Apple Delays Leopard Release

[JonasLondon]

This is HORRIBLE!
I'm totally NOT interested in the iPhone, I'm just waiting to buy a MBP with Leopard, so Apple: you really disappointed me with this one! I hope this won't happen again anytime soon...

Are you gonna bark all day little doggie, or are you gonna bite?
Seriously people, stop whining. This isn't the end of the world, and yes, Apple Stocks might go down for a few days. Soak up some put options and then get back in with calls before the WWDC, and your iPhone and next Mac are probably paid for.

 

[JonasLondon]

No, I don't think so. Vista was going to be a major rewrite. But it isn't. They had to scrap that, didn't they?

From what I can tell, it is XP with a few little add-ons, and slight improvements under the hood. (And better security.)

the "better security" comes at a cost of constantly nagging questioning by the OS though. And programs can still install "in secret" if you're logged in as an Admin - OS X will still require any major modification and installation to be confirmed by the admin password, i.e. higher security.

 

[JonasLondon]

Jeez, you'd think the world was ending... It's impossible to read all these posts, so I'll just shout into the wind here.

First: stop with all the stupid Microsoft analogies. Leopard slipped a quarter, Vista slipped years and all of that time Vista was busy shedding promised features. Schedules slip, it's a fact of business and a fact of life.

Second: Apple was able to say the rumors weren't true because the schedule is the same until it changes. Today it changed. Before today, Apple's official position was that they were shipping in June. Even if every developer realized they weren't going to make their deadline, nobody in the company will talk about a change before the change is official and the PR machine is up to date on it. I suppose they could have let the rumors stand, but generally things are denied until they're true.

Third: Apple couldn't have solved this problem by hiring. It sounds like these were individuals with unique skills who were transferred across programs, not bullpen coders. Regardless, staffing up in the middle of a project will only serve to make it later-- it takes too long for developers to train.

Fourth: Apple is properly focusing their attention on their highest profile release. I always thought there was a bit much schedule for June, something had to give. Can't slip the iPhone because it's too hot, Leopard was the obvious choice. Right thing to do. If the phone slips there's no phone, if Leopard ships there's Tiger.

I've been looking forward to Leopard, but I'm not going to cut my wrists over this...

Very well said!

 

[CoreWeb]

the "better security" comes at a cost of constantly nagging questioning by the OS though. And programs can still install "in secret" if you're logged in as an Admin - OS X will still require any major modification and installation to be confirmed by the admin password, i.e. higher security.

Okay "technically better" security. The "better" I suppose is quite a subjective term.

 

[Stella]

No, I don't think so. Vista was going to be a major rewrite. But it isn't. They had to scrap that, didn't they?

From what I can tell, it is XP with a few little add-ons, and slight improvements under the hood. (And better security.)

I would say that Vista is more than Win95 -> Win98 , or more than 10.2 -> 10.3, as example.

microsoft have made a lot of security changes under the hood, such as in the kernel to prevent viruses / trojans. So, the extra security isn't just nag nag nag. It is more involved.

You get viruses via services etc, which the user won't know about.

But your forgetting that MS started and abandoned a Vista project and restarted - just like that happened to OS10. The final version was based upon NeXT - so Apple didn't have to develop from stratch , just like microsoft.

 

[Max Payne]

Are you gonna bark all day little doggie, or are you gonna bite?

Welcome to the world of Orange.

 

[CoreWeb]

I would say that Vista is more than Win95 -> Win98 , or more than 10.2 -> 10.3, as example.

microsoft have made a lot of security changes under the hood, such as in the kernel to prevent viruses / trojans. So, the extra security isn't just nag nag nag. It is more involved.

You get viruses via services etc, which the user won't know about.

95 -> 98 or 10.2 -> 10.3 could be right. (I started using Mac at 10.3). But you know, 98 really stank - I would put it somewhere right under ME for "Worst Windows Editions". But maybe that's just looking back on it...

Very well said!

The worry is that Apple will continue to slip, like Microsoft. (At least, that's the worry for me.)

 

[JonasLondon]

Welcome to the world of Orange.

