Apple Outlines $30M Bag Check Lawsuit Settlement on Legal Website

[Solomani]

Interesting case, I can see arguments for both sides of the isle on this one.

Apple has a right to inspect employees for potential theft. And if the bag checks are conducted AFTER shift clock out, then Apple also needs to compensate them for the time they have to stay in order to process the bag checks. If the employee ends up 5 minutes overtime because of it, then Apple should pay 5 minutes overtime.

It's really that simple. And it should have been thought out years ago before going to court.

 

[danakin]

Good. Pay me for the time I’ve wasted with TSA.

Funny how some people will whine and cry about the “evil” corporations but ignore what government does every day.

Apple employees always have the option of switching employers. It’s not that easy to switch governments.

Fellow MR Forum posters, the search for Ridiculous Post of The Year can be concluded; yes, in the 2nd week of January.

 

[superberg]

You’ve heard of pockets, right? If you‘re taking so many medications that you need a bag to carry all of them, a bag search is the least of your concerns.

You make a lot of assumptions in your replies. As someone who worked in retail management and had to do bag checks, let me enlighten you:

1. Not everyone drives to work. Lots of retail employees take public transit to work, especially if they are students.

2. Lots of retail employees work multiple jobs. They may not have time to return home between shifts, whether they have a car or not. Students often go right from work to school.

3. Some medications need to be kept cold or require injections, making “carry it in your pocket” an impossible request in some instances. Medications often need to be taken at regular intervals, which don’t take the constantly shifting schedules of retail employees into account.

4. A good manager knows when shifts end and should be prepared to do a bag check in a timely manner.

5. Apple already has cameras all over their stores and can monitor employee behavior easily, making bag checks a waste of time.

6. iPhones and other easily stolen high-value devices check-in for activation before use and can easily be checked for a sales history. (This isn’t rocket science, by the way. Video game console serial numbers have been tracked at purchase for over two decades)

7. Apple customers can walk into a store, scan a product on the floor, and walk out without interacting with a single employee. Apple would not allow this if they didn’t have good floor monitoring practices.

8. Back room inventory can and should be kept under tight control, limiting the need to check bags for anyone working on the floor.

9. Lockers or safe storage space could be provided for employees and monitored as part of shrink protection.

TL;DR: Your opinion is, at best, uninformed. Do better.

 

[HeinoM]

I’m genuinely curious to hear what argument you see here in favor of Apple.

I see both both sides of the “aisle” as well. Any company has a right to protect its intellectual property and try to prevent it from being stolen. Maybe they went about it the wrong way, but I understand the thinking behind bag searches.

 

[TarkinDale]

I’d happily get some back pay for unpaid and wasted time when I worked at the Sydney store.

 

[BGPL]

True. Apple has legitimate security concerns. TSA, on the other hand, spends $7 billion a year and has never caught a single terrorist.

And I never got a class-action suit from TSA, either.

TSA catches people with firearms, knives and explosives almost every day. Just because you didn't read it on Fox News, doesn't mean it didn't happen. They aren't the most prestigious agency in the country, but they are catching people, quite literally every day.

 

[crymimefireworks]

You make a lot of assumptions in your replies. As someone who worked in retail management and had to do bag checks, let me enlighten you:

1. Not everyone drives to work. Lots of retail employees take public transit to work, especially if they are students.

2. Lots of retail employees work multiple jobs. They may not have time to return home between shifts, whether they have a car or not. Students often go right from work to school.

3. Some medications need to be kept cold or require injections, making “carry it in your pocket” an impossible request in some instances. Medications often need to be taken at regular intervals, which don’t take the constantly shifting schedules of retail employees into account.

4. A good manager knows when shifts end and should be prepared to do a bag check in a timely manner.

5. Apple already has cameras all over their stores and can monitor employee behavior easily, making bag checks a waste of time.

6. iPhones and other easily stolen high-value devices check-in for activation before use and can easily be checked for a sales history. (This isn’t rocket science, by the way. Video game console serial numbers have been tracked at purchase for over two decades)

7. Apple customers can walk into a store, scan a product on the floor, and walk out without interacting with a single employee. Apple would not allow this if they didn’t have good floor monitoring practices.

8. Back room inventory can and should be kept under tight control, limiting the need to check bags for anyone working on the floor.

9. Lockers or safe storage space could be provided for employees and monitored as part of shrink protection.

TL;DR: Your opinion is, at best, uninformed. Do better.

Well said! Bag checks are not the way. Shame on Apple.

 

[michaelflynn]

Good. Pay me for the time I’ve wasted with TSA.

Funny how some people will whine and cry about the “evil” corporations but ignore what government does every day.

