Apple's Phil Schiller Explains Why Valve's Steam Link App Was Rejected

[ersan191]

Thanks for answer but it is still unclear to me. eBay (for example) is used to buy goods (both physical and services). eBay takes a cut of sales (as does PayPal) and in effect, this is also an “in-app” purchase. I am having difficulty understanding the difference between buying a game on eBay vs buying a game from Steam.

Specifically (from what I understand) they make the distinction based on whether or not what you're purchasing is something to be used inside or outside of the app. If it's something that can be used inside the app it must use in-app purchasing (which is a specific API that Apple offers, and takes a 30% cut of).

Ultimately though it's completely up to Apple what they want to allow and not allow, unfortunately.

 

[Regime2008]

I assume you haven’t been paying attention to console life cycles lately.

Like how the Xbox one had 2* hardware upgrades over a few years? Same with ps4? Customers are upgrading for full price, and not getting barely any benefits. Still can barely do 1080p @30fps on many games, not to mention faux checkerboard 4k.

Edit: 2*

 

[Michael Goff]

Like how the Xbox one had 3 hardware upgrades over a few years? Same with ps4? Customers are upgrading for full price, and not getting barely any benefits. Still can barely do 1080p @30fps on many games, not to mention faux checkerboard 4k.

Three hardware upgrades? What are you banging on about? Xbox One S isn’t an upgrade, it’s a miniaturization of the One and the X is an upgrade. So there has been one, and it isn’t even like you need to buy it to keep playing XBox games.

You talk about how I don’t know anything about Steam, but you seem to know nothing about consoles.

 

[Regime2008]

Three hardware upgrades? What are you banging on about? Xbox One S isn’t an upgrade, it’s a miniaturization of the One and the X is an upgrade. So there has been one, and it isn’t even like you need to buy it to keep playing XBox games.

You talk about how I don’t know anything about Steam, but you seem to know nothing about consoles.

So there were no benefits about the Xbox one s over the OG Xbox one? No upscaling or anything? Was it just rebranded? Because I personally know a couple of folks that upgraded to the S, than to the X. NONE of them are upgrades in MY eyes, but they are in fact an upgraded SKU. Otherwise, Microsoft wouldn't have released it.

Hmmm... A quick Google search shows otherwise btw.

 

[AdonisSMU]

Valve probably should just tell us what the "business reasons" are for their app being rejected. Apple has clearly contacted Valve and given them all the specifics. Valve is just being deliberately obtuse. Apple is not in the position to give out these details as it would be a violation of Valve's business privacy and potential trade secrets.

I realize it's VPN software. However, seeing as other VPN software exists on the App store I dont think for a second Valve is being entirely forthcoming on what the actual violations are that Apple found.

Lastly, just because Apple employees made a mistake in the initial approval process doesnt mean Apple shouldnt rectify it. It's the right thing to do as other app developers who dont have the clout Valve does will think Valve is getting unfair and preferential treatment.

 

[Geohord]

When was Apple clear?

 

[AdonisSMU]

When was Apple clear?

They are clear with the app developers themselves. Apple should not be giving up a companies trade secrets to the general public. I know first hand that Apple generally will work with companies like Valve on compliance with the app store rules.

 

[Nuno Lopes]

When you first connect to Steam via a Steam Link or the app, this is what it looks like:

It's that huge STORE button that Apple is not happy about. Valve can simply remove this entire section (and any deep links that point to it) and Apple will surely accept it into the App Store, all is not lost.

What about Remote Desktoo to Windows 10 PCs? Will they require MS to remove the Windows Store when streaming?

I wouldn’t be surprised if this just opened their eyes to a problem they didn’t realize was there and they started clamping down on RD.

Yes. I think Apple has not thought this throughly and need some time. Personally I don’t find Steam Link that practical and its very expensive, it requires a PC at home, very good network connection so on and so forth. It’s almost a hack. It’s a niche solution. It bares no impact in the App Store sales, it does not compete with it.

