Apple's Mac Sales Stagnant in Q2 2017 Amid Continuing Worldwide PC Market Decline

[gnasher729]

Apple isn't going to admit that they are wrong and remove the touch bar. But Apple should consider releasing a 15" non-touch bar next year.

Customers seem to agree with Apple.
[doublepost=1499936944][/doublepost]

Even accounting for a "reasonable" price increase: The 15" MacBook Pro used to cost £1599, it now costs £2349. That's £750 more!

You know that you can thank frog face Farage and mini-Trump Johnson for that, don't you?
[doublepost=1499937073][/doublepost]

Yep, it used to be Apple growth defying stagnant global PC market. Drop the bleeding prices Apple. I haven't bought a Mac for 4 years, which certainly is longer than my usual average. Too expensive!

The global PC market isn't stagnant anymore, it's shrinking. Apple is the only one that's not shrinking (if we ignore sales moving around between Dell, HP, and Lenovo, but all three together are still shrinking).
[doublepost=1499937234][/doublepost]

Based on the comments here Asus and Acer should be bankrupt next quarter since they posted a loss in growth 30 times worse than Apple !

What's interesting is that Apple is for the first time in the top five world wide sellers, having overtaken both Asus and Acer.

Well, not overtaken really, just passing them when they had an engine failure
[doublepost=1499937522][/doublepost]

I don't get it, laptop market shrinking, tablet market shrinking, desktop market shrinking...do people just want phones, phones, and more phones?

I think what happens is that the average life time of computers has been growing. Both by lasting longer, and by slower technical progress. Annual sales equals "computers in use" divided by "average life time", plus "new computers added". I think the total number of computers in use is still growing. But there is saturation as well.

 

[albusseverus]

Firstly the headline should read Apple sales hold up while PC market declines.
But somehow I don't think that would get as much or any attention.

Secondly, you'll see it all over this thread - prices outside US are prohibitive. Can't wait for new iPhone prices!

Thirdly, the new models did not excite customers, they bought because Macs finally got an upgrade - any upgrade. Apple seems to think aspirational applies to price only.

Fourthly, I can understand using social activism to distract from inability to ship, but shipping tone-deaf features… there's no excuse. That Touch Bar was invented before iPhone and frankly, it shows. I've written elsewhere, Point-Of-Difference is supposed to be between you and your competitors, not between your own products. That just guarantees Touch Bar won't be adopted, even if it was useful.

Apple will be taken seriously as a computer manufacturer if it ships properly updated Macs next year, and the year after, etc.

 

[jacksmith21006]

"Worldwide Chromebook shipments grew 38 percent in 2016, while the overall PC market declined 6 percent. "

It is Google again. How in the world are they able to growth sales by 38% at the same time Mac declined?

I did see

"At Apple CEO Tim Cook’s old high school, they are selling their MacBooks to buy Chromebooks"

Also saw

"For the first time, Google beat Apple in PC sales — and that's really bad news for Microsoft"

Part of the issue was that Windows is so horrible so you chose a Mac. But now with another choice that is really good and really secure it is taking sales.

My wife never had anything but Apple hardware her entire life. But last v-day I replaced the iPad she locked herself out of with a Chromebook. The CB was $450 and $100 more than the lower end iPad but she loves it. Having the ability to use your favorite mobile apps with a keyboard is huge for her.

Apple needs to do a 2 in 1/convertible. I would most like have given her Apple hardware if they had something. They also need to put iOS apps and have OS X on such a device. Google doing this is just rather genius. With 38% growth while everyone else declines and then adding this ability is going to be touch to compete with.

Even our school replaced the last Macs with Chromebooks that they used for AP CS 1 and 2. They use this thing called Crouton on the CBs and they are basically Linux desktops. Was at conferences and they were showing the kids able to use Eclipse. I was shocked and had thought Chromebooks was a web browser.

 

[mlody]

"Worldwide Chromebook shipments grew 38 percent in 2016, while the overall PC market declined 6 percent. "

It is Google again. How in the world are they able to growth sales by 38% at the same time Mac declined?

I did see

"At Apple CEO Tim Cook’s old high school, they are selling their MacBooks to buy Chromebooks"

Also saw

"For the first time, Google beat Apple in PC sales — and that's really bad news for Microsoft"

Part of the issue was that Windows is so horrible so you chose a Mac. But now with another choice that is really good and really secure it is taking sales.

My wife never had anything but Apple hardware her entire life. But last v-day I replaced the iPad she locked herself out of with a Chromebook. The CB was $450 and $100 more than the lower end iPad but she loves it. Having the ability to use your favorite mobile apps with a keyboard is huge for her.

