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Apple Restricts Hard Drive Replacements on New iMacs
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Anandtech clocked the Vertex 3 at 4.15 W under heavy load, and StorageReview measured 4.1 W peak on the 5 V rail for a 2 TB WD Caviar Black. So worst case scenario, with an SSD and HDD both on one power cable thrashing at full bore, you'd be at 8.25 W altogether, but I'm guessing you could pull at least 15 W before you ran into any trouble. I didn't mean to get you worried, I'd go the splitter route as well... If I had a mid 2011 iMac.
Your vision of "every computer manufacturer" is flawed. They design their desktop computers to be serviceable. Most are easy to upgrade, but can be fairly limited by the "just right" sized power supply. Replacing a hard drive and ram won't matter, but you certainly can't drop in a high-end video card or power hungry raid controller and 2-4 hard drives. However, this allows customizable systems at BTO time.
The iMac (as well as PC all-in-ones) aren't built to be CTO to the extent of a normal desktop. Because of their nature, likely having the same "right sized" power supply, they can't support video card swapping. The iMac comes with great external extensibility, and high speed ports built into a small and well-organized enclosure. It is no xMac, nor is it a Mac Pro. The low end, tower Mac will not come back. The 1000 people who want it can get a Mac Pro or build an unauthorized Mac and deal with the components in the wild that Apple doesn't want to (which is likely big part of the weighted decision as to why this is no longer an option. Non-"power users" adding in PC components, having them not work, possibly damaging their systems, and blaming Apple)
I would say it has to do more with most OEMs using generic OEM hardware than designing the computers for serviceability. Most OEMs void your warranty just by opening up the side of the case so I suspect they don't really care how serviceable it is for a end user.
From what I've seen it actually is an off the shelf Y-cable. They just don't use that proprietary power connector but the power connector on the other end of the line (the part that goes into the hdd). That end isn't proprietary but standard SATA. It was the 27" iMac iirc, apparently it does have enough space for it. I think it was on the chargedpc.com blog.
Loudness is a very subjective thing. You need to measure it, I think using the amount of rpm will be good enough for most people, don't necessarily need dB.
In a Dutch forum somebody replaced the hdd with an OCZ Vertex 3 (start reading it from here and onwards). The temperature in the SMART status is 128C. It seems that quite a lot of ssds report this as a temperature. I think those drives don't have a temp sensor at all and just report this back. Could be that the iMac is interpreting this as "hey, there is an ssd which doesn't have a temp sensor so no need to rev up". Reporting anything other than 128C will trigger the fans to rev for safety. Mind you, this is just a theory.
In my experience AHT is unusable anyway. Other tools are much better at troubleshooting since they actually detect the problem whereas AHT says everything is just fine. I wouldn't worry about what AHT says, it is not to be trusted imo.
From what I've seen people posted pics with the fan rpm being around 800~900. If it has the same fans as my Mac Pro has this is the lowest setting, very quiet.
Or it may not even need any sensor since it is hooked up to a standard slimline cdrom sata connection on the logic board.
I wish you guys posted this in the initial blog post. This is a much better one since it explains your findings without drawing any definitive conclusions like the first blog post does. The situation has gone from "not even remotely possible" to "ah, we think it could be done". Quite a drastic change if you ask me...
Again, it's about a 10 minute job to swap out a supply. I've been doing it since 1985.
Let me guess, no PC has "great external extensibility" other than the Mac..
No, it's NOT 1000 people. It's the 95% of the world's population who don't use Macs. Trust me, Everyone who owns a PC isn't a "geek" or a "tinkerer" who NEEDS Apple to Install the RAM for them, or change a HDD at about 3 time the price!!
Oh Yes, You can't use "PC components", they are "Crappy and Clunky" compared to the wonderful "special" Processors, RAM, Hard drives, and Video Cards that Apple Uses..
Wake up.. It's just a Pretty PC with the world's best OS sold at a jacked up price. PERIOD!
