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Apple's Nokia Deal Could Cost Android Manufacturers Too

FlameofAnor said:
Castrate your competition, Steve?....... that's not very nice. ;)
Click to expand...

This is much more clear evidence of the failed US patent system than anything else...

But even then, SJ is a genius in making such a move - settle for a lost cause, pay a few millions, cross-license the rest and let Android burn under the newly-acquired legitimacy of Nokia's patents...simply genius. :rolleyes:
 
So much hatred against Florian Mueller.

The guy has actually given some good coverage on the Lodsys issues lately.

Don't see the point of such ad hominem attacks. If you have beef with the actual article then say it.

To me it appears the two platforms are similar, so he has a point.
 
BRLawyer said:
let Android burn under the newly-acquired legitimacy of Nokia's patents...simply genius. :rolleyes:
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Please, anyone talking about "legitimacy of Nokia's patents" can explain which patents and how affect other companies?

Or there is only wishful thinking and fanboyism?
 
gkpm said:
So much hatred against Florian Mueller.

The guy has actually given some good coverage on the Lodsys issues lately.

Don't see the point of such ad hominem attacks. If you have beef with the actual article then say it.

To me it appears the two platforms are similar, so he has a point.
Click to expand...

I said it. I call the article what it was. Complete BS and nothing but headline grabing. if you understand the industry at all you would understand how crappy this article is and it is pretty clear Mueller does not know what he is talking about.

The major android manufactures have been making cells for a very long time and have had an agreement with Nokia during that time. The OS has zero effect on that part. HTC, Samsong and others already are paying the fees so it is a non issue.

It is a crappy article that is just full of misinformation. It is an empty threat.
 
gkpm said:
So much hatred against Florian Mueller.

The guy has actually given some good coverage on the Lodsys issues lately.

Don't see the point of such ad hominem attacks. If you have beef with the actual article then say it.

To me it appears the two platforms are similar, so he has a point.
Click to expand...

From the original filing from Nokia:

"Nokia has already successfully entered into license agreements including these patents with approximately 40 companies, including virtually all the leading mobile device vendors, allowing the industry to benefit from Nokia's innovation.

The ten patents in suit relate to technologies fundamental to making devices which are compatible with one or more of the GSM, UMTS (3G WCDMA) and wireless LAN standards. The patents cover wireless data, speech coding, security and encryption and are infringed by all Apple iPhone models shipped since the iPhone was introduced in 2007."

Has Florian even read the filing and the patents in question?
 
******* Florian Müller.

Really guys, when you read the name Florian Müller you should automatically keep it away from MacRumors. The guy is a paid mouthpiece for Microsoft and nothing else. Whatever he says you can be sure that he paints the bleakest picture possible for any Microsoft competitor. Google and anything related to Google is top of his hitlist because at the moment Google looks even more threatening to Microsoft than Apple does, but that can change any moment when he gets different instructions from his paymasters.

This site is supposed to be about rumours. I don't mind a bit of actual fact in between the rumours :D but paid disinformation doesn't belong here.


gkpm said:
So much hatred against Florian Mueller.

The guy has actually given some good coverage on the Lodsys issues lately.

Don't see the point of such ad hominem attacks. If you have beef with the actual article then say it.

To me it appears the two platforms are similar, so he has a point.
Click to expand...

"Good coverage"? Florian Müller is the one who advises iOS developers to suck it up and pay the patent trolls. And Android developers should do the same. Look, when there is a history of one article after the other by the same author spewing misinformation, by an author who has actually no qualifications whatsoever, and each single article is attacking Microsoft competitors, and in many cases making exactly the same statements that Microsoft makes officially at the same time, then an attack on the person is not "ad hominem" anymore.


Rodimus Prime said:
I said it. I call the article what it was. Complete BS and nothing but headline grabing. if you understand the industry at all you would understand how crappy this article is and it is pretty clear Mueller does not know what he is talking about.
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And when I strongly agree with Rodimus Prime, as I do on this point, you can safely assume that he is correct.
 
