Hopefully a new generation of MBPs is coming this year that fixes this and makes the touchbar at least optional (or just removes it altogether)
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Apple Apologizes Over 'Small Number' of Users Who Continue to Have Issues With Third-Generation MacBook Keyboards
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I really hope so. I have a MacBook Air that is 6 years old. Still runs fine but the demands of MacOS are a lot greater than when it was introduced so it's starting to feel rather slow at times. I'd buy a new MacBook in a heartbeat but I'm not buying one with a bad keyboard. Even if the butterfly keyboard was reliable (and we know that's not true), it's also god-awful to type on.
Apple needs to get rid of this keyboard design entirely. It wasn't that long ago that Apple's keyboards were second only to ThinkPad keyboards, and they were a pleasure to use. Now, most people hate them and everyone lives in fear of them failing (unless they've failed already).
2017 MBP user here (I used to have 2016 model, but after many store visits and phone calls due to keyboard problems, they swapped to the whole computer for a 2017 model).
I'm having almost daily issues with random keys getting stuck, being unable to get pressed fully. I believe what happens is that when I move the MBP around in the case, the process of moving it shifts the dust and tiny pieces of grime around under the keyboard, so some of them fall under the keycap and block it from moving. I then have two options: Either press the key strongly, and hope the keycap breaks apart the grime particle that's blocking it, or remove the keycap, and clean whatever's underneath with a wet tip of a toothpick. I often opt for the latter as it resolves the problem reliably. I'm very careful with this and know how to do it expertly at this point, but now I've noticed that due to being removed multiple times, the cursor up/down keys have become ever so slightly wobbly and less sensitive to press. They are not broken in any way, it's just that the plastic connectors on the keycap have become ever so slightly looser/worn out. I guess my next step is buying replacement keycaps from that site that sells them. It's just hard to believe there's so much trouble with this keyboard. I really hope apple implements whatever mechanism they have in the current desktop "magic" keyboard into future MBPs also. It's a very good mechanism that combines the reliability of old, and the click feel of the new butterfly switch.
Also, if you wonder why I don't just use the compressed air to solve the problem like Apple recommends - well I did that once, and it totally messed up a bunch of keys, as it just kept displacing the dust, so it landed in worse spots than it was. That was not a fun day, and I'm scared of every doing it again. I also tried vacuuming, but that didn't seem to help at all. Some keys got stuck the very next day after a thorough vacuuming session.
*edit*I just checked the thebookyard.com site that sells replacement keycaps, and the up/down arrow keycaps are out of order. Can't say I'm surprised to be honest :\
Also, what I truly hope for Apple to do on the next MBP keyboard is to go back to the older, all half-height arrow key layout, which allowed me to easily feel where the up/down arrow keys are. Right now, even after two years of extensive use, I still very often end up pressing the right shift key, thinking it's the up arrow key. It's just bad design, and I know some prominent voices in the Apple circles have complained about this same problem.
I'm having almost daily issues with random keys getting stuck, being unable to get pressed fully. I believe what happens is that when I move the MBP around in the case, the process of moving it shifts the dust and tiny pieces of grime around under the keyboard, so some of them fall under the keycap and block it from moving. I then have two options: Either press the key strongly, and hope the keycap breaks apart the grime particle that's blocking it, or remove the keycap, and clean whatever's underneath with a wet tip of a toothpick. I often opt for the latter as it resolves the problem reliably. I'm very careful with this and know how to do it expertly at this point, but now I've noticed that due to being removed multiple times, the cursor up/down keys have become ever so slightly wobbly and less sensitive to press. They are not broken in any way, it's just that the plastic connectors on the keycap have become ever so slightly looser/worn out. I guess my next step is buying replacement keycaps from that site that sells them. It's just hard to believe there's so much trouble with this keyboard. I really hope apple implements whatever mechanism they have in the current desktop "magic" keyboard into future MBPs also. It's a very good mechanism that combines the reliability of old, and the click feel of the new butterfly switch.
Also, if you wonder why I don't just use the compressed air to solve the problem like Apple recommends - well I did that once, and it totally messed up a bunch of keys, as it just kept displacing the dust, so it landed in worse spots than it was. That was not a fun day, and I'm scared of every doing it again. I also tried vacuuming, but that didn't seem to help at all. Some keys got stuck the very next day after a thorough vacuuming session.
