Other Apple is slowing down older iPhones based on battery wear level [MERGED]

[boltjames]

Copied from another thread.

Good luck getting your battery replaced easily.

My daughter's iPhone was being throttled as proven by Geekbench4 and cpudasher64. Her iPhone 6S was made in November 2015, just after the October 2015 battery recall date for the iPhone 6S. Her battery was at or slightly under 80% on my tests (yet always over on Apple's tests) and her iPhone 6S is still under Applecare warranty. She went to the Apple Store on the 27th and they refused to do anything. They were rude and said they don't look at 3rd party benchmark or CPU tests and that the battery tested fine on their test.

I told her to just buy the replacement battery and she did which immediately restored CPU speeds to normal.

When I saw the announcement Thursday (28th) I called Applecare to complain and they authorized a refund which they said had to be done at the store. When I went to the store they refused to apply the refund. I had to argue for half an hour before they actually read the Applecare Case ID and agreed.

Two rude 'geniuses' told me they were dreading all the battery replacement visits they were going to get and said the battery would still have to fail some tests before they would replace it under the new $29 terms, regardless of 3rd party CPU tests.

And the moral of this story is that a measley $79 (now $29) solves the problem.

Not to mention that a phone over 2 years old and out of warranty had a battery that was still retaining almost 80% of it’s original capacity.

And still they complain. Unbelievable.

 

[cyb3rdud3]

Copied from another thread.

Good luck getting your battery replaced easily.

My daughter's iPhone was being throttled as proven by Geekbench4 and cpudasher64. Her iPhone 6S was made in November 2015, just after the October 2015 battery recall date for the iPhone 6S. Her battery was at or slightly under 80% on my tests (yet always over on Apple's tests) and her iPhone 6S is still under Applecare warranty. She went to the Apple Store on the 27th and they refused to do anything. They were rude and said they don't look at 3rd party benchmark or CPU tests and that the battery tested fine on their test.

I told her to just buy the replacement battery and she did which immediately restored CPU speeds to normal.

When I saw the announcement Thursday (28th) I called Applecare to complain and they authorized a refund which they said had to be done at the store. When I went to the store they refused to apply the refund. I had to argue for half an hour before they actually read the Applecare Case ID and agreed.

Two rude 'geniuses' told me they were dreading all the battery replacement visits they were going to get and said the battery would still have to fail some tests before they would replace it under the new $29 terms, regardless of 3rd party CPU tests.

And why would Apple believe a third party app? I wouldn’t accept it either...being rude is not good...But stating that they don’t accept results from third parties isn’t the same as being rude.

 

[0014]

They stated that they will release a battery health section in the software soon. So if the phone is saying your iPhone battery is goosed there will be no need to test it. It will be clear to see on the phone.

As to what the battery health section will show remains to be seen. But I would imagine it will be the same/similar as you get on a MacBook Pro. So:

Design capacity
Current capacity
No. of charges
Condition (this will probably be the key bit as it will say if healthy or not)

 

[Stang6790]

Check out the nexus 6P. It was googles flagship a few years ago.

This was determined to be a hardware defect and Google were replacing the phones, even if they were out of warranty. Some people even received Google Pixel XL phones. What they didn't do was add a hidden software "feature" that throttled the CPU to keep this from happening.
[doublepost=1514644800][/doublepost]

And the moral of this story is that a measley $79 (now $29) solves the problem.

Not to mention that a phone over 2 years old and out of warranty had a battery that was still retaining almost 80% of it’s original capacity.

And still they complain. Unbelievable.

So even though the battery life may have been plenty to get the user through the day and they would have had no need to replace it, they should have to spend 10% of the original purchase price because Apple decided to slow their phone down? Once again why is it throttled before Apple says the battery is bad? Shouldn't those thresholds be the same?

 

[ablatt]

This was determined to be a hardware defect and Google were replacing the phones, even if they were out of warranty. Some people even received Google Pixel XL phones. What they didn't do was add a hidden software "feature" that throttled the CPU to keep this from happening.
[doublepost=1514644800][/doublepost]

So even though the battery life may have been plenty to get the user through the day and they would have had no need to replace it, they should have to spend 10% of the original purchase price because Apple decided to slow their phone down? Once again why is it throttled before Apple says the battery is bad? Shouldn't those thresholds be the same?

This is exactly the point. Apple warrants a battery to hold 80% of it's charge up to 500 cycles during the 2 year AppleCare period. But if at the same time the battery isn't up to snuff (in what way we don't really know) they will slow it down - and not a little bit but from 1848 to 600 (using cpudasher64). And tell you the battery is fine. It does boggle the mind.

 

[boltjames]

So even though the battery life may have been plenty to get the user through the day and they would have had no need to replace it, they should have to spend 10% of the original purchase price because Apple decided to slow their phone down? Once again why is it throttled before Apple says the battery is bad? Shouldn't those thresholds be the same?