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Rodimus Prime said:
The major android manufactures have been making cells for a very long time and have had an agreement with Nokia during that time. The OS has zero effect on that part. HTC, Samsong and others already are paying the fees so it is a non issue.

It is a crappy article that is just full of misinformation. It is an empty threat.
Click to expand...

You post was actually the one that wasn't just straight Florian bashing.

But I'm curious now, first you say "it's safe to bet that the other manufactures were already paying the for the patents", but then make it seem that's a certain thing?

Can you actually prove the others have licensed these patents?
 
Cross off another lawsuit off the list.

Everyone wins, everyone loses. Like one of the comments I saw previously, I agree with the fact that Apple shouldn't win every legal battle thrown at them, no matter how awesome their inventions are. There comes a point where it's almost necessary for the big $$ companies to throw down a bit. I'm not saying Nokia is a small company in any sense, but hey, I'm sure they'll need that sum in the long run.

It also avoided the courts... god, they would have spent that PLUS more, not to mention it saved a ton of time. This time they earned my respect with that action, rather than arrogantly going headfirst into the ringer.

However, in no way am I insinuating a company should not defend its intellectual property, either. :apple:

And Android? A rip off of Apple?

What is this guy thinking?
 
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gkpm said:
You post was actually the one that wasn't just straight Florian bashing.

But I'm curious now, first you say "it's safe to bet that the other manufactures were already paying the for the patents", but then make it seem that's a certain thing?

Can you actually prove the others have licensed these patents?
Click to expand...

"Nokia has already successfully entered into license agreements including these patents with approximately 40 companies, including virtually all the leading mobile device vendors, allowing the industry to benefit from Nokia's innovation."

http://press.nokia.com/2009/10/22/n...ringement-of-nokia-gsm-umts-and-wlan-patents/

It's not exactly a proof, but I highly doubt that a company like Motorola or Samsung doesn't have paid or cross-licensed this technology.

They have been making phones way before than Apple, Motorola, way way before.
 
gnasher729 said:
******* Florian Müller.

Really guys, when you read the name Florian Müller you should automatically keep it away from MacRumors.
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So his Lodsys posts are tied to Microsoft's angle in what way exactly?

Feels almost like I'm defending the devil here :)
 
Ok, so Nokia says:

"Nokia has already successfully entered into license agreements including these patents with approximately 40 companies"

Seems very weasel speak to me. Surely they know the exact number of companies?

And why not say: "has licensed these patents to ..." instead of this mumble?
 
gkpm said:
You post was actually the one that wasn't just straight Florian bashing.

But I'm curious now, first you say "it's safe to bet that the other manufactures were already paying the for the patents", but then make it seem that's a certain thing?

Can you actually prove the others have licensed these patents?
Click to expand...

Read below. On top of that safe assumption considering how long the others have been in the market.

Florian killed his credibility on this one. He Open Mouth, insert Foot.

Oletros said:
From the original filing from Nokia:

"Nokia has already successfully entered into license agreements including these patents with approximately 40 companies, including virtually all the leading mobile device vendors, allowing the industry to benefit from Nokia's innovation.

The ten patents in suit relate to technologies fundamental to making devices which are compatible with one or more of the GSM, UMTS (3G WCDMA) and wireless LAN standards. The patents cover wireless data, speech coding, security and encryption and are infringed by all Apple iPhone models shipped since the iPhone was introduced in 2007."

Has Florian even read the filing and the patents in question?
Click to expand...
 
Oh noes! Now that apple has lost to nokia the entire smartphone industry will collaspe. We all know that even if the android OEMs have been paying nokia now that apple has lost they will have to pay more. Why?

Also the genius stated that android is a coppy of android. Sadly it is not it is a copy of Blackberry os and sambian heavily modified to be optimized for a touch screen. It looks similer to iOS but it is not a copy.
 
gkpm said:
Ok, so Nokia says:

"Nokia has already successfully entered into license agreements including these patents with approximately 40 companies"

Seems very weasel speak to me. Surely they know the exact number of companies?

