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It's very, very rare for a district court to grant a preliminary injunction in a patent case. So this case is unusual on this basis alone. Samsung will be able to appeal to the Court of Appeals for the Federal Circuit. District court judges are often reversed on appeal for incorrect claim construction, which is the definition given to disputed terms in a patent claim. Many district court judges joke that they might as well flip a coin in deciding claim construction. To avoid a preliminary injunction, an accused infringer need only raise a substantial question that the patent claims are invalid. The burden of proof is much lower regarding invalidity than it would be when the case actually goes to trial.

For those of you who have opinions about the merits (for or against) of Apple's claim, I doubt you have ever prepared a claim chart that correlates each patent claim with features in the accused product (to show infringement) or with features in the prior art (to show invalidity). It's a very rigorous analysis, which is another reason that injunctions are rarely granted in patent cases before the parties have actually completed some discovery on the issues.

This case has just begun.
 
Apple stole PalmOS?

The Newton was released in 1993

Image

and the Palm was released in 1996:


Image

They look very similar, but which came first ? (There's a hint in the post.)

Thats awesome. But even in this with dates and such showing with came first. I'm more concerned about "what's patented or not" here. Its possible that Palm has patents that Apple didn't have and vise versa. Also whether or nor at the time, they had patents that were shared, or completely invented all on there own. Did they battle it out in court, or did Apple just say, "its not worth it right now to deal with this, let Palm have it", vice versa, or none of the above.

People complain so much about who copied who and what is right or wrong, but at the end of the day. If they don't fight it out in court or settle it out of court. License or sell there ideas. We meager peoples will never "know" who owns what, when they will in force what they have, if ever or not. Or anything other then either our made up opinions, or what actual facts come out of a court case.
 
Apple stole PalmOS?

The Newton was released in 1993

(img)

and the Palm was released in 1996:


(img)

They look very similar, but which came first ? (There's a hint in the post.)

Your argument is invalid here because 50% of the people on this forum were born in 1993 and don't know what a Newton is.
 
It's very, very rare for a district court to grant a preliminary injunction in a patent case. So this case is unusual on this basis alone. Samsung will be able to appeal to the Court of Appeals for the Federal Circuit. District court judges are often reversed on appeal for incorrect claim construction, which is the definition given to disputed terms in a patent claim. Many district court judges joke that they might as well flip a coin in deciding claim construction. To avoid a preliminary injunction, an accused infringer need only raise a substantial question that the patent claims are invalid. The burden of proof is much lower regarding invalidity than it would be when the case actually goes to trial.

For those of you who have opinions about the merits (for or against) of Apple's claim, I doubt you have ever prepared a claim chart that correlates each patent claim with features in the accused product (to show infringement) or with features in the prior art (to show invalidity). It's a very rigorous analysis, which is another reason that injunctions are rarely granted in patent cases before the parties have actually completed some discovery on the issues.

This case has just begun.

So on the basis that the injunction was granted, one must assume that Apple's claim has merit enough to proceed before discovery and trial.

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Your argument is invalid here because 50% of the people on this forum were born in 1993 and don't know what a Newton is.

I love my Newton :D still kicks around after all these years...now thats quality!
 
I'm talking about market share, not about income cash.

Apple has lost a huge market share, and continues to loose.

Actually, Apple has been increasing their market share in the PC market, in the phone market, and in the smartphone market year after year.
 
Your going in circles.
No where did ever say or imply anyone should have a monopoly. As a matter of pure fact, this is the first time I have even typed MONOPOLY in these forums. So your just strait up lying about anything I have said to date.
When I suggested monopoly it was clearly described as a possible interpretation of your statement (hence the "you sound like you're saying"). So please don't accuse me of lying. And your argument stating that "since I've lied now I have lied about anything you've said to date" is a logical fallacy.

You keep avoiding showing me examples of what has been stolen from iOS. If you say that Android has stolen something from iOS, tell me what. Otherwise you simply can't state that.
 
I have an issue or two with these.
1) The internet back then may have not been as good as it is today on mobile device, but it surely didn't suck on some device, specifically Windows Mobile devices of yore. In most cases I was able to go full webpages(at least I did when I had my old WM device, which sites recognized as IE for desktops), but then that slowly started change as more and more mobile sites popped up.