You're right, I should credit them, although they probably didn't invent it, but their ad is quite good. --> Statement (c) Orange

 

[MacAodh]

i know it's been said a 100 times already but ****. might be moving to linux then

 

[nickane]

Don't you know he guy that wrote that song later commited suicide; just so you know.

No he didn't. That guy only stole the hook ("Don't worry, be happy") from some other guy who said it years ago. That guy definitely didn't kill himself, cos he got mercilessly tortured and put to death by whatever cruel regime it was that was in power around that time (I forget). Apparently, it all worked out for him in the end though, somewhat proving the validity of his ethos. His name escapes me but a lot of ppl seem to think he was kind of a big deal and I think he even had something to do with that long weekend we just had...

 

[schopenhauer]

oh come on!

How could anyone possibly compare Apple to Microsoft because of this delay. Delays happen all the time. The fact that Microsoft OS releases are ALWAYS delayed (by as much as 2 years, mind you), let's not jump out of our prissy little skin. Alternatively, we can sit back and relax- and enjoy the final stage of a well built product for a few more months before years of updates and patches integrate themselves into our everyday computing lives once again.
I'm looking forward to Leopard to but I'm not going to throw myself off the tappanzee bridge because I have to wait a little longer to spend more money and patch all my other software so that I am running as efficiently then as I am now.

 

[curmi]

Regardless of whether this is good or bad, or whether people are whinging too much or their complaints are justified, this does show bad planning at Apple. Someone - or most likely a number of people - are to blame for the resourcing and estimation blunder.

As a developer and project manager I can tell you that software development estimation is very very difficult to get right. Most of the time developer's with make huge estimates just to cover themselves - and often even these huge estimates are too low. It is one of the most difficult parts of planning big, complex projects.

Apple are usually pretty good at this stuff - and to be honest, what they achieve in years is beyond what most organisation are capable of in those time frames. Just look at how long Microsoft take to do things compared to what Apple has done in less time. That shows generally extremely good planning and tight development processes that really work at Apple. It isn't just sticking large numbers of developers on a project - that doesn't work to make a project complete faster.

The trouble is though there is an appearance - perhaps not justified - that Apple got too excited with their new toy (iPhone) and didn't really concentrate on Mac OS X. Steve is rumoured to get caught up with one thing and forget everything else around him, and possibly this is what has happened to Mac OS X.

It could all be coincidence of course. It is unfortunate that Apple took the "Computer" out of its name so recently, because it gives the appearance that Apple no longer care about the computer side of the business. This may not be true - it may have just been bad planning on the iPhone side.

However, Steve does need to fix the bad vibe the company is giving to a lot of its long time supporters over this. And if the share price suffers, Steve really needs to make an apology to the shareholders - as this happened on his watch. Something like an apology, and a promise that any new purchases of Macs will receive Leopard free when it is ready would go a long way to making customers feel that Apple hasn't abandoned the computer.

And Apple needs to get some new hardware out - and do it soon.

Those of you who think people are whinging too much, keep in mind that the iPhone is of little use outside of the US - where the iPhone won't be out for over a year at least. The Apple TV is of little use - there is no iTunes movie content in most countries outside the US. So you've got countries where the last MacWorld meant very little to them, they've had little in the way of new Macs (like we all have), and the only thing they had to keep them going was the promise of Leopard. Now that has been delayed, so people outside the US are feeling pretty down right now.

 

[iAlan]

Well...

While I would like a new Mac and am waiting for the next design update of the MacPro line -- or better yet a min-tower somewhere between the MacPro and iMac -- I don't see why everyone is getting soooo upset that Leopard is being delayed?

Is Tiger not a fully functioning OS? Is it so bad it has to be replaced?

I mean, Microsoft didn't exactly have the best of operating systems what with each update built on the shaky foundations of their predecessors. So Microsoft said 'Let's rewrite the base code and release a more modern OS" Well they didn't -- there is still legacy code underpinning Vista -- and that was delivered way off schedule and didn't really offer all that much more -- or more than anyone else offered via software add-on's

I am hoping that Apple is in fact going to bring us something really innovative and the delay is to bring back the 'Wow' factor -- which is missing right now me thinks

Anyway, all the 'Me Me Me' posters out there will be saying 'I don't want an iPhone. I want Leopard Me Me Me. Apple doesn't know what they are doing -- I know better...blah blah blah'

Well, Apple -- in my opinion -- does know what they are doing and I am sure we will all be 'Wow'-ed once again.

