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Canada iTMS November 30?

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don't blame Apple (at least not entirely)

A lot of people here are blaming Apple for delays in opening iTMS Canada, but from decidely inconsistent published comments, you may want to blame the CMRRA (or its president, who the comments are attributed to) instead. Their web site is http://www.cmrra.ca, and their president's e-mail address is mailto://dbasskin@cmrra.ca. Actually, he has a photo website which doesn't work properly with Safari (you have to use Internet Explorer -- bad omen) at http://www.basskin.com. Not that I'm blaming Mr. Basskin in particular for anything, but he certainly seems to be a central figure in the pointless delay. We're all free to e-mail him and enquire... apparently you can even call him at work -- his extension's listed :)
 
emptyair said:
The artists are being compensated. We pay a fee (like a tax) every singe time we buy blank media in Canada (VHS, CD's, DVD's, etc.). And we pay that tax whether we are backing up our files or making audio cd's. The iPod has a levy on it as well. So, I have paid literally hundreds of dollars to artists while I've been backing up my files and various other files. They screw us over for years with their levy and then think that they can try and make it illegal to download music. Well, guess what it's not illegal and yes the artists do get their compensation.

:cool:
Click to expand...

That is very true and I had forgotten about that. If I added up the amount I have paid in levies (3 ipods in my house & tons of CD-Rs) I would burst.

I think the artists are well compensated so its one or the other! :cool:
 
aestival said:
A lot of people here are blaming Apple for delays in opening iTMS Canada, but from decidely inconsistent published comments, you may want to blame the CMRRA (or its president, who the comments are attributed to) instead.
Click to expand...

How about we give them to the end of the day before giving them hell? It is possible that we may yet have an iTMS to call our own before the end of the day.

Mr. Basskin actually posted to this forum in another thread when discussions were underway. He seemed genuinely interested in seeing a Canadian iTMS, so I'm willing to give him the benefit of not immediately jumping down his throat before we get the whole story.
In fact how about you thank him if the iTMS actually arrives?
 
Can somebody verify there isn't a November 31st? ;)

A few days ago I told my brother that the store would open on the 30th at 11:59 PM. For future releases, when Apple says there going to release something in a particular month, best bet to count on the last day of that month.

Come on Apple!! We've waited long enough!
 
atraininc said:
That is very true and I had forgotten about that. If I added up the amount I have paid in levies (3 ipods in my house & tons of CD-Rs) I would burst.

I think the artists are well compensated so its one or the other! :cool:
Click to expand...

Artists have seen very little of that money so far. There ware a lot of complaints that CCPC just sits on that money.

Levies are:

- 29 cents on audio cassette tapes of 40 minutes or longer.
- 21 cents on CD-Rs and CD-RWs.
- 77 cents on CD-R Audio, CD-RW Audio and MiniDiscs.
- 25 $ on MP3 players
 
tutubibi said:
Artists have seen very little of that money so far. There ware a lot of complaints that CCPC just sits on that money.

Levies are:

- 29 cents on audio cassette tapes of 40 minutes or longer.
- 21 cents on CD-Rs and CD-RWs.
- 77 cents on CD-R Audio, CD-RW Audio and MiniDiscs.
- 25 $ on MP3 players
Click to expand...

Hi,

Irregardless of whether the artists see that money, Canadians are all paying a tax/fee on recordable media as a compensation for recording music for personal use. If the artists are not seeing the money that "we" paid then the artists need to use legal means to get the money from the CCPC.

As for iTunes? *yawn* I could care less about downloading an album for $9.99 when I can buy the CD and liner notes for $12.99 and not worry about losing it when my HD fails.

s.
 
tutubibi said:
Levies are:

- 29 cents on audio cassette tapes of 40 minutes or longer.
- 21 cents on CD-Rs and CD-RWs.
- 77 cents on CD-R Audio, CD-RW Audio and MiniDiscs.
- 25 $ on MP3 players
Click to expand...

Hmm, why no levy on hard drives?
 
tutubibi said:
Artists have seen very little of that money so far. There ware a lot of complaints that CCPC just sits on that money.

Levies are:

- 29 cents on audio cassette tapes of 40 minutes or longer.
- 21 cents on CD-Rs and CD-RWs.
- 77 cents on CD-R Audio, CD-RW Audio and MiniDiscs.
- 25 $ on MP3 players
Click to expand...
Whether or not the system is working, what is the intended mechanism for distributing blank media surcharges? What determines which artists get how much?
 
Raid said:
Mr. Basskin actually posted to this forum in another thread when discussions were underway. He seemed genuinely interested in seeing a Canadian iTMS, so I'm willing to give him the benefit of not immediately jumping down his throat before we get the whole story.
In fact how about you thank him if the iTMS actually arrives?
Click to expand...

Unfortunately, Mr. Basskin also gave a quote to the Globe and Mail on Friday stating "We have only recently started negotiations". So at this point his integrity on the matter is in question.
 
mr.steevo said:
Hi,

Irregardless of whether the artists see that money, Canadians are all paying a tax/fee on recordable media as a compensation for recording music for personal use. If the artists are not seeing the money that "we" paid then the artists need to use legal means to get the money from the CCPC.

As for iTunes? *yawn* I could care less about downloading an album for $9.99 when I can buy the CD and liner notes for $12.99 and not worry about losing it when my HD fails.

s.
Click to expand...