Apple needs to do a 2 in 1/convertible. I would most like have given her Apple hardware if they had something. They also need to put iOS apps and have OS X on such a device. Google doing this is just rather genius. With 38% growth while everyone else declines and then adding this ability is going to be touch to compete with.

Even our school replaced the last Macs with Chromebooks that they used for AP CS 1 and 2. They use this thing called Crouton on the CBs and they are basically Linux desktops. Was at conferences and they were showing the kids able to use Eclipse. I was shocked and had thought Chromebooks was a web browser.

How are they able to grow? Because they sale dumb devices with dumb OS to mostly dumb institutions (schools) in terms of IT who do not know how to do proper IT device management or do not want to deal with it. Most schools have kids running the IT shops, with one or two guys somewhat having some basic IT experience, but because IT is always considered as an expense and not revenue generating unit, schools do not invests in people to run those departments, so when they have an opportunity to deploy a dumb device that requires zero IT management, of course they will fall for it. Tons of schools seldom have time and man power to properly deploy Windows, SCCM, GPOs and other management practices and policies, so this is why the Chromebook business is growing!

 

[ColBatGuano]

Well I'd be happy to buy a new mac mini, but sadly Apple don't care.

A new Mac mini could have a new form factor - the existing model is based on the size of a DVD drive.
I'd be happy with fixed RAM (as if I'd have a choice!) of 16 or 32GB, and SSD.
4-6 x USB-C
Ethernet

 

[elmaco]

People are buying tablets, that explains the general decline.

I think Apple could have thrice the market share, with more competitive prices and better support for Linux and Windows.

What if you could select OS when you boot up your Mac the first time?

Of course, if you pick Windows 10 you would have to pay Microsoft and if you pick Linux you would pay some other vendor for support (Ubuntu or Red Hat). If you want to install something unsupported, you are on your own, like today. There could be buttons on the touch bar where you could instantly switch OS and there would be highly optimised device drivers for Windows/Linux.

This would make the transition a breeze and you could still run that old Windows software.

Why would you not choose a Mac?

That said, I think Apple is going for profits, not market share, which could hurt them longer term. Other venders could find opportunities, like Google's Chromebook.

 

[PinkyMacGodess]

As a 20+ year IT Veteran, Dell is utter garbage. Always has been and probably always will be. Lenovo Thinkpads are tanks and probably one of the most durable "normal" laptops.

HP is decent and the Spectre x360 I bought in January is every bit as good as a Macbook AND has a touchscreen and pen. It's what Apple should have done if they were actually visionaries.

As much as it pains me to say it, even Win10 has been good to me so far for the past 6 months.

10, aside from being rather chatty with the mothership, isn't the frightful monster that 8 was. Given the nasty new keyboard of the latest MacBook Pros, OMG, almost anything would be an improvement. The 'touchbar' is a toy of limited use too. But anyway...

 

[democracyrules]

Apple's Mac sales remained stagnant in the second quarter of 2017 compared to the year-ago quarter, according to new PC shipping estimates shared today by Gartner.

During the quarter, Apple shipped an estimated 4.24 million Macs worldwide, down from 4.26 million in the second quarter of 2016, for an estimated decline in growth of -0.4 percent. While sales were down slightly, market share was up. Apple held 6.9 percent of the market during the quarter, up from 6.7 percent a year ago. Apple is estimated to be the number four PC vendor in the world, edging out Asus, the company that held that position this time last year.

HP and Dell, the number one and number three worldwide PC vendors, respectively, saw shipment growth during the quarter. HP shipped an estimated 12.7 million PCs for 10.8 percent of the market (3.3 percent growth) while Dell shipped an estimated 9.6 million PCs for 15.6 percent of the market (1.4 percent growth). Lenovo, once the number one worldwide PC vendor, is now in second place after sales dropped from 13.3 million in Q2 2016 to 12.2 million in Q2 2017. Lenovo now holds 19.9 percent of the market and saw a -8.4 percent dip in growth.

Asus and Acer, the number five and six worldwide PC vendors, also saw PC sales fall significantly. Asus shipped 4 million PCs during the quarter, down from 4.5 million for -10.3 percent growth, while Acer shipped 3.9 million, down from 4.4 million for -12.5 percent growth.

According to Gartner, overall worldwide PC shipments totaled 61.1 million units in Q2 2017, a 4.3 percent decline compared to Q2 2016.In the United States, PC shipments totaled 14 million units during the second quarter of 2017, a 5.7 percent decline compared to the second quarter of 2016. Apple is the number four PC vendor in the United States, shipping an estimated 1.7 million Macs (for 11.8 percent market share), a significant decline from the 1.83 million Macs shipped in the second quarter of 2016.