*edit*I just checked the thebookyard.com site that sells replacement keycaps, and the up/down arrow keycaps are out of order. Can't say I'm surprised to be honest :\
Also, what I truly hope for Apple to do on the next MBP keyboard is to go back to the older, all half-height arrow key layout, which allowed me to easily feel where the up/down arrow keys are. Right now, even after two years of extensive use, I still very often end up pressing the right shift key, thinking it's the up arrow key. It's just bad design, and I know some prominent voices in the Apple circles have complained about this same problem.
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Just curious, to qualify your opinion, what are you basing It on? Just complaints online? Were you able to measure and analyze any data about shipments, sold and how many of those have the issue?
The "N" key on my kid's 2018 MBA's keyboard is acting up.
This is just embarrassing, Apple.
This is just embarrassing, Apple.
I have not upgraded my classic 2012 yet due to this design...
Jobs would have fired everyone responsible for this disaster and he'd have been right to do so.
This ongoing mess is so, so, so toxic to Apple's reputation. That article by Joanna Stern should be the only thing on Cook's desk today and I bet the myopic fool doesn't even read it.
This ongoing mess is so, so, so toxic to Apple's reputation. That article by Joanna Stern should be the only thing on Cook's desk today and I bet the myopic fool doesn't even read it.
I fail to see why people should trust a single poster that owns one laptop at a time with their hard earned money. It takes more than a love of a product to defend something as absolute as you are saying.
So far, I am looking at 10% return rate within 10 months at my place.
Apple's stubbornness and don't care under Tim Cook is appaling. The Touch Bar is useless dribble. Distracting, expensive, only there because Apple is too stubborn to put a touchscreen in. The keyboard in it's third iteration is still crap. It's only getting louder, your fingers hurt after typing for too long and inevitably keys will break.
And don't get me started on the **** USB-C ports I had to replace TWICE already on my 2017 Macbook. Yes. I am on my third. Because after six months of use the charging cables just won't stay connected and the battery is being killed by endless charging/discharging cycles (connects and disconnects numerous times a day).
I'd much rather have a Huawei with a better screen for almost half the price than this
And don't get me started on the **** USB-C ports I had to replace TWICE already on my 2017 Macbook. Yes. I am on my third. Because after six months of use the charging cables just won't stay connected and the battery is being killed by endless charging/discharging cycles (connects and disconnects numerous times a day).
I'd much rather have a Huawei with a better screen for almost half the price than this
My 15 inch 2012 rMBP finally needed replacing this week when the dGPU failed.
I replaced it with a 2014 model - I did not even consider replacing it with a current rMBP as I don’t want a keyboard that might break (who would?).
I don’t want a touchbar.
I also don’t like how they write “MacBook Pro” under the screen on current models either.
I replaced it with a 2014 model - I did not even consider replacing it with a current rMBP as I don’t want a keyboard that might break (who would?).
I don’t want a touchbar.
I also don’t like how they write “MacBook Pro” under the screen on current models either.
Maybe you will
I'll never buy a Mac that has that.In fact I'm already not using the butterfly Macbook Pro I got from work. I just threw it in a drawer for testing. I use an iMac as main driver and got a used last-gen wired keyboard (the "magic" keyboard is also collecting dust in my drawer
)I have had RSI for a long time so ergonomics are of the utmost importance. No use putting up with this.
Or switch to a keyboard based on the current Magic Keyboard 2. It's just as reliable as the pre-2016 MBP keyboards and doesn't use the butterfly switches, yet still offers a decently tactile experience for a low-profile membrane keyboard.
I know people hate the keyboard, but I loved it so much I had to replace my wireless desktop keyboard with the newer design.
Having said that, I had the gen 1 keyboard as I have a 2016 model - not great. But I love the low key travel.
Having said that, I had the gen 1 keyboard as I have a 2016 model - not great. But I love the low key travel.
Just as I was about to pull the trigger and buy the new MacBook Air, this article appears
It's not like this issue is new, and the articles have been out there even with the new ones.
We have four 2016-2018 MacBook Pro keyboards in my team. No one has had an issue yet. My Core i9 machine is pegged on CPU constantly. no issues with my keyboard.
Maybe you will
I will remain openminded... for now. We're at a point of diminishing returns. I don't want my machine to be any thinner. I want it to be capable and easy to use. Going with glass keyboard for the sake of making it thinner will be a mistake.