FILE A CLASS ACTION LAWSUIT against Apple over this, people!
Buying a different computer product other than Apple is not an option. Demand that a company respect consumers' wishes and preferences. Don't tell me it can't be done. IT CAN BE DONE! Just force them to accept your preferences as an user-consumer.
Dream up new legal ways to force a company to respect and accommodate user-consumers' preferences.
Buying a different computer product other than Apple is not an option. Demand that a company respect consumers' wishes and preferences. Don't tell me it can't be done. IT CAN BE DONE! Just force them to accept your preferences as an user-consumer.
Dream up new legal ways to force a company to respect and accommodate user-consumers' preferences.
+1
My old Gateway tower from 2003 is still be used because its "built to be upgradable". I certainly got moneys worth out of it
Update
OWC has posted an updated blog entry with a much less "the sky is falling" tone, and some actual research data, here:
http://blog.macsales.com/10206-further-explained-apples-imac-2011-model-hard-drive-restrictions
Hardmac also has a take on the situation:
http://www.hardmac.com/news/2011/05...le-to-replace-the-hard-drive-of-the-2011-imac
OWC has posted an updated blog entry with a much less "the sky is falling" tone, and some actual research data, here:
http://blog.macsales.com/10206-further-explained-apples-imac-2011-model-hard-drive-restrictions
Hardmac also has a take on the situation:
http://www.hardmac.com/news/2011/05...le-to-replace-the-hard-drive-of-the-2011-imac
Thanks for Hardmac link.
Apparently there is indeed an issue with the hard drive swap on the new iMacs and there is proprietary firmware on the Apple supplied Hard Drives.
The good news is that it doesn't appear to be a sinister plot by Apple to lock out the end user but was changed to monitor the temperature of the disk as precisely as possible.
As is usually the case there is always a middle ground between those saying NO PROBLEMS exist and those saying THE SKY IS FALLING.
The worst part of all these discussions is that no one will remember the true facts and still believe what they want to believe.
Most people still believe that the MacBook Air has a super-powered USB to run the MacBook Air Superdrive.
I don't think anyone said there were NO problems, just that the article was false as there were people who had successfully replaced the drives.
Seriously man, I was contemplating a 27" iMac i7, or an i7 21.5 and a second screen, and demote my hackintosh to a backup machine/PC gaming rig.
But another stupid apple move is making me consider a new i7 hackintosh, i already have a spare GPU and PSU, so for a beefy i7, 12GB of ram, nice corsair water cooler and case I'd be spending less than £700, and my dual 1680 x 1050 monitors still have plenty of life in them.
I'd love a MacPro, but it's honestly more than I need, and beyond my budget for what I'd use it for, and I still believe over priced/under specced for the base models. The 12 core ones may cost a fortune, but they seem to be on a par with other work stations, whereas the quad/hex core ones need more ram slots and better GPU to justify the price.
If they actually updated the mini to use an i7, with replaceable ram and HD (don't care too much about the GPU in a mac as I game in windows) I'd buy one for the convenience.
But another stupid apple move is making me consider a new i7 hackintosh, i already have a spare GPU and PSU, so for a beefy i7, 12GB of ram, nice corsair water cooler and case I'd be spending less than £700, and my dual 1680 x 1050 monitors still have plenty of life in them.
I'd love a MacPro, but it's honestly more than I need, and beyond my budget for what I'd use it for, and I still believe over priced/under specced for the base models. The 12 core ones may cost a fortune, but they seem to be on a par with other work stations, whereas the quad/hex core ones need more ram slots and better GPU to justify the price.
If they actually updated the mini to use an i7, with replaceable ram and HD (don't care too much about the GPU in a mac as I game in windows) I'd buy one for the convenience.
Hard Drive IS NOT User-Replaceable
I had a 2009 27-in iMac and I currently own a mid 2010 model. Believe what you will, but I KNOW from my own experience that you CANNOT just swap drives on neither, even with the same brand hard drive, without the fans going into high gear permanently. Swapping the hard drives involved some sort of BS workaround like installing a software fan controller, finding a matching SATA cord, or installing an alternate temperature sensor. In other words, replacing the HD on these involves jerry-rigging the machine somehow. That SUCKS.
