Apple Announces Over Two Million iPhone 5 Pre-Orders in First Day of Sales

[Geckotek]

this is the biggest problem for many of us who are more interested in the market and care about it all and aren't fanboys.

I make a comment "that item isn't what i'd call innovative", sudenly it's me saying the phone is completely devoid of any innovation and i'm some anti-apple hater.

the problem is also reversed. Apple Fanboys who absolutely refuse any criticism, even when facts are there.


Criticism of something doesn't imply hatred, nor allegiance. I criticise out of study. Not emotion.

it sucks being a moderate. Nobody likes us

Agreed. I think I get so caught up responding to the extremists (I'm really trying to avoid the 't' word here) that I often assume someone is making an "extreme" statement...even when they are just honestly criticizing.

 

[Flux.Capacitor]

I completely agree with this, but I think you're ignoring a small portion of people that are causing a huge part of the problem. There is a faction of people, call them fandroids, Apple haters, whatever you like, that come in here and specifically stir up trouble. Their main focus is not to honestly criticize, but to just consistently stir things up to get a response from the forum. We have the same on the Apple side as well, but....this is an Apple forum so I don't see as much of an issue with that.

Either way, people left in the middle (like myself) end up caught up in the arguments becuase we feel the need to reply (even though we should probably ignore).

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I agree with your original statement, I just felt compelled to make my clarification due to so many that have stated that Apple no longer innovates. Sorry if I incorrectly implied you felt that way.

I totally agree with you on this. I come in here and try really hard not to get sucked in. I could probably be used to define a true Apple Fanboy. I've been using Apple products for decades but I feel that sometimes us Apple fans are like a bunch of dumb a** fish who still haven't realized that that delicious floating piece of food in the water has a hook attached, so we bite, and the fight begins.

As I posted before, I understand this is a Mac News site, and that many people use both Apple and other products, but I don't understand why, if you don't own an iPhone, don't care for an iPhone... why are you on an iPhone thread? Is it just to stir things up? Same goes the other way around. Don't troll the Android boards if you don't use android. Why do people feel the need to change others' opinions or beliefs? If someone like the S3, by all means let them be. It's a good phone. And if we Fanboy's want to believe that 2 million in one day is "blown away" worthy... so be it. I don't see the gain in trying to discredit one or the other, other than the trolling effect.

 

[Namjins]

Fair enough

I always am.

I'll keep that in mind for future posts. :-D

 

[Supermule]

You're entitled to your opinion and I'm entitled to my opinion that your opinion is confused.

Niche and different don't mean the same thing but even accepting your definition of "not being general/classic" Apple remains different for all the reasons I outlined. Maybe you can point out another company like Apple that designs its own hardware and software and provides it's own stores, services, media and app stores and releases only one new iteration per year focusing on one direction rather than trying to fill every niche? No? Then Apple is not "general/classic".

I didn't say the click wheel wasn't good. It was. But you said you want different, not better. If you want different you should be happy they did something different even if it isn't better.

You should keep your focus on the subject. Not that you dont understand/agree with my way of expressing myself. Go after the ball and not the man. Its allways a sign og topic-weakness when a user goes after other users. Now, that was a forum-lesson for you and on my bill

Why should I find a company that do as much different stuff as Apple? Its not a battle on multitasking. I just want a nice new phone. And I have some demands in that regard. "Nice new phone" for me is not a phone that looks and feels like the last phone I had. I had expectations that Apple could deliver what I wanted. But they couldn't. Thats all. And know Im elaborating over Apple and there new productline. And I dont think Im the only one whos disappointed, and mainreason is that I know Apple could have made something surprising, but they dont due to they dont have to.

 

[MattInOz]

Foreigner stuff. They often use . instead of , in numbers.

Crazy people don't use inches, feet or gallons either. It's just crazy

Well it isn't metric, not as far the standard is concerned. Next we'll be using centimetres all over the joint.

 

[EdwardSung]

I totally agree with you. And thats why they are loosing a costumer like me. Im and economist, and I no all about doing max. calc., but maybe Apple could find a "cooler" way than just to become the worlds biggest company - how fun is it really in the end? They should use their savings to buy more of there own stocks, become more independent of investers, and just give full throttle out on their own tangent - maybe then to a smaller audience.

Today allmost everything in the consumer market is about being bigger or stronger than "the guy next door".

Good point. Obviously it makes better economic sense to be conservative and play it safe, but it seems like a squandered opportunity for a company as innovative as Apple to not spend some of the vast capital they've accumulated to take some chances and get back some of that avant garde spirit of the early iMac days. Safe is safe, but Apple also risks turning into the next Sony.

