BBC Documentary Claims Apple Fails to Protect Chinese Factory Workers

[xSinghx]

My take is the following. Why is the BBC focussing on Apple as if this was all the responsibility of Apple. Where are the governments of China and Indonesia on protecting their worker's rights in all of this and regulating companies such as FoxConn and Pegatron. It is really the government's responsibility to enforce laws and environmental regulations. It's a little disingenuous for the BBC to lay all the blame at Apple's feet.

While this documentary was illuminating it was unfair at targeting just one company.

Are you so naive as to think corporations don't influence governments and regulators? I suppose with this kind of magical thinking you'd have us believe the 2008 economic collapse in the US is totally a failure of the government and those on Wall St. bear no responsibility?

How would not targeting a leading company that is financially responsible for such a situation bring more attention to the issue with the same amount of detail? How would that instigate a better or broader awareness? Do you pay more attention to the wrongdoings of smaller companies that make products you've never heard of and never buy? Do you think smaller companies have a greater impact on our world than transnational corporations when it comes to labor and supply chains?

 

[3goldens]

I'm a physician and I routinely work 80+ hour weeks (and 100+ hour weeks during residency). These factory workers have it good! Maybe the BBC should produce a documentary on overworked physicians (something that actually matters).

Geez, are you actually comparing yourself to a factory worker in China on an assembly line? Maybe I am reading this wrong.

Is your pay scale the same as well?

 

[nylon]

Are you so naive as to think corporations don't influence governments and regulators? I suppose with this kind of magical thinking you'd have us believe the 2008 economic collapse in the US is totally a failure of the government and those on Wall St. bear no responsibility?

How would not targeting a leading company that is financially responsible for such a situation bring more attention to the issue with the same amount of detail? How would that instigate a better or broader awareness? Do you pay more attention to the wrongdoings of smaller companies that make products you've never heard of and never buy? Do you think smaller companies have a greater impact on our world than transnational corporations when it comes to labor and supply chains?

This is known as a "straw-man" argument.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

 

[Speedy2]

I'm a physician and I routinely work 80+ hour weeks (and 100+ hour weeks during residency). These factory workers have it good! Maybe the BBC should produce a documentary on overworked physicians (something that actually matters).

It says a LOT about you if you compare your working conditions and pay to the Chinese factory worker.

Good luck in your life!

 

[TimelessOne]

While I empathize and even sympathize with your views and intentions, the problem is far larger then any one company can fix. It needs to be addressed on a global scale. The good thing is that these issues are being raised and Apple is trying to address them. However, to focus on one company is just disingenuous.

You could have removed the word "Apple" from this documentary and it still would have had the same impact.

Human beings are a flawed species. All we can do is work towards a better world.

LOL funny. If you think it would of had the same impact with out Apple in it then you are crazy.
More people will watch it because Apple is in it.

Apple has more power to do something that anyone else because they are the most well known brand that does it.
Apple is the most well known by a healthy margin. So yeah they are in the spot to be able to do the most about it so yes they should take most of the heat as they can do more than anyone else.

 

[apolloa]

Watched it, very balanced documentary, good facts and even words directly out of Tim Cooks mouth that are the complete opposite of the truth.

As they say, no where else in the world has a workforce that is so cheap and can make Apple's products so fast.

And that my friends equals $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ which is ALL Apple cares about, it's a giant corporation, what else do you really think they want?

But i'm sure Apple aren't the only ones. The rich are getting richer at the expense of the poor getting poorer.

Oh and Apple won't do anything about this, unless it is forced to, it cannot reduce it's bottom line. Nike are the same, they are just as well known yet they have been caught knowing about workers being abused in their Chinese sweat shops, in fact in this report they highlight the business model they use which is an exact copy of Apple's, out source your manufacturing to dirt cheap sweat shops:

http://www.businessinsider.com/how-nike-solved-its-sweatshop-problem-2013-5?IR=T

And another report on the Nike sweat shops:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...factories-making-Converse-line-Indonesia.html


If these corporations and governments weren't so utterly obsessed with profit, then they would actually have their products made in their own damn country's!

 

[Reason077]

Right right... because they sell absolutely nothing on www.bbcshop.com, and the iPlayer doesn't show ads, right?

iPlayer, along with all BBC websites and other properties, do NOT show ads of any kind to users/viewers in the UK.

 

[rish]

Watched it, very balanced documentary, good facts and even words directly out of Tim Cooks mouth that are the complete opposite of the truth.

As they say, no where else in the world has a workforce that is so cheap and can make Apple's products so fast.

And that my friends equals $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ which is ALL Apple cares about, it's a giant corporation, what else do you really think they want?

But i'm sure Apple aren't the only ones. The rich are getting richer at the expense of the poor getting poorer.

You are totally correct. They say that 80% of the worlds wealth is held by 20% of the worlds population. That's a frightening thought if this is close to the truth.