Apple employees always have the option of switching employers. It’s not that easy to switch governments.

Lmao absolutely the dumbest comment in the history of MacRumors.

 

[Kabeyun]

If you don’t trust your employees it is your fault, modify your hiring process or train your hiring managers better so you get employees you can trust; Apple is a company with the clout to draw top talent, even in retail. It’s a bad policy that demeans employees and steals from them, it should have never been implemented and the consequences are justified.

Trust your employees? Heh. Do you have any idea how much employee theft costs companies? About $50 billion in the US alone. That’s billion with a B. It’s so common they call it “retail shrinkage.” Except Apple, of course, who’s the only company that manages to hire only honest employees who’d never, ever steal. The nerve of anyone who’d dare to impugn their honor!

 

[Jimmy Bubbles]

I was employed by Apple retail from 2012 - 2014. I remember these checks. They even had us carry a “product” card to note what the serial # of what our personal devices were. It was almost an incentive not to carry a bag because then they didn’t have to stop you. But anytime I left the store (break, end of shift) I’d have to stop and present my stuff.

 

[applicious84]

Trust your employees? Heh. Do you have any idea how much employee theft costs companies? About $50 billion in the US alone. That’s billion with a B. It’s so common they call it “retail shrinkage.” Except Apple, of course, who’s the only company that manages to hire only honest employees who’d never, ever steal. The nerve of anyone who’d dare to impugn their honor!

It sounds like a lot...with a B, but Apple alone is valued in Ts. If all the employee theft in the US alone was multiplied by 60, it would still be less than $3 Trillion+ (with a T) value of Apple. Apple's quarterly revenue is worth more than the retail shrinkage of all retail companies in the US combined. $50 billion ain't sh*t when compared with treating employees like humans

Edit: Oops, more like 57x. Apple is currently only worth $2.86T...probably because those employees stole all those iPads

 

[Seoras]

They are not willing to pay high fees/salary for local tech that is why they are outsourcing it in other countries like China where they can get more for less...

"More" ?
Did you see the Uber watch app article on here 3 days ago?
"We no longer supporting the Apple Watch App"
That's what you get when you out source to Asia. I wouldn't call it more, with English like that, I'd call it less.

 

[cosmichobo]

I can appreciate that employers are at the mercy of their staff in that regard - if someone is walking out with stock, it can be a big issue. Surely however, there'd be plenty of surveillance going on in an Apple store..? There must be other ways... (and given they don't do bag searches now - guessing they found them.)

 

[LonestarOne]

TSA catches people with firearms, knives and explosives almost every day. Just because you didn't read it on Fox News, doesn't mean it didn't happen. They aren't the most prestigious agency in the country, but they are catching people, quite literally every day.

I don’t watch Fox News. You’re confusing me with you.

If TSA caught terrorists every day, the prisons would be full of them.

Yes, they take a few pocket knives and scissors from law-abiding citizens. I know a 757/767 pilot who had his nail clippers confiscated. But they don’t catch terrorists every day. Or every week. Or ever. Not a single successful apprehension.

You’ve fallen for government propaganda. You don’t question what the politicians tell you — but heaven forbid a private company takes a few simple measures to reduce theft.

 

[pubb]

Apple's argument was, don't bring a bag or iPhone to work? What year is this?

Looks like Apple lawyers seriously thought that argument would work, up until a female California Supreme Court judge ruled in favor of the retail employees.

I mean, its not entirely out of whack. You choose to bring a bag, you are tacitly agreeing to have it searched after hours.

I don't agree with that argument, particularly since Apple likely has dress codes and having bulky items in pockets is probably not in compliance but whatever. It wouldn't be completely bonkers if that argument was accepted. I would wager that argument would win in other states

 

[boss.king]

I see both both sides of the “aisle” as well. Any company has a right to protect its intellectual property and try to prevent it from being stolen. Maybe they went about it the wrong way, but I understand the thinking behind bag searches.

I don’t think anyone is saying they can’t protect their property though. The whole point is that the way they did it was wrong and they fought tooth and nail not to correct that even though it would cost them peanuts.

 

[macsound1]

Having worked in an Apple store, they were sticklers for clocking in and out.
You'd be penalized for checking your email if you weren't clocked in. You couldn't lift a finger when on break, before or after your shift. They were so particular, constantly reminding us to not feel bad about working while we were on break. Don't answer the walkie-talkie, quickly tell a customer you're off shift while walking in and out.

We had over 100 employees at my store and there were only 30 lockers. So people who did bring bags left them all over the back room. There wasn't another choice. The store was too profitable and our remodel was canceled 3 times.
I could understand if people who took the bus or came after school, might have a large backpack that wasn't just in a locker all day.

