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Apple Announces New iPhone SE With 4.7-Inch Display, A13 Chip, and Touch ID, Starts at $399
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At some point you have to learn what a meritocracy is...
The usually way it goes that the next iteration of the same processor is usually faster than the old one. My understanding is that GPU is combined within the same chip with CPU, which makes it confusing that the A12 is faster than A13. I could understand if it had a separate GPU.
So while the cameras on the 1st SE (came out March 31, 2016) looks the same on the outside as the camera in the 2nd SE known as the SE 2020 edition they are quite different. The new iPhone SE 2020 edition is slightly better than the iPhone's 8 camera and is much better than the camera in the 1st SE iPhone that came out in 2016. The iPhone SE that came out in 2016 is pretty much an iPhone 6S in the body of an iPhone 5S. The camera in the 1st SE and the iPhone 6s are indentical in capabilities and specs.
The iPhone 8 and iPhone SE both have a single 12MP, f/1.8 wide camera with digital zoom up to 5x. The iPhone SE 2020 edition get a sapphire crystal lens cover (a feature not on the iPhone 8). The iPhone SE 2020 edition allows Portrait Mode (limited to people), Portrait Lighting, Smart HDR, and QuickTake video, all of which are not available on the iPhone 8. Both the iPhone 8 and the iPhone SE 2020 edition can record 4K video and have the same 7MP, f/2.2 front camera. Only difference with the front camera on the SE 2020 edition is you can now take portrait videos with the front camera (couldn't do that on iPhone 8).
The cameras on the iPhone SE and 6S Plus are identical. Since the SE has the same camera and processor as the 6S, it also shares 4K video recording at 30 frames per second. Not only that but it comes with the slo-mo video recording that lets you shoot at a whopping 240fps for 720p and 120fps at 1080p resolutions.
Basically the SE 2020 edition is an improvement over the iPhone 8,7,6S, 6 etc. It also quite a bit better than the iPhone SE from March 2016.
Great phone at a good price, BUT not an SE. It's an iPhone 8 replacement and not an SE replacement. Missed opportunity to keep the niche alive!
Well yes, but only upon release and for the next six months. Starting with iPhone 7 in 2016, Apple went to a dual camera flagship, though you had to buy the Plus model to get it.
And I think it was kind of crazy to expect the main camera to be from the 11. That’s an expensive sensor, with the 100% Focus Pixels that allow for night mode; the SE was never going to have night mode.
Of course people hoped for night mode, just like they hoped for dual camera. Neither was ever a realistic ask of a $399 iPhone.
I take your point about other phones, but Apple doesn’t usually pay all that much attention to what other brands offer.
Upon release is all that ever counts, doesn’t it? The 2016 SE at $399 had a flagship level camera on release. What’s more, in terms of image quality it didn’t really start to lag behind the curve (for iPhones) until XS and XR jumped into computational photography bandwagon with Smart HDR in September 2018. So we’re talking about 2,5 years of relevant camera experience on $399 iPhone.
Compared to that, the 2020 SE, while it’s praised for being a great value (and rightfully so) still isn’t as good a value as the OG SE was.
Unlike the 2016 model, 2020 SE has a camera and battery life that are significantly behind the curve already on release.
Edit: Thinking about why the new SE isn’t as good value as the OG SE was I guess it has to do with the flagship costing $650 at the time (so only $250 difference) while it costs $699 to $999 now (so 300-600$, $450 on average difference- a much bigger jump).
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The new SE takes away almost 100% of the reasons I bought the original SE.
1. The size. The 4 inch screen (approx 120mm H x approx 60mm W) really works well and it's why a lot of people bought the original SE. The new SE plus sized phone is a huge downgrade.
Sure I like the original SE form factor but that's not here no there. Both new and old form factors get the job done.
2. It gets the basics done well. SE purchasers don't want all the bells and whistles . . . well the one exception tot hat would be battery life. "About the same as Iphone 8" WTF is this. Can't Apple tell us exactly how long it should last? Of cause the figure given is lowballed to prevent those pesky lawsuit happy idiots going to court.
