BBC Documentary Claims Apple Fails to Protect Chinese Factory Workers

[apolloa]

You said: "As said it is APPLE who makes these claims and yet none of them are being met."

To me that translates to Apple is lying. If that's the case then one would assume the BBC is working to make sure those false claims are removed from Apple's documentations and Apple's website.

Since when is the burden of proof on the accused? Isn't it innocent until proven guilty? If you or the BBC or whoever think Apple is lying here then it's up to YOU to prove it.

And you took my comment out of context, I NEVER said lying, YOU assumed that. So I have nothing to answer other than what I already have. And it's very clear you have not seen the programme or taken note of what anyone here has said about it, considering the BBC reporter and camera crew drove to Apples HQ, and sat outside their HQ and reported that the interview Apple promised them with a high level executive had been cancelled and instead they issued a statement. Now in the interest of slander I am pretty sure what the BBC said was true, so on the basis of that I can't see Apple removing it's claims off it's website considering they wouldn't even face an interview.

I can google Apple and Pegatron working conditions and post links here if you wish, but I am not the one who said Apple release a report on the matter without linking to said report...

 

[Renzatic]

No one could prove that, they're definitely planning on invading Uganda

Exactly! There isn't any proof they're not planning on invading Uganda...

 

[tennisproha]

What you are not getting us that Apple claims to inspect these factories 100s of times a year and do not "see" any of these issues. They produce their social and environmental reports on their supply chain and everything' is apparently fine and within their code of conduct, when clearly it is impossible for them not to know the truth or see what a couple of journalists saw in a few weeks. It is clear that they are culpable in hiding the truth or ignoring the reality.

They do not "inspect these factories 100s of times a year". The problem is Apple is simply big enough for everyone to target so they become the easy scapegoat. If you watched the documentary you saw how those Chinese Watch Dogs were blaming Apple instead of their government when they clearly know Pegatron is the employer, not Apple.

 

[aerok]

Exactly! There isn't any proof they're not planning on invading Uganda...

Found proof that apple is invading Uganda (Sorta)

Introduced, naturalised or invasive in East Africa

Although likely to be native to the three countries Solanum incanum (Sodom Apple) is invasive in parts of Kenya, Uganda (A.B.R. Witt pers. obs.) and Tanzania (Henderson 2002).

http://keys.lucidcentral.org/keys/v.../Media/Html/Solanum_incanum_(Sodom_Apple).htm

 

[doelcm82]

I'm not. I'm saying they almost always get a pass from the media while Apple somehow takes responsibility for the entire industry.

So you don't give them a pass, and I don't give them a pass. Just everyone else?

Perhaps the reason the media puts a spotlight on Apple is that Apple is considered more likely than the others to be a leader in the fight for better working conditions, and then Apple will come out looking like the good company, forcing the other companies to follow suit or lose market share because of their continued support for wage slavery.

Do you want Apple to lead in this area, or would you prefer that Samsung or someone else makes the first move?

 

[kettle]

You obviously don't know how the BBC is funded.

Yes, but the BBC do sell productions for profit - so again - you are a person nuancing a statement to fit an agenda.

 

[apolloa]

Yes, but the BBC do sell productions for profit - so again - you are a person nuancing a statement to fit an agenda.

I think they sell their programmes to other country's? Like Top Gear? But they do get the majority of their income from the British public, and I personally don't agree with that due to recent events. But I doubt anything I say will change it.

 

[Rogifan]

Still being an apologist. And you took my comment out of context, I NEVER said lying, YOU assumed that. So I have nothing to answer other than what I already have. And it's very clear you have not seen the programme or taken note of what anyone here has said about it, considering the BBC reporter and camera crew drove to Apples HQ, and sat outside their HQ and reported that the interview Apple promised them with a high level executive had been cancelled and instead they issued a statement. Now in the interest of slander I am pretty sure what the BBC said was true, so on the basis of that I can't see Apple removing it's claims of it's website considering they wouldn't even face an interview.

I can google Apple and Pegatron working conditions and post links here if you wish, but I am not the one who said Apple release a report on the matter without linking to said report...