Apple's U.S. sales dropped 9.6 percent from Q2 2016 to Q2 2017, with Lenovo and Asus also seeing sharp dips. Lenovo's sales were down 16.3 percent (1.9 million PCs shipped vs. 2.2 million in Q2 2016), while Asus's sales were down 40.7 percent (447K PCs shipped vs. 754K in Q2 2016).

IDC also released its PC market shipment estimates today, and its numbers are a bit rosier. IDC estimates Apple shipped 4.3 million Macs during the quarter, up from 4.26 million for a small 1.7 percent growth. According to IDC, worldwide PC shipments totaled 60.5 million units, a decline of 3.3 percent. Like Gartner, IDC estimates Apple is the number four worldwide PC vendor, behind HP, Lenovo, and Dell, but above Asus and Acer.

It's important to note that data from Gartner and IDC is preliminary and that the numbers can shift, sometimes dramatically and sometimes less so. Last year, for example, Gartner estimated Mac shipments of 4.56 million in the second quarter of 2016, but the actual number was 4.26 million.

Apple recently refreshed much of its Mac notebook lineup and its iMacs, so it could see some growth in the coming quarter as customers purchase the new machines.

Article Link: Apple's Mac Sales Stagnant in Q2 2017 Amid Continuing Worldwide PC Market Decline

I am confident Apple will catch up with the stagnant or decline on Mac sales. After all, they are very smart on their business modeling and a very powerful company. Love Apple.

 

[kazmac]

So many have said, lack of updates until late in the Quarter is probably a good reason why; but they're still selling Macs regardless.

It will be interesting to see these numbers in the 3rd and 4th quarters. Looking forward to seeing what else Apple might release in the Fall besides the iMac Pro (Mac Mini please...)

 

[imronburgundy]

People are finally realizing that Apple is just bending them over when it comes to prices on sub par laptops and desktops. For 15 years, all the computers I have purchased have been Apple. Today I finally purchased a non-Apple DIY computer, for about $1600, and it knocks the socks off anything Apple has. Apple will continue to be amazing for iPhones, but they are certainly pushing people away from computers. It's too bad for us computer geeks.

Yup. Everyone's got a "good enough" macbook laying around at home at this point. If you want something that performs, building your own desktop is the way to go.

 

[mlody]

People need to wake up and realize that Apple is not catering to every Joe Shmoe on this planet, so please stop with all the complains about price increases or how expensive the products are. Am I happy that prices are higher or general pricing of the Apple products? Hell no!!! However, I also understand what they are doing.

No one is complaining that BMW 5-series is too expensive and should have had some features removed, to make it more affordable. No one is saying that $30k Accord has to some degree feature parity and options with BMW 5-series for $60k. If you want a cheaper car, but 1-series bimmer or something Japanese or domestic. Don’t blame it on the BMW that you can’t afford.


Same goes with Apple. If you do not like $3500 price tag of loaded MBP, don’t buy it. It obviously is not for you. HP or Dell will be happy to sell you their equivalent of $3500 MBP for half the price.


Apple and mainsteam pricing will probably never happen, so we just need to deal with it and move on with our lives.

 

[mscice]

lower the prices, its not rocket science

 

[Juicy Box]

Apple's world wide market share has been growing. And world wide is what counts. But never mind, you probably read a different article than the one I read.

You are right, I focused on the US section, and misread the World chart. There is a slight increase in WW market, so I guess that is something.

 

[Jax44]

There's a simple explanation of why that is:

Apple releases hot garbage year after year and their desktops are obsolete before they even make it to market, so Apple buyers NEED to constantly replace their terrible computers.

PC desktops however, last years, can be easily upgraded, come with way better hardware and cost less. Duh.

The " duh" part is befitting...

 

[bn-7bc]

That's a pipe dream until Apple fixed SMB networking, improves Finder, improves graphics performance for gaming, and adds Enterprise features like iSCSI, Active Directory, etc.

OS X is fine for casual use but these days it's really fallen behind Windows in terms of functionality and even stability.

ISCSI is avalable, so is Ad autebitcation and management of macs (needs 3d party plugins). Can you expand on smb, whatare the problems? Graphics perfotmance will be fixed in osx 10.13 with extrenal gpu) Finder is a problem I agree

 

[satchmo]

People are buying tablets, that explains the general decline.

I think Apple could have thrice the market share, with more competitive prices and better support for Linux and Windows.

