots. I mean, the fact that many editions of Windows 10 show app ads in its start menu (what MS calls "suggestions" etc.) has been discussed over and over again.

I have also posted multiple links that illustrate various techniques MS used, from annoying pop ups telling you "install our browser, its much better than Chrome you are using now" to an attempt to integrate ads into their stock Mail application.

I have really no idea what kind of "proof" are you asking of me here. If you want a screenshot, here is one: that of google search showing 305 million hits for "Windows 10 built in advertising"

 

[c0ppo]

Please just google for "how to disable windows 10 ads" and you will get thousands of screenshots. I mean, the fact that many editions of Windows 10 show app ads in its start menu (what MS calls "suggestions" etc.) has been discussed over and over again.

I have also posted multiple links that illustrate various techniques MS used, from annoying pop ups telling you "install our browser, its much better than Chrome you are using now" to an attempt to integrate ads into their stock Mail application.

I have really no idea what kind of "proof" are you asking of me here. If you want a screenshot, here is one: that of google search showing 305 million hits for "Windows 10 built in advertising"

Well, that IS THE problem. You said that your start menu is 'littered with ads'.
I own a desktop PC, build it myself. Except Candy Crush and some other game, I can't find anything else on my start menu. And those two were removed in less then 10secs (right click - uninstall).

But you say that your start menu is littered with ads. Could be, I have no clue. That's why the screenshot of your start menu would be more then enough to convince me and all other people here to believe you.

So, will we get that screenshot or not?

 

[leman]

But you say that your start menu is littered with ads. Could be, I have no clue. That's why the screenshot of your start menu would be more then enough to convince me and all other people here to believe you.

So, will we get that screenshot or not?

Look, I just posted you a search link that has a few million cases of people complaining about Win10 ads, people who tell others how to deactivate these ads, and people giving examples of these ads.

And no, you are not getting any screenshots from me, because I am certainly not going to drive to a computer lab on the other side of town in the middle of the night to take a screenshot to satisfy your ego. In the same spirit I could ask you for a video proof of your MacBook Pro having keyboard issues. It's simply ridiculous. Built-in advertisement of Windows 10 is a known and widely discussed fact. My personal experience with it hardly matters.

 

[c0ppo]

You pointed out your personal experience, which differs greatly from other user experiences, and my own.
Now it hardly matters?

I agree. It does not.
Best regards, no need to push this anymore. My ego is satisfied

 

[MBAir2010]

Virtually any site (this includes searches on your phone, or in apps) you visit today tracks you. And one of the big thing they track is your searches. Look for toner or printer reviews on Cnet and you are going to get related adds. Look for Word features on a tech site and you are going to get office ads. Watch a YouTube video on solar for your home, and you are going to get solar ads, and emails. Selling your information is a big part of these "free" sites revenue streams. And then these search aggregators and ad placement companies use this information so that sites like this (and almost every other site) show you ads targeting you.

This never happened before on my mac,
These brief advice on pc related products and advice while i am only using word and these message protrude from the lower right corner of the screen.
But a dead horse is a dead horse, and food for stan barathians army!

 

[AndyMacAndMic]

This never happened before on my mac.

Yes that happens also on your Mac, but probably on your Mac the browser does not show messages.

Or maybe you use an Addblocker on your Mac and not on Windows? Lots of different reasons how adds can happen.

See an earlier post of mine how to disable (browser) messages in Windows as well.

Edit:
Reading some other posts as well: it isn't clear to me if you have problems with popup messages on your desktop, adds in your browser or both. In my answer above I refer to both.

 

[leman]

You pointed out your personal experience, which differs greatly from other user experiences, and my own.
Now it hardly matters?

What I pointed out was the fact that Windows 10 has in-built ads, which has been a topic of much controversy and discussion from the first day it was released. I am not sure what my personal experience has to do with it. I regret it if the tone of my post or the particular wording I used might have lead to any confusion.
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This never happened before on my mac,

If you never noticed anything like this, its maybe because you only use search engines and websites that have strict privacy policies. Spend some time with google servivces, amazon and the like, and the personalised internet ads will follow you like a magnet

 

[Martyimac]

If you never noticed anything like this, its maybe because you only use search engines and websites that have strict privacy policies. Spend some time with google servivces, amazon and the like, and the personalised internet ads will follow you like a magnet

But your original comments pertained to ads popping up on the Windows 10 home page. Your comment above talks about ads that pop up while browsing the internet. Two completely different topics of discussion.