The rich continue in their arrogance and ignore those risking their lives. An example I would use while I'm sure there are better ones are the GTA employees who got laid off while the managers cashed in their shares to a make a few mil to look after their own. Doubt the ground staff got anything close to a whiff of that. That's in America. What does everyone think is going on in companies in Asia. Considerably worse. Every industry relies on manufacturing in Asia. Cheap labor - enough to keep them in their shacks than to pay them fairly and free them of their deprivation so they can truly live.

 

[Rogifan]

To everyone bitching about them making products for other companies. No one is denying that.

The programme is about the claims Apple makes and how they do not live up to them. Samsung, LG etc do not get there CEO on stage spouting off about doing this and doing that for workers. Apple does. If they are going to make these announcements in public, they sure as hell should make them happen.

Tim Cook has claimed the Apple ethos is about the environment and being green and carbon footprint etc. Yet all the raw materials are gathered in exactly the same method as it is for all of their competitors.

For All of the claims Apple makes to happen, they would need to get off there collective fat backsides and spend some of that huge cash pile. Everyone knows that will not happen. Putting a few solar panels up means nothing.

Was there anyone from Apple on this program to respond to/counter their claims? We know how unbalanced the media can be when it comes to Apple (hello New York Times). I don't trust the BBC one bit.

 

[Lankyman]

Yet they fail to report that these hard done by people are paid a fair wage by there countries going rate and there there by CHOICE. It's not forced labour!

If you have a conscience then watch it, however, if you like the self-satisfied feeling you get by owning Apple products then I guess you won't.

The film is pretty shocking and let's the viewer decide.

Having watched it myself this evening the evidence is pretty damming. Apple didn't do themselves any favours by agreeing to do an interview in reply to the documentary then pulled out at the last minute. I guess they realised after watching the evidence the game was up.

 

[Rogifan]

You are totally correct. They say that 80% of the worlds wealth is held by 20% of the worlds population. That's a frightening thought if this is close to the truth.

The rich continue in their arrogance and ignore those risking their lives. An example I would use while I'm sure there are better ones are the GTA employees who got laid off while the managers cashed in their shares to a make a few mil to look after their own. Doubt the ground staff got anything close to a whiff of that. That's in America. What does everyone think is going on in companies in Asia. Considerably worse. Every industry relies on manufacturing in Asia. Cheap labor - enough to keep them in their shacks than to pay them fairly and free them of their deprivation so they can truly live.

And yet all everyone in the western world complaining about this still continue to fund these nasty corporations. Put your moneh where your mouth is and stop funding them.

 

[apolloa]

Was there anyone from Apple on this program to respond to/counter their claims? We know how unbalanced the media can be when it comes to Apple (hello New York Times). I don't trust the BBC one bit.

Did you even watch the programme? Apple REFUSED an interview with the programme so you are wrong on that, and they showed countless videos of Tim Cook himself stating facts about Apple and it's supply chains standards, and they showed several quotes from Apple on it's standards too. As said it is APPLE who makes these claims and yet none of them are being met.

 

[babyj]

Its up to the Chinese government to regulate its companies. And its up to Pegatron to live by its rules and regulations.

The Chinese government do regulate their companies and the companies live by those regulations. The problem is that those regulations are not what most people in the West view as acceptable - child labour, unsafe working conditions, long hours and so on.

They have no interest in changing those regulations unless they have to and targeting companies such as Apple that are happy to use those regulations to their own advantage (for cheap labour) is one way to achieve that.

 

[Lankyman]

Was there anyone from Apple on this program to respond to/counter their claims? We know how unbalanced the media can be when it comes to Apple (hello New York Times). I don't trust the BBC one bit.

Apple were given the opportunity to respond. The BBC were asked to go to Cupertino for a high level interview response. When the BBC arrived Apple chickened out and put out one of their famous mission statements instead.

What could they say - they have been well and truly caught with their pants down. Denying this documentary is like denying the moon landings took place - oh what's that, they didn't take place!

 

[gnasher729]

Apple can choice end relationship with these factories or companies. Apple also need to make sure their supplier met their code of conducts. It is Apple who turn blind eyes to labor abuses in order to make more profit. Though it is not 100% Apple's fault, Apple also need hold accountable for labor abuse as well.

Do you have any evidence that Apple has ever turned a blind eye on the abuse of employees?

There are surely cases where Apple only found out about abuse after it happened, or maybe never finds out about specific cases. However, they are trying hard, and when abuse is found, they have in several cases quit using a contractor altogether, and in many cases forced the companies to stop that abuse, and to give compensation to the workers.

As an example, if Apple finds that someone under the age of 16 is employed, that kid will go back to school _and the company will pay for it and pay their wages until they are 16_ Apple has forced comanies to pay back millions of dollars in fees that workers had to be to employment agents to get a job. They have forced companies to pay overtime that wasn't paid or was paid incorrectly, or to pay for other time where they didn't want to pay.

 

[nylon]

LOL funny. If you think it would of had the same impact with out Apple in it then you are crazy.
More people will watch it because Apple is in it.

Apple has more power to do something that anyone else because they are the most well known brand that does it.
Apple is the most well known by a healthy margin. So yeah they are in the spot to be able to do the most about it so yes they should take most of the heat as they can do more than anyone else.

