Apple on iPhone Battery Locking Issue: We Want to Make Sure Battery Replacement is Done Properly

This is not a big problem. It tells you that it can't verify the information about the battery. Wanna bet somebody will make a "Battery" app that bypasses it? The normal sort of thing you'd do would be find a way to repeat what you need to know about how that battery is performing. But if you want to be supported by the System, you'll have to get a cert. I hope they do it free. Do they not have the right to tell you it's not following Apple standards. Maybe the way to go would be, Apple has to offer verification of the battery for free, and then you get the display of data in the system. If price is what you want, get a cheaper or non-standard battery. Make an app that shows you the data you need.
 
fingerpuppet said:
Has anyone checked to see if iMazing can report on battery health in these cases? I doubt if it can, but just wondering ...
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I don’t have a device with a third-party battery to check, but there's no reason it shouldn't be able to.
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mattster16 said:
From a brand public perception standpoint fraudulent battery health information is a vulnerability.
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Why would the battery misrepresent its capacity, though? It'd be almost immediately obvious because battery percentage would never hit 100%. That’s…kind of how battery percentage is calculated. Current charge relative to capacity. Divide the former by the latter.

Current charge capacity is the numerator when calculating Battery Health (instantaneously), too.
 
It's simple, Apple can design future iPhones to have an easily swappable battery that users could change themselves. Or, what I would prefer, would be for future Apple customers vote with their wallets and not buy anything Apple until Apple stops being so darned greedy and starts offering more value.

I doubt either will happen any time soon.
 
jonblatho said:
Folks, if you have doubts, just write the following sentence on a piece of paper 100 times until said doubts vanish:

Apple has my best interests, not their revenues, in mind.
Apple has my best interests, not their revenues, in mind.
Apple has my best interests, not their revenues, in mind.
Apple has my best interests, not their revenues, in mind.
Apple has my best inter​
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I have an iPhone here. I put in a crap battery myself, I think I did it right. I'll sell it to you for $400, but I promise the battery is fine. You want to buy it?
 
Ahaahahahaha.
Tim: Everyone else iz stupid shhhtinky and unqualified.
Me: Ferdinand’s Excrements..... I’m not buying it.
Tim: Ahhh. I’ve fallen down and cannot giddy up!

(if you have kids you’ll understand what I am saying because you watched the cartoon Ferdinand)
 
jonblatho said:
Why would the battery misrepresent its capacity, though? It'd be almost immediately obvious because battery percentage would never hit 100%. That’s…kind of how battery percentage is calculated. Current charge relative to capacity. Divide the former by the latter.

Current charge capacity is the numerator when calculating Battery Health (instantaneously), too.
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A sketchy third party manufacturer would probably be happy to save money on lithium cells to produce a lower capacity battery and then report a higher capacity to the OS. Or maybe they'd be happy to reuse partially depleted lithium cells to save some money and have the battery electronics still report 100% health.

If the battery electronics are supplying both current charge and overall capacity it would still hit 100% charge...
 
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What an utter load of tosh! All in the name to kill off third party repairs and force you to pay Apple it’s overpriced repairs.. if you could only use Apple they’d make you buy a new iPhone everytime!
 
mattster16 said:
A sketchy third party manufacturer would probably be happy to save money on lithium cells to produce a lower capacity battery and then report a higher capacity to the OS. Or maybe they'd be happy to reuse partially depleted lithium cells to save some money and have the battery electronics still report 100% health.
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The battery electronics themselves don't report battery health directly.

As I already explained, it's a mean or median of recent calculations of current capacity divided by original capacity (for which Apple, if I recall from before they removed battery health APIs, does not necessarily rely on the original capacity of the battery itself but rather the device model's design capacity), because when calculated instantaneously this value will fluctuate based on environmental conditions.

In either case you'd have some way of knowing when the battery is new that something is amiss because either the battery percentage when charging would never hit 100% or Battery Health for the newly replaced battery would never report 100%.

And once again: Apple's batteries aren't special.
 
jonblatho said:
The battery electronics themselves don't report battery health directly.

As I already explained, it's a mean or median of recent calculations of current capacity divided by original capacity (for which Apple, if I recall from before they removed battery health APIs, does not necessarily rely on the original capacity of the battery itself but rather the device model's design capacity), because when calculated instantaneously this value will fluctuate based on environmental conditions.

In either case you'd have some way of knowing when the battery is new that something is amiss because either the battery percentage when charging would never hit 100% or Battery Health for the newly replaced battery would never report 100%.

And once again: Apple's batteries aren't special.
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Why do you keep focusing on these "Apple's batteries aren't special" thing? Nobody is saying they are special, what they are saying is that they are a KNOWN entity to Apple in terms of specs, design and quality control.

If the 'original capacity' is based on the device model's design capacity, wouldn't it be easy for a non-reputable third party manufacturer to program their battery electronics to misreport a higher than actual current capacity value - thereby showing 100% battery health. The battery charge percentage still hits 100% even with a severely degraded battery since it is based on current charge divided by current capacity (again both of which COULD be misreported by the battery), so I'm not sure where you're coming from there.
 
jonblatho said:
Folks, if you have doubts, just write the following sentence on a piece of paper 100 times until said doubts vanish:

Apple has my best interests, not their revenues, in mind.
Apple has my best interests, not their revenues, in mind.
Apple has my best interests, not their revenues, in mind.
Apple has my best interests, not their revenues, in mind.
Apple has my best inter​
Click to expand...

