Apple Admits to Court that Samsung Will Draw More Customers from Android than iOS

[Glideslope]

"I'm going to destroy Android, because it's a stolen product. I'm willing to go thermonuclear war on this." -Steve Jobs.

That was when Steve was here.

The Samsung stuff is a distraction. HTC will slowly become a non issue, Motorola will not be purchased by Google, as Google will be trying to make money, not give it away. Tim is going to make Billions off Android, not kill it.

Think of Android in the future as a type of automobile, and Apple as the gas station. If Android chooses to remove Apple's gas (Think Multi-Touch Patents) from it's tanks then it will die slowly due to Ice Cream Sandwich becoming two chocolate wafers, and some white liquid.

It's all about Apple receiving a % of every Android Phone made with licensing agreements. It's about kicking Google in the a**. Specifically Eric and his broken trust with Steve.

Everything else is a distraction from the real trajectory. Just watch.

 

[scoobydoo99]

Seriously.

I thought Steve Jobs said the way to succeed as a company is to 'innovate', I don't remember a quote where he said the way to succeed is to 'litigate'.

omg. when will you guys get it? this is such a non-story. Litigation is just a part of business. Apple and Samsung are not emotional about it. They don't care who's right or wrong (if anyone even is) - the point is to use the legal system as a weapon against competitors - slow them down, cost them money, delay their introduction of products, sometimes even win and get royalties. The point is, it's not some philosophical war, it's not a "childish" squabble, it's not an occasion to say "get a room and get it over with" as someone said. People who try to condescend to the litigants by belittling their motives are completely obtuse. These companies know what they are doing! It is part of their business plan just like research, marketing, and any other activity. They will ALWAYS be in litigation. They don't spend nearly as much time fretting over it as you people on these threads.

 

[KPOM]

That was when Steve was here.

It's all about Apple receiving a % of every Android Phone made with licensing agreements. It's about kicking Google in the a**. Specifically Eric and his broken trust with Steve.

Everything else is a distraction from the real trajectory. Just watch.

I think it's also about sending a message to Google, Samsung, HTC, et. al. If it were just about royalties, they'd have gone the same route as Microsoft and just asked for monetary damages.

By going after product bans, etc. Apple is sending a message that they won't let people copy their products without a fight. I think in Steve Jobs' case it was personal because it had happened to him once before (Microsoft got the better of Apple regarding the Mac and won in court), and because it seems like, from Steve Jobs' perspective, Eric Schmidt took advantage of his position as an Apple director to assist his own company in developing and marketing a competing product.

 

[KnightWRX]

Think of Android in the future as a type of automobile, and Apple as the gas station. If Android chooses to remove Apple's gas (Think Multi-Touch Patents) from it's tanks then it will die slowly due to Ice Cream Sandwich becoming two chocolate wafers, and some white liquid.

Apple has no such patent though, only patents that cover a few gestures. Stock Android's multi-touch doesn't infringe on these for now.

----------

Eric Schmidt took advantage of his position as an Apple director to assist his own company in developing and marketing a competing product.

Citation needed.

Really people, Apple invited Eric to the board, after (and this is key here) Google's purchase of Android.

All you guys saying Eric spied on the iPhone and iOS are calling Apple a big bunch of idiots, basically opening the door to the ennemy.

I don't think of Apple as such.

 

[voonyx]

3) Your battery begins to overheat.

4) You drop your phone in the water



Sure. Besides being able to easily replace the original battery with one with higher capacity (I always do this with a new smartphone).... it's very convenient to be able to swap in a fully charged battery when I want to go back out after a long day, or if I've just landed after a long flight watching videos, or if I'm going camping.

It's not super critical for me. Convenient? Absolutely.

Ok that's fair. I never doubted the convenience of it, I just dont think its some make or break thing. Its kind of silly when people argue SD cards and removable batteries as something that makes android better when neither have anything to do with android at all...

 

[Abazigal]

Yeah but it does not change the fact that removable battery is still better and will stay better than non-removable.

It is only better insofar that people actually use said function to their benefit. Simply offering that option alone isn't necessarily superior.