You are really just criticizing human beings for being superficial here nothing more. The problem with this kind of journalism is that it is also unethical to single out a single company to promote it's topic rather then focussing on the greater issue at hand.

I'm sure Apple can make a difference but the issue is greater then Apple.

 

[Rogifan]

Having watched it myself this evening the evidence is pretty damming. Apple didn't do themselves any favours by agreeing to do an interview in reply to the documentary then pulled out at the last minute. I guess they realised after watching the evidence the game was up.

What game is up? How many people here complaining are going to toss out their Apple gear and buy something else? I say to them all: put your money where your mouth is. If you believe Apple is intentionally exploiting Chinese workers for the almighty greenback and lying about it stop buying their products. No better way to get Apple's attention.

 

[gnasher729]

The Chinese government do regulate their companies and the companies live by those regulations. The problem is that those regulations are not what most people in the West view as acceptable - child labour, unsafe working conditions, long hours and so on.

What about child labour? In China, employing someone under the age of 16 is illegal. In two cases, Apple found systematic breach of this rule, and both cancelled their contracts with the contractors in question, and reported the matter to the authorities. On the other hand, in the UK for example the rules are exactly the same. If you are 16, you can get a full time job.

While I sympathize with your sentiments. This is a very naive statement.

Well, that's exactly what Apple has done at least twice. Two companies got their contract cancelled because they were found to systematically hire people who were under 16.

Now if Foxconn or Pegatron refused to improve what they are doing, that would put Apple into a difficult situation. However, they don't refuse to improve.

And seriously, most cases of abuse are not good for business anyway. For example, you can't legally employ anyone under 16. Which means you can't hire a 15 year old and pay him less, you can only hire a 15 year old and pretend he or she is 16. So what good does that do a company? Since you pay the same money, wouldn't you prefer an employee who is a bit older and therefore more educated, stronger, more concentrated in his work? Or the BBC claiming that someone did so much overtime that they ended up sleeping on the job? That's not exactly good for business, is it? I'd rather have people working and not sleeping. If that happened, it is abuse, but it is also stupid, so companies should stop it out of self interest.

 

[nylon]

If these corporations and governments weren't so utterly obsessed with profit, then they would actually have their products made in their own damn country's!

You literally need to change the fundamental socio-economic system that this planet runs on and remove money as the primary incentive to achieve what you want. That's going to take some time.

 

[Lankyman]

You are really just criticizing human beings for being superficial here nothing more. The problem with this kind of journalism is that it is also unethical to single out a single company to promote it's topic rather then focussing on the greater issue at hand.

I'm sure Apple can make a difference but the issue is greater then Apple.

The reason Apple have been singled out is because they are the ones making pious statements about being a model employer, caring for the planet etc. etc. etc. Tonights film showed them out to be not one bit better than a 19th century sweat shop employer when they think no one is looking.

But hey, what does it matter, it's other people not me, knock yourself out, enjoy your iPhone.

 

[Rogifan]

Did you even watch the programme? Apple REFUSED an interview with the programme so you are wrong on that, and they showed countless videos of Tim Cook himself stating facts about Apple and it's supply chains standards, and they showed several quotes from Apple on it's standards too. As said it is APPLE who makes these claims and yet none of them are being met.

So the BBC is accusing Apple of lying and knowingly making claims that are untrue? So according to the BBC the information on http://www.apple.com/supplier-responsibility/ is false? If that's the case I would assume the BBC will work to ensure these false claims are removed from Apple's website?

 

[Lankyman]

What game is up? How many people here complaining are going to toss out their Apple gear and buy something else? I say to them all: put your money where your mouth is. If you believe Apple is intentionally exploiting Chinese workers for the almighty greenback and lying about it stop buying their products. No better way to get Apple's attention.

Well at least you're honest in your dismissal of other people's misery.

By saying the game is up I meant Apple's pious sanctimonious statements are nothing more than empty vessels and you know what they say about empty vessels?

 

[ani4ani]

So instead of presenting these findings to Apple and actually trying to improve the situation, they are going to capitalize on it by making a "documentary" for more $$$? Disgusting.

Watch the documentary before defending your electronics religion. The documentary was made months ago and Apple were made aware of it and saw it at the same time...hence how have Apple claimed to have improved the situation since it was made, unless of course all of the issues were solved in the 90 minutes since it aired!

 

[batchtaster]

So I take it the BBC is going to do another report on Samsung, LG, Lenovo, Dell, etc. The BBC is all about being fair and balanced, right?

Since they're basically the same factories anyway, the report already isn't fair or balanced. These are contractors who manufacture for multiple clients simultaneously. But they bailed up only Apple, purely out of sensationalism.

 

[apolloa]

If you google Pegatron and Apple then you will see we had story's of Pegatron breaching workers rights making Apple products LAST YEAR, and yet they continue to do so, so to somehow believe Apple doesn't know about it is to be the most stupid and naive person on the planet to be honest.

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-s...le-rocked-by-child-labour-claims-8736504.html

So Apple utterly deserves this negative publicity.