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1. No we won’t. Batteries aren’t going to be able to be popped out and in by the user on a daily basis.
2. We HAD phones that allowed exactly that. When given the option people overwhelmingly preferred the durability of non-removable battery phones. Only a tiny tiny majority of consumers want this. Forcing it on the rest of us who prefer the tradeoff of durability, waterproof, etc. is asinine.
3. USB-C isn’t an improvement for most of us. It’s bigger, less secure, less durable, less waterproof, and inconsistent in what it actually supports. The only advantage USB-C has over Lightning is top data transfer speed, which few iPhone users actually care about. Just like removable batteries the EU forced a feature wanted by a small minority on the rest of us even if we didn’t want it.

For customers like me the EU has already made the iPhone a worse experience.

Meanwhile if you wanted a phone with a removable battery and USB you could have bought one already. They exist. They just aren’t sold by Apple.
Why is USB-C less secure?
 
Nothing the EU makes sense, their attack on Apple is just money grab, they demand things to be a certain way without making it really work for their citizens. There is an entire disconnect with how the EU is behaving lately and it is worrisome as their aim is not to make it safe but rather unsafe. I don't understand why we need another app store on our device, why we can't have AI, why I can't mirror my iPhone in my MacOS 15... these are odd decisions. It should be up to the customer right to choose. Someone ought to investigate the integrity of the EU and their decisions.

EDIT: Also EU is spending far too much time going after Apple and spending resources on it rather than protecting and ensuring their citizens are safe walking outside at night, that financially they are not going to suffer due to the mass migration etc.
Their countries are safer than ours. Enough with the American hubris.
 
1. No we won’t. Batteries aren’t going to be able to be popped out and in by the user on a daily basis.
2. We HAD phones that allowed exactly that. When given the option people overwhelmingly preferred the durability of non-removable battery phones. Only a tiny tiny majority of consumers want this. Forcing it on the rest of us who prefer the tradeoff of durability, waterproof, etc. is asinine.
3. USB-C isn’t an improvement for most of us. It’s bigger, less secure, less durable, less waterproof, and inconsistent in what it actually supports. The only advantage USB-C has over Lightning is top data transfer speed, which few iPhone users actually care about. Just like removable batteries the EU forced a feature wanted by a small minority on the rest of us even if we didn’t want it.

For customers like me the EU has already made the iPhone a worse experience.

Meanwhile if you wanted a phone with a removable battery and USB you could have bought one already. They exist. They just aren’t sold by Apple.
Phones with removable batteries aren't popular anymore because of tech influencers pushing the idea that thinness is better.

And the smartphone industry isn't important enough for people to organize protests in front of apple stores, just to queue up whenever the latest iphone drops.

The USB-C point is such a non-argument lol... lightning ports are notoriously fragile and the charging cables shipped are also awful. Its an issue that used to run rampant especially when iphones still had the home button. That's a part of history Apple is proud of, too.

You are fine to claim your iphone experience has dropped but that's because Apple has been found to do bad things. Maybe it's time for you to buy something else then, because your self-interest is more important for you than Apple's.
 
Correct me if I am wrong but:

The EU wants iOS open source?

No, they don't.

This entire discussion is even barely about the smartphone market itself. They want to make sure that adjacent markets like smartwatches, voice assistants, music, tv streaming, digital payments, home speakers, etc are all healthy markets. Healthy in this case means there is genuine competition and possibilities for smaller companies to compete with the big guys on the quality of their product by itself rather than satellite markets where people who have already chosen a smartphone are by default choosing the 1st party solution of their smartphone supplier.

Back when Apple was smaller, trying to differentiate themselves by offering better integration between different products was OK. Now that they're bigger and are pretty dominant in smartphones, actively trying to make your ecosystem stickier and actively making it harder for competitors who don't produce smartphones to compete with you is not OK.
 