And yet, I love my machine. It's beautiful, fast, and stable. But I KNOW that when the HD dies I'll have to send it in somewhere (unless your tinkering skills are well beyond average, you will too).
OWC is merely saying that on the newly released ones they cannot apply the jerry-rigs that they could on previous models. That's all. This is good info for us; we need to know what were getting into before we spend our hard-earned cash. I know I spent quite a bit trying out different brand and model HDs to upgrade mine, while following the advice on the 'net, to no avail. Had I known that the iMacs had this issue to begin with, I would have made different decisions with regard to hard drive capacity when I made my purchase, or even skip it altogether.
They are not spreading FUD, like I've seen some posters say here. From my personal experience, it's all true. Believe who you want...
I had a 2009 27-in iMac and I currently own a mid 2010 model. Believe what you will, but I KNOW from my own experience that you CANNOT just swap drives on neither, even with the same brand hard drive, without the fans going into high gear permanently. Swapping the hard drives involved some sort of BS workaround like installing a software fan controller, finding a matching SATA cord, or installing an alternate temperature sensor. In other words, replacing the HD on these involves jerry-rigging the machine somehow. That SUCKS.
And yet, I love my machine. It's beautiful, fast, and stable. But I KNOW that when the HD dies I'll have to send it in somewhere (unless your tinkering skills are well beyond average, you will too).
OWC is merely saying that on the newly released ones they cannot apply the jerry-rigs that they could on previous models. That's all. This is good info for us; we need to know what were getting into before we spend our hard-earned cash. I know I spent quite a bit trying out different brand and model HDs to upgrade mine, while following the advice on the 'net, to no avail. Had I known that the iMacs had this issue to begin with, I would have made different decisions with regard to hard drive capacity when I made my purchase, or even skip it altogether.
They are not spreading FUD, like I've seen some posters say here. From my personal experience, it's all true. Believe who you want...
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This makes no difference. It won't deter Apple's target market from handing them record Mac sales each quarter. Quite a few people here are taking the opportunity to troll by artificially inflating the issue to make it seem like a total deal-breaker.
I used to have an iMac. And like most consumers who buy them, I've never had its hard drive fail on me. And if it did, the last thing I'm going to do is start taking the damn thing apart.
Computers are appliances we use to get things done, not tech projects we work on.
For the average user with a warranty, their best bet always is to go through Apple.
This makes no difference. It won't deter Apple's target market from handing them record Mac sales each quarter. Quite a few people here are taking the opportunity to troll by artificially inflating the issue to make it seem like a total deal-breaker.
I used to have an iMac. And like most consumers who buy them, I've never had its hard drive fail on me. And if it did, the last thing I'm going to do is start taking the damn thing apart.
Computers are appliances we use to get things done, not tech projects we work on.
For the average user with a warranty, their best bet always is to go through Apple.
When an appliance, such as a refrigerator, needs the water filter replaced, do you want to take it in and pay for a replacement + labor or do you want to replace it yourself for the cost of a filter?
If your cars blinker stopped working do you want to take it into the shop and get it replaced or just buy a new light and pop it in?
Your reply really essentially feeds into the fact that you only care about how Apple does as a company versus how you do as a consumer. Its strangely backwards.
Exactly! Who cares? Sure there are a few technical people out there, but the reality is that the majority of people who buy iMacs just do not want that hassle.
I have two iMacs now, actually 5 if you count the old ones in my lab, and never once have I felt the urge to switch out a hard drive. My current i7 iMac from the last round has a 2TB drive and that vent on the top chucks out a serious amount of heat. Anything Apple can do to control that is fine by me.
Besides, my understanding is that the new iMacs are a nightmare to open and for $120 I was able to get three years of Applecare, so they can fix it for me if something goes wrong. I always get good value with the Applecare packages I have had in the past, particularly with my Macbooks because they take quite a beating in my bag.