And I expect a major hardware announcement within a month -- expect the new MacTower around WWDC

Or, there may be more chance of Sanjaya being voted off American Idol before new Mac is released...

 

[MacSA]

It's worse for NON US customers. Leopard is delayed to make way for a product you can't even buy.

 

[Lyle]

I just want iLife and iWork '07..I can live with out 10.5, but I'm still using iWork '05(on an Intel Mac) because I've put off iWork '06 w/ iWork '07 "coming around the corner".

I'm in the same boat. I hope that they'll say something definitive about the release date for iWork '07. If it is also delayed until October (and I'm guessing it will be), I'll have to suck it up and get iWork '06 after all. I can't stand running iWork '05 on my MacBook anymore.

 

[BGil]

Hardly. While it took MS years of additional time to get their software straight it is still not as bug free, stabel and mature as an of the recent .0 releases that the MacOS X has seen. Besides, the difference between 3 months (Leopard delay) and 3 years (Longhorn, no, I mean Vista delay) is 12-fold. Go figure.

Vista was only delayed 1 year. The very first time Microsoft talked aobut Longhorn publically was at WinHec 2003 in May of that year. At that time they said Longhorn would "likely" be in 2005. Even in Thurrotts first writeup of Longhorn he puts the release date in 2005:

"So will it happen? No one outside of Microsoft can say, and the company sure isn't talking. But I recently received word that Longhorn will be shipping far later than originally thought--think 2005--"

"Windows Media Player Refresh - Because the next-generation Windows Media Player will ship in late 2002, Longhorn will include a much later version when it ships in 2005. "

http://www.winsupersite.com/showcase/longhorn_preview.asp

Even just looking at Microsoft's typical release cycle shows that the amount of time between Windows 2000, Windows Server 2003 (which Vista is based on) and Windows Vista is about 3 years.

---------------
This latest Leopard delay is also at least 4 months (possibly 5 if you think it would have shipped in Early June) not 3. IT was also delayed once before. Remember, originally they told us "Late 2006/Early 2007" as the release date. June is not early 2007.

 

[Zmmyt]

...

Thank you!

 

[b0ned0me]

Then Steve Jobs ought to go work for Nokia and stop f@#$<ing with Apple and Mac OS X.

What, you think Apple would be better off if Nokia or SE succeed in turning the iPod phenomenon into a historical footnote? Imagine every affluent high-school kid spending a year with a super-snazzy Nokia or Sony Ericsson audio/video/game/internet/phone/GPS appliance in their pocket - do you think they would then want a MacBook as their first laptop when they head to college? Having seen what the iPod did to help get Apple back in the game, I can't imagine Mr Jobs would like to see some other multi-billion-dollar tech company play the same trick on him.

Of course, you're welcome to write to all the pension fund managers and banks who effectively own AAPL - they're always willing to look at new ways of boosting the value of their investment and I'm sure they would be interested to hear your ideas on how surrendering the iPod space to phones (and presumably the TV space to HTPCs/DVRs) would accomplish that.

 

[petvas]

Why not delay iPhone instead of Leopard? Oh, I forgot, Apple is consumer electronics maker now, not a computer/OS company. WTF! I'm PISSED

So how can anyone invest in the Mac platform anymore when Apple has and is sending a clear message that Macs and OS X are on the back f@#%!%ing burner???

Relax! The iPhone is an almost revolutionary product and runs Mac OS X (at least some version of it). I don't see how Apple isn't supporting its OS.

Of course we would all be happy to see Leopard being released on time, but I prefer it that way. When the product is ready it will be released. Please do not forget that such a product like the iPhone should be on time. Apple couldn't afford to delay it. Apple is not alone in this. Apple has partnered with Cingular, Google and Yahoo on this one, so meeting the deadlines must be dead important.