 

[Flux.Capacitor]

this is the biggest problem for many of us who are more interested in the market and care about it all and aren't fanboys.

I make a comment "that item isn't what i'd call innovative", sudenly it's me saying the phone is completely devoid of any innovation and i'm some anti-apple hater.

the problem is also reversed. Apple Fanboys who absolutely refuse any criticism, even when facts are there.


Criticism of something doesn't imply hatred, nor allegiance. I criticise out of study. Not emotion.

it sucks being a moderate. Nobody likes us

Thats fine, nothing wrong with disagreeing. And I understand the other side of the coin as well. the Apple fans who take everything waaay too personal. But for me personally, I get bothered when I see the same posters who appear to comb through the site, looking for something to debate "against" an apple product. As if it's their duty to go inform all the "misinformed" about the inferiority of their product(s). The truth is, people don't care. S# users dont care about their plastic case. iPhone users don't care about their smaller, NFC less phone. iOS users don't care that they are in a walled garden and Google users aren't going to listen to the people saying they are being used and tracked by Big Brother. The truth is EVERY platform has it's pro's and cons, and there are people for everything.

And don't be so hard on yourself, Moderate... not everyone dislikes you.

Just don't talk bad about MY Apple product!!! (kidding)

 

[tigress666]

That's the thing, you're both mistaken. There is no "haters". Some people just don't agree with everything Apple does. One guy stating a "negative" opinion of one facet of Apple does not make him a Fandroid or Samsung-ite. Heck, owning a Samsung or Android product does not disqualify anyone from coming to MacRumors.

That's what I mean by mistaking your opinion (that is, thinking we're all Apple enthusiasts or supporters) for forum rules. There are no rules that stops casual Apple users from coming here. Those users might not agree with everything Apple stands for or does. They might also own products from other vendors. You know they don't check your list of gadgets at the Apple store before selling you their trinkets right ?

I'm sorry, but while there are people who prefer Android and think it is better, there are haters too (Some who have only glommed onto Android cause it's the one most likely to topple Apple). There are people who do want to see Apple fail because they really dislike non open systems on principle and dislike how Apple is closed system (it goes against their principles). Or who just see Apple as the evil empire (whether it is or isn't). They don't want to see Apple succeed cause they feel that if Apple succeeds it is bad cause closed systems are bad and everything should be open system (yes, unlike what people accuse them of being here a lot of them are Linux fans, not Windows fans).

Hell, go to G+, you'll see a lot of them. Go find any popular journalist like Mike Elgan who might post something positive about Apple and read the comments, they get attracted there like flies.

You are right that a lot of people just have their own preferences and not all of them are "Fandroids" so to speak. You are wrong that the "haters" don't exist though. And some of them were haters before Android, they just are cheering for Android cause they feel that some one has to take Apple down (and even better, Android uses their beloved Linux if I understand right).

(and no, I'm not accusing all Linux people of being like this either. It just seems that this segment I'm talking about is a subset of Linux enthusiusts).

 

[Namjins]

Image

Dang. Looks like its a Spanish model only.

 

[Zunjine]

You should keep your focus on the subject. Not that you dont understand/agree with my way of expressing myself. Go after the ball and not the man. Its allways a sign og topic-weakness when a user goes after other users. Now, that was a forum-lesson for you and on my bill

Why should I find a company that do as much different stuff as Apple? Its not a battle on multitasking. I just want a nice new phone. And I have some demands in that regard. "Nice new phone" for me is not a phone that looks and feels like the last phone I had. I had expectations that Apple could deliver what I wanted. But they couldn't. Thats all. And know Im elaborating over Apple and there new productline. And I dont think Im the only one whos disappointed, and mainreason is that I know Apple could have made something surprising, but they dont due to they dont have to.

If you'd like to point out where I failed to focus on the subject that would be nice.

You claimed that Apple isn't different yet you can't come up with a single company that they aren't different from! I think this discussion has run its course.

 

[StyxMaker]

Yes it's truly amazing how many people just follow the crowd.. Heaven forbid consumers actually bought a product on merit rather than jump on the apple bandwagon.

In case you're a yank and don't understand sarcasm, I'm being sarcastic. How about just buying a product because you want to rather than investing in Schadenfreude..

What's schadenfreude selling for these days?

 

[StyxMaker]

It is a logistic nightmare I'm sure...Dozens of carriers, plus balancing online vs. retail on opening day. I don't know if there is a "right" way to do it. You don't want to turn away people knocking at the door on the 21st either.…

I'm sure there's an app for that.

