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I have a problem with corporations paying 6% income tax (Google, Apple, etc.) when I pay close to 6 times that. After I factor in state income tax, sales tax, and the litany of other crap I'm forced to pay for and deal with (high gas tax, etc.), I get absolutely screwed compared to them. I'm paying like 40-50% of everything I make to some kind of taxation.

That's a ridiculous hardship on me. I can do real things that would improve my quality of life significant with that money.

I can't perform a Double Irish Arrangement to cut my rate. There are no loopholes or tricks for me, being a single guy. High asset prices and inflation absolutely screw my savings. I keep my expenses low, which means I just have fewer deductions. I work two jobs which just means I pay more. **** socialists - you already rob me of enough to pay for your stupid **** I never voted for and never wanted.

Either make corporations pay the same rate as individuals, or allow individuals the same loopholes corporations get so I can pay the same rate they do. Flat tax across the board for everyone is best. No deductions - simplify the tax code and make it a 1 page form for everything.

The current tax situation in this country is unsustainable, especially when you consider that raising taxes to 100% on everyone won't cover BS entitlement expenses, or even interest payments on the national debt should the interest rate be allowed to rise where it needs to be (target inflation : 0%).

A true flat tax just won't work because it doesn't provide a way to recoup business expense. Under a flat tax system, a man who invests $100,000 in equipment for a small machine shop can't write any of that off his taxes because there are no decoctions on that type of tax system. A flat tax sounds great for wage income, but it kills businesses.

Dale
 
Issues are complicated and can't be explained perfectly in one picture with text over it

Yet some people take the decisions that will affect them the most based on one liners on the internet. The fundamental problem is that (some) people need a government to have someone to blame, because they hate owning their mistakes.
 
Yet some people take the decisions that will affect them the most based on one liners on the internet. The fundamental problem is that (some) people need a government to have someone to blame, because they hate owning their mistakes.
The problem is we don't have an informed public. People think trump is honest because he says crazy things. You see this when news people go out on the street and ask people what they think on issues like this. People see politicians as like characters in a movie. They either like em or don't. People generally don't research too much into what the candidate is actually about when stepping into that voting booth. It's more like "I'm getting a good vibe from this guy. He gets my vote"
 
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As
"I'm totally a liberal, right up until a liberal policy makes my annual iPhone purchase more expensive"

Something like that probably...
As much as I love the thought of local production of phones etc., it's just unrealistic. I'm from Denmark and we have to accept here in Europe, as you need to in The US, that a lot of old school production jobs have been lost to other markets and won't just return because a lot of politicians feel it would be "Good for America". They are faster, better and do it cheaper in a lot of eastern markets to produce stuff for us, and to be honest, we have a lot of people who don't even want jobs like that anymore.

We should focus on educating and developing our people even further and "beat them" that way. Advanced production facilities like some car manufacturers (BMW for example use awesome Danish robot tech to make production better and still employ local people)

They should of course pay them good and treat them very well - and that's no matter if we talk about production of iPhones, cars or toasters
 
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Bernie criticizing Apple of all people for doing something every company does is pretty ridiculous.

Bernie was asked about Apple and answered that their are worse offenders than Apple, dunno how you come to the conclusion that Apple is singled out in anyway.
 
Bernie was asked about Apple and answered that their are worse offenders than Apple, dunno how you come to the conclusion that Apple is singled out in anyway.
I'm just used to seeing Apple be singled out. Take the Foxconn issue. Nobody ever talks about how other companies contract with them. Apple and Foxconn are practically synonymous at this point.
 
The problem is we don't have an informed public. People think trump is honest because he says crazy things. You see this when news people go out on the street and ask people what they think on issues like this. People see politicians as like characters in a movie. They either like em or don't. People generally don't research too much into what the candidate is actually about when stepping into that voting booth. It's more like "I'm getting a good vibe from this guy. He gets my vote"
Yes. Complicated laws x complex issues + uneducated people = profit.
 
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I never completely understood Apple as a target either. Especially with the Foxconn stuff. When other products like X boxes are made there, but people aren't calling on Microsoft to cut down on the slave labor like they're responsible for people jumping off buildings

It is unfair to pick on Apple solely, and expect them to be the only company out of hundreds to step up and do something about it. Could they have more of a social conscious about thing? Yeah, they could. But they are pretty much doing what's expected of them, and using a system that's been built for them to do just what they're doing.