3. The cost of the new SE outside the US is not cheap. $749 (where I live, tax included) for the base model is not cheap. In saying that the original SE here was not cheap either. But it is the most affordable iPhone and to that end it will sell well. I didn't consider the original SE a budget model phone. Apple don't do budget model phones. Never have. The 5c was the closest Apple ever got to that.
*******
I understand Apple wanted to rid themselces of the 4 inch phones. One less size to worry about. But . . . the whole iPhone 11 mess exists.
11 Pro - 5.8 inch
11 - 6.1 inch
11 Pro Max - 6.5 inch
Honestly having the 4th size at 4 or 4.7 inch makes no difference to anyone. It's still an outlier size for everyone to deal with.
I honestly think the SE and now SE-2 is just Apple's way to rid the supply chain of excess parts not ussed up in the previous generation of phones. I am sure Apple is very happy with it's marketing team to come up with a way to make old, no longer current parts marketable and actually sound interesting to a portion of the public.
*******
The reality is this. What the people want and what Apple are doing here are not he the same.
People want a small inexpensive phone with iOS that does the basics well.
Apple want a way to clear out their supply chains of older no longer current parts.
These older parts will not always make up exactly what the customer wants as evidenced with the SE-2.
Apple know if the price is not too high, these customers will just compromise.
It's not what I want but . . .
It's not phone sized but it's also not a huge phablet like all the other Apple phones
It's not a great form factor at all but it's still very usable
The camera is not the best but it's still better than no camera
The battery life is not great but it's good enough
For these people, the iPhone SE, whatever form it takes over the coming years and decades will work for them.
However for those who want a decent phone sized phone (ie approx 4 inches) you have to leave the Apple ecosystem. Apple has abandoned you.
1. The size. The 4 inch screen (approx 120mm H x approx 60mm W) really works well and it's why a lot of people bought the original SE. The new SE plus sized phone is a huge downgrade.
Sure I like the original SE form factor but that's not here no there. Both new and old form factors get the job done.
2. It gets the basics done well. SE purchasers don't want all the bells and whistles . . . well the one exception tot hat would be battery life. "About the same as Iphone 8" WTF is this. Can't Apple tell us exactly how long it should last? Of cause the figure given is lowballed to prevent those pesky lawsuit happy idiots going to court.
3. The cost of the new SE outside the US is not cheap. $749 (where I live, tax included) for the base model is not cheap. In saying that the original SE here was not cheap either. But it is the most affordable iPhone and to that end it will sell well. I didn't consider the original SE a budget model phone. Apple don't do budget model phones. Never have. The 5c was the closest Apple ever got to that.
*******
I understand Apple wanted to rid themselces of the 4 inch phones. One less size to worry about. But . . . the whole iPhone 11 mess exists.
11 Pro - 5.8 inch
11 - 6.1 inch
11 Pro Max - 6.5 inch
Honestly having the 4th size at 4 or 4.7 inch makes no difference to anyone. It's still an outlier size for everyone to deal with.
I honestly think the SE and now SE-2 is just Apple's way to rid the supply chain of excess parts not ussed up in the previous generation of phones. I am sure Apple is very happy with it's marketing team to come up with a way to make old, no longer current parts marketable and actually sound interesting to a portion of the public.
*******
The reality is this. What the people want and what Apple are doing here are not he the same.
People want a small inexpensive phone with iOS that does the basics well.
Apple want a way to clear out their supply chains of older no longer current parts.
These older parts will not always make up exactly what the customer wants as evidenced with the SE-2.
Apple know if the price is not too high, these customers will just compromise.
It's not what I want but . . .
It's not phone sized but it's also not a huge phablet like all the other Apple phones
It's not a great form factor at all but it's still very usable
The camera is not the best but it's still better than no camera
The battery life is not great but it's good enough
For these people, the iPhone SE, whatever form it takes over the coming years and decades will work for them.
However for those who want a decent phone sized phone (ie approx 4 inches) you have to leave the Apple ecosystem. Apple has abandoned you.
Not at all. They sold that phone for 2.5 years. For 80% of its time on market, it didn’t have the flagship camera.
