Did I miss mention of barometer in series 2?

[Julien]

So....
Or....
Or ....

No need to concern yourself since you don't need or understand the meaning . And definitely no need to offer a patronizing opinion advocating that since it is an unimportant and not understand metric to you therefor it must be worthless to everyone else.

 

[exxxviii]

Barometric altimeters are table stakes features in activity trackers and fitness devices. Have been for years. Apple Watch does not have one. Ergo, the Apple Watch cannot count stairs or give you real-time, accurate elevation information during workouts that athletes use and people use to compare to one another in activity challenges.

I believe that there may be a conflict in a water proof watch & the need to have access to air.

5 ATM Fitness devices have had barometric altimeters for at least 5 years.. probably longer. There is not a conflict between offering the barometric altimeter feature on a device also designed for underwater use.

 

[MaulRx]

Not to mention the iPhone 7 is also waterproof and has a barometer.

 

[BarracksSi]

Barometric altimeters are table stakes features in activity trackers and fitness devices. Have been for years. Apple Watch does not have one. Ergo, the Apple Watch cannot count stairs or give you real-time, accurate elevation information during workouts that athletes use and people use to compare to one another in activity challenges.

So... Showing off for others, like I said.

5 ATM Fitness devices have had barometric altimeters for at least 5 years.. probably longer. There is not a conflict between offering the barometric altimeter feature on a device also designed for underwater use.

+1 for that; we can buy G-Shocks with altimeters, too. Got a friend who has a Tissot with a touch-sensitive crystal, thermometer, and altimeter.

 

[ronm99]

So... Showing off for others, like I said.

If you want to get snarky about it, then there is no point having fitness trackers at all. What is the point of measuring how far you run, how many calories you burn, etc. ... Just to show off to others?

I personally like having a fitness tracker because it measures how much exercise I do, and it lets me know what progress I'm making, and it also incentivizes me to beat what I did yesterday. The GPS / distance measure is the most important one, but if you are running on hilly trails, the altitude you climb is also an important measure of how much work you did.

 

[Vihzel]

Still in iOS 9 here, so I don't have that screen but...

View attachment 649990

That's so interesting. For some reason, I can't get the same thing.

http://imgur.com/1iBHTwS
http://imgur.com/hMXGlBq

 

[nicho]

That's so interesting. For some reason, I can't get the same thing.

http://imgur.com/1iBHTwS
http://imgur.com/hMXGlBq

i don't know *why* it's there, it must be some form of bug, but the fact is it's there doing nothing but taking up space. hopefully some updates to iOS10 / watchOS 3 will sort it.

 

[Julien]

So... Showing off for others, like I said.....

Despite the condescending and borderline trolling attitude I will give you a plausible answer and a specific use case for me.

Also anything that makes fitness more interesting or accessible is a 100% positive gain since it actually improves the quality of life, increases life expectancy, improves worker productivity and lowers medical costs. Now you can sit on the couch and mock us all you want but doing this (sedentary life style) has its health related consequences. So instead you should get up and join us.

My main use of elevation data is for analyzing running pace. I consider a <8 minute mile (flat) to be my ideal over distances. So if I run 8 miles (flat) my time must be <1:04:00 to be a successful run (I like to do a 7:29 or <59.59 - 8 miles). That is of course easy to monitor since all I need to know is pace. However I live in a hilly area so I need to understand my pace vs elevation to know if I’m meeting my goals. In general if I run 8 miles in <1:12:00 (<9 minute miles) and have an elevation gain of about 800’ (100” or a 10 story building climb per mile) my run will be a successful.

There are many, many other ways to use elevation data in comparing other metrics that change going up or down a hill like vertical oscillation, stride length, HR, cadence, ground contact time, etc. Biking has it’s own metrics and uses too like power meter, RPM’s, perceived exertion, etc. You know unimportant (to you) athletic stuff.

 

[Phil A.]

I recently changed my phone to an SE (which doesn't have an altimeter either) and flights climbed has been at zero ever since (and, as other have said, the watch doesn't show as a source for flights climbed in iOS 10).

