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Can we please remove the vote buttons?
- Thread starter InsanelyApple
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Bravo my dear. You've hit the nail on the head. And for those who don't think she knows what she's talking about, she is married to a former MR moderator.
Moderators and admins have no say in how the technology of the site changes any more than regular forum users. It's purely arn's call. We're clearly aware of the pros and cons as users have outlined in this thread but there's 100% nothing we can do about it either. I do agree with you that some decisions take an abnormally long amount of time. The only person you should be upset with for the issue in this thread is arn. I believe annk was only making a reference to closing the thread since it's going nowhere at this point much like it seems the functionality change is (actually I reread this thread a few weeks ago and it stopped providing new arguments for/against by around page 5). There's really no new arguments to be made (this threads been going on for near a year now) since nothing is being done at present. I believe the site should be able to make these kind of decisions faster and if arn doesn't have the time then somebody should be put in place that can. While the admins have a bit more authority in general, to the best of my knowledge they don't have any authority to do anything about this. Only arn and maybe a few others whom I couldn't even guess as to who they are.
The arguing will stop when people choose to stop arguing. It may be tempting to place blame, but no one is forcing anyone to argue.
This sort of decision is arn's. The site owner can try out any functions he likes, for as long as he likes. It's as simple as that.
arn has stated he will be making adjustments. You've made it clear you're not happy with the timetable. That's fine, but I don't see the point of raging at the site owner or the mod/admin volunteers because of the rate at which the owner makes changes on his Internet forum.
People, at the end of the day we're talking about up-and-down buttons on a discussion forum. This is obviously an important issue for some members, and arn's response makes it clear that it is going to be addressed. Opinions are fine, calls for change are fine, expressions of dissatisfaction are fine, but is the issue really worth nastiness and arguing, once the site owner has said he will be changing things??
If the buttons and how they're used bother you while you're waiting for arn's changes, do as I do - ignore them. (For the record - they don't bother me, but that's because I ignore them.
) When arn has made his adjustments, you can regroup and see what you think. A new discussion will pop up, and who knows - more adjustments might be made based on it. It's a process, and on a huge site with over 600,000 members, it's not always a bad thing that processes take time.Let arn do his thing with this. And let's use some of this energy to send good thoughts to the injured developer. I'm not saying this issue isn't important, I'm saying let's keep some perspective.
iBlue for president!
I guess I should have just hit the +1 vote button on her, but I like to voice my opinion and not hide behind cowardly anonymous vote buttons.
I guess I should have just hit the +1 vote button on her, but I like to voice my opinion and not hide behind cowardly anonymous vote buttons.
Totally agree. Whether iBlue's comments will finally prompt them to do something is the question (although Arn did say the person responsible for making changes is in critical condition).
And for those who don't think rdowns knows what he's talking about, he's driven a former MR moderator from NY to MD and back in his car (and who knows what else).
Edit: @Annk/Silent Panda: The problem with closing the thread is then it just gets forgotten and definitely nothing happens. As far as the arguing goes, there really wouldn't be if you'd actually delete some of the posts from certain posters that just want to antagonize and don't really care one way or the other (for example, look at who has made most of the posts in this thread and then look thru all of their posts and see how many friggin' times they've stated the same damn thing over and over...including me in response to the antagonism.)
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Seems like this thread should be closed then. It's pretty clear this thread serves no purpose, and that a lot of people have been wasting their time and hard-earned concern when in reality there's nothing they can do about it. Arn will make the decision based on data and his whims, not based on 13+ pages of bitching and moaning about personal preferences.
It's sad you feel the need to make crap up and call names. It's why I don't respect anything you have to say. My views have not changed at all. I've said the same things from day one. Unlike you, I don't feel the need to post signature insults or accuse people of trolling. Both prove you have no argument or couth for that matter.
You can imagine anything you want, but it's obviously not true. It's not like this is the only thread I post in and I certainly antagonize anyone (or is that your code word for actually giving an opinion contrary to your own?).
What does seem to be true is that your "side" is hypocritical, won't take NO for an answer and doesn't care what the other side thinks. You seem to believe that if you state how much the voting system sucks often enough that people will believe it's the truth. You'd probably make a good politician.