4) I can't say for the other platforms really, but there were many apps for WM device, though many were good at best. I even remember playing an EA Tiger Woods Golf on my old HP iPaq Pocket PC.

6) I will give you that one, syncing my old WM Palm and Samsung devices to my iBook and Macbook Pro(on OSX) was a bit of a pain as I had to use third-party software. Under windows it was a bit better, and at the time like native Outlook support as that was the app I was using for email. That said I prefer ums and the way the iPhone and Android devices do it these days.

7) One could argue WM was more of a pocket computer than iPhone, because of the sole fact it gave you a full file browser(with access to all folders without the need of jail-breaking for rooting), like you would find on an desktop OS.

The only argument one needs is, it's WM for fickey sake. Most people would rather have a really bad case of the stomach flu than to use that ill-excuse of an OS, even when it was current.
 
Just amazing that people really believe there opinion, even in face of FACTS. Stop caring one way or another. It is what it is, if you don't like it, we can discuss it and what it should be, and maybe one day change it. But, why people "think" they "know" what they clearly do not is baffling. ;)
It is not amazing that there are devout communists and socialists. When their ethic causes anarchy and poverty, they blame others, because only others are the source of all aspects of their life.

It is amazing how entirely different free people with free will and self-actualization are. They even solve poverty and strife better.

Let the gainsayers spew.

Rocketman

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OhvhP41P8uE
 
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There is no way Apple will stop suing unilaterally, and that's a good thing. It's basic game theory. If Apple will stop suing unilaterally there will still be companies that will sue Apple, and thus Apple will lose lots of money. The only way for any company here is to join in these vigorous IP battles, since it's the option that has the highest payoff.

The only ways to get out of this ridiculous patent litigation nightmare for any of the companies involved are either all agreeing to stop (with the risk that some will play a game and still litigate, creating another round of escalating cases) or if there is a structural change in the patent litigation system. With neither being very likely in the short term, it is sure that this situation will continue.

As an Apple shareholder I'm glad that Apple defends it's IP rights in court as other companies do the same. If Apple would jump out by itself, it would get ripped to shreds by Samsung, Nokia and Google etc.

Bashing any company (with the exception of real patent trolls) because they join in is therefore useless, as each and all companies in this industry are now forced to join in or face massive royalty payments to competitors.
 
“Picasso had a saying - 'good artists copy, great artists steal'
- and we have always been shameless about stealing great ideas.”

A great quote. Unfortunately, many people don't understand what it actually stands for. Good artists copy and create the same old, the same old again. Great artists steal ideas from the world around them, and use them to create something great and new.
 
Thats awesome. But even in this with dates and such showing with came first. I'm more concerned about "what's patented or not" here. Its possible that Palm has patents that Apple didn't have and vise versa. Also whether or nor at the time, they had patents that were shared, or completely invented all on there own. Did they battle it out in court, or did Apple just say, "its not worth it right now to deal with this, let Palm have it", vice versa, or none of the above.

People complain so much about who copied who and what is right or wrong, but at the end of the day. If they don't fight it out in court or settle it out of court. License or sell there ideas. We meager peoples will never "know" who owns what, when they will in force what they have, if ever or not. Or anything other then either our made up opinions, or what actual facts come out of a court case.

Well, I was really just talking about this notion that Apple copied Palm. To be honest, I don't know where the original icon layout came from, but it was certainly not copied from Palm.

And you're quite right. I'm not even convinced the companies involved know who owns what.

From Apple's point of view, the outcome of the case is not as important as being seen to fight for their IP rights, tooth and nail.
 
Uh oh !

Image

Touch Screen, Menu's and buttons that you TOUCH.

HOLY ****ING SHITBALLS. ROUNDED EDGES TO!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?

OH MY GOD.

THEY COPIED APPLE.

In 2002...
I'd rather be in the hospital that touch or even look at that disgrace of an device. BTW that more like 2004 not 2002 since its a color screen device.
 