... except for the most obvious thing perhaps?
The simplest way for Apple to do something about the overheating problems with Imacs and Apple laptops would be to increase the space within the chassis to improve the cooling (better airflow, more space for larger fans, more vents, ...).
If nothing else, this "proprietary disk" story shows how Apple engineering (or the Apple fashion team) puts thin over function. If the design requires special firmware and hardware to monitor temperatures to avoid a meltdown - perhaps the design should be reconsidered.
The simplest way for Apple to do something about the overheating problems with Imacs and Apple laptops would be to increase the space within the chassis to improve the cooling (better airflow, more space for larger fans, more vents, ...).
If nothing else, this "proprietary disk" story shows how Apple engineering (or the Apple fashion team) puts thin over function. If the design requires special firmware and hardware to monitor temperatures to avoid a meltdown - perhaps the design should be reconsidered.
And how important is a super thin AIO? It sits on a desk its whole life. Its not a portable computer.
Very interesting how this thread has turned out. Seems OWC is correct across he board on this issue. Any non-apple firmwared drive WILL required some alternate Gorman of fan control. That is absolutely shameful on Apples part. Thank you to OWC for making this known quickly so people can decide if they want to support this type of arrogance from Apple. I am Die-Hard Mac by the way.
In fairness to Michael, we were still working through the exact details of what Apple had done here. We have a lot of projects rolling and to the point of the blog, the one thing that was 100% confirmed is that connecting a drive into the iMac 2011 HDD bay that didn't originally come in a iMac 2011 (not sure if Apple will be using the same firmware on the drives going into Mac Pros now?) is not a compatible solution. it also shared his opinion, it was his blog post related to what our product development team had encountered and was working through. I think some aspects got a blown out of proportion, and taken out of context. This has been learned from.
As for successful upgrades out there and calling our report false - from what we understand now, those 'successful' upgrades involve the use of a Y-Power splitter. This Y-Power splitter shorts Apple's thermal sensor line which, as reported by Hardmac, tells the iMacs's thermal monitoring system that there is no hard drive present and thus no sensor to read.
it's a really good idea that those users immediately install a SMART app like iStat or HDD Fan Control - which can be used to control the iMac's HDD Bay fan speed by the SMART reported temperature provided from the hard drive now in the bay. Otherwise... going to likely have some baked hard drives.
It is true that you can no longer replace the hard drive with another drive and have your iMac operate with stock software. I don't see that as a huge deal... but it isn't ideal. The need to use a SMART monitoring application means if that application glitches, an OS update interferes with the version you have and don't know, or somebody who's not as well versed buys a so configured iMac used - this has caveats that can actually have severe consequences - toasting the hard drive if nothing else.
For the typically DIYer, this is all manageable. But, again - this has consequences that work arounds for 2009 and 2010 iMacs do not have. Just have to be aware...
As a side note, leaving the HD alone and just adding an SSD has huge benefits... and this can be done in a way with the stock Apple drive which doesn't have any negative consequences or software solutions, etc. to maintain and be mindful of. Have to do that right too... short that thermal line and it doesn't matter what brand/rom HD is in the hdd bay.
====
As for this change being for any reliability or accuracy reasoning... This change, in my opinion, gets the same data - but allows Apple to use a single cable solution for whatever drive they are building with. It is a very custom solution, re-appropriating leads on the hdd power connector that do LED access output for the thermal voltage - but it eliminates the need to stock and maintain BOMs with a different cable set for each different drive manufacturer.