The real number is that 100% of MacBooks with butterfly keyboard are affected. Because the keyboard design is fundamentally flawed.
They keep flawed design for three years, try to cover issues up with some half assed “fix” and lie to customers that it was just for sound dampening... and give them instructional video how to clean their keyboard - as if it’s the problem that we are all messy slobs..
didn’t even bother bringing in my 2016 mbp yet what they gonna do put another broken keyboard inside?
I take it as a 4K lesson to not buy apple computers anymore
My wife and I have 2017 MBPs. We've used them HEAVILY for almost 11 months now. My wife uses hers every day for HOURS for her PhD. I have had 0 problems, my wife has had 0 problems. Other 2016-2017 MBP owners we know have had 0 problems. I do not know anyone in person who has a problem, but I don't know many 2016-2018 MBP owners (under 5).
I'm a 160+wpm typist and a huge mechanical keyboard hobbyist. I wasn't a huge fan of the keyboard when I initially got the laptop but I've adapted to it, used it for 11 months now, and have grown to like it. I can actually type on it REALLY fast now, the energy required to type on it vs other keyboards with more key travel is a lot less than you'd think. I don't mind it now. My wife likes this keyboard too and types out lengthy papers with it.
I've grown to like the keyboard. It takes a change from how you type on a normal keyboard. Once you adapt, it is quite pleasant and you can type really fast for hours.
I've never cleaned my wife's keyboard - I do clean mine now and then but I haven't bothered for months now. We've had 0 issues. Glad to see Apple standing behind their product and giving us 4? years of keyboard replacements. We plan on keeping these laptops for 6 years at least.
We absolutely love our laptops - this is definitely the best laptop I've ever had.
Glad to see Apple addressing this issue.
I'm a 160+wpm typist and a huge mechanical keyboard hobbyist. I wasn't a huge fan of the keyboard when I initially got the laptop but I've adapted to it, used it for 11 months now, and have grown to like it. I can actually type on it REALLY fast now, the energy required to type on it vs other keyboards with more key travel is a lot less than you'd think. I don't mind it now. My wife likes this keyboard too and types out lengthy papers with it.
I've grown to like the keyboard. It takes a change from how you type on a normal keyboard. Once you adapt, it is quite pleasant and you can type really fast for hours.
I've never cleaned my wife's keyboard - I do clean mine now and then but I haven't bothered for months now. We've had 0 issues. Glad to see Apple standing behind their product and giving us 4? years of keyboard replacements. We plan on keeping these laptops for 6 years at least.
We absolutely love our laptops - this is definitely the best laptop I've ever had.
Glad to see Apple addressing this issue.
Uhh, maybe because I believe all 2018 MacBooks are still under warranty?
Correction, Apple did have one of the best laptop keyboards on the market until the butterfly mechanism keyboard was released. Some would say it was perfect before Apple ruined it to shave off a few mm in height and for a “even” pressure on each key stroke, which was never a complaint to my knowledge.
Apple ruined what was good about the 2015 MBA and released junk every year after. People wanted 1-2 USB-C ports instead Apple replaced them all for just one type of port without a transition period.
If Apple really wanted to apologize, they would scrap the current butterfly keyboard for something completely new.
What really bothers me is the repairability of the latest laptops. It seems like every repair no matter how small requires Apple to replace half the laptop at a high cost.
It's ok when you have AppleCare but does that mean the laptop is only good for three years for its high cost (AppleCare included in the price).
Most people liked Apple laptops in the past mostly because of the low ownership cost over many years.
What really bothers me is the repairability of the latest laptops. It seems like every repair no matter how small requires Apple to replace half the laptop at a high cost.
It's ok when you have AppleCare but does that mean the laptop is only good for three years for its high cost (AppleCare included in the price).
Most people liked Apple laptops in the past mostly because of the low ownership cost over many years.
Aww hell, the 2018 model has the same issue?
I sold my 2016 MBP at a $2,000 loss after experiencing 3 top case replacements in a 9 month period, for the sole reason that I thought (prayed?) the third gen keyboard of the 2018 model solved the issue of keyboard malfunction.
I guess the joke’s on me!
I sold my 2016 MBP at a $2,000 loss after experiencing 3 top case replacements in a 9 month period, for the sole reason that I thought (prayed?) the third gen keyboard of the 2018 model solved the issue of keyboard malfunction.
I guess the joke’s on me!