 

[Zunjine]

Good point. Obviously it makes better economic sense to be conservative and play it safe, but it seems like a squandered opportunity for a company as innovative as Apple to not spend some of the vast capital they've accumulated to take some chances and get back some of that avant garde spirit of the early iMac days. Safe is safe, but Apple also risks turning into the next Sony.

Taking risks when you don't need to take risks just doesn't make any sense. Apple took a risk when they launched the iPod. They took a risk when they launched the iPhone. They took a huge risk when they launched the iPad. That's three bloody big risks in a decade. But why take a risk when launching an updated version of a product that's already massively popular? For the sake of being risky? To surprise and delight a few geeks on tech forums? Apple takes risks when it has to - that's good business.

As for "turning into the next Sony" I don't really know what you mean. Sony came unstuck not due to being too safe. Sony came unstuck by launching mediocre products across too many categories and by trying to do everything rather than just do what they do best. Apple's current strategy is exactly why they aren't going to be the next Sony.

 

[EdwardSung]

Taking risks when you don't need to take risks just doesn't make any sense. Apple took a risk when they launched the iPod. They took a risk when they launched the iPhone. They took a huge risk when they launched the iPad. That's three bloody big risks in a decade. But why take a risk when launching an updated version of a product that's already massively popular? For the sake of being risky? To surprise and delight a few geeks on tech forums? Apple takes risks when it has to - that's good business.

As for "turning into the next Sony" I don't really know what you mean. Sony came unstuck not due to being too safe. Sony came unstuck by launching mediocre products across too many categories and by trying to do everything rather than just do what they do best. Apple's current strategy is exactly why they aren't going to be the next Sony.

But Sony diversified without innovating. To me they're a cautionary tale of a company trying to dominate markets while playing it too safe. I'm not saying Apple is headed down that path in any way, just noting that it's possible to be too conservative.

Also: yes, I agree with your point 100% and have made the same argument myself about Apple and risk-taking. Obviously Apple's strategy is good business. I think they made the smart move with the iPhone 5, even though it disappointed many who wanted to see something more spectacularly different. All I'm saying is that there's also something to the idea that a company that's in as dominant a position as Apple can afford some space to take bigger chances. The fact that they took huge risks with the iPod, iPhone and iPad, and enjoyed transformative successes, actually kind of argues for that position more than against it.

Having said that, I acknowledge that this is pure geek fantasizing on my part. I obviously prefer a healthy, thriving Apple to a reckless one that squanders its advantages over its competitors. I just hope that in the post-Jobs era the "think different" spirit is not gone for good.

 

[Marlon177]

These people must be brainwashed!! I hate Apple! I hate its closed ecosystem and prefer Google's open Android platform! I loathe Apple that it deliberately makes fragile iPhone and wants its customers to buy new iPhone whenever they release ones!! Their products are wayyyyy overpriced and they don't donate their profits to third world countries!! I WANT FREEDOM AND I DON'T WANT TO BE CONTROLLED BY APPLE!!!

then wtf u doing here? this is *Mac*rumors forum, if u have nothing good to say, why dont u ****.

 

[ani4ani]

2X CPU power
2X Graphics power
2X RAM
2X sales in the first 24 hours than last year to 2 million units

Ofcourse, as you know, Apple is doomed to hell and beyond for this innovation-less minor update.

Not that the specs matter...apparently!

 

[lordofthereef]

You're funny. So fandroids can make childish and stupid comments here but we can't make comments such as where did they go when faced with reality because doing so is childish and stupid.

You are completely misreading my intentions. All of these types of comments are childish and stupid. The thing is, there are more people here bashing fandroids than there are fandroids to bash. I think I have seen a whopping TWO fandroid posts. Everything else was Apple fans mentioning the fandroids. Ridiculous!

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Nope, evidence of innovation is the new processor. Apple did something original there.

way to take my post out of context., especially when I pointed out that the new processor is evidence of innovation, which you conveniently cut out of my quote...

 

[wikus]

Tell me one thing Steve Jobs actually invented?

Yeah, nobody answered, just as I suspected.

Steve Jobs took existing ideas and charged people enormous prices for them. He took existing MP3 players, infringed on Creative's patents, and charged enormous prices. He took the smartphone and made it flashy but lied about apple inventing multi-touch (because they never did) and charged outrageous prices for it. He took the tablet, an already existing product, scaled up the iPhone and called it a day while again, charging enormous prices for it. But somehow each of these products to apple fanboys and the general public is innovation and revolutionary. Its not. All of it was evolutionary.

