Why are we assuming that people buy an iPhone in spite of its closed app ecosystem, and not because of it?
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Apple Says Spotify Wants 'Limitless Access' to App Store Tools Without Paying
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Why are we assuming that people buy an iPhone in spite of its closed app ecosystem, and not because of it?
Ad a gatekeeper, Apple is still not a monopoly.
There are many apps available that compete directly with Apple apps.
Pages is free, yet Word and other text processors are available.
If Apple wanted the app store to be a monopoly they wouldnt allow these in.
Your beef I believe is Apple does stop some types of apps out of the stores.
Apps they dont write either. Apps that grant access to hardware or allow games to be emulated.
Although they do allow games and computer emulators that are genuinely licenced or new versions.
Plenty of 80s game like Pacman etc.
Even the Commodore 64 was emulated in a way.
Apps that came pre installed on my 'consumer device'. Apple TV, Apple Podcasts Apple Messages, Facetime, Apple News, Apple Music, Safari, Apple App Store
Apps that came pre installed on my M3 'general purpose tool' Apple TV, Apple Podcasts Apple Messages, Facetime, Apple News, Apple Music, Safari, Apple App Store.
Yeah totally different things.
Thats the issue though for Spotify...
If the have their own payment option, Apple is still going to charge them a 27% technology fee - so they wont be happy at all
They want to pay nothing.
The Safari on your phone is totally different to the Safari on your laptop.
The apps you mention arent the ones all the vocal "open up my iPhone" want to use
But once you set the precedent, it opens the way to challenge all other companies.
Thats exactly how the law works.
SOmeone pushes the boundaries for a ruling and then others use that to get what they want due to the prior ruling
Thats the issue though for Spotify...
If the have their own payment option, Apple is still going to charge them a 27% technology fee - so they wont be happy at all
They want to pay nothing.
How much do they pay for their Mac App?
Do you really think Epic like paying Sony and Nintendo 30%?
Really?
They are picking on the easiest target because a phone already has other apps allowed (even if vetted).
They saw the opportunity to use it.
But if they win, it will embolden them to push into other platforms.
There is no Spotify app in the Mac app store. So its like all other Mac apps/programs.
General purpose computer running a program that doesn’t need to use Apple’s tools to build installed by downloading a .zip file from Spotify.com.
Apple has never collected money for programs not in their App Store.
What’s your point?
Oh I know, I was just pointing out the absurdity of Mrkevinfinnerty’s wish for EU regulation 😂Thats the issue though for Spotify...
If the have their own payment option, Apple is still going to charge them a 27% technology fee - so they wont be happy at all
They want to pay nothing.
Spotify probably did you free Apple tools to write the program though.
Many on here either dont know or forget that in the early days, we paid for OS updates. We paid for dev tools like compilers.
Apple really opened things up giving both away.
It forced Microsoft to do it too.
That was a huge change and allowed more people to get into programming.
The app store yearly fee covers some of the time and effort of reviewing/checking an app before release.
The Mac App Store is the same.
But people are also welcome to release software on their own sites with payments they handle.
Even still, some devs find the app store is a great hub to make your program visible, alert users when updates happen, market and promote and no worry about payments and refunds. Even when they offer the same on their own site.
Exactly.
If Epic is unhappy when they "lose" 30% by selling VBucks on Apple's App Store... they should also be upset when they "lose" 30% by selling VBucks on XBox, Playstation, and Switch.
Fees are fees... and every platform has them.
I knew you did and good on you for calling out the absurdity.
It gets silly each day on here.
And yet so few voices against what Apple does.
Given the tech nature of the reader on here, I would have expected heaps more voices against Apple controlling things.
Instead it is a few.
We all know banks charge transaction fees for electronic payments.
The rate you get depends on the size of your business.
Apple is probably still being cheeky suggesting 3% cost. Even large supermarkets with high volumes get 1.1%- 1.5%. Small players get hit much harder. Amex still think they are a premium service and many businesses here refuse to use them or hit the customer with a 5% extra.
The move to 27% technology provision is not going to make people happy.
It's a clever way to say "you can have your alt payments" but you arent going to get rich doing it
You could claim the tools you give them for free, the marketing etc all are paid for by this fee.
The payment processing is just a small part of doing business.
