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Apple Reportedly Pressures Pegatron into Ceasing ASUS Zenbook Production

dukebound85 said:
Not sure if serious

Using ones weight to force a manufacturing company to quit producing a competitor's product or risk losing theirs is bullying
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As stated by others, we don't have all the details, so we can only speculate based on what was reported. Yes, it can be seen as bullying, but one of the terms in the agreement between Apple and Pegatron may be that they don't produce similar devices for competing companies. That's entirely reasonable, and Apple may just be reinforcing this term.

Companies (like Apple) invest huge amounts of money to help their manufacturing produce their products to their exact specification. We know that Apple pushes the boundaries of what's been done in manufacturing before. They invent new procedures and process, and then train and equip their partners to utilize those procedures and and processes. If what is learned by Pegatron from Apple is then applied to a competitors products, that would seriously piss off Apple, I think.
 
quaternio said:
Apple aren't doing this because it is a copy; if it were a copy they'd sue ASUS. They are doing it because the product cuts into their market share, because the target audience is the same. I don't know if I like it, but I don't think there should be a law against it, if apple really are doing it.
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Actually it looks like Apple gave Petradon money to make new tools for there products and Petradon uses that same technology to make a competitor product - if that is true than Petradon has done something that is really wrong and there should be a law against that. The problem is that these companies are countries like china and our laws don't mean anything. ( that law part is just a guess ).
 
topmounter said:
So Apple has exclusive rights to "thin" and made out of and/or looks like "metal"?

I love my 13" MBA, but there is no way that I'm going to mistake that Asus thing for a MacBook Air... not even a little bit.
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There are plenty of "Ultrabooks on the market that are thin and light and made of metal that Apple hasn't given a hoot about. This one is different you place the two next to each other and every line is the same. Everything is an exact copy, slope, corner radius, venting, connector location and spacing the only real difference is the color and logo.
 
Speedy2 said:
Copying someone's ideas and designs isn't at all what I'd call a healthy competition, and it sure will not force Apple to innovate. In fact, Apple could release almost the same product every year this way. It also doesn't really improve the choice for the customer when they can only choose between "the original" and several cheap knock-offs that were all produced in the same factory.

I really hate to see the day when all notebooks look like Macbooks and all tablets are virtually identical to iPads.
Please, Asus, HP etc, get off your lazy asses and develop your own stuff. We all know you can do it.
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I 100% agree and good thing about Microsoft Wndows Phones is that they are not copies.

The funny thing the ones that are buying the cheap invitation now say Apple is copying them.

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danielwsmithee said:
There are plenty of "Ultrabooks on the market that are thin and light and made of metal that Apple hasn't given a hoot about. This one is different you place the two next to each other and every line is the same. Everything is an exact copy, slope, corner radius, venting, connector location and spacing the only real difference is the color and logo.
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The ASUS is actually uglier - I dislike the black part around the screen. And it does have the little notch below the touch pad that makes it easy to open.
 
Rivix said:
This is a rumor site where we speculate and debate. Duh?
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Indeed, have at it! But just keep in mind that 95% of stuff that Digitimes prints turns out to be false, and the majority of it is ex ante absurd. Often they don't even bother to make their articles consistent with each other (i.e., they'll publish directly contradictory articles in the timespan).
 
ubersoldat said:
they are just selling a "maybe" similar product at a lower price. which then forces the premium manufacturers like apple to engineer more innovative products to justify their higher price point. similar: generic drugs <-> patented drugs.
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Your analogy has a problem.
Generic drugs don't compete with patented drugs at all, because it's not even legal to manufacture a generic version of a patented drug. You can only start producing generic drugs when the patent protection runs out after a certain number of years. Try selling a Viagra copy and see what happens.

If drug manufacturers weren't allowed a "copy protection" they had no incentive to pour billions into research and take all the risk for introducing new drugs.