As someone with a 6s and little personal interest in the 2016 SE (though I bought two for family members because they were the cheapest iPhone), I strongly disagree the 4.7” SE is a worse value than the OG.
It’s got a great camera (the camera from a phone that was $749 last year, but with even more features), a great display, a screaming fast SoC, 3GB RAM, dual SIM (eSIM), WiFi 6, ultra-fast 2nd gen TouchID and faster LTE with more bands. Probably a few things I forgot, too.
No, compared to the OG, the new SE is a much better phone day 1, and it’s got a 5+ year life. Apple’s going to sell a ton of them. Probably more the first year than the 4” model did in it’s entire run. imo of course.
Hm, how so? I just don’t see it.
Chipset
OG: flagship - New: flagship
RAM
OG: flagship - New: worse than flagship
Battery life
OG: flagship (or better) - New: worse than flagship (possibly by a margin)
Camera
OG: flagship - New: worse than flagship
I think John Gruber nailed it.
daringfireball.net
He said the SE is a once in every 4 years iPhone based on parts and technology that is slightyout of date or not out of date at all . . . at the time of itinital release.
A lot of people can't afford or don't want to upgrade their phone every year or even every 2 years. But every 4 years? You'll easily notice now it's upgraded in every way to the predecessor. Sure not every upgrade is an improvement, but for those who want a longer 4 year cycle between phones and are ok with a smaller form factor, this is the phone for you.
Though I do agree 100% where John says the new SE is just "do I want the large "SE-2 or an even larger X iPhone" Totally ignoring the qyestion "do I evne want a large iPhone in the first place?"
Of cause this is just Apple clearing out it's inventory channels of older parts. Apple just found a way of making this appealing to the customers.
The SE line of phones are not phone sized phones. Apple does not make phone sized phones anymore. The SE line is for people who want upgraded phones every 4 years, who really want to feel their upgrades and have no want to pay top dollar for the iterative small upgrades every year.
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Of cause the SE-2 screen size is another issue all together.
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OG: Touch ID v1 (flagship at the time was Touch ID v2) - New: Still has Touch ID which doesn't compare to Face IDone is not strictly better than the other.
The Quadrennial iPhone SE Schedule
There’s nothing new strategically about the new iPhone SE — it’s a nearly exact replay of the original SE strategy from 2016, before the iPhone X era began.
daringfireball.net
He said the SE is a once in every 4 years iPhone based on parts and technology that is slightyout of date or not out of date at all . . . at the time of itinital release.
A lot of people can't afford or don't want to upgrade their phone every year or even every 2 years. But every 4 years? You'll easily notice now it's upgraded in every way to the predecessor. Sure not every upgrade is an improvement, but for those who want a longer 4 year cycle between phones and are ok with a smaller form factor, this is the phone for you.
Though I do agree 100% where John says the new SE is just "do I want the large "SE-2 or an even larger X iPhone" Totally ignoring the qyestion "do I evne want a large iPhone in the first place?"
Of cause this is just Apple clearing out it's inventory channels of older parts. Apple just found a way of making this appealing to the customers.
The SE line of phones are not phone sized phones. Apple does not make phone sized phones anymore. The SE line is for people who want upgraded phones every 4 years, who really want to feel their upgrades and have no want to pay top dollar for the iterative small upgrades every year.
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No one walks around naked. You don't have to see people's ***** or ugly parts. They are covered up by (sometimes) good clothing. The same is true for phones. As long as the case looks really good, is not bulky, and protects the phone from drops, that's all that matters.
Of cause the SE-2 screen size is another issue all together.
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The rumour is the SE has a 4 year cycle. So expect SE-3 in 2024.
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OG: Touch ID v1 (flagship at the time was Touch ID v2) - New: Still has Touch ID which doesn't compare to Face IDone is not strictly better than the other.
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I was never comparing it to any flagship. That’s not particularly relevant; take it for what it is, not what it isn’t.
It’s got a great camera, a great display, a screaming fast, top of the line SoC, 3GB RAM, dual SIM (eSIM), WiFi 6, instant TouchID, wireless charging and fast LTE. That’s a helluva iPhone for $399.
