Apple's Revamped Mac Pro to Launch in 2019

[Greymacuser]

I don’t fit the mold of a Pro user by many people on here, so I may not know, but are current MacBook Pro’s or iMac Pro’s not capable machines? Are they not able to meet demands of Pro users? Not talking ports or user upgradeable parts, since there are solutions to both.

I wouldn't include iMacs as professional desktops. If they gave you the option of a screen less one that was just the processing hardware so you could use your own screen, that would be different.
However, iMacs are horribly designed hot boxes that cook their own screens (know from experience).
Not to mention horribly over priced for what you get in the package.
as for upgradability, there is none. Other than a little extra ram anyways. Buying external GPUs is not cost effective. Plus the aforementioned internal thermal issues and horrible air flow disqualify the iMac for me as a professional user.

 

[Sackofnickels]

Not a moment too soon. Now if their "Pro apps" could keep up...
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I wouldn't include iMacs as professional desktops. If they gave you the option of a screen less one that was just the processing hardware so you could use your own screen, that would be different.
However, iMacs are horribly designed hot boxes that cook their own screens (know from experience).
Not to mention horribly over priced for what you get in the package.
as for upgradability, there is none. Other than a little extra ram anyways. Buying external GPUs is not cost effective. Plus the aforementioned internal thermal issues and horrible air flow disqualify the iMac for me as a professional user.

The term "Pro" is tossed around pretty loosely by Apple. Seems to indicate a price increase more than anything else.

 

[cmaier]

Not a moment too soon. Now if their "Pro apps" could keep up...
[doublepost=1536379653][/doublepost]

The term "Pro" is tossed around pretty loosely by Apple. Seems to indicate a price increase more than anything else.

Sure, because the price is the same and there are no additional features or higher performance components.

 

[ChrisA]

All Apple would have to do is talk to HP about buying and re-branding some "Z" workstations. Apple could paint them white and load Mac OS X on them and everyone would be happy with the result. These "Z" workstations are EXACTLY what people have been asking for Just put Mac OS in them and an Apple logo pated over the HP logo.

If Apple were to announce a computer with these exact specs I'd be amazed and think "They finally got it right."
http://www8.hp.com/us/en/campaigns/..._us/en/psg/ws_desktops/products/z8-learn-more

 

[cmaier]

All Apple would have to do is talk to HP about buying and re-branding some "Z" workstations. Apple could paint them white and load Mac OS X on them and everyone would be happy with the result. These "Z" workstations are EXACTLY what people have been asking for Just put Mac OS in them and an Apple logo pated over the HP logo.

If Apple were to anoubc a computer with these exact specs I'd be amazed and think "They finally got it right."
http://www8.hp.com/us/en/campaigns/..._us/en/psg/ws_desktops/products/z8-learn-more

Ah the old “reverse iPod” strategy.

Didn’t work so well for hp when they bought iPods and sold em as hp devices.

 

[Queen6]

I can't speak for anyone else, but part of my work involves very large dataset analysis using an app analogous to boinc. For number crunching, the MBPs, even with 6 cores, and the iMP are either a joke (the MBPs) or grossly overpriced (the iMP). But they do look nice.

It's really about the correct tool - running a MBP at 100% 24/7 is just not what they are built to do, and they throttle severely (NB - the GPU being used at 100% at the same time contributes to the problem - the MBP design doesn't allow adequate cooling for that kind of sustained operation). That's part of why the cMP is still a useful tool - it can be run 24/7 - and the tcMP is not. I don't do any sort of video or graphics work, so can't comment on those, but for hardcore computing, Apple's lineup is a sad joke. And what frustrates so many is that it used to be at least competent.
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I still have a 2010 MP that I upgraded to dual X5690s (3.46 GHz Xeons). It scores ~1700, which is better than the E5-2697 2.7 GHz 12 core tcMP, which is around 1550-1600.

Agree, for data analysis Mac's are hopelessly outclassed now. My primary notebook now is a 17" it weighs less than 3Kg, it never thermally throttles, nor is it problematic. If I wanted less weight & smaller footprint I'd of bought the 15" model. With a 20% -30% performance delta it's impossible to ignore the Windows OEM's, MBP is just a showpiece now.