In the other hand if games were served by some cloud service it would be a different matter IMHO.

The challenge is, where you draw the line.

 

[Hollywood Rose]

OK, he said something but in the end he didn't say anything.

This is the new par for the course in customer support. Get your whatever (post, app, content) rejected with nothing more than "it doesn't meet our guidelines" so that if you're being a scumbag you don't have to say that.

I've had Facebook do this to me. Ironically one time it was so freaking stupid it took me 5 messages with them and pulling out 5 teeth for them to say it was because I used hashtag Facebook with a lower case f. This is how brainless they are. Just tell me!!! I'll make the freaking f capital I mean WTF.

But yeah. I also have to say about this.. blocking apps is the p*ssy way out. Most of us entrepreneurs who haven't made it have to come up with new wats to provide value. These established brands block and sh*t on everyone else to prevent their value from being on their platform instead of focusing on making sure nothing is of more value than their stuff. Oh who does this let me count the wireless companies cable companies energy companies.

I love Apple though. Just seems it's standard operating procedure to skew everything in favor of the large corporation. And if you're both large corporation s well whoever has the bigger law sword wins.

But in Apple's defense. I gotta say. The kind of verbosely gross violatory sh*t that is allowed in the Google Play store is without equal anywhere, except maybe a porn site. The Apple app store is not like this entirely because of their policies. I just think they could loosen the reigns the slightest bit.

 

[Sunshoopa]

Esh at the console wars here. What does the Xbox or PS4 have to do with Steam streaming to iOS devices? Nothing... nothing at all.

Though... now that I think about it, there’s an app where you can stream your PS4 to iOS devices called R-Play. You can access the whole OS AND the PS store. What’s up with that? Why isn’t Apple blocking that? It even costs $11.99.

 

[ikir]

Vale should really improve Steam, it works badly, UI is old, it is completely alien to macOS (no native full screen) ecc.
I avoid Steam for many reason when I can, sure it is the main platform especially for multiplayer, but I buy from Mac App Store games when I can for not having bloated steam running and for App Store family sharing so I can play with my girl free without buying an extra license of the game.

 

[ersan191]

Vale should really improve Steam, it works badly, UI is old, it is completely alien to macOS (no native full screen) ecc.
I avoid Steam for many reason when I can, sure it is the main platform especially for multiplayer, but I buy from Mac App Store games when I can for not having bloated steam running and for App Store family sharing so I can play with my girl free without buying an extra license of the game.

I think it barely makes any money so they don't bother. It's pretty much the only popular program that's still 32bit

 

[Gilligan's last elephant]

How do you subscribe to Apple Music without having another Apple device?

Very easily.

 

[cube]

It's not about being lazy - there is literally no practical way to do it... This is all anyone has come up with https://steamcommunity.com/discussions/forum/1/144513670977901288/

And it's convoluted and has a lot of caveats. Don't talk with confidence about things you know nothing about. It is absolutely not designed to work this way.

Yes, and I see no problem with that kind of solution if it works. It is not difficult, and quite obvious, given the limitations of a Windows client OS.

 

[ersan191]

Yes, and I see no problem with that kind of solution if it works. It is not difficult, and quite obvious, given the limitations of a Windows client OS.

It doesn't work any more FYI... Someone asked a question and you gave them a wrong answer and now you're defending your wrong answer.

No, you cannot stream Steam Link and use the host computer simultaneously (if anyone else needs to know). It mirrors your PC's screen.

 

[cube]

It doesn't work any more FYI... Someone asked a question and you gave them a wrong answer and now you're defending your wrong answer.

No, you cannot stream Steam Link and use the host computer simultaneously (if anyone else needs to know). It mirrors your PC's screen.

Maybe this particular software does not work anymore, but theoretically it should work with ESXi, for example.

And I said you need two GPUs.

 

[mixel]

Hmm. I’d totally forgotten about the user generated content angle. Holy **** from that perspective Steam is a total hive of scum and villainy if you aren’t careful. It has groups for the absolute worst stuff and Apple might not have been as crazy as I thought originally.