You buy it today, keep it for 5 years and it’s all of $7/month. That’s an incredible value. Realistically, it’s all the iPhone anyone really needs, isn’t it? Sure some want (and will pay for) more, but the SE checks the boxes. Just my 2¢.
Great product for those who are price sensitive and/or those who are conservative and just want their ‘traditional’ iPhone updated.
It’s likely that these people are going to take a few photos and don’t need a camera supporting modes that they probably don’t know are there.
With no change to the chassis to accommodate a larger battery and using the same black faceplate on all models, this is obviously as cheap as Apple could make it
Mind you, I miss having a modern small phone. Let’s hope the rumours of the 5.4 inch phone are true.
It’s likely that these people are going to take a few photos and don’t need a camera supporting modes that they probably don’t know are there.
With no change to the chassis to accommodate a larger battery and using the same black faceplate on all models, this is obviously as cheap as Apple could make it
Mind you, I miss having a modern small phone. Let’s hope the rumours of the 5.4 inch phone are true.
Guessing this is Australia, based on the price.
So $749AUD is about $470 USD.
10% of that price is GST, so the 'untaxed' AUD price is $681.
$681AUD is $429USD.
Obviously exchange rates fluctuate all the time, but also consider that median income in Australia is higher both in local respective currency, and even when exchanged to USD, than the US.
Median income for Australian men is $77.8K (~49.1K USD) / year, for women is $53.4K (~33.7K USD) /year - across all workers.
Median income for US men is $46.6K / year, for women is $32.6K / year - across all workers.
That’s what I’m doing. You said:
And I offered my view why the 2020 SE is by far a worse value than 2016 SE was at the time.
It’s simple: 2016 SE had way more in common with the current flagship (6s) than 2020 does (11, 11Pro) thus making it a better value at the time of release.
Yes, 2020 SE has a lot going for it and it’s *enough* for a lot, maybe even most people *needs*. But I was expecting more based on what the SE offered in 2016. Particularly in the camera and battery life departments.
Agreed, there is a huge degrade in the way Apple is using video ads for the product and it is not very good at all.
Well, you can define value as having the most features in common with the current flagship if you wish. I prefer to define value as how satisfied I’d be with the product if I paid the asking price.
“Value” is a personal opinion. You highly value two things that this iPhone doesn’t have: a much better camera than the $600 XR, and a bigger battery than can fit into its iPhone 8 body.
If those are the things you’ve been anticipating the past year as you awaited the new SE’s arrival, I can understand why you’re so disappointed. But neither of those features were ever going to be possible.
We’ve been told for many, many months that the SE was going to be an iPhone 8 with an A13 and 3GB RAM. We got that, and more. It exceeded what was rumored, by including such features as a better camera, better LTE, WiFi 6 and dual SIM. Based on what was rumored, I’m thrilled with the SE and it could be my next; my 6s won’t last forever.
But I’m really looking forward to the 5.4” iPhone 12 this fall. It’ll be a few hundred dollars more expensive, but it’ll have an A14, 4GB, an OLED display, dual cameras, 5G, a hefty battery (not as large as the 6.1”, obviously), FaceID and importantly, though thicker, it’ll have a smaller footprint than the SE 🙂
100% agreed, it's just an iPhone 8S without any significant improvement and barely any faster than the A11 and the form factor is not very small to cater to the original iPhone SE customers.
Now talking strictly external design; its has the same design as the iPhone 6,6S,7, and 8
Now as far as the display, its decent, but its the same display as found on the iPhone 8: 4.7-inch Retina HD 1334x750 resolution at 326 ppi, along with True Tone, P3 wide color, and 625 nits of max brightness.
As far as touch id: it has the second generation touch id first introduced on the iPhone 6S
Now some might say wait touch id was first introduced on the iPhone 5S.
That's true, but there were 2 generations of touch id.