If it's not lying then what is it?

 

[ani4ani]

They do not "inspect these factories 100s of times a year". The problem is Apple is simply big enough for everyone to target so they become the easy scapegoat. If you watched the documentary you saw how those Chinese Watch Dogs were blaming Apple instead of their government when they clearly know Pegatron is the employer, not Apple.

So you must have watched a different documentary to me and it didn't quote Apple when they said they carry out hundreds of inspections and no one does more than Apple to ensure the well being of employees, and that their ethical, and environmental codes of conduct are met. So in the documentary you watched, you must agree with me then that they at least must be ignoring the issues if their not bothering to inspect

 

[tennisproha]

China and its megacorporations are simply profiting off of their own peoples backs while targeting the likes of Apple as the belligerent. As manufacturing technology improves we'll continue to see the likes of Apple bring their supply chain back to the US like they've done with the Mac Pro in Austin. In time iPhones will be made in the USA.

 

[shandyman]

Yes, but the BBC do sell productions for profit - so again - you are a person nuancing a statement to fit an agenda.

BBC worldwide sell the productions. Not the BBC. Different companies.

 

[apolloa]

If it's not lying then what is it?

Well I did post this..

Not false, Apple just blatantly couldn't care less as it means higher $$$$ profits for them, just how do you think the capitalist western world works? Stop being such an apologist.

So long as we are all comfortable knowing our gadgets and products are made at the expense of others all is fine, but don't try to turn a blind eye to it all.

Apple aren't lying, they couldn't care less until their image is at risk of being damaged and thus affect their $$$

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China and its megacorporations are simply profiting off of their own peoples backs while targeting the likes of Apple as the belligerent. As manufacturing technology improves we'll continue to see the likes of Apple bring their supply chain back to the US like they've done with the Mac Pro in Austin. In time iPhones will be made in the USA.

It would be great to buy a product with 'Made In America' stamped on it and Apple's logo, that's cheaper than the Mac Pro! But that will never happen until the profit margins from American work forces can match those of the Chinese ones. It would be nice if all companies did this in all countries.

 

[tennisproha]

So you must have watched a different documentary to me and it didn't quote Apple when they said they carry out hundreds of inspections and no one does more than Apple to ensure the well being of employees, and that their ethical, and environmental codes of conduct are met. So in the documentary you watched, you must agree with me then that they at least must be ignoring the issues if their not bothering to inspect

I'm quoting you… you wrote it didnt you. smh.

Its not Apples problem, its Chinas. It'll wholeheartedly be Chinas when Apples forced to go elsewhere in a few years because of Chinas tactics. Chinas simply biting itself while abusing its own people.

 

[MagicBoy]

I was alwways under the impression that as long as the TV was capable of receiving live broadcasts, you were eligible if you use it or not, but it seems you are correct on that one (I've never looked into it before)!

The definition was updated in 2004.

BBC BS. These workers work for the factory, not for Apple. It's their duty to care for their workers as subcontractors. The factory doesn't belong to Apple.
Why doesn't the BBC go after the factories instead? They may get something accomplished... Oh wait! They don't care, nor the country cares. and the workers are happy to have a job.
The day Apple starts using robots for manufacturing, then the media will complain about Apple take people's jobs away from them.

The truth is you can never please everyone.

Apple proudly pronounce their ecological and worker treatment policies as part of the brand. If they can't hold their subcontractors to the statements then it's fair that it's independently investigated.

There's bigger issues involved as regards cultural differences in Asia, but the basic issue is that Apple shouldn't be trumpeting these policies when there are widespread breaches from their major subcontractors and expect to get away with it.

Pegatron should be thoroughly ashamed of themselves, but I doubt they care.

For all the whining and griping going on from both sides of the political divide, I still wonder if any of us have taken the time to watch the documentary yet.

I have. I'm pretty much ignoring most comments from outside the UK and before 21:59 as it's just conjecture and speculation.

Was there anyone from Apple on this program to respond to/counter their claims? We know how unbalanced the media can be when it comes to Apple (hello New York Times). I don't trust the BBC one bit.