However, I've not noticed any difference in elevation measurements within Runtastic (which uses GPS for elevation measurements) since getting rid of my 6S+, so I'm guessing that Runtastic at least doesn't use the Altimeter even if it's available

 

[rockyromero]

Anything that make fitness more interesting is a 100% positive gain since it actually improves the quality of life, increases life expectancy, improves worker productivity and lowers medical costs. Now you can sit on the couch and mock us all you want but it has its consequences. So instead you should get up and join us.

I'm impressed and overwhelmed with the detailed graphs that you show.

How can I obtain the same tracking?

➰

 

[exxxviii]

So... Showing off for others, like I said.

I guess it depends on your worldview. If you love yourself, then it probably would be used for showing off. If you love your friends, then it could be used for motivation and encouragement.

 

[Julien]

I'm impressed and overwhelmed with the detailed graphs that you show.

How can I obtain the same tracking?

➰

You will need to use a Garmin (too).

 

[dyn]

@BarracksSi: When I did cardio-fitness (where your heart rate has to be within a certain range which is different for each person) I wasn't allowed to use all the equipment for the simple reason that my heart rate would be all over the place and that isn't healthy at all. Now, if I would have lived in a country that isn't as flat as a vinyl record then having an altimeter would have been a great value when going for bike rides because I have much more data to make a much more accurate conclusion such as: "I should not take this road again because my heart rate goes beyond the range".

I can imagine that for people who are into road bicycle racing (think Tour de France) knowing the various altitudes is key. Some of the riders are sprinters, some are skilled in climbing and so on. The climbers actually need to train on this. There is also this event to collect money for cancer research where amateurs are riding up a mountain (the Mont Ventoux to be precise). That requires a lot of training. You have to start at the base so first practice for getting over a hill, then a higher hill and so on. In those cases it is nice to see your progress and for that you do need to see the various altitudes and the corresponding data. It tells you if you are doing things the right or the wrong way and where you need to work on.

Besides that, there are people who use it for navigation. Having a compass as well as a barometer is just very nice to have in those cases.

It helps a great deal if you actually have ever done anything that is a physical sport...

 

[BarracksSi]

TL;DR: Quit whining about your gear and just go work.

It helps a great deal if you actually have ever done anything that is a physical sport...

You say this like I've never done anything physical.

I'll say this: If you don't feel like you're gonna puke and die, you can go harder.

I went through a data-collecting phase myself. I wore my Garmin 410 for everything -- yoga, interval workouts, weights, bike rides, Tabatas, long jogs, fartlek runs, physical fitness tests, doing Shaun T home videos with my wife… just about every workout session when I could wear my Garmin.

After a couple years of this, I realized that the data was telling me what I already knew: if I expended more effort, my body worked harder. Oh wow, on my bike, I got 195 bpm climbing the hill by the Capitol. Great, I thought, now I have a number to attach to my pain. I didn't bother to watch my HR after that.

*yawn*

I looked at all the data I had uploaded to Garmin Connect, and I just didn't care about it anymore. The coolest thing I had done was on a jog when I spelled out a big "M-O-M" via GPS in the park on Mother's Day. What am I going to do with it now? Print it out and stick it on the refrigerator? Meh. Sure, there's a few 100km bike rides, but I only remember feeling like I wanted to get home.

If you're going to get all bent out of shape about what your gadgets can or can't do, step back and think about why you're trying to collect the data in the first place. Is it vanity? Is it just geeking out with stats? Are you tweeting your new PB every week?

I'll partially concede that it's nice for motivating friends and family (especially under the banner of, "If he can run a 5k, maybe I can, too"), but that's if you can't get together to participate. It sure is a lot more fun to do these things together, on the same day in the same place. Get to know your neighbors and join a run club or group bike ride or something.

I get why people think they need more data. Maybe you're calculating your nutrition needs and planning what to take in your goodie bag (hint: if you're going for less than an hour, you don't need to take anything). Maybe you're checking the gearing on your bike (or maybe you just need to climb more). Maybe you're checking your exertion in the weight room (or maybe you should do more pull-ups).

I'm glad these little devices can get people off the couch. But, just HTFU and go run. Leave your electronic doodads at home for a month.