If they run an alt payment store, they are going to need to setup chop and handle a lot of processes in house (or outsource and pay someone else - the irony not lost there!).
Have you seen any examples of a legal, worthwhile sideloading app?
I keep asking them what they want to load.
Running a desktop program and distributing a "testing" app to family and friends seem to be the only legit answers.
Apple vetting/signing alt app store apps is still not going to make them happy either.
Two whole developers? That’s not a whole lot when there are thousands of developers. We’ve basically got Epic Games and Spotify. Haven’t heard anyone else speak up, so that’s a pretty bold statement to say, “Where as developers want Apple opened up.” I don’t see this clamor from a massive horde. Apple’s walled garden ran for over a decade before Epic Games decided it wanted to freeload. Now Spotify wants to freeload, probably because of Epic. You sound like there are huge numbers demanding change on the iPhone when it’s a grand total of 2. Two isn’t far from zero when there are thousands of developers. I could easily say, almost every iOS developer doesn’t care enough to force Apple to open up.
There’s not a vendor who doesn’t install their own stuff on devices they sell. Google does it. Microsoft does it. Samsung does it. Sony does it… the list goes on. Apple makes it easy to delete what you don’t want, something they put into their OS’es years ago. Just go into jiggle mode and hit the X and that app you don’t want is gone. The only app that can’t be removed is Store, which makes sense since you’ve practically crippled your device if you delete that. Even on Windows PC’s, every computer vendor installs its own apps or sponsored apps, which most people refer to as bloatware.
This is why I objected years ago when Europe demanded Microsoft remove Internet Explorer from Windows for no good reason. If you don’t want it, delete it, instead of wasting people’s time and money by suing over this stuff. There’s not a vendor that doesn’t do the same thing, and no one can even claim Apple‘s apps have the highest use, despite being bundled. On its own platform, Apple’s Safari, Messages, FaceTime, Music, etc. all lose to other apps, let alone on Android where Apple apps are few and far between. At least IE could claim to be the dominant browser app at the time. An actual monopoly wouldn’t allow the competition to be hosted on its App Store. Instead, Apple allows its own apps to lose the battle for market share without a protest.
The Safari on your phone is totally different to the Safari on your laptop.
The apps you mention arent the ones all the vocal "open up my iPhone" want to use
It really isn't.
That the idea that the platforms are fundamentally different in terms of software distribution is nonsense. The restrictions are artificial and there to ensure nobody can circumvent Apples rents.
That wasn't the point I was making. The point is to describe macOS and iOS as completely different is nonsense. I can run iOS apps on my mac!
The problem with IE is it was impossible to remove. It was so integrated in that you were required to have it on your computer zero other choice. Mix that with forced default and trying to hide the fact there were alternatives.
I remember back then IE for me served one purpose and it was to download Firefox.
It’s nonsense because you said so? 😂
Just because you can run an iOS app on top of Mac OS does not mean the *devices* fulfill the same role and must be treated the same.
Can you run a Mac app on iOS? Is that an “artificial” limitation or a real technological one?
Oh, “it really isn’t” is “really old” as a response.
No. The market is about mobile operating systems of which Apple (iOS) and Google (Android) are the two major players.
All you had to do was delete the shortcut and set the default browser to something else. In fact that’s the second thing I do when installing Windows or get a new Android device after changing the UI to dark mode. I used IE only when I had to, generally when I ran into incompatible websites that wouldn’t function right on any other browser, generally banking websites. That’s the only reason Chrome is installed today. Otherwise, I ignore(d) both of them because they both suck(ed). I’m not out there trying to get Chrome banned and removed from Android or Chromebooks despite Android being the dominant mobile OS. People always want to go for the complicated ways to deal with things when a quick delete and ignore is so easy to do. It’s a bad mentality, caring what other people do instead of just living your own life the way you want to do it. Too many people think disrupting someone’s business model and spending millions in court battles is easier than spending 20 seconds changing their defaults.
I had someone tell me that consoles aren’t being sued because no one cares enough to sue them, which makes Apple evil but Microsoft/Sony/Nintendo the guys wearing halos (not really, but I’m editorializing). Well, if someone doesn’t care enough to choose an alternate browser, why do you care? They don’t.