The throttle happens in two conditions: 1) it's a battery already below the 80% healthy threshold, 2) it's an iPhone in a situation where the threat of an unexpected shutdown is nearing.

That's when the throttle happens. It's not like the phone gets throttled first thing in the morning in a 70 degree house and a battery completely charged. The throttle happens later that day when, say, the old battery is in a cold environment and the user is engaging in a high-strain activity like playing a game. Where Apple used to issue a command to shut the phone down the new firmware instead issues a command to cut back on the processing so that a shutdown never happens. The result of this temporary scenario is a throttle. Stop playing the game, warm the phone up, no throttle.

It's a once-in-a-while protection mode. It's not an all-day crippling of the OS.

 

[Radon87000]

The throttle happens in two conditions: 1) it's a battery already below the 80% healthy threshold, 2) it's an iPhone in a situation where the threat of an unexpected shutdown is near

These conditions are a complete fail because there is a user in this thread itself where these 2 points weren't attracted and yet the phone was hrottled.

 

[ablatt]

The throttle happens in two conditions: 1) it's a battery already below the 80% healthy threshold, 2) it's an iPhone in a situation where the threat of an unexpected shutdown is nearing.

That's when the throttle happens. It's not like the phone gets throttled first thing in the morning in a 70 degree house and a battery completely charged. The throttle happens later that day when, say, the old battery is in a cold environment and the user is engaging in a high-strain activity like playing a game. Where Apple used to issue a command to shut the phone down the new firmware instead issues a command to cut back on the processing so that a shutdown never happens. The result of this temporary scenario is a throttle. Stop playing the game, warm the phone up, no throttle.

It's a once-in-a-while protection mode. It's not an all-day crippling of the OS.

I'm not sure that's true. The iPhone 6S was throttled every time I checked it and returned to full speed immediately after battery replacement. That's replacing a battery Apple said was fine and tested at 88%. Even though my tests showed 80% or less.

 

[boltjames]

This is exactly the point. Apple warrants a battery to hold 80% of it's charge up to 500 cycles during the 2 year AppleCare period. But if at the same time the battery isn't up to snuff (in what way we don't really know) they will slow it down - and not a little bit but from 1848 to 600 (using cpudasher64). And tell you the battery is fine. It does boggle the mind.

That's not what's happening. That is a misinterpretation. The problem isn't batteries. The problem is old iPhone's with old processors being updated to the newest OS's by their owners.

When an old car slows it is not because of consumables like tires, batteries, or windshield wipers; it is because the engine is old and can't deliver the horsepower like it used to. What's happening with your old iPhone is the same. Your old processor can't handle the strain of the newest OS and your old battery is therefore being taxed beyond its already compromised limits and that is what is creating the shut down condition.

Get a new iPhone with the newest processor, problem solved. Don't upgrade your 2+ year old hardware to the newest OS, problem solved. Get a replacement battery, you'll get another year or so before you're in the same spot again, problem solved short term.

Old iPhone users want the best of both worlds and Apple can't give it to you anymore. Your old equipment isn't suited for the newest OS. So stop upgrading.

 

[zackdbassist]

That's not what's happening. That is a misinterpretation. The problem isn't batteries. The problem is old iPhone's with old processors being updated to the newest OS's by their owners.

When an old car slows it is not because of consumables like tires, batteries, or windshield wipers; it is because the engine is old and can't deliver the horsepower like it used to. What's happening with your old iPhone is the same. Your old processor can't handle the strain of the newest OS and your old battery is therefore being taxed beyond its already compromised limits and that is what is creating the shut down condition.

Get a new iPhone with the newest processor, problem solved. Don't upgrade your 2+ year old hardware to the newest OS, problem solved. Get a replacement battery, you'll get another year or so before you're in the same spot again, problem solved short term.

Old iPhone users want the best of both worlds and Apple can't give it to you anymore. Your old equipment isn't suited for the newest OS. So stop upgrading.

So an iPhone with a new battery works as if it has a new processor or a new engine as per your understanding? I can simply laugh at your ignorance.

 

[boltjames]

These conditions are a complete fail because there is a user in this thread itself where these 2 points weren't attracted and yet the phone was hrottled.

The defect rate in the consumer electronics industry is 5%. That means that out of the 230 MILLION iPhone's sold in 2015 there will be 11 MILLION iPhone's with defects in circuitry, processors, batteries, ports, conflicts with third party apps, you name it. 11 MILLION defective iPhone's is more than the 9 MILLION units the last Adele album sold. It's a hell of a lot of people. But it's only 5% of the total, rather insignificant in the big picture.