That being said, our store didn't check bags regularly, it was random. So one random day a month or something, a manager would stand at the bottom of the elevator and ask to see your bag as you left.
People's scheduled were totally varied though, so it's not like a dozen people all got off shift at the same time so there was no backup.
Maybe this was more of a thing at flagship stores that had lots of people who closed. We usually had 3 closers even though during the day we'd have upwards of 50 employees working at the same time, so I don't know how there could ever be a backup at the end of your shift.

 

[pubb]

Having worked in an Apple store, they were sticklers for clocking in and out.
You'd be penalized for checking your email if you weren't clocked in. You couldn't lift a finger when on break, before or after your shift. They were so particular, constantly reminding us to not feel bad about working while we were on break. Don't answer the walkie-talkie, quickly tell a customer you're off shift while walking in and out.

We had over 100 employees at my store and there were only 30 lockers. So people who did bring bags left them all over the back room. There wasn't another choice. The store was too profitable and our remodel was canceled 3 times.
I could understand if people who took the bus or came after school, might have a large backpack that wasn't just in a locker all day.

That being said, our store didn't check bags regularly, it was random. So one random day a month or something, a manager would stand at the bottom of the elevator and ask to see your bag as you left.
People's scheduled were totally varied though, so it's not like a dozen people all got off shift at the same time so there was no backup.
Maybe this was more of a thing at flagship stores that had lots of people who closed. We usually had 3 closers even though during the day we'd have upwards of 50 employees working at the same time, so I don't know how there could ever be a backup at the end of your shift.

Not having worked at an Apple Store, is it possible that the staff had to wait around while the manager was navel-gazing or having a break or just occupied with something else?

 

[44267547]

Trust your employees? Heh. Do you have any idea how much employee theft costs companies? About $50 billion in the US alone. That’s billion with a B. It’s so common they call it “retail shrinkage.” Except Apple, of course, who’s the only company that manages to hire only honest employees who’d never, ever steal. The nerve of anyone who’d dare to impugn their honor!

You’re not kidding. I used to be a restaurant investor as a side business and got out of it just after the pandemic started. But I can tell you, theft in the retail/restaurant industry is absurd. Especially in the restaurant industry, you’re talking $500 averaging a week when employees take items that they think are ‘worthless’, but actually cost restaurant lots of money. I estimate, with internal theft in the restaurant industry, it’s not unlikely that accrues over $4,000 a year. What’s crazy is, employees will justify the means of why they take items, like “They can afford it” or “They owe this to me”. The rationalization is total lunacy that costs corporations thousands. There has to be accountability somewhere.

 

[ilikewhey]

Good. Pay me for the time I’ve wasted with TSA.

Funny how some people will whine and cry about the “evil” corporations but ignore what government does every day.

Apple employees always have the option of switching employers. It’s not that easy to switch governments.

do you work for TSA? is TSA your employer? no? then that is completely different than whats being discussed here.

 

[ilikewhey]

Then leave your bag at home. Or in the trunk of your car. You don’t need it while you’re at work.

If you walk into a store, visit an amusement park, or attend a concert, you’re likely going to be asked to submit to a bag check. On your time. You don’t like it? You want to go home? Fine. You aren’t indispensable.

clearly you never had a wife or girlfriend, every female i know has a bag no matter where they go and it usually contains personal hygene to their phones to make up.

 

[ilikewhey]

I don’t watch Fox News. You’re confusing me with you.

If TSA caught terrorists every day, the prisons would be full of them.

Yes, they take a few pocket knives and scissors from law-abiding citizens. I know a 757/767 pilot who had his nail clippers confiscated. But they don’t catch terrorists every day. Or every week. Or ever. Not a single successful apprehension.

You’ve fallen for government propaganda. You don’t question what the politicians tell you — but heaven forbid a private company takes a few simple measures to reduce theft.

please please show me one shred of evidence that what you say is true, i'm begging you. just because you don't see it, doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

 

[ChrisA]

Notice that when Apple found they would have to keep the employee on the clock while they searched the bag, they ended the searches.

In other words, when it cost Apple $3 to search a bag, they did the math and found it was not worth $3.

 

[ChrisA]

I'm just here to ask for the name of the lady on the picture...

But on a serious note, the time allotted for bag inspection should be counted for their work hours or they should have been paid additionally since they are extending their stay just to have their bags inspected...

THAT is pretty much what the court figured out. Apple saw had no way out and so agreed to pay back wages. As said, now that a search must be done on "company time" Apple stopped doing it.

 

[Enlightened Doggo]

Having to pay people to be at work–what a concept!