When Apple came up with the iPad, the vast majority of analysts and tech journalists were sceptical if this kind of product would sell well. A huge iPod? Who the hell is gonna buy that? After it was clear, that there were many people living in that hell, suddenly every IT company on earth announced their own tablet, even though it had been rumoured for years that such an Apple product would arrive in exactly that form. And yet the Asuses and Samsungs of the world did nothing. They just sat on their hands and only decided to jump on the train when it was rolling at full speed.

And now that everyone is talking about "Ultrabooks", a concept that was in fact conceived and successfully brought to the market by Apple, they are in a similar position. For crying out loud, a thin notebook doesn't have to look almost exactly like a Macbook Air, does it? Do all cars look like Aston Martins and Porsches?
 
The evil empire strikes back.

The most amusing part though is watching armchair fanboys defend the monopolistic and abusive practices of Apple. It's none of their business who their suppliers are also manufacturing for, as long as these operate well within the law. Apple has decided against competing strictly in the marketplace, and now want to exploit their extremely high market power (this is, of course, the beginning of any kind of monopolistic behaviour, which by definition is abuse of market power).

If they really think Asus computer is based upon illegal design, they are free to sue. But then again, seeing how keen Apple is to compete in the courtroom, I wouldn't be surprised if their considerable well-paid army of lawyers is standing by, ready to unleash hell upon a smaller competitor.

Ah, the hippies turning corporate.
 
Speedy2 said:
Copying someone's ideas and designs isn't at all what I'd call a healthy competition, and it sure will not force Apple to innovate. In fact, Apple could release almost the same product every year this way. It also doesn't really improve the choice for the customer when they can only choose between "the original" and several cheap knock-offs that were all produced in the same factory.

I really hate to see the day when all notebooks look like Macbooks and all tablets are virtually identical to iPads.
Please, Asus, HP etc, get off your lazy asses and develop your own stuff. We all know you can do it.
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to me it doesn't even look similar. looks clearly different.

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Speedy2 said:
Your analogy has a problem.
Generic drugs don't compete with patented drugs at all, because it's not even legal to manufacture a generic version of a patented drug. You can only start producing generic drugs when the patent protection runs out after a certain number of years. Try selling a Viagra copy and see what happens.
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i didn't write anything else. please read my post again.
 
*LTD* said:
I don't see them breaking any laws here. Not sure what you mean by "anti-competitive." Apple isn't anti-Asus competition. They've simply asked their supplier to choose. Apart from any contractual agreement Apple has with Pegatron, neither party is bound to the other.

Please stop misrepresenting the situation.
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Under U.S. Law, a company holding a monopoly who uses its position to "suppress competition" may be liable to penalties under the Sherman Anti-trust Act. In my mind there is no question that Apple is attempting to suppress competition here, and that it is using its economic position to do so. The end question then becomes, "Does Apple fit the definition of a monopoly?" In view of its market share, the answer has to be "no."* Still, they don't look very good here, do they?

*Is the answer the same if we look at revenues?
 
techsmith said:
This is different. Intel was punishing their customers (Dell, HP, etc) if they chose AMD. And Intel were crooks and bullies for doing it. Apple is in no way punishing their customers.
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Also Intel had an 80% monopoly and tried to kill any little bit of struggling competition that was springing up.

Apple has a <5% market share worldwide. Asus on the other hand sells A LOT more computers. They can fight each other all they want.
 
MacLawyer said:
Under U.S. Law, a company holding a monopoly who uses its position to "suppress competition" may be liable to penalties under the Sherman Anti-trust Act. In my mind there is no question that Apple is attempting to suppress competition here, and that it is using its economic position to do so. The end question then becomes, "Does Apple fit the definition of a monopoly?" In view of its market share, the answer has to be "no."* Still, they don't look very good here, do they?

*Is the answer the same if we look at revenues?
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how is Apple suppressing competition?

Asustek is free to build a MBA clone in another factory..

oh wait they need the manufacturing process Apple invested $$$ to help develop.
 