Though at the same time, I can understand why they get more press on the issue than MS, Nintendo, and the rest. Apple is currently one of the wealthiest companies in the world, which does make it easier to justify serving them up as the endemic example.
 
sorry to ask, is this Bernie from Muppet show? I never watched it. I know it from Forest Gump.
latest
 
True. That figure probably needs to be taken with a grain of salt. But it works for an average, I guess.

Yes, sure.

When I went to Vietnam we went a dive bar and paid 10p for a pint of beer, in the UK on a student night you would have paid £1 a pint, and in a cheap pub you'd have paid £1.60 a pint maybe. So that's 10-16x cheaper in Vietnam.

When we went to nice places in Vietnam you'd pay £1/pint, whereas in the UK you'd have paid £4/pint in an equivalent place, so that's ~4x cheaper in Vietnam.

With cocktails we paid I think about £2/drink, in the UK on happy hour I usually pay £3-4 for an equivalent drink, and you'd pay £6-7 for a full price one. So that's only 2-3x cheaper in Vietnam.

In China I looked to buy Ecco shoes, there they were £150 each, whereas in the UK they'd have probably been around £100.

There are exceptions, first class on the train in China was about 20-25% more than standard class, but you got 4 bunks in a space not six and you also got proper cabins, but that sort of thing generally seems to hold.
 
Bernie Sanders,...., where he commented on the company's manufacturing policies and rumors that Apple dodges taxes.

So when North Carolina gives Apple a tax-break (like they do in EVERY state for ALL large corporations, not just Apple) that is legal, but when Ireland does the same then it's illegal ? This is really political bull-s***.

$46 million tax break:
http://appleinsider.com/articles/11...tion_benefits_of_apples_1_billion_server_farm

$89m tax break:
http://www.datacenterdynamics.com/news/nevada-uses-tax-break-to-lure-in-apple/68395.fullarticle

So either we do allow tax breaks - or we all stop giving tax breaks (but that will be difficult politically, too many conflicting interests). So, it comes down to pre-election rhetoric (hollow phrases to catch votes).
 
So either we do allow tax breaks - or we all stop giving tax breaks (but that will be difficult politically, too many conflicting interests). So, it comes down to pre-election rhetoric (hollow phrases to catch votes).

The difference is we give tax breaks for other incentives to companies. Like "we'll give you a $100 million tax break if you bring jobs here" kinda deals.

Setting up a corporate tax haven in Ireland? The US gets nothing from that.
 
The whole point of what Sanders says is that them paying their fair share would allow the US to reduce the taxes on people like you.
We agree about what he said.

Instead of just complaining about high taxes, you should blame past governments for not having closed the loopholes, but also large companies who use them.
I do, but that's just another form of complaining.

Things can be done, measures can be taken. It's not "**** taxes" or "**** socialists", it should be "**** people who do not pay their fair share, because they make me pay for it on top of my share".
A flat tax across the board, to all income classes and across all individuals and corporations, without any deductions or loopholes, is the fairest and simplest share. Either massively reduce taxes, or make them the same rate for everyone so the corporations and free-riders can start to feel pained by it and push for lower taxes.

If you don't vote, or if you don't vote consequently, stop complaining.
Voting is not a solution when the system is corrupt and when you are forced to inherit corrupt ideas before you are even born. I didn't vote for the ponzi scheme of Social Security because I was not yet born, nor would I support it today because I save for my own retirement (which is a radical concept for certain people. Yet, I am forced to pay significant earnings into this ponzi scheme that, as a kicker, also does not track with inflation (because inflation is consistently manipulated and underreported). No way will I ever be paid back in dollars of equivalent purchasing power, if I am paid back at all, when the time comes. That money is effectively flushed, and the more you earn (the more you work), the more you are forced to flush.

No candidate is addressing the problem of an unsustainable government spending (the largest problem being entitlements), so who do I vote for? What do I vote for? Why should I even vote when whoever wins will most certainly keep the taxing and spending at current limits, if not raise them?

I am a citizen without representation. I have no one to vote for.
 
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I do agree with Apple, that saying "They pay their share of tax." BUT they pay it to the wrong country... Apple's in the U.S, not in China... They just make stuff there, and like any company, *because* it's cheaper to make.

That way Apple has enough to build all their fancy Apple stores they like. than if they wer making everything in the U.S

Apple, like any company who wants to squeeze through a hole, of course would say doube-standards... Confesses the guys speaking to them :D.

