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Does Apple Have a Scott Forstall a problem? [MERGED]

Scott Forstall is awful, clearly all he knows are cool cute little gimmick features. Seriously, you're going to have your Maps team do Flyover which is a gimmick feature over usable features? Got to be kidding me. Every time I see that guy on stage I'm just waiting for him to show off the new, terrible, useless features they are implementing this time.

P.S. I love Apple products and I only use Apple, but I'm not going to kiss a$$ if they punch me in the face, like some people. Simple fact is, they really offer nothing new year after year on iOS, it is just sad.
 
mKTank said:
Now that was the mistake. It's very clearly a beta and they definitely should have labeled it as such.

There's no such thing as a flawless first iteration, especially when it comes to mapping solutions. Google Maps did indeed suck at one point too, but of course lets all forget that and whine about Forstall and predict Apple's imminent demise. I think a lot of people in this thread really need to stop setting unrealistically high standards and smarten up.
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Actually, about the maps being "new", I don't think expecting the same level that we had prior to iOS 6 is unrealisticly high. iOS 5 maps had a certain level of information and accuracy, it shouldn't have gone down.

Unrealisticly high expectations would be expecting iOS 6 maps to provide superior accuracy and breadth of information than iOS 5 did, while still changing the backend from Google to Apple. But asking for at least a comparable level of service than we had before is normal.

The thing is, we've always had a Forstall problem. He's probably the reason all the crap with iOS went down in the first place since version 1. Steve probably never told him no, and Tim won't tell no either. MMS, Copy/Paste, bad notifications, the Icon grid stale UI, lack of widgets, multi-tasking, background wallpapers not appearing until 4 versions in and now Maps...
 
Honest question. What are some of the functions that you can do on Android that are lacking on iOS? I haven't really used an Android phone so I don't really know.
 
Just read an article that said immediately after ios 6 was released apple maps usage was up at 35%. Now it's down to 4%. That's utterly embarrassing.

The biggest issue is what apple screwed up on is search and POI, none of the alternatives the told us to use in the App Store do that, certainly not as good as google.
 
BoxerGT2.5 said:
Just read an article that said immediately after ios 6 was released apple maps usage was up at 35%. Now it's down to 4%. That's utterly embarrassing.

The biggest issue is what apple screwed up on is search and POI, none of the alternatives the told us to use in the App Store do that, certainly not as good as google.
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Link?

Do you really think Apple would let that type of info out?


Edit: sorry...found it in about two seconds. One company tracking only 5,000 of THEIR users over the first week? Hardly a proper sampling of true map use.
 
Rogifan said:
Yes of course because everything Steve did was always right. :rolleyes:
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Maps would not have been allowed to go public in that state.

I do agree the "Steve would never have" posts are too common, but after the debacle that was Mobile Me, I stand by that very comment regarding Maps.

It reeks of a lack of someone with authority saying its not good enough for our customers.
 
One of the worst things about iOS 6 is the colored menu bars. It is simply terrible. I can't believe they did that haha. Also App Store search is just embarrassingly bad. I mean you search and it brings up nothing half the time, even if you get it close, you have to get it like 100% spelled correctly and exactly how the App is titled, it is awful, not to mention how it brings up results... In a horizontal infinite list? Really? HAHA WOW so terrible.
 
mKTank said:
Now that was the mistake. It's very clearly a beta and they definitely should have labeled it as such.

There's no such thing as a flawless first iteration, especially when it comes to mapping solutions. Google Maps did indeed suck at one point too, but of course lets all forget that and whine about Forstall and predict Apple's imminent demise. I think a lot of people in this thread really need to stop setting unrealistically high standards and smarten up.
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So you are intentionally missing the point.

IF Apple allowed both map apps to co-exist then you can do your little excuse-dance and point fingers like a child claiming "Well Google wasnt perfect at 1.0 either". But the reason people are so down on Apple is because a solution already existed and Apple removed it entirely in favor of a product that is far from being as good. And that is a bad thing to do to your customers.
 
please remember the first iOS 1.0 and tell me how many people were actually complaining about mms, missing calls management settings etc etc. Now people are crying over a map app that you can easily bypass. I understand its a "selling" feature of iOS 6 for the iPhone 5 but come on.. real die hard fans bought the phone for the design first. iOS came after. People tend to forget that the iPhone was ment to work for the average joe and jenna ! all the iconic based menu is to facilitate the user experience and the only downside or fall i can see right now, is Apple trying to make iOS a complex not so user friendly system anymore !
the case of the newly "redesign" Apple store is an ex, where as some of you mentionned, really hard to find an app or browse the one that you wish to discover. Not even mentioning the keypad lag with letter E, R and U.
But all in all and after spending lots of time with a S2, Note and S3, iOS still deliver simplicity and good features. Apple must not rest or they'll fall like Blackberry !
 
I mean when you think about it, apple has released unfinished or beta products as HEADLINING features for the past 2 years. Siri was beta, Maps needs tons more work and Passbook has no vendors. And so I just feel it's a bit worrying that his dangerous precedent is being set- releasing unfinished products as selling points. One can't really stand by apple and say "it just works", which is what I proudly say to anyone wondering why I'm such a fan. It just feels like there isn't a push on the iOS front to get things right or move things forward correctly. The hardware, however, is still fantastic, the best out there, which makes the iOS stagnation all the more glaringly obvious.
 
appswipe said:
So you are intentionally missing the point.