Not sure I agree with that. We are paying a tax, that's for sure, but if you take a look at the tax we pay (i.e 20-70 cents per CD), that doesn't cover the cost of a real CD as sold by the labels.

The fact that we pay a tax (that is a small percentage of the real price) on something doesn't mean if gives us the right to copy the original work... especially since the artists will probably never see the money.

Unless you are a business with lots and lots of data or perhaps a graphic artists with huge file to backups, I can't see why a single person would use more than a handful of CDs per years. Most of what I use is for linux distros and personnal backups ... but I'm certainly not giving them tens and tens (or hundreds) of dollars per years.

If someone uses a CD to backup MP3 files downloaded on the web or software .. also illegally downloaded from the web, then the argument doesn't really count in my book since you are pirating stuff anyway.

Just my 2 cents. As a bonus, with the current value of the Canadian dollars, this is rapidly approaching an actual 2 cents USD :D
 
Doctor Q said:
Whether or not the system is working, what is the intended mechanism for distributing blank media surcharges? What determines which artists get how much?
Click to expand...

The organization the collects the levy has not yet determined the mechanism. Apparently that is why they are sitting on it.

In fact, they have been sitting on it for many years now, while expanding the items for which the levy is collected (it's been collected on blank casette tapes for a long time).

A more cynical person might question whether they ever intend to distribute it...
 
ferratus said:
Unless you are a business with lots and lots of data or perhaps a graphic artists with huge file to backups, I can't see why a single person would use more than a handful of CDs per years. Most of what I use is for linux distros and personnal backups ... but I'm certainly not giving them tens and tens (or hundreds) of dollars per years.
Click to expand...

Incremental backups of my laptop produces ~ 6GB per month. Until recently that was a lot of CDs per year, on which I was paying a tax for music.

Now it's not nearly as many DVDs, but the tax is proportionately bigger.
 
I'm not able to browse the content of iTMS. I can only get the "not in your country yet"-sign. The font of the message has changed. The message says I'm able to browse but not buy - however browsing doesn't work. Also still not able to download the danish version of iTunes: download page doesn't exist on web server. Amazing what we can get excited over...
 
If Apple doesn't follow up on their promise...

just don't buy anything from the iTMS store when it get launched.
Yeah right, boycot that thing in Canada. :D
 
Doctor Q said:
Whether or not the system is working, what is the intended mechanism for distributing blank media surcharges? What determines which artists get how much?
Click to expand...
Its based on the number of time each artist gets on the various radio station. So the more you play on radio, the more they think you are pirated so the more money from the pot you get.

This might sound stupid (the rich get richer) but studies have shown that its prety accurate. The songs that are the most downloaded from Kazaa & co. are also the most popular.

So we might think that its working, but its not! A big chunck of this money is used to pay the managing of this taxe collection and also in promotion. So basicaly, artists get almost nothing.
 
AS the day goes on, its looking increasingly likely that iTMS Canada is yet another product Apple has been unable to release on time.

The Missed Project Launch List continues to grow at quite an alarming rate.

No wonder apple has such as poor market share - it is unable to get its products out.
 
It will be november

I don't know what any of you are complaining about. Apple isn't going to break its promise. Did anyone hear them say "iTunes Canada will be launched in November 2004?" Show me that quote. There is a November in 2005, 2006 and probably 2007. If they miss today, they can just wait for the next November to roll around.
 
Called Canada Apple Store...

I called the Canadian Apple Store to ask if iTunes Store was being launched in Canada today. The representitive said that he hadn't received an e-mail that said it would. He did not seem to know much of anything about it.

I hate to say it guys, but it looks like we were lied too. This sucks.

No store today.
 
J-Squire said:
I don't know what any of you are complaining about. Apple isn't going to break its promise. Did anyone hear them say "iTunes Canada will be launched in November 2004?" Show me that quote. There is a November in 2005, 2006 and probably 2007. If they miss today, they can just wait for the next November to roll around.
Click to expand...

well, that person quoted on friday DID say something to the tune of "we said November. It's still November."

One should be able to assume that she did mean 2004.
 
Levies and timing

Hi folks - greetings from Nanaimo, where it's only quarter after 11. They're not going to say "it's going to be in November" and not meet that schedule - all the agreements have been signed, it's just a matter at this point of flicking the switch - which I'll bet will happen shortly.

Maybe when Steve gets done with the protest on Parliment hill - he has been known to be drawn to such things before, you know?

As for levies and downloading - I had a whole conversation earlier this year about this over drinks with a Provincial Court Judge. What he explained to me was that it was legal to download music in Canada because that constitutes copying for personal use - which is what the levy is for. It is not legal to make these copies available to others - because that is illegal distribution. So, what he does when downloading music is turn off the sharing portion of the program.

As a side note - did you know that the same people who collect these levies charge radio stations twice for the priviledge of putting their music on hard drives for the purpose of automation - even if the radio stations aren't doing it? So - for Q107 in Toronto, The Fox in Vancouver or CFNY who aren't automated, but pay literally millions of dollars a year to be able to be, I say download away.

I'm excited about getting iTMS up here in Canada, not because of any ethical reason (since I've already paid, radio's already paid, you've already paid, etc), but because there are some things I'd like that aren't available on the P2P networks and because it'll be more reliable and I can finally get music that won't sound like it's been encoded by a twelve year old.
 
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