The iPhone 5S and iPhone 6 got the FIRST GENERATION touch id
The iPhone 6S,7,and 8 got the SECOND Generation touch id which Apple says is faster and more accurate
The iPhone 8,iPhone 8 Plus, and iPhone X got the LTE Advanced modem which supports theoretical speeds up to 600Mbps
The iPhone 7 and iPhone 7 Plus got the LTE Advanced modem which supports theoretical speeds up to 450 Mbps
The iPhone 6s and 6s Plus, got LTE Advanced modem that supports theoretical speeds up to 300 Mbps
The iPhone 6/6 Plus got LTE-Advanced that supports up to theoretical speeds of 150 Mbps
The iPhone SE 2020 edition has many improvements when compared to an iPhone 8 or earlier iPhone. I've discuused that in an earlier post of mine in this very thread. Refer to that post if you want the extra info on the camera.
The iPhone 6S,7,and 8 got 2GB of Ram. If the rumors are proven true about this iPhone SE 2020 getting 3GB of Ram than that'll be another improvement compared to iPhone 8 and earlier models.
Yup, the iPhone SE 2020 edition gets some really cool features such as the A13 chip, Gigabit-class LTE, 802.11ax Wi‑Fi 6, Express Cards with Power reserve, 3GB of RAM, Dual Sim (eSIM), and slightly better camera when compared to an iphone 8 or earlier
Gigabit-class LTE:was first included/introduced on the iPhone XS and iPhone XS Max and now included in the iPhone SE 2020 edition
dual SIM (eSIM): was first included/introduced on the iPhone XS and iPhone XS Max and now included in the iPhone SE 2020 edition
The A13 chip, 802.11ax Wi‑Fi 6, Express Cards with power reserve are 3 new features first introduced/included on the iPhone 11,11 Pro, and 11 Pro MAX and now on the new iPhone SE 2020 edition.
Express Cards with power reserve feature, also included in the iPhone 11 and 11 Pro, allows for authentication of Express Transit cards even when an iPhone's battery is exhausted. It can also be used for the "CarKey" function that Apple has in the works which will let an iPhone serve as an alternative to a traditional car key in vehicles that support the feature.
Overall the iPhone SE 2020 is a great iPhone especially for the price.
Agreed. Good analysis. But isn’t the camera actually better than the XR? That’s how it looked when I did the head-to-head comparison using the Apple tool on the website. (The front camera is somewhat better than the 8, as it has portrait mode and Portrait Lighting effects.)
iPhone - Compare Models
Compare features and technical specifications for iPhone 15 Pro, iPhone 15 Pro Max, iPhone 15, iPhone 15 Plus, iPhone SE, and many more.
www.apple.com
Apple is making a bad mistake by not developing ultrasonic fingerprint and it's why Tim Cook is not a visionary leader that resulted in most of the Apple products being ordinary rather than extraordinary.
Agreed. Good analysis. But isn’t the camera actually better than the XR? That’s how it looked when I did the head-to-head comparison using the Apple tool on the website. (The front camera is somewhat better than the 8, as it has portrait mode and Portrait Lighting effects.)
iPhone - Compare Models
Compare features and technical specifications for iPhone 15 Pro, iPhone 15 Pro Max, iPhone 15, iPhone 15 Plus, iPhone SE, and many more.www.apple.com
The iPhone XR has a slightly better front camera known as a TrueDepth front camera vs the iPhone SE 2020 front Facetime HD camera. The iPhone XR front camera can do Animoji and Memoji vs iPhone SE 2020 edition's front camera can't do that. Although both have the same spec 7MP with 2.2 apeture front camera.
Yes, while most specs between the iPhone XR rear camera and iPhone SE 2020 rear are the same. There are a few key differences listed below. So Yes the iPhone SE 2020 has a slightly better rear camera.
Both iPhone XR and iPhone SE 2020 got 12MP with 1.8 Apeture rear camera, True Tone flash, Optical image stabilization, and 5x digital zoom.
The iPhone SE 2020 has Portrait Lighting with six effects (Natural, Studio, Contour, Stage, Stage Mono, High‑Key Mono).
While the iPhone XR has Portrait Lighting with three effects (Natural, Studio, Contour)
The SE 2020 gets the Next-generation Smart HDR for photos and QuickTake video
The iPhone XR has Smart HDR and does NOT get QuickTake video