And I would like Apple to finally sell me a fully-fledged product, not one stripped of its functions. Poles often pay higher prices for equipment than other European countries, and they get defective equipment.
 
I'm genuinely curious is there is any aspect or detail of a product's design and/or operation that the EU feels it should not dictate?

This reeks of bureaucratic momentum.
So how do you rationalise the US DOJ antitrust lawsuit in your head? Or the direction Japan is heading?
 
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That’s exactly what the EU should, develop their own smartphone OS with all these requirements it’s trying to impose on Apple. See which one people choose. My guess is it won’t be euOS.
I honestly love it when people think that way. Thankfully tech development and supply chains have become international and thinking like that will get you nowhere. The moral of the story is, that in today's climate, that EU cannot live without the US anymore and the US cannot live without the EU. They have become codependent in practically any field.
 
Apple could open iOS completely up per the request of the EU, and it still would not be enough. Then they would demand Apple allow third-parties to install iOS on their own devices.

The goalposts keep moving.
sure why not ;) it would be nice to have ability to put Honda's engine on BMW and vice versa it would be so nice
 
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That’s Apple’s right. And then they will lose a lot of customers.

It’s so weird for a European to read how Americans take the side of a company over people.

Interoperability: great! Privacy: great! Universal port: great! 2 year warranty: great! Stop complaining and enjoy your products.
I think the idea is that if consumers don't like the product or its terms of use, they can choose other products. Nobody in the EU is ever compelled to buy an iPhone. It is not like the iPhone has anything like a monopoly in the European market (see https://www.statista.com/statistics/1232268/apple-smartphone-market-share-in-europe/). People in the EU already had plenty of choice. This is a protectionist attack on a US company and the US should retaliate.
 
It’s hard to imagine Spotify and IKEA ever becoming gatekeepers in their markets
Spotify already IS a Gatekeeper in their market by the EUs definition. They have a significantly larger market share by both % and raw users in the EU than Apple does on the iPhone.

The only reason they are excluded is because they are an EU company, proving this isn’t about protecting consumers it’s about punishing successful non-EU companies. Which, yes, the EU has the prerogative to do, but they shouldn’t be lying about it and hiding beyond the false idea that this is about protecting customers.

Meanwhile despite NOT meeting the EUs already arbitrary “gatekeeper” metrics, the EU decide to include ipadOS too just because they can, again proving it’s not about gatekeepers or customers.
 
Spotify already IS a Gatekeeper in their market by the EUs definition. They have a significantly larger market share by both % and raw users in the EU than Apple does on the iPhone.

The only reason they are excluded is because they are an EU company, proving this isn’t about protecting consumers it’s about punishing successful non-EU companies. Which, yes, the EU has the prerogative to do, but they shouldn’t be lying about it and hiding beyond the false idea that this is about protecting customers.

Meanwhile despite NOT meeting the EUs already arbitrary “gatekeeper” metrics, the EU decide to include ipadOS too just because they can, again proving it’s not about gatekeepers or customers.
How is spotify prohibiting other streaming services to integrate with iOS / android?
 
Spotify already IS a Gatekeeper in their market by the EUs definition. They have a significantly larger market share by both % and raw users in the EU than Apple does on the iPhone.

The only reason they are excluded is because they are an EU company, proving this isn’t about protecting consumers it’s about punishing successful non-EU companies. Which, yes, the EU has the prerogative to do, but they shouldn’t be lying about it and hiding beyond the false idea that this is about protecting customers.

Meanwhile despite NOT meeting the EUs already arbitrary “gatekeeper” metrics, the EU decide to include ipadOS too just because they can, again proving it’s not about gatekeepers or customers.
Spotify is a service.

its available everywhere on all platforms, they don't hold the rights to stream ALL music.

You don't understand what a gatekeeper is do you?

Europeans choose Spotify over Apple Music because they prefer it.