BBC were invited to 1 Infinite Loop, got a three hour meeting but no interview, just a statement.

My take - Apple chickened out. I'm surprised they got that much to be honest, Apple tend to stonewall/ignore press requests they don't like.

 

[aerok]

I'm quoting you… you wrote it didnt you. smh.

Its not Apples problem, its Chinas. It'll wholeheartedly be Chinas when Apples forced to go elsewhere in a few years because of Chinas tactics. Chinas simply biting itself while abusing its own people.

So much Chinas

 

[Renzatic]

It would be great to buy a product with 'Made In America' stamped on it and Apple's logo, that's cheaper than the Mac Pro! But that will never happen until the profit margins from American work forces can match those of the Chinese ones. It would be nice if all companies did this in all countries.

That won't happen so long as your average first worker expects a living wage, and safe work conditions.

Apple could still turn a massive profit manufacturing their goods here in the states. The problem is, it wouldn't be as massive as what they could get elsewhere. Considering the economy of the first world is currently riding on a perpetual growth at all cost model rather than sustained prosperity, a move like that wouldn't be kosher to those on Wall Street.

 

[tennisproha]

It would be great to buy a product with 'Made In America' stamped on it and Apple's logo, that's cheaper than the Mac Pro! But that will never happen until the profit margins from American work forces can match those of the Chinese ones. It would be nice if all companies did this in all countries.

well the Mac Pros are a start at least. I think Mac Minis could be next. Or iMacs but they have that pesky screen lol.

 

[aerok]

That won't happen so long as your average first worker expects a living wage, and safe work conditions.

So USA is ideal?

 

[tennisproha]

So much Chinas

Chinas everywhere!

 

[Renzatic]

So USA is ideal?

It was at one time.

 

[Poisonivy326]

As I said, Apple's probably no worse than many major companies with regards to labor conditions and probably is above average. But they just need to stop banging on and on about how they're the best and most humane and ecologically friendly company.

They make themselves a target with this kind of bulls__t.

 

[Porco]

I'm going to have to eat my words a bit after being snarky about this before I watched it.

Don't get me wrong, I didn't think it was the greatest reporting ever but they made many fair points in amongst the sensationalistic (shaky blurry cam! It's like Panorama is secret undercover agent James Bond and Apple is SPECTRE!) and slightly disingenuous statements, and Apple clearly need to do a lot more. They can clearly do more if they feel under pressure to. It doesn't matter if Apple are doing better than any other company in these matters, I want them to do much better.

They need to improve conditions for workers and enforce the rules more. Pay more inspectors, send in undercover inspectors, whatever they need to do.

They need to get a much stronger supply chain of legal-only tin.

They have the money, and they can spend a lot of it on these issues before it'd be costing more than they end up making. Maybe some of that cash they don't want to repatriate…(?!)

Go do it Apple. Stop hiding behind all the other companies being worse, don't just be the least negative and expect that to be ok, be positive.

On the pro-Apple side, I hope there aren't people who watch this and go and buy an android device or other manufacturer's PC in response, as if Apple are the only ones involved with these suppliers. The programme didn't do enough to underline the point that Apple are not the only ones who use these suppliers. The programme hammered home the name Apple so often it got a bit ridiculous. And there was barely more than a mention of governmental responsibility from the countries where the suppliers are based. But all this is insignificant compared to the real issues raised for the suppliers' workers.

 

[Rogifan]

Well I did post this..



Apple aren't lying, they couldn't care less until their image is at risk of being damaged and thus affect their $$$.

You said they are making claims that aren't being met. How is that not lying?

 

[aerok]

It was at one time.

Many will argue that it still is.

 

[ani4ani]

I'm quoting you… you wrote it didnt you. smh.

Its not Apples problem, its Chinas. It'll wholeheartedly be Chinas when Apples forced to go elsewhere in a few years because of Chinas tactics. Chinas simply biting itself while abusing its own people.

I think you need to read your own post when stated Apple don't inspect these factories 100s of times a year. The documentary clearly quotes Apple making such claims and I repeated that in my post.

For clarity, for my understanding, what are you stating? Do you think Apple does or does not inpect these factories?