The only thing Steve Jobs was great at, was persuading people to buy these items whilst never telling them to explore his products beyond what he dictated, all the while locking down the products so people could only use them as he saw fit.

I'll give you guys the fact that every apple product that sells is polished excessively to the point of perfection. And I'll agree with the time Steve Jobs said 'We don't sell junk' because they dont, as all the products sold function as advertised, and that the ease of use, stability and smoothness of the UI is top notch.... but that doesn't put him in the same spot light as, say, Nikola Tesla or Thomas Edison.

While the fanboys often use the car analogy and refer to ford with their ridiculous claims against Android, Samsung and others in regards to patents and what apple supposedly 'invented' and got unjustified patents, heres something to think about when using the Henry Ford rebuttal:

I invented nothing new. I simply assembled into a car the discoveries of other men behind whom were centuries of work...Had I worked fifty or ten or even five years before, I would have failed. So it is with every new thing. Progress happens when all the factors that make for it are ready, and then it is inevitable.

-Henry Ford

But Apple filed a 28 page patent application for something as simple as 'slide to unlock' and got it.

Consider this, if these bits and pieces of the the whole OS are supposedly able to be patented, would Steve Jobs ever have gotten to where he is if Xerox had patented scroll bars, icons that looked computers or papers, and so forth?

This Apple and Steve Jobs bandwagon giving them the amount of credit theyve received is absolutely disgusting and detrimental to the progress of real innovation. In the last few years Apple has been suing everyone they can and everyone else has been suing back and forth between others.

Is this healthy for future of technology and the publics awareness of corporate brands having so much control. None of you fanboys liked Microsoft when they were the evil empire, but now that the tables have turned, Apple's all of a sudden an angel because you can't look at the situation objectively?

 

[ani4ani]

For those questioning the numbers - Apple demands resellers/networks to provide daily "Velocity" reporting - ie report on devices that have shipped.

They then compare this against activations on iTunes.
This stops resellers/networks holding onto stock.

So, the numbers should be pretty accurate

Since there are no activations yet...and nothing has shipped, how does this make the number "accurate." Not arguing that they are not accurate, but confused how your rational supports the statement

 

[JayLenochiniMac]

You are completely misreading my intentions. All of these types of comments are childish and stupid. The thing is, there are more people here bashing fandroids than there are fandroids to bash. I think I have seen a whopping TWO fandroid posts. Everything else was Apple fans mentioning the fandroids. Ridiculous!

Trust me, we have bigger and worse childish and stupid comments to ignore like all those "Cool story, bro" posters. At least those fandroids actually say something constructive for us to support or refute.

 

[Supermule]

Good point. Obviously it makes better economic sense to be conservative and play it safe, but it seems like a squandered opportunity for a company as innovative as Apple to not spend some of the vast capital they've accumulated to take some chances and get back some of that avant garde spirit of the early iMac days. Safe is safe, but Apple also risks turning into the next Sony.

Jep. Thats what (may) happen. I just had a feeling - back then - that the "old" Apple was not just about making money. Maybe I was wrong....Well, I guess Plan B is that we just need some heavy competition! (and I think we see it allready coming), so that Apple will be forced to the Iphone that I want

 

[ani4ani]

Where are the doomsayers from the previous threads? You know the ones that predicted the iPhone 5 wasn't going to sell well.

Just goes to show that actually 4S users did actually want a bigger screen...I wonder where all those have gone from the previous threads?

 

[darkslide29]

I appreciate your valid argument .. I dunno .. I think its a bit of a deja vu with the iPad .. more of the same .. but lighter, smaller and faster ... but its a helluva price premium to do so .. but being in the UK two of our providers .. VodaFone and O2 both cannot use the current model iPhone 5 because it doesnt use their allocated LTE frequency .. so even if I bought one today .. its of no use to me in the future because it cant use the band ... crazy but thats it .. and then I would have to buy the 5S next year at probably a similar upgrade cost .. such a shame . .I was so looking forward to it too ....