What if you could select OS when you boot up your Mac the first time?

Of course, if you pick Windows 10 you would have to pay Microsoft and if you pick Linux you would pay some other vendor for support (Ubuntu or Red Hat). If you want to install something unsupported, you are on your own, like today. There could be buttons on the touch bar where you could instantly switch OS and there would be highly optimised device drivers for Windows/Linux.

This would make the transition a breeze and you could still run that old Windows software.

Why would you not choose a Mac?

That said, I think Apple is going for profits, not market share, which could hurt them longer term. Other venders could find opportunities, like Google's Chromebook.

Yup, they all but abandoned the Mac mini whose main purpose was to draw people into the Mac OS platform. Of course that was at a time when Apple wasn't the richest company on the planet. And perhaps one could argue, they got there by focussing on higher profit margin devices.

I'm not sure Apple has ever been interested in marketshare...I mean sure, they do when they're number one. But losing the desktop market to Windows and the mobile market to Android hasn't hurt their bottom line.

They're more than content being number two or three in marketshare numbers and focus on being number one in profits.

 

[pat500000]

Updating the Mac HW on a regular basis would help.

The mac pro's baby brother...lost cause.

 

[kemal]

The innovation in the Apple desktop market has been in Bluetooth functionality. You need a new machine if you want to hand off whatever coherence whatchamacallit. The only other driving force has been the SSE4 compiler flag. Even then a six year old Mac can run the latest OS.

 

[ugru]

No one is complaining that BMW 5-series is too expensive and should have had some features removed, to make it more affordable.

Apple is removing features (ports, magsafe, battery capacity) and increasing the price, your analogy is just wrong...

 

[iConnected]

Apple's Mac Sales Stagnant in Q2 2017 Amid Continuing Worldwide PC Market Decline

Or: "Apple maintains Mac sales and increases market share in a falling market".

 

[oliversl]

iPad, iPhone and USB-C are canibalizing the Mac. If the MBP had only todays port and costed the same as previous models ...

 

[MacsRuleOthersDrool]

And yet sales of the older models of MBP's jumped after Apple released the dumb new ones.

Ain't rocket science: don't release crap!

They didn't.

The 2016 MBP is significantly better, engineering-wise, to the previous (and now "hallowed") 2015 model.

People are just stupid.
[doublepost=1499963354][/doublepost]

"Higher PC prices due to the impact of component shortages for DRAM, solid state drives (SSDs) and LCD panels had a pronounced negative impact on PC demand in the second quarter of 2017"

when are people going to see through this smokescreen and call it like it is: artificial scarcity to drive up price. you cant realistically claim they couldnt predict demand would increase.

OEMs just can't sh** manufacturing capacity, ya know.

And when there really are only a couple of true manufacturers of a component, like with SSD-innards, LCDs and DRAMs, it doesn't take many OEMs launching new products around the same time (like they all do!) to swamp-out almost any manufacturing-capacity.
[doublepost=1499963552][/doublepost]

Surely jacking up the prices and adding a gimmicky touch bar should've gotten them more sales

Let's see:

The report points out that prices are up almost universally across the board, and yet somehow, Apple is increasing prices "just because".

As for he Touch Bar, ask some people that actually OWN one if they think it is "gimmicky". The majority of ACTUAL users (and to some extent, it depends on what Applications they use most often) think that the Touch Bar is QUITE useful.
[doublepost=1499963771][/doublepost]

Lack of innovation + higher prices + better iPad Pro = stagnant sales.

Actually, considering the actual numbers, the headline for the article SHOULD have been "Mac sales hold their own despite worldwide PC sales decline".

MUCH less perjorative than the adjective "Stagnant", and much more CORRECT, given the rest of the market's performance.
[doublepost=1499963860][/doublepost]

well when you release a product that is more expensive, glued together, cant sync with your flagship product out of the box, and isn't any more functional then the cheaper product released a few years ago.. this is what happens.

But NONE of that is actually TRUE.

 

[nexusrule]

HP and Dell seemed to be doing okay, especially when you compare them to the others.

Do mean Apple's Mac stagnation, or the PC market in general?

I wouldn't blame Apple's current Mac performance on market stagnation, because they are also losing market share. To me, if it was just stagnation, then market share would be relatively unchanged.

From the post: While sales were down slightly, market share was up. Apple held 6.9 percent of the market during the quarter, up from 6.7 percent a year ago.

 

[MacsRuleOthersDrool]

You do not need much tech for emojis.

Nor many brains for an off-topic post...

 

[MrX8503]

...implying a postPC-guy can't be CEO of a IT company

The definition of a PC is changing.