I'd throw several people off for breaking the rules. Long term membership means nothing if you just let people insult others with differing opinions just for the hell of it. Such people are not worthy of respect because they have no dignity or principles. They think throwing tantrums and insulting the forum owners will somehow get their point across when it only proves its their own insecurities that lead them to criticize the harmless voting system in the first place. I mean who gives a crap if you get downvoted. I surely don't. But that doesn't give people like iBlue the right to bark at the owners over a STUPID issue that harms no one. Frankly, if someone doesn't like the forums, LEAVE already! I won't miss you. I promise.
I agree completely.
^^^^Another classic!
I say leave the thread open. If anything, it's a reminder to arn and whoever else is running this zoo that members are not happy with the way things are.
I mean, look at how the poll results have changed over time. The "No" vote used to have a pretty decent lead over the pure "Yes" vote. But as time has progressed, the "Yes" votes have caught up. It's getting close to even. To me, that indicates that members have grown more and more annoyed over this issue. Perhaps they've come to the Site and Forum Feedback forum to start their own thread about how the voting system annoys them, and have come across this thread instead. I'm sure that there have been a few threads merged into this one already (I've noticed one, but don't feel like scanning the whole thread for more).
Plus, if you add up the "Yes" and "Like Button Only", it's greater than 54%. The majority of members who voted want some sort of change. I'm not including the "Other" votes, because I don't know what they have in mind.
Don't be a sissy. Leave it open.
I say leave the thread open. If anything, it's a reminder to arn and whoever else is running this zoo that members are not happy with the way things are.
I mean, look at how the poll results have changed over time. The "No" vote used to have a pretty decent lead over the pure "Yes" vote. But as time has progressed, the "Yes" votes have caught up. It's getting close to even. To me, that indicates that members have grown more and more annoyed over this issue. Perhaps they've come to the Site and Forum Feedback forum to start their own thread about how the voting system annoys them, and have come across this thread instead. I'm sure that there have been a few threads merged into this one already (I've noticed one, but don't feel like scanning the whole thread for more).
Plus, if you add up the "Yes" and "Like Button Only", it's greater than 54%. The majority of members who voted want some sort of change. I'm not including the "Other" votes, because I don't know what they have in mind.
Don't be a sissy. Leave it open.
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^^^^Another classic!
I say leave the thread open. If anything, it's a reminder to arn and whoever else is running this zoo that members are not happy with the way things are.
I mean, look at how the poll results have changed over time. The "No" vote used to have a pretty decent lead over the pure "Yes" vote. But as time has progressed, the "Yes" votes have caught up. It's getting close to even. To me, that indicates that members have grown more and more annoyed over this issue. Perhaps they've come to the Site and Forum Feedback forum to start their own thread about how the voting system annoys them, and have come across this thread instead. I'm sure that there have been a few threads merged into this one already (I've noticed one, but don't feel like scanning the whole thread for more).
Don't be a sissy. Leave it open.
Are you just speculating on the poll trends as I don't recall that being the case?
I'll have to take a look back in the thread, but I seem to recall some discussion about it.
Great, now I have to search the thread......ugh....
I scanned through the thread, but I could only find one post (by me, actually ) that mentions the poll numbers. I could have sworn there were earlier posts that talked about them as well, but the mods have done quite a bit of clean up in this thread, and I'd guess they were deleted because they were a part of a heated argument.
Here's a part of my post:
Just in one month, the "Yes" and "Like button only" votes have gained 2 percentage points. That's the only hard data I could find within the thread. I wonder if there is a way within vBulletin to graph the data over time....<nerd>that would be cool</nerd>
) that mentions the poll numbers. I could have sworn there were earlier posts that talked about them as well, but the mods have done quite a bit of clean up in this thread, and I'd guess they were deleted because they were a part of a heated argument.Here's a part of my post:
Just in one month, the "Yes" and "Like button only" votes have gained 2 percentage points. That's the only hard data I could find within the thread. I wonder if there is a way within vBulletin to graph the data over time....<nerd>that would be cool</nerd>
For the record I do intend my overly irritated post towards Arn. I know it's ultimately up to him. I apologize to all his messengers.