I'm curious...which company, organisation or business doesn't have revenue in mind? Even a charity has to account for income before it can deal with the best interests of its endeavour.

This just comes across as petulant, intended or not.
 
VulchR said:
Exactly - this would affect the re-sale value of iPhones that have been repaired in non-Apple service centres or by users themselves. This imposes a rather large financial cost to Apple's customer's and it is so unnecessary. I've been using Apple products since the Lisa (yes, I have word-processed on a Lisa) and Apple are really beginning to annoy me with poor quality control and intentionally obstructionist design aimed at making Apple's products disposable rather than repairable. The latter is the real issue for me. If a technician has to replace a battery, then the design of the product is poor. There are plenty of consumer devices in which swapping out a battery takes seconds and these devices neither explode or have poor performance. Imagine if you could only replace the batteries of a flashlight at a designated service centre....
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You want to sue because you wont be able to lie to the buyer about the history of the phone you are selling?
 
MauiPa said:
Save $15 and get a crappy battery, sounds like a winner to me, not to mention jeopardizing the water resistance, and potentially blowing up! $69 is not too much for a battery, cheaper would be better of course, but its not $129, so pretty cheap.

BTW: fixit was b&*T(Ting and moaning about putting in a used battery and what, they were upset?


Also: https://www.ifixit.com/Guide/Samsung+Galaxy+S10+Battery+Replacement/121826. According to iFixit, changing the battery on the Samsung Galaxy S10, is moderated difficulty, and takes 1- 2 hours , and you know, its a battery, somewhat dangerous. so lets see, getting calculator out, battery cost $30, 2 hours labor at $100/hr. woah! that much. So, is $69 really a lot of money? That is like $30 for certified labor. Doesn't sound like a biggie
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What assurance do you have that Apple won't return to its former pricing for battery replacements after the dust settles on the numerous lawsuits related to Batterygate? After all, they'll be the sole source for battery replacements if they are successful. $129 to replace a $30 part in 1/2 hour (or less)... that's $200 an hour for labor.

Don't forget. Apple showed its true colors when it denied battery replacements to customers with out-of-warranty phones. Not free batteries replacements. Replacements period. Instead, owners were expected to live with the performance hit and the software band-aid that Apple didn't disclose.

I rather chew on a lithium battery than trust a Genius bar to advise me.
 
NY Guitarist said:
I see a class action lawsuit in the making here. It seems like Apple is using a scare tactic to reduce competition.

A replacement battery doesn't automatically mean the phone needs 'service'.

Unless there is an obvious and verifiable service issue, battery status should indicate nothing more than the battery may not be an Apple factory replacement.
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Probably, but the net result is going to be far worse for Apple. Can you say "RIGHT TO REPAIR" laws? :)
 
iConcept said:
I'm curious...which company, organisation or business doesn't have revenue in mind? Even a charity has to account for income before it can deal with the best interests of its endeavour.

This just comes across as petulant, intended or not.
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The point: Apple's doing this for money, not safety.

mattster16 said:
If the 'original capacity' is based on the device model's design capacity, wouldn't it be easy for a non-reputable third party manufacturer to program their battery electronics to misreport a higher than actual current capacity value - thereby showing 100% battery health.
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Certainly possible, I suppose, but too much effort, and as I've now said I believe at least twice, if they did so, the battery would never charge to 100% and risk overcharging.
 
And that is another reason why I still have my SE, also I am not deep in the Apple ecosystem, and I have started playing with Linux and will probably buy a feature phone next.= time I replace my phone....cost less than $50 vs over $1000 for an iPhone.

Apple is making it hard by design. These are design choices that Apple is making. Go look how easy it is to change the battery is a cordless phone, unclip the back, pull the battery out...etc...all done in less than 30 seconds.
Thin is a design choice
Glue is a design choice
etc etc etc
 
JRobinsonJr said:
Probably, but the net result is going to be far worse for Apple. Can you say "RIGHT TO REPAIR" laws? :)
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You can still repair it. Apple isn't stopping you from doing this. The same thing if I add an aftermarket radio in my truck, some stuff will not work if I did this. Should I sue the car manufacturer because if this?
 
JPack said:
It's about killing the second hand phone market and repair industry.

Phones with perfectly working parts can no longer be salvaged. There's an entire industry that buys back old iPhones or accepts trade-ins. You can no longer swap a battery from a genuine working device with a broken display without a scary warning.
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Scary warning? Seriously? That’s a bit alarmist. And exactly what is stopping these 3rd market companies from becoming official Apple repair companies?
 
jonblatho said:
The point: Apple's doing this for money, not safety.
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So wouldn't it be logical to accept any old tinkerer be able to swap out the battery purchased from goodness knows where, have it potentially die/brick the iPhone/blow an ear off, then Apple have a new sale?

If your argument was about blame, that Apple were doing it so they couldn't be held responsible for anything going wrong, then I'd be more supportive. I just don't see this being about money.
 
This will be good when it comes to used phones. I’ve seen so many resold phones with dark displays and bad batteries. I do most of the maintenance myself when it comes to macs and iPhone, so I totally understand the frustration but unfortunately there are many resellers not doing a good job and not being honest with the Apple stuff they sell.
 
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