As mentioned, not everyone even comes close to maxing out the storage capacities of their phone to necessitate a SD card, and for transferring files, there are easily workarounds like dropbox. There are certain aspects of android you can customise, but again, how much does that actually benefit you? I certainly haven't felt like I have lost out in any way, and this coming from a guy who can't even be bothered to change the wallpaper on my imac (or any other PC I have used).

As for me, my iphone's batt easily sees me through the entire day with ~30% batt life to spare, and if need be, I can easily charge it while at work. The only time it may come in handy is if I were in a hurry to go somewhere, and realised I had forgotten to charge my phone the night before (which can be remedied by simply being more meticulous).

So yeah, if you insist on pressing that issue, I can agree with you that having a removable battery is likely better, with the caveat that said feature may not be such a big deal for the majority of people. I certainly won't miss a feature I never had need for in the first place.

 

[aristobrat]

Yeah but it does not change the fact that removable battery is still better and will stay better than non-removable.

IMO, they each have their pros and cons.

Removable batteries do "stay better", and don't add bulk to the phone.
They typically require the phone to be restarted when swapped in, which can suck if you're on a marathon work conference call.
They typically only fit one model of phone, so you're constantly rebuying them each time you get a new phone.

For the iPhone, you get a generic dock charger like below.
It adds bulk to the phone while it's recharging it.
It doesn't require restarting the phone to use.
It fits all generation iPhones, iPod touches, and many iPods, so you're not buying a new battery each time you upgrade to a new Apple device.
It's extremely easy to share.

 

[voonyx]

It is only better insofar that people actually use said function to their benefit. Simply offering that option alone isn't necessarily superior.

As mentioned, not everyone even comes close to maxing out the storage capacities of their phone to necessitate a SD card, and for transferring files, there are easily workarounds like dropbox. There are certain aspects of android you can customise, but again, how much does that actually benefit you? I certainly haven't felt like I have lost out in any way, and this coming from a guy who can't even be bothered to change the wallpaper on my imac (or any other PC I have used).

As for me, my iphone's batt easily sees me through the entire day with ~30% batt life to spare, and if need be, I can easily charge it while at work. The only time it may come in handy is if I were in a hurry to go somewhere, and realised I had forgotten to charge my phone the night before (which can be remedied by simply being more meticulous).

So yeah, if you insist on pressing that issue, I can agree with you that having a removable battery is likely better, with the caveat that said feature may not be such a big deal for the majority of people. I certainly won't miss a feature I never had need for in the first place.

This is my opinion as well. It's convenient, yes, but is it "better" or is it a "dealbreaker"? That depends on every individual user. The Droid RAZR doesn't have a removable battery. Oddly, people on the android forums are still talking about what a great phone it is. That in itself proves that sd cards and removable batteries making a phone "better" is purely subjective.

 

[Glideslope]

Apple has no such patent though, only patents that cover a few gestures. Stock Android's multi-touch doesn't infringe on these for now.

----------





Citation needed.

Really people, Apple invited Eric to the board, after (and this is key here) Google's purchase of Android.

All you guys saying Eric spied on the iPhone and iOS are calling Apple a big bunch of idiots, basically opening the door to the ennemy.

I don't think of Apple as such.

They will be enforced by the end of 2012


Eric used his presence on Apple's board to gain favor with Steve. He was then given access to information that he then applied to Android. He used Steve, and broke a solemn oath of trust. It's fairly obvious that this betrayal consumed Steve until his last breath.

Don't underestimate Tim's commitment to his friends last wish.

 

[haruhiko]

Over 3 years of debate...

People just won't improve.

For smooth, polished experience with tonnes of apps and games, top-notch after-sale services, for the ones who don't bother or don't have the time to disintegrate their phones, choose Apple.

For the ones who want to customise their homescreen and sideload apps by just installing the .apk to the phone (piracy?), for the ones who have super big hands and won't be satisfied with any screen smaller then 5", go Android.

End of discussion.

For end users I don't think "who is copying who" is an issue. But just look at the Samsung Galaxy S vs iPhone 3GS... if you don't think it's a copy, then it's not to you. If you think that it's a copy, it is. Legal rules and statutes to a certain extent are just tools or paths for lawyers (and maybe the judge) to reach their desired judgments.