I've never seen so many professional's walk away from Apple as in recent years, and for good reason as you said Mac's used to be competent, right now they are overpriced, underperforming and unstable, and that impresses nobody who relies on their hardware for a living...

Q-6

 

[zzzachi]

MacPro update! Still no word. Still no sign. Is vaporware applicable to hardware as well? Maybe unicornmac.

it's pretty easy to foresee what is coming:
2019 apple will release a new mac pro with an unnecessary and force-invented modularity.

if they dont want do kill off the pro line completely they will have to allow users to install
standard components (hd, memory and specially gpus)
i bet they will use a multiple-case design for the components (cpu, storage, gpu)
in their thinking that will compensate for the lost sales on non-apple components, but for the
users it will be just way more expensive than a standard tower design
(which is modular already)

 

[CodeJoy]

From a hardware perspective it really doesn't seem like it should be too hard to put together some halo products. But for some reason, Apple always seem to be reaching for something that comes "later", instead of focusing their resources on the "now". I don't know if it's this ARM transition idea that makes them reluctant to go full force on their current lineups. Whatever it is, it's a (mis-)management issue. It seems like they could achieve so much more if they put a bit of thought into their Mac product lineups, reduced the number of different models, and made each more versatile and configurable.

Plus, let's not be ambivalent about hardware choices. If they're going with AMD chips, put a Vega chip in every Mac. There are small enough ones around for budget computers, and it would make it so much easier for developers to know roughly what hardware they should build for. Put the T2 and fast SSDs in all Macs. Make up your mind about the touch bar. Either put it on all Macs so it gets some real software support, or just drop the idea altogether. Make up your mind about TB3 as well. It may be fine to standardise on one port (mostly) but then do it across all product lines. Litter all devices with TB3 ports. Make sure monitors are widely available. Make sure peripherals are widely available. And seriously, this whole eGPU thing.... it's not awesome. I guess it's a good thing for use cases where a real GPU is impractical or undesirable, but don't base whole product strategies around external boxes for core computing concepts.

And this ARM transition thing. Don't just decide for people what they should want. Put a test product out there, see if people like it. If they do, make more. If they don't, stop. Or just buy Intel or whatever

It's really just management problems. Ambivalence. Either they don't have the right people in the right places, or they have a fundamental governance issue. I don't know which, but it's clear that they're acting like a confused organisation right now.

 

[chucker23n1]

Note I said "power" user, not "Pro," which is a meaningless marketing term. Apple gave up in the power user market when it introduced the trash can MP.

I use this machine ~11 hours a day. 8 hours at work, several hours at home. It’s a MacBook Pro. Not sure how that isn’t “power” enough for you.

 

[apolloa]

They just don't know how to properly handle high-end GPU & CPU laptops, they tried with the trashcan and failed, imagine thin laptop chassis, they rather use mediocre GPUs for less heat and in the case of i9 MBP, time will tell, but have seen it stressed and temp gets too high, will likely bring issues if exposed too long to it.

This is something most tech industry is struggling with, look at Razer, beautiful machines, but they melt so fast, even their latest 15 with vapor chamber fails to properly cool. Whoever really solves high end hardware heat on thin chassis first will lead the game, might even compete with desktops if proper upgradeability is provided. Another thing is metal has a long way to go outside of Final Cut, Adobe's suite in Windows is outperforming macOS at the moment, which is ironic considering Apple was the first one interested Adobe's work back in the day.

They already have solved it, Nvidia developed a new cooling system and GPU’s for thin laptops that apparently drastically make them cooler. The GPU’s aren’t quite as fast as the standard laptop ones but not far off.
I’ve never seen one though just read about them.

http://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/products/10series/laptops/max-q/

http://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/uk.pcmag.com/asus-rog-zephyrus-gx501vi/94305/feature/what-is-nvidia-max-q%3famp=1

Now Apple would NEVER allow this design concept as firstly they didn’t think of it, and secondly it uses Nvidia who they seem to hate and it reduces battery life.

Otherwise you need a big laptop like Alienware still do and apparently run cool, unsurprisingly.