So saying "hey, I know a guy whose iPhone 6 is throttled all the time" can also be interpreted as he's one of the 11 MILLION unfortunate owners out of 230 MILLION who has a defective iPhone with a defect that hasn't been known until Apple pushed out the last update. Not saying he's not entitled to compensation- he is. Just saying that for every 5 people complaining about an all-day throttle there will be 95 who won't.

 

[Radon87000]

The defect rate in the consumer electronics industry is 5%. That means that out of the 230 MILLION iPhone's sold in 2015 there will be 11 MILLION iPhone's with defects in circuitry, processors, batteries, ports, conflicts with third party apps, you name it. 11 MILLION defective iPhone's is more than the 9 MILLION units the last Adele album sold. It's a hell of a lot of people. But it's only 5% of the total, rather insignificant in the big picture.

So saying "hey, I know a guy whose iPhone 6 is throttled all the time" can also be interpreted as he's one of the 11 MILLION unfortunate owners out of 230 MILLION who has a defective iPhone with a defect that hasn't been known until Apple pushed out the last update. Not saying he's not entitled to compensation- he is. Just saying that for every 5 people complaining about an all-day throttle there will be 95 who won't.

I am just saying your conditions are false. It's completely random. If there are 2 phones with equivalent wear, one is throttled, one is not. There have been many such cases reported on Reddit.

 

[boltjames]

So an iPhone with a new battery works as if it has a new processor or a new engine as per your understanding? I can simply laugh at your ignorance.

Read my post again. An old processor running new firmware it was never designed to handle means it's working harder and, among other things, is straining the battery further. It's how computers work.

If that battery is already 2+ years old, then the strain of the new firmware is the tipping point to push that battery to a shut down condition. If that battery is brand new, then it buys the old processor more time but won't fix the problem indefinitely.

The iPhone 6 was originally optimized and shipped with iOS 8 in 2014. We're at iOS 11 and 2018. And you think the processor wouldn't be an issue nor its impact on battery life on an aged battery? Be real.

 

[Radon87000]

Read my post again. An old processor running new firmware it was never designed to handle means it's working harder and, among other things, is straining the battery further. It's how computers work.

If that battery is already 2+ years old, then the strain of the new firmware is the tipping point to push that battery to a shut down condition. If that battery is brand new, then it buys the old processor more time but won't fix the problem indefinitely.

The iPhone 6 was originally optimized and shipped with iOS 8 in 2014. We're at iOS 11 and 2018. And you think the processor wouldn't be an issue nor its impact on battery life on an aged battery? Be real.

Why was the phone updated to an OS it was never designed to handle in the first place? It shouldn't be updated at all.
[doublepost=1514647775][/doublepost]

And the moral of this story is that a measley $79 (now $29) solves the problem.

Not to mention that a phone over 2 years old and out of warranty had a battery that was still retaining almost 80% of it’s original capacity.

And still they complain. Unbelievable.

Those batteries aren't good quality. I have just about 80 cycles on my iPhone 6 and the replacement battery health deteriorated to 94% health in just a few months of replacement. In contrast my 7 Plus battery has 98% health after 200 charge cycles on its original battery. What's worse I paid out of pocket for a battery replacement which depreciated so fast I should have just spent that amount getting Assassins Creed Origins. That would have been worth it.

 

[boltjames]

Why was the phone updated to an OS it was never designed to handle in the first place? It shouldn't be updated at all.

Now this, in my opinion, is the entire point. We shouldn't be arguing about battery quality. We should be discussing Apple's philosophy to have a single version of an OS and offer it to owners of old iPhone's.

I believe strongly that Apple should freeze upgrades on old iOS devices as they approach the 2 year mark or the mark where it's about to be two iOS versions away from what it shipped with and was optimized for.

Any member of this forum for the past few years knows full well not to upgrade their older iOS device to the newest iOS version that's 2 generations newer. If you have an iPad that shipped with iOS 9 and you upgraded a year later to iOS 10 and now you're offered iOS 11, don't take iOS 11. There is a huge chance it's going to slow your iPad down to a crawl. This has been going on for a decade.

Some call that shady. I call it Apple trying too hard to a) please legacy consumers and b) make it easier for app developers.

 

[Radon87000]

Now this, in my opinion, is the entire point. We shouldn't be arguing about battery quality. We should be discussing Apple's philosophy to have a single version of an OS and offer it to owners of old iPhone's.

I believe strongly that Apple should freeze upgrades on old iOS devices as they approach the 2 year mark or the mark where it's about to be two iOS versions away from what it shipped with and was optimized for.

Any member of this forum for the past few years knows full well not to upgrade their older iOS device to the newest iOS version that's 2 generations newer. If you have an iPad that shipped with iOS 9 and you upgraded a year later to iOS 10 and now you're offered iOS 11, don't take iOS 11. There is a huge chance it's going to slow your iPad down to a crawl. This has been going on for a decade.