I don't think the the government needs any help with that.

If Tim reckons making products in China is "skill" what does that say for the U.S? lack of ?
 
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they care only about the money...make a strong deal with apple to move even the foxcon with all his employees and then have claims
 



berniesanderspic.jpg
Bernie Sanders, candidate for the 2016 Democratic presidential nomination in the United States, was today queried about Apple in an interview with the Daily News, where he commented on the company's manufacturing policies and rumors that Apple dodges taxes.

When asked if Apple is part of corporate America that is "destroying the fabric of our nation," a question inspired by statements made by Sanders' himself, Sanders said he does not believe that to be the case, instead pointing the finger at big banks like JPMorgan Chase and corporations like General Electric. He went on to clarify that he would, however, like Apple to move manufacturing of some devices to the United States and pay a fair share of taxes.Sanders is not the first presidential candidate to comment on Apple's manufacturing policies, with Donald Trump also claiming he would force Apple to manufacture its products in the United States.

Though the bulk of Apple products are manufactured overseas, Apple has in fact made an effort to move some production jobs back to the United States, something that Sanders and Trump both appear to be unaware of. Apple's Mac Pro line of computers is assembled by Flextronics in Austin, Texas, an effort that cost Apple $100 million. Many third-party components used in Apple devices are also created by suppliers located in the United States, as Re/code points out. Corning's Gorilla Glass, used in iPhones and iPads, is made in Kentucky, for example.

In a December interview with Charlie Rose, Apple CEO Tim Cook gave some color on why Apple products are made in China. "It's skill," he said, going on to explain that China has focused heavily on training people to create machinery and parts for electronic devices.
When it comes to taxes, Tim Cook has previously said that Apple pays all of the taxes that it owes. During the same December interview, he said accusations Apple avoids taxes on revenue held overseas is "total political crap." "There is no truth behind it," he said. "Apple pays every tax dollar we owe."

Note: Due to the political nature of the discussion regarding this topic, the discussion thread is located in our Politics, Religion, Social Issues forum. All forum members and site visitors are welcome to read and follow the thread, but posting is limited to forum members with at least 100 posts.

Article Link: Bernie Sanders Wishes Apple Would Move Some Manufacturing to US and Pay 'Fair Share' of Taxes
Apple could, anytime it wished, move all its manufacturing to the USA.
Apple would then pay US taxes on all its income.
Apple could reduce profit margins from an average of 40%.
All customers would benefit especially those in the USA.
Apple's reputation would benefit.
Apple cares not a jot for any of this because of greed for money, anyone's money, just so long as it's in their bank balance not yours and they will spin, lie and wriggle to keep the staus quo.
 
Hope you're squeaky clean, Bernie. Things like this have a habit of leaving teethmarks in your backside.
 
Apple pays what they owe due to loopholes in the tax code. What we need is a reasonable plan to close down those loopholes slowly over a period of years. Then we need a reduced tax holiday for corporations to repatriate cash that escaped through the loopholes. Lastly, I think Apple will continue to move production back to the states, or perhaps even into many different countries to minimize shipping cost and carbon footprint. If you look at that new robot that disassembles and recycles iPhones, it's difficult to not see similar technology being put to use to completely build the same devices in the future. It won't create as many jobs, but it will be more efficient.
I agree, the companies (most of them) are not breaking the law so it's not a matter of getting them to pay more it's up to the governments around the world change the laws, we are having the same debate here in Australia.
 
A true flat tax just won't work because it doesn't provide a way to recoup business expense. Under a flat tax system, a man who invests $100,000 in equipment for a small machine shop can't write any of that off his taxes because there are no decoctions on that type of tax system. A flat tax sounds great for wage income, but it kills businesses.

Dale

You have to understand in a Flat Tax system their is no deductions! That is the point!
 
I'm just used to seeing Apple be singled out. Take the Foxconn issue. Nobody ever talks about how other companies contract with them. Apple and Foxconn are practically synonymous at this point.

Actually it's true. Microsoft, Dell, Hp, etc. is never called out, and certainly I haven't seen a dedicated page from Microsoft, Dell, HP, or Lenovo on how they are increasing and enforcing standards in China.

I've even had people say they won't buy Apple because of "child labor this and that" when Apple is the only company showing their efforts to enforce standards at the same plants every other tech manufacturer uses.
 
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