I scanned through the thread, but I could only find one post (by me, actually
Here's a part of my post:
Just in one month, the "Yes" and "Like button only" votes have gained 2 percentage points. That's the only hard data I could find within the thread. I wonder if there is a way within vBulletin to graph the data over time....<nerd>that would be cool</nerd>
Well I stand corrected! lol thanks for actually looking into that
So I've been afk (anyone remember CS 1.6?) for quite some time, but holy carp has this discussion been entertaining to read, albeit disconcerning.
I have very firm opinions about this subject, and I believe they've been expressed, but guys & gals need to learn to better debate around here. This has always been an issue.
We (and I'm talking about society in general now) have always kind of sucked at debate and only need to look as far as Washington to see so, but we're at a cool advantage here guys. We have our own community that, while 600,000 large, is pretty tight-knit and a few hundred strong. It's an advantage because we get to really hash things out nicely around here. We've got these moderators who are willing to, almost on-demand, discuss borderline arbitrary topics of discussion for days and days. How cool is that?
While I completely agree with some points that the "leave it alone" camp has made, and I completely agree with some points that the "down with downvotes" camp has made, I can't in my right mind agree with the manner in which said points have been verbalized.
Some of the language, attitude, and overall disrespect that has taken place in this thread alone is downright disgusting.
I hope some of you can manage to take a figurative step back and reflect on how you've conducted yourselves lately, and frankly, be ashamed.
I'll make no claim to have always been polite and curteous around here. I can be as snarky and rudely sarcastic as the next guy at times, but I don't think anyone around here could point at me and say, "There. That guy's a downright jerk. He really just doesn't like people." - I can't say the same for others.
___________________________
That's my opinion on the overall discussion. If I may though, here's my final two-cents on the topic at hand.
I think the downvoting needs to go, BUT... only if the upvoting goes with it. The funny thing is that in the end, whatever happens, this isn't my website. I don't rightly care all that much. arn runs a pretty cool place for us here and while some of us toss him and the rest of the gang $25 once in a blue moon, I don't see that or our length of membership or perceived clout to be a reason for us to go off to the soapbox store and get ready for a good old fashioned Les Miserables tirade against the tyranny that is MacRumors.com.
When it comes down to it, we do frequent the site and some of us support it financially. Some of us bounce around here more than others and generate ad-click revenue more than others. Some of us even volunteer extra funds and lend a hand with things on the side. That's fantastic, but you know what? It doesn't matter. In the end, it will always come down to a take it or leave it scenario.
I've been a reader and silent observer of MacRumors since the early 2000s, and decided (to great enjoyment) to member-up only 3 years ago. I have to say, after all this time (just under 10 years now) I've always noticed one thing relevant to this debate, and that's that without fail, there will always be long-standing, respected members with thousands of posts under their belt. This is fantastic, but as they from time to time begin to grow weary of new, unproven members with few posts and no real, proven track-record or clout in this community, true boredom sets in. We find ourselves in situations such as these, where the "kids" have stirred up some sort of change, and the long-standing folk don't like it.
Most of the time, we find that the newbies don't have the care or strength to win the fight. Well, look at this. We have a big struggle now, don't we? As much as the upper-tier of members has tried, there's an audible roar loud enough to be heard. So, forced to continue the battle, each side has clearly gotten louder and louder, and now, the side against changing the vote system has even gained some long-standing members for support, surely enraging "leaders" on the other side further.
Guys, I know this sounds absurd, and like I'm describing some sort of WWII battle, but it's reality. This is happening. On an internet forum. On your computers.
I'll go back to what I said earlier. This is arn's site. Period. We've all said quite a bit about the subject, and it'll either be considered, or disregarded. Such is life. It's okay. In the end, we can either roll with the state of things, or find a different community to roll in alltogether, but no matter what we decide to do, let's please be civil.
Let's move away from the name-calling, the snarky comments, the jabs, and the strawman-style arguments that some of you know fully well you're doing. Just stop. You're only making each other angry. Let's just make our best effort to keep things factual, yet opinionated and respectable. If you feel you can't respect your opponent, close your browser and go grab a beer.
<3
I have very firm opinions about this subject, and I believe they've been expressed, but guys & gals need to learn to better debate around here. This has always been an issue.