I don't think that the delay will cause a stagnation is Mac sales...Thats bul$$$$
If someone wants to have a Mac, he/she will buy it. The Leopard upgrade will cost 129$ probably, so when buying a 2000$ computer I don't think you really care about the extra 100 bucks.
Now, if I wanted to buy a computer in September, then I would wait a month. For everybody else I don't see any reason.
I think that we will be very pleased on June 11th when we see all features of Leopard!

 

[richyfp]

Why I think Leopard's taking so long.

 

[markfc]

I was hoping to get a new mac book next month after a Leopard announcement, I guess I'll just save a little longer, by october I'll probably have enough for macbook pro...this could be a good thing!

 

[kddpop]

OMG I do NOT beleive this! This is the most f$#%cked up news of 2007! Delay Leopard in order to develop a f#^@$$%#ing cell phone Brilliant, Apple. Just totally f@#%@ing brilliant.

Dude, I'm gettin a Dell. Vista is already out.

really? you think vista is on par with what leopard will be? if you think the MS OS is interchangable with the mac, then why even be a mac user? the hardware is more expensive, many games aren't released for mac...etc etc.

it's too bad that they had to delay things but it will be head and shoulders above vista. im willing to wait. i will not go to vista simply because the new os is delayed. and if you do jump ship for vista, don't expect the same experience as you're used to with the mac.

but if you're familiar with windows and are happy there, go for it.

-kyle

 

[Pittsax]

While I would like a new Mac and am waiting for the next design update of the MacPro line -- or better yet a min-tower somewhere between the MacPro and iMac -- I don't see why everyone is getting soooo upset that Leopard is being delayed?

Is Tiger not a fully functioning OS? Is it so bad it has to be replaced?

Well, Apple -- in my opinion -- does know what they are doing and I am sure we will all be 'Wow'-ed once again.

THANK YOU!

$10 and my left nut says that if Apple were to release Leopard in spring, it would be a seriously stripped down version from what was promised last WWDC. And then all of the people who are whining now would be back here yawning and saying how it's little more than an upgrade to Tiger. Last time I looked Tiger was still the best OS out there (my opinion, mind you), and if I'm going to upgrade, I want something a little more substantial than Spaces and TimeMachine -- which, by the way, I'd prefer to have working properly in 10.5.0, NOT 10.5.2. And if a few more months is what it's going to take, fine by me. And no, hiring more people isn't the answer. If you need a novel written and the author is off doing something else, you can't solve the problem by hiring 10 type-setters.

As far as iLife and iWork goes, yeah it's a bummer that we're (more than likely) not getting a new release in the near future. But really...is it that big of a deal? Are you really going to get all worked up over not having those 3 new transitions in Keynote, the 5 new loops in Garageband, or goodness knows what other MINDBLOWING features that you can't live without even though you don't know what they are and seem to be doing just fine without them right now?

Everyone just calm down, take a deep breath, and remember that a little while ago, you were running Panther, but couldn't live without Tiger.

 

[BGil]

No, I don't think so. Vista was going to be a major rewrite. But it isn't. They had to scrap that, didn't they?

From what I can tell, it is XP with a few little add-ons, and slight improvements under the hood. (And better security.)

Vista is a major rewrite. Not a total rewrite, but then again it didn't need to be like OS X did.

Think about it... total replacement/update of the following:
Printing subsystem, display subsystem (DWM),
graphics subsystem (DX10, DX9L), Media subsystem (Media Foundation), Audio (Core Audio), Media Center, Networking, brand new Explorer, new search system, new IIS7, system-wide RSS, new color system, new image codec system, new backup system, new memory subsystem, new speech system, text rendering, encryption, UAC, slideshow, .NET 3.0, new power system, clickonce, WIM, Powershell (not technically in Vista but released at the same time), Hypervisor/virtualization, 64-bit.

On the surface the improvements are minor but under the hood they are huge.

 

[dernhelm]

My main concern is there will definitely be a 10.4.10 release before October - and the number scheme alone might cause people's heads to explode.