 

[KnightWRX]

They will be enforced by the end of 2012

Citation needed. What patents exactly and how does Android infringe on them ? Remember, stating your opinion as fact is quite the big fail.

Eric used his presence on Apple's board to gain favor with Steve. He was then given access to information that he then applied to Android. He used Steve, and broke a solemn oath of trust. It's fairly obvious that this betrayal consumed Steve until his last breath.

Don't underestimate Tim's commitment to his friends last wish.

Again, your opinion. The truth is Apple knew ahead of time about Android, before invinting Eric to the board. You're basically calling Apple's board idiots. I don't subscribe to that fantasy scenario.

 

[voonyx]

Citation needed. What patents exactly and how does Android infringe on them ? Remember, stating your opinion as fact is quite the big fail.

You do the same thing, say things without any basis and then ask everyone for sources. Practice what you preach.

 

[KnightWRX]

sideload apps by just installing the .apk to the phone (piracy?),

So dragging an .app bundle from a .dmg image downloaded on a website is piracy now ?

Sideloading apks and installing apps from outside the Mac App Store is basically the same thing. It has nothing to do with piracy.

 

[jontech]

Can we just go back to the pre lawsuit days where my kids run into Best Buy and mistake a Samsung product for the real deal before squealing "Make the bad pad go away daddy!. Make it go away!"

 

[Rodimus Prime]

This is my opinion as well. It's convenient, yes, but is it "better" or is it a "dealbreaker"? That depends on every individual user. The Droid RAZR doesn't have a removable battery. Oddly, people on the android forums are still talking about what a great phone it is. That in itself proves that sd cards and removable batteries making a phone "better" is purely subjective.

And if you look threw those same forums they say draw back is no removable battery or SD card. It is just not a deal breaker or enough to not say it is a great phone.
You confused this issues of removable vs non removable batteries.

 

[voonyx]

And if you look threw those same forums they say draw back is no removable battery or SD card. It is just not a deal breaker or enough to not say it is a great phone.
You confused this issues of removable vs non removable batteries.

Is this not what I just said....? I didn't confuse anything. It's not a dealbreaker. Perhaps you should go back and read my post?

What I'm saying is people who say that iPhone is somehow "worse" because it doesn't have a removable battery or an SD card are silly, because it's not a dealbreaker and really not that big a deal. The RAZR is a fine phone, and doesn't have a removable battery. The Nexus will be a fine phone and it doesn't have an SD card. The iPhone is a fine phone and doesn't have neither. Saying android is somehow better because of removable batteries or SD cards is purely subjective, as proven by the fact that you don't have some crazy uproar because of the RAZR or Nexus.

 

[Rodimus Prime]

Is this not what I just said....? I didn't confuse anything. It's not a dealbreaker. Perhaps you should go back and read my post?

What I'm saying is people who say that iPhone is somehow "worse" because it doesn't have a removable battery or an SD card are silly, because it's not a dealbreaker and really not that big a deal. The RAZR is a fine phone, and doesn't have a removable battery. The Nexus will be a fine phone and it doesn't have an SD card. The iPhone is a fine phone and doesn't have neither. Saying android is somehow better because of removable batteries or SD cards is purely subjective, as proven by the fact that you don't have some crazy uproar because of the RAZR or Nexus.

No you acted like it is a non reason.
The iPhones lack of both get added to a list of reason why they choose one phone over it.
Personally I feel they both are minor reasons. Getting the battery or SD card out of my Atrix 4G is a pain and not something I like doing but that is more because of my otterbox case than the phone. If it was not for the case it would be quick and easy.

 

[ghostlyorb]

As an Android user right now... I can say that Android will never surpass iOS. Not if Apple keeps bringing it to more carriers. I will be getting the next iPhone. Android may be nice in the fact one can hack it and Google does not care, but it is still not as fast and smooth as iOS (on my phone at least).

 

[FakeWozniak]

I actually enjoy reading about the legal wranglings. Maybe a section like the Verge has on "policy"?