That's an excellent reason to skip this version. To me, LTE is a big part of the upgrade. If you can't make use of it now, then you're buying the iPhone 5 for what it can be one day, and not for what it is today. By the time lte does get to you, the next iPhone may be right around the corner! However, I would still be tempted

Normally, I would pay $199 for an iphone with a two-year contract. But since I am still under contract, my provider (AT&T) wanted an extra $250 as an early upgrade fee. So, $450. I said no, that's too much when everyone else is paying $199, and the 4S is still nice.
But then I realized I could sell my phone on eBay for maximum value now, and have that money pay for most of the iPhone 5. Especially since when the next one is announced in a year or so, my 4S will lose a lot of value in that years time. So I got more money for my phone now, but had to pay more for the iPhone 5. In the end, it will cost about the same to me I think. Maybe not quite, but it's close. And I get a new phone out of it

And I think incremental updates is what we will see for a while. From everyone including apple, samsung, etc. I mean, not too much else can be done, at least for a while. I would expect the iPhone 5S to have a much better, fast processor (like the S always does), and a much better camera since the one on the 5 is pretty similar to the 4S. That will probably be the two biggest changes to the phone.

Just seems odd to me that it's being called an incremental upgrade when the 3G to the 3GS was purely internal, 4 to 4S was also internal (besides Siri). They should be applauded for changing the design, adding LTE, increasing the screen size, and improving the processor and more ram. Otherwise, the 5 to 5S will seem really disappointing to those same people.
It's a good thing that Apple didn't make anything iphone 5 exclusive, and instead allow the 4S to do everything. They could have made panorama mode iPhone 5 only, or anything else. But they didn't make anything an exclusive I don't think.

 

[Zunjine]

But Sony diversified without innovating. To me they're a cautionary tale of a company trying to dominate markets while playing it too safe. I'm not saying Apple is headed down that path in any way, just noting that it's possible to be too conservative.

Also: yes, I agree with your point 100% and have made the same argument myself about Apple and risk-taking. Obviously Apple's strategy is good business. I think they made the smart move with the iPhone 5, even though it disappointed many who wanted to see something more spectacularly different. All I'm saying is that there's also something to the idea that a company that's in as dominant a position as Apple can afford some space to take bigger chances. The fact that they took huge risks with the iPod, iPhone and iPad, and enjoyed transformative successes, actually kind of argues for that position more than against it.

Having said that, I acknowledge that this is pure geek fantasizing on my part. I obviously prefer a healthy, thriving Apple to a reckless one that squanders its advantages over its competitors. I just hope that in the post-Jobs era the "think different" spirit is not gone for good.

I agree with you 100%. But I think you're worrying unnecessarily. Apple remains a risk taking business but perhaps not in the way you're thinking.

Consider the choice to hold off on NFC; everyone else is packing NFC into their high end smartphones but Apple has chosen not to follow this trend. Same goes with wireless charging which has become something of a totem of high end-ness in smartphones. Apple choosing NOT to follow these trends is a risk in and of itself. The safe thing to do in technology is to go all in for whatever trend everyone else is following - it takes a risk taking mentality to say no sometimes. Apple has famously done this for years and there's no sign of that stopping any time soon. They said no to Blu-Ray. They said no to Flash. They said no to LTE until it was good and ready. All these things were risky - and they were all classic Apple moves.

Sticking to a yearly cycle and refusing to put out multiple models of iPhone is another risky move. Samsung, Sony, HTC, Nokia - all of them release dozens of phones a year but Apple is staying true to what makes Apple... Apple!

As for the iPhone 5 disappointing people, well, I don't know if two million pre-orders in 24 hours is a sign of widespread disappointment! Sure - everyone always expects Apple to blow them away - that's what you get when you blow people away so often! Whenever Apple releases a product that is merely brilliant people feel let down... that's a good problem to have.

The time to take the big, proactive risks is when you see a way to make something fundamentally better. That's why Apple was willing to go risky with the iPod, iPhone and iPad. That's the philosophy that Jobs followed; taking risks for the sake of being surprising and different was never his MO and nor should it ever be the way Apple works. Jobs believed in simplicity and in saying 'no' a lot, even to really good ideas. Unless he could see a way to do something much, much better than the competition he would say no. This iPhone launch, along with that of the new iPad and Retina Macbook Pro, aren't signs that Apple is drifting from the Jobsian method - they are perfectly in line with that way of thinking. This is the Apple that Jobs built.

In life as well as in business, the hardest thing is to be yourself. When Apple stops being Apple, that's the time to start worrying.

 

[lordofthereef]

Trust me, we have bigger and worse childish and stupid comments to ignore like all those "Cool story, bro" posters. At least those fandroids actually say something constructive for us to support or refute.

Yeah, "cool story bro" is worse, but I wouldn't say by much. Go back and have a look at this thread. I challenge you to average one post per page that is actually meaningful and has a point to it? Apple posts sales numbers and these threads all erupt into behavior that would rival the crusades (if the crusades were held on the internet and didn't actually involve killing )