 

[dyn]

That sentence in my reply was there intentionally because that's exactly how you responded to everyone else here. Now you know how that comes across.

The entire point of having this data is to stay within your own physical limits. It prevents overheating (which can cause death, especially on hot days), overtraining, injuries, maximises your exercise(s) but most of all keeps you healthy. Just because you don't feel like dying and you're not puking doesn't mean you should go harder.

There are also many other sports besides running where you'd want/need such data. It's even beneficial for those doing physiotherapy or are recovering from something. Try to imagine what sports there are and how they could benefit from technology as this, helps better than how you responded here.

 

[BarracksSi]

The entire point of having this data is to stay within your own physical limits.

Lord knows how we managed to exercise within our limits before all these gadgets hit the market.

My point is, it's not worth the stress to get worked up about what "features" someone thinks should to be included but, because of their ever-increasing expectations (my parents would use the word "spoiled"), are now somehow "missing." Missing from what? Ten years ago, GPS was only usable in the car, and now that it's on on your wrist, it's still not enough?

You aren't building fitness trackers. This isn't something you can control unless you can make them yourself. Don't worry about what you can't change. Accept what's available, and instead of wasting energy whining and complaining, get out there and exercise.

 

[dyn]

Because previously we didn't need to exercise. Over the course of years we went from a very active life to inactive lives (desk jobs and such) so we now have to

Btw, lots of the exercises that we need these fitness features for actually didn't exist back then because, well, we didn't have the equipment to do them. Back then we also didn't push ourselves over the limit because we did not care about things like performance. Our current society does and people need tools to prevent them from going too far.

Besides, there is absolutely no point in comparing to the old days because we don't live in the past nor the future. We live in the now.

 

[BarracksSi]

Because previously we didn't need to exercise. Over the course of years we went from a very active life to inactive lives (desk jobs and such) so we now have to

Btw, lots of the exercises that we need these fitness features for actually didn't exist back then because, well, we didn't have the equipment to do them. Back then we also didn't push ourselves over the limit because we did not care about things like performance. Our current society does and people need tools to prevent them from going too far.

Besides, there is absolutely no point in comparing to the old days because we don't live in the past nor the future. We live in the now.

Heh. No, they don't need tools to know when they feel like crap and need to slow down.

Pick up heavy things and put them down. Go run. Stretch and massage. Yoga. That's it.

Not many "tools" needed to work out. Not nearly as many as companies have been marketing in search of profits. All those repetitive-motion machines designed to "isolate" certain muscles need to be hauled off for scrap metal. [separate rant]

 

[grue]

I'm still looking for confirmation on this myself. I'm developing an app right now that will be effectively useless if there's no barometer (using an iPhone 6s+ for functional testing now, pending receipt of my watch). Hopefully it's something that didn't get mentioned, but is present.

 

[lordofthereef]

Lord knows how we managed to exercise within our limits before all these gadgets hit the market.

Not sure what changed here. In my limited time in the subforum, you seemed like the more grounded regular. Now you are going out of your way to defend your personal stance that data collection is a pointless waste of time.

But to answer your question, we got along fine without a lot of things. When I was a kid, the coolest tech out was a nintendo. We didn't have internet. A dvr was a tape recorder. And you had to rewind your videos and music you were watching to and listening to. I will never understand the argument that we "got along fine" without this or that, because frankly, humanity endured millenia without hardly anything we have today...

Aside from a fitbit, I haven't really had anything collecting data, and even that all happened within less than half a year. Still, between the years 2010 and 2012 I managed to lose about 50 pounds, get far more active than I have ever been, and want to continue doing that. Most of us aren't ever going to the olympics. We aren't ever going to perform our sport of choice professionally. What is neat and rewarding is to look at where you were last month or last year and have tangible data points to look at.

 

[BarracksSi]

Not sure what changed here. In my limited time in the subforum, you seemed like the more grounded regular. Now you are going out of your way to defend your personal stance that data collection is a pointless waste of time.

I think what's getting on my nerves is all the juvenile bitching and moaning about why doesn't a smartwatch have this-or-that feature.