IF Apple allowed both map apps to co-exist then you can do your little excuse-dance and point fingers like a child claiming "Well Google wasnt perfect at 1.0 either". But the reason people are so down on Apple is because a solution already existed and Apple removed it entirely in favor of a product that is far from being as good. And that is a bad thing to do to your customers.
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Exactly.
The fact that an OS upgrade takes away a core feature of the phone is a big screw up.
I pointed this out to many times to apple during iOS 6 betas, but I guess they didn't listen.

but really...it doesn't take a genius to realize that iOS 6 wasn't ready for the general public; I hope apple doesn't start falling apart without Steve.
 
JS82712 said:
Exactly.
The fact that an OS upgrade takes away a core feature of the phone is a big screw up.
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I think in terms of inaccuracies, they made some errors, but in terms of changing the features such as bike paths or public transportation routes, etc. that was a decision they made purposely. Not to say they won't eventually put those back in but I don't see it as a screw up.
 
If these things bother you in a daily basis so much that you want somebody you've never met fired, tarred and feathered; then perhaps it's time to get a hobby or girlfriend/boyfriend, pet or anything that will take your mind off these horrible first world problems that keep you up at night. ;)
 
WeegieMac said:
Maps would not have been allowed to go public in that state.

I do agree the "Steve would never have" posts are too common, but after the debacle that was Mobile Me, I stand by that very comment regarding Maps.

It reeks of a lack of someone with authority saying its not good enough for our customers.
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Sure they would have. But Steve would have presented the rough edges better.
 
appswipe said:
But the reason people are so down on Apple is because a solution already existed and Apple removed it entirely in favor of a product that is far from being as good. And that is a bad thing to do to your customers.
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The solution that already existed is from a direct compete tor that is amplifying their attacks on Apple to gain market share. IMO the move by Apple was long overdue. Inaction was not the answer. I also don't see Google ready to submit an app to the app store. That's on them no Apple to insure it was ready. I have little Doubt Google was caught off guard. Where are they when it comes to providing that dual solution? Where are they in terms of modifying their web based access to insure it has greater functionality?
 
The problem is not Scott, it's that his responsibilities have stretched too far with the addition of the Geo team. They need another VP. I think Apple's intentions with Maps is directly reflected in the fact that it's just a part of the overall iOS team.


iseras said:
This is coming from a diehard apple fanboy- but in my opinion, iOS 6 is a total failure. It's main feature, "Maps" is a disaster. Its other main feature, "Passbook", isn't even really useable yet. And the rest of the updates are so minor you'd really have to dig deep to find what they were.

The responsibility for this failure is on Scott Forstall. He's heading iOS, and I bet he must be facing a lot of heat (or at least I hope). I love the iPhone 5- it's such a fantastic phone, but I truly feel it's been let down by this update. I wonder what's going on?! Did you guys see him during the iPhone 5 event? He almost looked bored and showed zero enthusiasm- all the while touting maps as the best maps ever, which clearly isn't the case. It's shameful.

In any case, things obviously need some shaking up on the iOS front, and it mostly falls down on Forstall's shoulders.
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pdqgp said:
I think in terms of inaccuracies, they made some errors, but in terms of changing the features such as bike paths or public transportation routes, etc. that was a decision they made purposely. Not to say they won't eventually put those back in but I don't see it as a screw up.
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I believe the intention with public transport etc is for 3rd party apps to hook in and provide this functionality. There are already apps available that provide routing for busses and tubes on the app store, and many are free.

I guess Apple just thought that 3rd parties can do a better job and provide more choice than just having it baked into the OS.
 
MrGimper said:
I believe the intention with public transport etc is for 3rd party apps to hook in and provide this functionality. There are already apps available that provide routing for busses and tubes on the app store, and many are free.

I guess Apple just thought that 3rd parties can do a better job and provide more choice than just having it baked into the OS.
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^^ I agree and have noted this but prepare for the onslaught of complainers that it's not integrated and thus their phone is a brick.
 
WeegieMac said:
Maps would not have been allowed to go public in that state.
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Like MobileMe ? Like Ping ?

Again folks : Apple probably didn't even know the state of Maps prior to WWDC 2012. Automated testing is the culprit, because it can't find errors only humans can. Apple probably thought their unit tests returning positive results were a good indication that the solution was ready.

Steve would've stamped it too. Steve would have sent out an open letter too. Steve wouldn't have done anything different, because nothing's been done different than in other situations where Apple faced the same problems.

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SpyderBite said:
If these things bother you in a daily basis so much that you want somebody you've never met fired, tarred and feathered; then perhaps it's time to get a hobby or girlfriend/boyfriend, pet or anything that will take your mind off these horrible first world problems that keep you up at night. ;)
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By that token, we should simply delete Macrumors. There's always something better to do/more important problems. What are you even doing on Macrumors ? Don't you have a pet, a hobby, a girlfriend/boyfriend or anything that will take your mind off of people discussing their first world problems ?

We live in the first world, that doesn't mean we shouldn't take care of our problems because people in the 3rd world or something have their own.

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ajvizzgamer101 said:
And replace him with who?
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Maybe it's time Apple looked into poaching Andy Rubin. The guy has over 13 years of experience building mobile OSes, had Steve Wozniak on the board of one of his startups and worked at Apple in the early 90s.
 
I seriously hope he's not next in line for CEO. I'll prefer Phil.
 
HazyCloud said:
Passbook has only been out a little over a week. Give it some time to develop. As for Maps, I personally haven't had any issues with it. If you are having issues, there's plenty of alternatives.
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Partners should have already been lined up. Waiting for a feature that's been touted in adverts on Apple.com and videos is completely inexcusable.
 
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