The MacBook Pro was designed to run Final Cut for all the You Tubders our there really, and with that it still can throttle due to heat. But hey it’s so thin!!

 

[DNichter]

I wouldn't include iMacs as professional desktops. If they gave you the option of a screen less one that was just the processing hardware so you could use your own screen, that would be different.
However, iMacs are horribly designed hot boxes that cook their own screens (know from experience).
Not to mention horribly over priced for what you get in the package.
as for upgradability, there is none. Other than a little extra ram anyways. Buying external GPUs is not cost effective. Plus the aforementioned internal thermal issues and horrible air flow disqualify the iMac for me as a professional user.

Fair enough. I was just trying to understand if today’s machines just weren’t capable at all. Sounds like they aren’t. I only use iOS as I find their laptops and desktops too expensive.

 

[ArthurCrown]

All I wonder is ... will I actually be able to afford one?

 

[seclusion]

Maybe a sneak peak on Sept 12 , they did give a sneak peak for the iMac pro 6 months before they shipped.

 

[rpmurray]

Maybe a sneak peak on Sept 12 , they did give a sneak peak for the iMac pro 6 months before they shipped.

Apple said 2019 which means if they do follow through it won't announce until December 2019 and ship in volume sometime in 2020. Look at how they handled the 2013 Mac Pro as a guide.

 

[Naimfan]

Fair enough. I was just trying to understand if today’s machines just weren’t capable at all. Sounds like they aren’t. I only use iOS as I find their laptops and desktops too expensive.

Again, it depends on the task. For what I do, Apple offers nothing capable (the iMac Pro could be if it wasn't so overpriced and if there were a screenless option, but . . . ). We tried substituting tcMPs, but every single one failed (GPUs failed, likely from heat).

So we've switched to HP Z8s. So far, vastly improved throughput and zero failures.

 

[lederermc]

I hate to say it, but at this point Apple might as well not bother. It will have been 7 years since they had a competent desktop for a power user. Is there ANYONE still waiting? No - which means Apple will have to try to rebuild the MP customer base from scratch. And it won't bother, as a new MP won't sell in sufficient numbers to make it worthwhile to Apple.

That's not where the money is. It's only about bragging rights

 

[Naimfan]

That's not where the money is. It's only about bragging rights

Welcome to the Department of Redundancy Department.

 

[tallscot]

I hate to say it, but at this point Apple might as well not bother. It will have been 7 years since they had a competent desktop for a power user. Is there ANYONE still waiting? No - which means Apple will have to try to rebuild the MP customer base from scratch. And it won't bother, as a new MP won't sell in sufficient numbers to make it worthwhile to Apple.

I'm thinking about making the switch. A custom-built PC with one of those new GeForce RTX 2080 video cards with DaVinci Resolve as my NLE, and Adobe Creative Cloud would be a screaming system for about $2,500. I can use the same external LaCie RAID Thunderbolt drives I already own, though I'll probably want to upgrade to Thunderbolt 3 drives because they are so much faster (not an option with my Mac Pro 2013).

Keep the Mac on a single monitor for email, web browser, calendar synced with my iPhone. Maybe I can do all that on Windows? I need to research it.

 

[nvmls]

They already have solved it, Nvidia developed a new cooling system and GPU’s for thin laptops that apparently drastically make them cooler. The GPU’s aren’t quite as fast as the standard laptop ones but not far off.
I’ve never seen one though just read about them.

http://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/products/10series/laptops/max-q/

http://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/uk.pcmag.com/asus-rog-zephyrus-gx501vi/94305/feature/what-is-nvidia-max-q%3famp=1

Now Apple would NEVER allow this design concept as firstly they didn’t think of it, and secondly it uses Nvidia who they seem to hate and it reduces battery life.

Otherwise you need a big laptop like Alienware still do and apparently run cool, unsurprisingly.

The MacBook Pro was designed to run Final Cut for all the You Tubders our there really, and with that it still can throttle due to heat. But hey it’s so thin!!

All new Razer blade 15 options offer a GTX 1060 or 1070 with Max-Q.