Stop this USA being bullied chat 😂
 
Apple should call their bluff and simply leave the market. Either that or make other features us only, simply don’t offer them there at all.

The eu is coming after Apple because they have no indigenous innovation. Can’t compete, so regulate.
They don’t have to leave the market, just announce that they would by some date in the future due to the oppressive nature of the EC. The blowback that would cause for the EC would quickly have them reverse their nonsense. No consumer is asking for this but they sure want their Apple devices to work.
 
For one wild moment I thought they were demanding Apple allow iOS to run on third-party phones.
It’s inevitable that they will; they’ll force Apple to allow Android to run on the iPhone hardware, too. That seems like a perfectly reasonable endgame as far as the these bureaucrats are concerned.

If you force all smartphones to have the same functionality and the same access to the same software and the same accessories, they become the same! How is that competition? The differences between the available operating systems and the hardware is what makes it competitive!
 
I think the idea is that if consumers don't like the product or its terms of use, they can choose other products. Nobody in the EU is ever compelled to buy an iPhone. It is not like the iPhone has anything like a monopoly in the European market (see https://www.statista.com/statistics/1232268/apple-smartphone-market-share-in-europe/). People in the EU already had plenty of choice. This is a protectionist attack on a US company and the US should retaliate.
Apple does not represent the United States of America. It's like saying Japan would retaliate for actions against Toyota. The US themselves are investigating Apple on multiple shady business practices.
 
You do know that a lot of stuff from Apple is actually developed and build in the EU maybe we can start to develop our own EU iPhone 🤣.
Also I think it is funny that all Americans want a free marked for hardware, food and so on but can't see that the same should be true for the digital market. The same rules should apply to different domains. Competition in general is good for us. In the case of smartwatches they just have to enable forwarding of notifications and calls that's it.😂
I'm sure it will be as successful as qwant, the eu's search engine. 🤣
 
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Spotify already IS a Gatekeeper in their market by the EUs definition. They have a significantly larger market share by both % and raw users in the EU than Apple does on the iPhone.

The only reason they are excluded is because they are an EU company, proving this isn’t about protecting consumers it’s about punishing successful non-EU companies. Which, yes, the EU has the prerogative to do, but they shouldn’t be lying about it and hiding beyond the false idea that this is about protecting customers.

Meanwhile despite NOT meeting the EUs already arbitrary “gatekeeper” metrics, the EU decide to include ipadOS too just because they can, again proving it’s not about gatekeepers or customers.

Yeah they really aren't, you seem to have just made most of this up.

What are gatekeepers?​

Gatekeepers are large digital platforms providing any of a pre-defined set of digital services (‘core platform services’), such as online search engines, app stores, and messenger services. These companies have:
  • a strong economic position, significant impact on the internal market and are active in multiple EU countries;
  • a strong intermediation position, meaning that they link a large user base to a large number of businesses;
  • an entrenched and durable position in the market, meaning that their position has been stable over time.




The argument that this is just EU vs American businesses is nonsensical also given that Apple/ Google/Amazon/ Microsoft have all drawn regulatory action from their own government too.
 
Apple absolutely acts in their own self-interest, and they were found to act like a mob boss. Sure, the EU also acts in their own interests, but do you want to have companies running society?
LOL no.

First Apple is not a mob boss. Anyone who buys an Apple product or developers software for an Apple product does so entirely by choice. Literally no one is forced to do buy an iPhone or write an iOS app against their will. And you are completely free to by a non-Apple device or develop for non-Apple platforms at any time and Apple will do exactly nothing to you. That makes them the worst “mob boss” of all time.

Second no, I don’t want companies running society. I also don’t want governments running product development at private companies.

I want governments to ensure companies:

1. Don’t sell dangerous products
2. Tell the truth about their products so I can accurately make my purchasing decisions
3. Step in if a company gains monopoly power and abuses it.

The DMA does none of those things. It’s simply an excuse to punish and control non-European companies.
 
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