We (and I'm talking about society in general now) have always kind of sucked at debate and only need to look as far as Washington to see so, but we're at a cool advantage here guys. We have our own community that, while 600,000 large, is pretty tight-knit and a few hundred strong. It's an advantage because we get to really hash things out nicely around here. We've got these moderators who are willing to, almost on-demand, discuss borderline arbitrary topics of discussion for days and days. How cool is that?
While I completely agree with some points that the "leave it alone" camp has made, and I completely agree with some points that the "down with downvotes" camp has made, I can't in my right mind agree with the manner in which said points have been verbalized.
Some of the language, attitude, and overall disrespect that has taken place in this thread alone is downright disgusting.
I hope some of you can manage to take a figurative step back and reflect on how you've conducted yourselves lately, and frankly, be ashamed.
I'll make no claim to have always been polite and curteous around here. I can be as snarky and rudely sarcastic as the next guy at times, but I don't think anyone around here could point at me and say, "There. That guy's a downright jerk. He really just doesn't like people." - I can't say the same for others.
___________________________
That's my opinion on the overall discussion. If I may though, here's my final two-cents on the topic at hand.
I think the downvoting needs to go, BUT... only if the upvoting goes with it. The funny thing is that in the end, whatever happens, this isn't my website. I don't rightly care all that much. arn runs a pretty cool place for us here and while some of us toss him and the rest of the gang $25 once in a blue moon, I don't see that or our length of membership or perceived clout to be a reason for us to go off to the soapbox store and get ready for a good old fashioned Les Miserables tirade against the tyranny that is MacRumors.com.
When it comes down to it, we do frequent the site and some of us support it financially. Some of us bounce around here more than others and generate ad-click revenue more than others. Some of us even volunteer extra funds and lend a hand with things on the side. That's fantastic, but you know what? It doesn't matter. In the end, it will always come down to a take it or leave it scenario.
I've been a reader and silent observer of MacRumors since the early 2000s, and decided (to great enjoyment) to member-up only 3 years ago. I have to say, after all this time (just under 10 years now) I've always noticed one thing relevant to this debate, and that's that without fail, there will always be long-standing, respected members with thousands of posts under their belt. This is fantastic, but as they from time to time begin to grow weary of new, unproven members with few posts and no real, proven track-record or clout in this community, true boredom sets in. We find ourselves in situations such as these, where the "kids" have stirred up some sort of change, and the long-standing folk don't like it.
Most of the time, we find that the newbies don't have the care or strength to win the fight. Well, look at this. We have a big struggle now, don't we? As much as the upper-tier of members has tried, there's an audible roar loud enough to be heard. So, forced to continue the battle, each side has clearly gotten louder and louder, and now, the side against changing the vote system has even gained some long-standing members for support, surely enraging "leaders" on the other side further.
Guys, I know this sounds absurd, and like I'm describing some sort of WWII battle, but it's reality. This is happening. On an internet forum. On your computers.
I'll go back to what I said earlier. This is arn's site. Period. We've all said quite a bit about the subject, and it'll either be considered, or disregarded. Such is life. It's okay. In the end, we can either roll with the state of things, or find a different community to roll in alltogether, but no matter what we decide to do, let's please be civil.
Let's move away from the name-calling, the snarky comments, the jabs, and the strawman-style arguments that some of you know fully well you're doing. Just stop. You're only making each other angry. Let's just make our best effort to keep things factual, yet opinionated and respectable. If you feel you can't respect your opponent, close your browser and go grab a beer.
<3
Holy carp did you really have to revive this dying thread just to say all that's already been said? Let sleeping dogs lie, sheesh.So I've been afk (anyone remember CS 1.6?) for quite some time, but .........
Holy carp did you really have to revive this dying thread just to say all that's already been said? Let sleeping dogs lie, sheesh.
He was commenting on the level of the discussion. That hasn't been said already, has it?
He was commenting on the level of the discussion. That hasn't been said already, has it?
Yeah, he actually has some good points (that have already been made - perhaps not so eloquently).. but I just didn't want to see this thread at the top of my subscriptions list again and I was feeling cranky last night.
Sorry soco, love ya man.
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