I wonder what’ll happen here. Massive disclaimers everywhere saying this experience has nothing to do with Apple? If it takes off it could dramatically shift the expected experience from a safe place for kids etc to total mess.

Valve are like Twitter in their reluctance and inability to crack down on terrible behaviour. Hmm. I wouldn’t care if they removed a lot of the community stuff from the streaming app.

 

[Halopend]

To everyone defending Apple: Inform yourself of what steam link is before you start trying to tear down something you don’t even understand.

Facts:

• this app ONLY streams within your own home from a computer you already one. It is effectively a Remote Desktop app that works much faster than normal. Fast enough for gaming with some special sauce for streaming the controls as well.
• There are several apps on the App Store that does EXACTLY the same thing already (moonlight, KinoConsole, remotr).
• There is already a steam app on iOS that lets you buy games from steam. This new app just allows you to now play those games too as long as you are home.

So tell me. With all that information above, tell me what apples kerfuffle is here on this exact app/implementation that has them ruffled?

 

[gnipgnop]

To anyone defending Apple: you either have no idea what this app is/does or are just a loyal fanboy without any ability for real critical thought.

Or they actually read Schiller's statement. Apple didn't reject the app because it streams PC games. You said it yourself, there are already apps that do similar functions...so that can't be the problem. Valve was sloppy in following the guidelines and needs to clean it up.

 

[chatin]

As a platform with no native iOS support, Valve decided to take a heavy handed approach to force users to use phones on the service through Valve Guard. I have stopped supporting them because as Apple has noticed, the ploy is pretty obvious.

 

[Regime2008]

Im not sure what points you are trying to make in the last few pages.

You talk about the crap state of the steam store, and sure its not perfect, but as someone approaching an embarrasingly large number of games in my library, I can assure you, it doesnt get in the way of enjoying what steam can offer. I would rather they let in all the crap they can, rather than have a curated mediocre politically correct mindnumbing emotionally bankrupt ecosystem that Apple has. Not all of us need someone to moderate the content in our lives, and some of us have the capacity to actually decide things for ourselves.

You are now attacking PC gaming as if people into PC gaming dont know what they are doing, and havent carefully considered everything that you in your vast intellect can conceive. It might surprise you some actually are capable of making the good decisions for themselves, and for some of us, PC gaming is exactly where we want to be.

I just now seen your comment. You have all of the respect that I can give for this post!

 

[KanosWRX]

Time to make the switch to Android, Apple is going to far now and showing their true greed once again!

 

[juri-han]

honestly steam link with apple tv vs a console, the console wins 100 times out of 100 ive used steam from my pc to macbook pro and it was crap no way id even bother installing it if i owned a apple tv and sure as hell wouldn't make me go out and buy one just for that lmao

 

[Halopend]

Or they actually read Schiller's statement. Apple didn't reject the app because it streams PC games. You said it yourself, there are already apps that do similar functions...so that can't be the problem. Valve was sloppy in following the guidelines and needs to clean it up.

I changed my wording on the section you quoted as I realized I being reductionistic.

That said, just because Apple has allowed apps like this in the past doesn’t mean the fact you can buy games within steam be the actual reason they blocked this. It’s certainly possible and was probably a factor, but it’s also possible it’s just a go-to line they can use to defend their descicion after the fact when they’ve seen how much push back they’ve gotten.

My faith in Apple has been quashed by things like hiding hardware issues with their batteries while continuing to sell millions of devices with defective hardware and then adjusting the performance of those devices without telling anyone to cover up the hardware defect. And then, once finally caught red handed, instead of fixing the issue they still have the nerve to charge people to replace their batteries, just at a reduced price.

Now that’s a different argument to what we are talking about here, so I’ll give you that maybe you are right and the issue is just that steam allows you to buy games through the interface. But I’m not apt to trust Apple 100% in any line they give. They’ve simply broken that trust too much to be taken at word.

 

[Mike MA]

Peter Gabriel: „Give me steam!“