Home screen for starters (i'm sure it's changed now a bit, but at the onset it looked the same). Not that I can say that's "Patentable" but, I'm not in position to know that (did not develop the concept). Nor do I know if its something that can be patented. It may very well be, and it may very well by by Apple. Or it may not.

Are you saying that the iPhone was the first showing a grid of icons? Really?

Ah, and the home screen in an Android is very different from an iPhone, it can be totally empty, it can have only widgets or it can have icons.

Click on a number link to dial or web link to bring you to a web page from a message.

This is not an iPhone thing, is a lot prior to the iPhone

The bigger question is "what do you know about it?" I mean that literally, as in "KNOW" about it. One way or another. Do you know if Apple has a patent for said infringement in this case? Or are you just assuming they don't? Are you assuming they nor anyone else should have a patent on said instance? Or are you assuming the Android in use here did or did not? You and I are not the judge on this case. WE DON'T KNOW?

Again, most of this discussion is about "opinions" about what is and what is not fact. Asking someone else "what is it? What was infringed" Is not possible. We are not going to determine the outcome of it. Just don't assume you can speak for it as fact, and not really know anything about it, either way.

You're the one claiming that Android has stolen iOs or that it is a rip off.
 
Thermonuclear moment

I have the feeling that Apple's thermonuclear moment against Google is fast reaching ground zero. And as well it should because Google's Nexus 7 tablet, designwise, is a blatant cheat of the iPad and iPhone casing. It takes tremendous courage and confidence for Apple to raise all these injunctions a mere few months before the launch of the new iPhone. I hope the courts rule in Apple's favor. IP needs all the protection it can get both from domestic and foreign competitors. And by the way, cheating and copying is not competition but fakery and cowardice. The real, undisputed spirit of competition is innovation, originality, singularity and such attributes.
 
I'm sorry, I don't see that as the inspiration for anything ... except nausea.
Or perhaps the inspiration to do something FAR better.

That layout is simply hideous.

I'm sorry, your comment is irrelevant.

Your opinion does not effect facts.

Windows mobile was a technical achievement at the time and your attitude does nothing to change that. So be as opinionated as you want. You can't change the facts.

The whole point was that nobody ripped off Apple when Apple clearly stole from everybody else to make the iPhone. If Microsoft wanted to they could rip them a new one in a patent war however they remain curiously silent. I call that class
 
The android users hanging around here? Obviously. The Apple users? Looking at the votes, sorry, 'fraid not.
Who said the people I'm talking about is only limited to this itard headquarter?
Although, I do see some apple fanboys in here do get tired of their own favorite company acting like bunch of morons.
 
That's an opinion. Samsung is a pretty big company too. They make things other then phones and it sells world wide. Even in things not branded by them.
If Apple believes there software or hardware design or whatever they make that's patented is being infringed upon. They can "choose" to go after them.

Apple has $100 billion +, and its still a growing company. When it comes to lawsuits, they can knuckle up with anyone they want. And again, that's if Microsoft is infringing.

so so much as an opinion but a fact. Apple knows full out and well that MS has a huge number of software patents and if Apple trys to sue Microsoft with is crapents they would be hit by a lot more from MS.

Apple is the biggest patent troll out there right now using crapents left and right.
 
Your argument is invalid here because 50% of the people on this forum were born in 1993 and don't know what a Newton is.

Which is a bit like saying molecules don't exist because most people have never seen one ...

:rolleyes:
 
so so much as an opinion but a fact. Apple knows full out and well that MS has a huge number of software patents and if Apple trys to sue Microsoft with is crapents they would be hit by a lot more from MS.

Apple is the biggest patent troll out there right now using crapents left and right.
Rotten apple is the biggest patent troll ever to be surfaced out of the business world in the history of capitalism.

Every year and I mean literally; apple sues some poor company over ridiculous patent settlement ever.

I wouldn't be surprised if their own revenue is mostly comprised of money they got from suing other companies.
 
A small fraction of posters generally agree with Patents but feel this application is in some way lacking. Those folks are simply wrong. That's why we have judges, and I point out the hill that has to be climbed in time, resources, and proof is VERY steep, and was accomplished.

The trial has ended and we have a sentence?

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iOS did not rip off Palm OS, pull your head from your ass.

And Android did ripped off iOS?
 
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