If anyone is to blame for Apple's unique and, yes proprietary solution (at least today it is) - it's these HD manufacturers who all had to have their own pin out arrangement for standard thermal sensor connection.
can see more comment in the followup blog
<http://blog.macsales.com/10206-further-explained-apples-imac-2011-model-hard-drive-restrictions>
As for successful upgrades out there and calling our report false - from what we understand now, those 'successful' upgrades involve the use of a Y-Power splitter. This Y-Power splitter shorts Apple's thermal sensor line which, as reported by Hardmac, tells the iMacs's thermal monitoring system that there is no hard drive present and thus no sensor to read.
it's a really good idea that those users immediately install a SMART app like iStat or HDD Fan Control - which can be used to control the iMac's HDD Bay fan speed by the SMART reported temperature provided from the hard drive now in the bay. Otherwise... going to likely have some baked hard drives.
It is true that you can no longer replace the hard drive with another drive and have your iMac operate with stock software. I don't see that as a huge deal... but it isn't ideal. The need to use a SMART monitoring application means if that application glitches, an OS update interferes with the version you have and don't know, or somebody who's not as well versed buys a so configured iMac used - this has caveats that can actually have severe consequences - toasting the hard drive if nothing else.
For the typically DIYer, this is all manageable. But, again - this has consequences that work arounds for 2009 and 2010 iMacs do not have. Just have to be aware...
As a side note, leaving the HD alone and just adding an SSD has huge benefits... and this can be done in a way with the stock Apple drive which doesn't have any negative consequences or software solutions, etc. to maintain and be mindful of. Have to do that right too... short that thermal line and it doesn't matter what brand/rom HD is in the hdd bay.
====
As for this change being for any reliability or accuracy reasoning... This change, in my opinion, gets the same data - but allows Apple to use a single cable solution for whatever drive they are building with. It is a very custom solution, re-appropriating leads on the hdd power connector that do LED access output for the thermal voltage - but it eliminates the need to stock and maintain BOMs with a different cable set for each different drive manufacturer.
If anyone is to blame for Apple's unique and, yes proprietary solution (at least today it is) - it's these HD manufacturers who all had to have their own pin out arrangement for standard thermal sensor connection.
can see more comment in the followup blog
<http://blog.macsales.com/10206-further-explained-apples-imac-2011-model-hard-drive-restrictions>
Apparently, thinness is more important than reliability, performance or the ability to use off-the-shelf standard parts.
Two words - "profit margin".
Solid state hard drives are more expensive than spinning hard drives. An all-SSD lineup would be much more expensive - Apple would have to reduce profit margins to keep the price more reasonable.
The entry Imac has a 500 GB 7200 RPM hard drive - 500 GB 7200 RPM 6 Gbps SATA drives are less than $40 at retail.
Apple wants $600 extra for a 256 GB SSD - Newegg has them starting at about $450 for 256 GB. The price on a 512 GB SSD at Newegg is around the price of the entry Imac....
It's hardly "tragic" - SSDs just haven't yet fallen in price far enough to be mainstream in entry-level systems. (Although it's a stretch to call a $1200 system entry-level, unless it's from Apple.)
Gee, so those screaming in giant red letters about fabrications stories, etc. are wrong after all about OWC? Tsk. Tsk.
questions
Heaven knows I'm no lawyer, but I do wonder how far down this kind of road a company can go before it can be accused of committing restraint of fair trade.
Heaven knows I'm no lawyer, but I do wonder how far down this kind of road a company can go before it can be accused of committing restraint of fair trade.
Who knows where this will go. Aside from those who are displaying frankly blind allegiance and coming out with remarks like "Go Apple, this is great for profit margins", this move seems to have garnered almost universal disdain on this thread. Sure, most of the comments are from geeks, most iMac owners probably wouldn't undertake an upgrade themselves, etc etc. But I wonder how the average iMac user is going to feel if they experience a hard drive failure and they find out how much Apple is going to charge them for a replacement, not to mention the inconvenience of having to get to an Apple store.
And there's a principle at stake here....Yet another Apple dependence mechanism to add to the non user serviceable battery in laptops and iPads.....More golden handcuffs.
This isn't trivial.
And there's a principle at stake here....Yet another Apple dependence mechanism to add to the non user serviceable battery in laptops and iPads.....More golden handcuffs.
This isn't trivial.