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MacLawyer said:
Under U.S. Law, a company holding a monopoly who uses its position to "suppress competition" may be liable to penalties under the Sherman Anti-trust Act. In my mind there is no question that Apple is attempting to suppress competition here, and that it is using its economic position to do so. The end question then becomes, "Does Apple fit the definition of a monopoly?" In view of its market share, the answer has to be "no."* Still, they don't look very good here, do they?

*Is the answer the same if we look at revenues?
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I think we very well should be.

And if we use oil as an example, and their effect on the public policy, it's only a matter of time before apple starts exerting their muscle.
 
ubersoldat said:
i didn't write anything else. please read my post again.
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Uhm, yes you did.
You implied that copying would drive innovation by giving the analogy of generic drugs, completely leaving out the crucial fact that these copies are only allowed after the patented original is 20 years old.
If the Macbook Air is, say, 5-10 years old, I'm pretty sure Apple won't mind Asus copying it because they and the others who drive innovation have already moved on.
 
I think this thread (along with pretty much every fan-based website and discussions of IP) also highlights not many people understand differences between copyrights, trademarks and patents, and what actually constitutes abuse of market power or anti-competitive behaviour.

In short, whether we agree with it or not, it's still anti-competitive conduct. Unless there's a valid business reason for forcing a supplier to deal exclusively with a business with threat of losing their business (e.g. the excess capacity is reducing the capacity for their own contract) then it's likely to be considered anti-competitive. That being said it's not hard to come up with a business reason to justify such behaviour.
 
MacLawyer said:
Under U.S. Law, a company holding a monopoly....
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You lost me already. Apple is NOT a monopoly. In fact, Apple is the UNDERDOG. So anything else you say is irrelevant.


Asus sold 7.09 million laptops, Apple sold 2.74 million (http://www.notebookcheck.net/Notebook-shipments-decline-across-the-board-for-Q1-2011.52400.0.html) - this is just a quick google, I'm sure there are other numbers in other quarters.

and you somehow think APPLE is a monopoly? Seriously????
 
bbeagle said:
You lost me already. Apple is NOT a monopoly. In fact, Apple is the UNDERDOG. So anything else you say is irrelevant.


Asus sold 7.09 million laptops, Apple sold 2.74 million (http://www.notebookcheck.net/Notebook-shipments-decline-across-the-board-for-Q1-2011.52400.0.html) - this is just a quick google, I'm sure there are other numbers in other quarters.

and you somehow think APPLE is a monopoly? Seriously????
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according to a lawyer somebody's always in the wrong ;)
 
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*LTD* said:
Good. No one wants to lose Apple's business.

Nice to see Apple taking a stand against this. Seems Tim Cook is more Jobsian than previously thought. Which I for one, like to see.
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All credit to you. Probably the most consistently down-ranked poster on MacRumors, but you keep coming back for more.

It's strange, though. I've no doubt that, in an ideal world, you'd like nothing more than Apple churning out the same stuff, at quadruple the price, with absolutely no competition.

And that takes fanboyism to an entirely new level.
 
MacLawyer said:
Under U.S. Law, a company holding a monopoly who uses its position to "suppress competition" may be liable to penalties under the Sherman Anti-trust Act. In my mind there is no question that Apple is attempting to suppress competition here, and that it is using its economic position to do so. The end question then becomes, "Does Apple fit the definition of a monopoly?" In view of its market share, the answer has to be "no."* Still, they don't look very good here, do they?

*Is the answer the same if we look at revenues?
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You forgot the part about Apple taking a stand (quite likely legal) against rip-off artists, counsellor. ASUS in this case is no "ordinary" competition. They are another legal target, and for now, Pegatron is enabling ASUS' activities. This is a prelude to a wider campaign by Apple against MBA knock-off artists. Same as Apple's moves against Samsung were the opening salvo of their wider campaign against Google (as we're seeing now with Apple's move against the Galaxy Nexus running stock Android.)

What, you assume Apple had no legal basis for doing this and just went into it blind??

LOL
 
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