 

[ChrisA]

ARM Transition? Why is this even in the same thread as a Mac Pro discussion? If Apple moves to ARM it would mean the end Apple's support for professionals.

Every sense Apple dropped Aperture I've decided to "keep my bags packed" so to speak and NEVER again be dependent on Apple for critical work flow. They make nice computers for web surfing and office work but I would never use them for "mission Critical" apps. They dropped Aperture, I figure Logic dnthe Final Cut Pro will go next.

I do depend every day on Autodesk's Fusion 360 running on my iMac but Fusion 360 runs in Windows too and I could move to a Windows VMWare image quickly if Apple switched to ARM.

 

[CodeJoy]

They already have solved it, Nvidia developed a new cooling system and GPU’s for thin laptops that apparently drastically make them cooler. The GPU’s aren’t quite as fast as the standard laptop ones but not far off.
I’ve never seen one though just read about them.

Max-Q does nothing for the cooling. It's just a power limited GPU. AMD and Apple do the same thing already, they just don't call it Max-Q.
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ARM Transition? Why is this even in the same thread as a Mac Pro discussion? If Apple moves to ARM it would mean the end Apple's support for professionals.

I don't think it's relevant for a Mac Pro anytime soon, it's just an example of Apple's ambivalence, which is exactly what the Mac Pro line is suffering from.

As far as ARM chips replacing Intel in a Mac Pro, I don't really see that as a viable option until the next (post 2019) Mac Pro redesign at the earliest. Even if it's possible (viable commercially and timely, it's certainly possible from a tech viewpoint) to build ARM chips that deliver top level performance, and if Apple were already far ahead, they'd still have to prove themselves on lower end models first.

 

[apolloa]

Max-Q does nothing for the cooling. It's just a power limited GPU. AMD and Apple do the same thing already, they just don't call it Max-Q.
[doublepost=1536449845][/doublepost]
I don't think it's relevant for a Mac Pro anytime soon, it's just an example of Apple's ambivalence, which is exactly what the Mac Pro line is suffering from.

As far as ARM chips replacing Intel in a Mac Pro, I don't really see that as a viable option until the next (post 2019) Mac Pro redesign at the earliest. Even if it's possible (viable commercially and timely, it's certainly possible from a tech viewpoint) to build ARM chips that deliver top level performance, and if Apple were already far ahead, they'd still have to prove themselves on lower end models first.

No Apple don’t do the same. And it does do something for the cooling as stated in the links, it’s a design philosophy for the entire laptop:

http://gizmodo.com/what-you-need-to-know-about-max-q-nvidias-plan-to-mak-1795658324

 

[CodeJoy]

No Apple don’t do the same. And it does do something for the cooling as stated in the links, it’s a design philosophy for the entire laptop:

http://gizmodo.com/what-you-need-to-know-about-max-q-nvidias-plan-to-mak-1795658324

Apple and every other laptop manufacturer downclocks and power limits the GPUs. Or if you want to be detailed, AMD does it for them. Your linked article says exactly nothing about any Max-Q cooling hardware, because there is none. There is a whisper mode, if that's what you're referring to then maybe you should say that. Nvidia have effectively branded and marketed something that already existed. Not to say that's not clever, they do diabolical things with marketing that constantly walks the fine line of being deceptive. And people get deceived clearly.

So they have put a name on a policy. Great, but your statement that due to this, GPUs in thin laptops is now a solved problem, that's a lie.

 

[Applemaniac7]

Cue the complaints from people that won't be putting down the money to buy a Mac Pro regardless.

I'm upset about the Ferrari that's far outside of my price range.

How redic, Mac pros are for business that has to watch the bottom line every day but need them. Ferraris are for millionaires with unlimited Income.. just play things..

 

[chucker23n1]

No Apple don’t do the same. And it does do something for the cooling as stated in the links, it’s a design philosophy for the entire laptop:

http://gizmodo.com/what-you-need-to-know-about-max-q-nvidias-plan-to-mak-1795658324

Let me edit the article:

What You Need to Know About Max-Q, Nvidia's Plan to Make Gaming Laptops That Aren't Monstrosities

NVidia is making a new brand of gaming GPUs.