A smartwatch, remember. It's like that bit from Louis C.K. -- everything's amazing, but nobody's happy. People have the horsepower of an iPhone on their wrist and they're still going to stamp their feet like a four-year-old who's not getting ice cream?

When I got on this forum, it seemed like an active one to get more info about the Watch I had just bought. At times, it's been good.

But, holy crap. What a bunch of crybabies.

This is a caustic environment, all this useless complaining. People get swept up in the mob and just pile on, talking about all the things they don't like and all the objects they wish they had.

It's disguised as "venting", maybe, but no matter how you slice it, no matter how funny you are as you do it, it's still just bitching.

 

[exxxviii]

Here's an alternative view. I used my Garmin for a few weeks as a 24/7 activity tracker. It was the first time I have worn a fully functional tracker. Prior to that, the most advanced tracker I used was a Fitbit Zip, which is pretty basic. (My family has other Fitbit's but I did not have first-hand use.) My feelings after a few days were a bit of anger and frustration at Apple for releasing such a crappy activity tracker in the AW. I had already gotten over the frustration that the AW is a mediocre fitness device. People coming from another activity tracker will be shocked at how bad the AW is at activity tracking.

So, it is not bitching or crying when I am ticked that I will be buying either a Garmin or Fitbit activity tracker to wear on my other wrist, along with my AW, because the AW is so bad at activity tracking. This should be easy, and Apple whiffed it. I hope that this forums like these draw attention to that, and maybe Apple catches wind, and maybe in wOS4 or wOS5, Apple invests a little more in app and web development to solve the cruddy activity tracker they are selling.

I think people are starting to see the AW for what it is, and that is coming out in threads like these.

 

[lordofthereef]

I think what's getting on my nerves is all the juvenile bitching and moaning about why doesn't a smartwatch have this-or-that feature.

A smartwatch, remember. It's like that bit from Louis C.K. -- everything's amazing, but nobody's happy. People have the horsepower of an iPhone on their wrist and they're still going to stamp their feet like a four-year-old who's not getting ice cream?

When I got on this forum, it seemed like an active one to get more info about the Watch I had just bought. At times, it's been good.

But, holy crap. What a bunch of crybabies.

This is a caustic environment, all this useless complaining. People get swept up in the mob and just pile on, talking about all the things they don't like and all the objects they wish they had.

It's disguised as "venting", maybe, but no matter how you slice it, no matter how funny you are as you do it, it's still just bitching.

Ignore works miracles for people constantly under your skin. Best advice I can give. Telling people to stop botching is like asking the sun to stop shining. Won't happen. And ultimately you're the one wasting the most time with it.

For what it's worth, the most bitching I see in this thread here is from you. Sorry to say. Obviously we have different views about this.

 

[BarracksSi]

Ignore works miracles for people constantly under your skin. Best advice I can give. Telling people to stop botching is like asking the sun to stop shining. Won't happen. And ultimately you're the one wasting the most time with it.

For what it's worth, the most bitching I see in this thread here is from you. Sorry to say. Obviously we have different views about this.

Yeah, it's difficult to say what I wanted to say without coming off like that.

Four or five members posted complaints ("it's enough of a disappointment, I won't be upgrading", "glaring omission", and "it's a bummer Apple didn't do this", etc), then the rest was just dinking around, trying to infer the watch's sensors by looking at Health data.

I guess I'm thinking of other threads, too, like the much more idiotic idea of having the AW measure blood pressure, or complaining that it doesn't include sleep tracking as a "core feature" (whatever that means) while multiple sleep tracking apps are already available. It's insane how spoiled this group is.

 

[Julien]

...I guess I'm thinking of other threads, too, like the much more idiotic idea of having the AW measure blood pressure, or complaining that it doesn't include sleep tracking as a "core feature" (whatever that means) while multiple sleep tracking apps are already available. It's insane how spoiled this group is.

The problem is features you use and consider useful are smart and intuitive. However features others use or want that you don't show ignorance and are pretentious. Don't be so dismissive and patronizing because something doesn't fit your use case. I don't swim but 100% support the inclusion of swimming metrics so those that do can benefits in what every way they chose. And I'm not going to judge people negatively for it. You should try and be more tolerant and less judgmental.

Now get off my lawn.