Completely agree with this. In my opinion also Apple should stop support for iOS devices beyond 2 years, 3 max. Anything beyond that and they should enable downgrade support for older devices so the user can go back to an older version of he so desires. There is a reason Google doesn't support Pixel beyond 3 years. Devices are just too slow at that point.

 

[HallStevenson]

Two rude 'geniuses' told me they were dreading all the battery replacement visits they were going to get and said the battery would still have to fail some tests before they would replace it under the new $29 terms, regardless of 3rd party CPU tests.

I'd venture to say that those geniuses aren't as smart as they think they are. Apple isn't likely to have written up all of the rules/policy regarding this, especially since it doesn't start for almost a month away.

 

[Martyimac]

Completely agree with this. In my opinion also Apple should stop support for iOS devices beyond 2 years, 3 max. Anything beyond that and they should enable downgrade support for older devices so the user can go back to an older version of he so desires. There is a reason Google doesn't support Pixel beyond 3 years. Devices are just too slow at that point.

I made a post to this effect somewhere here on MR. Didn't get much traction but I fully agree with this.

 

[Puddled]

Completely agree with this. In my opinion also Apple should stop support for iOS devices beyond 2 years, 3 max. Anything beyond that and they should enable downgrade support for older devices so the user can go back to an older version of he so desires. There is a reason Google doesn't support Pixel beyond 3 years. Devices are just too slow at that point.

It is a good idea (the right idea)

But it wont happen. Updating phones for such long times gives the impession of longevity whist the truth is that they become unusable and hence need replacing.....

 

[Martyimac]

It is a good idea (the right idea)

But it wont happen. Updating phones for such long times gives the impession of longevity whist the truth is that they become unusable and hence need replacing.....

Took me about three reads of your post but finally got what you were saying. Correct me if i am wrong but it's Apple's way of forced obsolescence?

 

[zackdbassist]

Read my post again. An old processor running new firmware it was never designed to handle means it's working harder and, among other things, is straining the battery further. It's how computers work.

If that battery is already 2+ years old, then the strain of the new firmware is the tipping point to push that battery to a shut down condition. If that battery is brand new, then it buys the old processor more time but won't fix the problem indefinitely.

The iPhone 6 was originally optimized and shipped with iOS 8 in 2014. We're at iOS 11 and 2018. And you think the processor wouldn't be an issue nor its impact on battery life on an aged battery? Be real.

Sire, so you mean to say an iPhone 7's processor (A10 is still better than most android flagship processors, I am sure I don't need to say this), if its being throttled because of a battery at 90% health isn't capable of handling a new firmware? Then why do we keep shouting that apple ensures that people keep getting the latest and the greatest when it comes to software updates? (FYI, apple already removes the feature it deems the processor wouldn't be able to handle)

Also, not just 2+ year old iPhones are affected by throttling, even the 7 series is which completely renders your argument or should I say you trying to advocate apple useless.

It's not about battery life here, people want the same performance their phone is capable of with a new battery no matter the device age. If iPhone's are shutting down because of an old battery it simply is a case of poor quality batteries(cheap to add to apple profit) or apple doing it on purpose because other device on the market don't and neither do they throttle their device and call it a "feature". Food for you thought!

On a lighter note, I hope we can be face to face in a court battle.

 

[ablatt]

That's not what's happening. That is a misinterpretation. The problem isn't batteries. The problem is old iPhone's with old processors being updated to the newest OS's by their owners.

When an old car slows it is not because of consumables like tires, batteries, or windshield wipers; it is because the engine is old and can't deliver the horsepower like it used to. What's happening with your old iPhone is the same. Your old processor can't handle the strain of the newest OS and your old battery is therefore being taxed beyond its already compromised limits and that is what is creating the shut down condition.

Get a new iPhone with the newest processor, problem solved. Don't upgrade your 2+ year old hardware to the newest OS, problem solved. Get a replacement battery, you'll get another year or so before you're in the same spot again, problem solved short term.

Old iPhone users want the best of both worlds and Apple can't give it to you anymore. Your old equipment isn't suited for the newest OS. So stop upgrading.

My daughter's iPhone 6S was and is still running IOS 10.3. It started shutting down less than a year into it's life, and IOS 10.2.1 was released to deal with the shutdowns and throttle about a year after it was made. So the new IOS argument is bogus.

 

[Martyimac]

I do know one thing this issue has convinced me of. Going forward from here, I do not intend on upgrading iOS on my phones past the first major step after whatever comes on my phone., IE if it comes with iOS 14 for example, I may not even update to the next iOS 15 release unless there is something in it that is a major fix or added functionality I need.
Apple has a lot of "splainin" to do.

 

[Pagemakers]

Surely they are doing the same to iPads. Hell knows, laptops even!

 

[C DM]

Surely they are doing the same to iPads. Hell knows, laptops even!

And iPods, even Newtons too!