And why not say: "has licensed these patents to ..." instead of this mumble?
Click to expand...


It was a press release. Press release is not going to include it. Also often times there are agreements between companies not to publicly release names of who is licencing the tech.
 
gkpm said:
Ok, so Nokia says:

"Nokia has already successfully entered into license agreements including these patents with approximately 40 companies"

Seems very weasel speak to me. Surely they know the exact number of companies?

And why not say: "has licensed these patents to ..." instead of this mumble?
Click to expand...

Why Nokia has to list any number of companies in a filing against other company? Does Apple list all the companies they have licensed any patent when filing against other? Any company does it?
 
Rodimus Prime said:
I said it. I call the article what it was. Complete BS and nothing but headline grabing. if you understand the industry at all you would understand how crappy this article is and it is pretty clear Mueller does not know what he is talking about.

The major android manufactures have been making cells for a very long time and have had an agreement with Nokia during that time. The OS has zero effect on that part. HTC, Samsong and others already are paying the fees so it is a non issue.

It is a crappy article that is just full of misinformation. It is an empty threat.
Click to expand...

People keep saying that there are patent deals in place.

If so, please provide a link.
 
Oletros said:
Why Nokia has to list any number of companies in a filing against other company? Does Apple list all the companies they have licensed any patent when filing against other? Any company does it?
Click to expand...

Then why say 40 at all :confused:

Just say licensed by every major phone manufacturer?

Did they need to fill in the blank space in that PR?
 
MacRumors said:
In fact, because Apple has so many of its own patents (some of which it cross-licensed to Nokia) other manufacturers may have to pay even more for the same licenses.
Click to expand...

*laughing*

Wait a second...

So if a company doesn't have patents they're willing to cross license, then they must pay Nokia more???!

This reasoning sure sounds familiar.
 
gkpm said:
Then why say 40 at all :confused:

Just say licensed by every major phone manufacturer?

Did they need to fill in the blank space in that PR?
Click to expand...

No they say over 40 to prove a point. That it is not that Apple is being specially targeted. They know the the Apple fans will come out and call them trolls if they do not have a case to back it (aka other majors players agree to it.

ptysell said:
People keep saying that there are patent deals in place.

If so, please provide a link.
Click to expand...

Why would their be a link to the list? It not something you have to or even do release publicly.
On top of that other law suit so why should their be a list on what the deals are.


There is plenty of evidance to suggest that the other major players licences the patents.

1.) It is part of the global standard.
2.) 40 or more companies licences it.
3.) Other major players like LG, Samsung Motorola, HTC, Sony ect have not been sued and they have all been making phones a hell of a lot longer than Apple.
 
thejadedmonkey said:
So because iOS infringes, this automatically makes Android infringe upon it too?
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You really need to keep track of what is pro Apple / anti Apple opinion, and what is fact. Fact is that Nokia has about 800 patents that anyone making phone calls over GSM will need to license. Totally unavoidable. Apple vs. Nokia was never about whether Apple had to pay or not, it was always about _how much_ Apple had to pay. And it is totally unavoidable that Android phone makers will have to pay as well.

Where Florian Müller, Microsoft's personal spambot, is wrong is that these license deals are just a normal part of every phone makers business, and all these Android phone manufacturers, just like all the non-Android phone makers, have been paying license fees all the time. Nothing new here. Whatever happens in the industry, you will find Florian Müller making some comment that claims coming doom for some Microsoft competitor. Nothing new there as well.


Rodimus Prime said:
Florian killed his credibility on this one.
Click to expand...

It's more like Germany's oldest oak tree is planted right on the grave of Florian Müller's credibility.
 
kdarling said:
*laughing*

Wait a second...

So if a company doesn't have patents they're willing to cross license, then they must pay Nokia more???!

This reasoning sure sounds familiar.
Click to expand...

That seems to be it. This is what Apple had a beef with.
 
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