 

[voonyx]

No you acted like it is a non reason.
The iPhones lack of both get added to a list of reason why they choose one phone over it.
Personally I feel they both are minor reasons. Getting the battery or SD card out of my Atrix 4G is a pain and not something I like doing but that is more because of my otterbox case than the phone. If it was not for the case it would be quick and easy.

You're telling me what I meant, now? How does that work? I stated that I didn't see any practical purpose for it and it doesn't make a phone "better". kdarling provided 2 more examples of when he could use them, and i agreed. I then stated that its subjective, which I stated from the beginning. Having a phone with an SD card or a removable battery doesn't make the phone "better" for everyone. In my previous post I said perhaps you should read my other post. Now I'm saying you absolutely should read my other post because you've misconstrued it twice now.

 

[robeddie]

omg. when will you guys get it? this is such a non-story. Litigation is just a part of business. Apple and Samsung are not emotional about it. They don't care who's right or wrong (if anyone even is) - the point is to use the legal system as a weapon against competitors - slow them down, cost them money, delay their introduction of products, sometimes even win and get royalties. The point is, it's not some philosophical war, it's not a "childish" squabble, it's not an occasion to say "get a room and get it over with" as someone said. People who try to condescend to the litigants by belittling their motives are completely obtuse. These companies know what they are doing! It is part of their business plan just like research, marketing, and any other activity. They will ALWAYS be in litigation. They don't spend nearly as much time fretting over it as you people on these threads.

Disagree. While many companies litigate at times, this non-stop, protracted and extremely virulent battle between Apple and Samsung is, as far as I can tell, a good measure more intense than most companies.

Throw a couple examples of recent legal spats between companies that have gone on this long and involved this kind of scope and number of litigations, and I'll be willing to concede, but this seems like it's far and above the 'average' corporate 'business plan'.

 

[Swift]

Nonsensical

How can Samsung take customers from Android? It IS Android! If it gains customers at the expense of HTC, Android adds customers. If HTC takes Samsung customers away, so what? It's all Android!

Android customers are way less loyal to HTC, Moto or Samsung -- or the rest -- than Apple customers are loyal to Apple. What's that got to do with anything?

 

[Swift]

omg. when will you guys get it? this is such a non-story. Litigation is just a part of business. Apple and Samsung are not emotional about it. They don't care who's right or wrong (if anyone even is) - the point is to use the legal system as a weapon against competitors - slow them down, cost them money, delay their introduction of products, sometimes even win and get royalties. The point is, it's not some philosophical war, it's not a "childish" squabble, it's not an occasion to say "get a room and get it over with" as someone said. People who try to condescend to the litigants by belittling their motives are completely obtuse. These companies know what they are doing! It is part of their business plan just like research, marketing, and any other activity. They will ALWAYS be in litigation. They don't spend nearly as much time fretting over it as you people on thee threads.

Apple has been through this before with Microsoft. They were far too late in starting up the legal engines with MS. As a result, their innovative Mac had been caught up to by '91. Partly, that was the slow pace of improvement after Steve was tossed, and the dopey agreements with MS were put in place and the deadheads in Cupertino dawdled and didn't defend the Mac, then it was game over, nearly, in 1997, after a decade when their market share and profits dwindled. Steve put the company on solid grounds, and he saw the necessity of defending what they'd accomplished. If you copy, you will go to legal hell. You will at least have to spend lots to defend yourself. (And it won't matter that Google gave you a free OS, if it wasn't unemcumbered.)

Do me a favor, look up HTC's profits this past quarter. Not good. They might make the best Android -- or maybe Samsung, now -- but what happens? They're eking out a small profit, and Apple's lawyers are on their backs. My advice? License a system, or write one of your own. Come up with a different UI, as Microsoft did. Enough with the imitation crap.

 

[marksman]

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_0 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9A334 Safari/7534.48.3)

I like samsung's argument that because Apple can't meet demand for their products it is okay for Samsung to copy Apple to help meet the demand. Samsung is clearly being benevolent and just trying to help Apple out when they copy their products. Samsung is just misunderstood.

 

[marksman]

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_0 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9A334 Safari/7534.48.3)

What is weird about this thread is how many Mac rumor posters still think there is a page 2. Page 2 went away a while ago.