Back in the day China would lease soil to US so they could setup the Jeep car seat factory which would be recognized like part made in the US.
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Donald Trump Says Apple Won't Be Granted Tariff Relief on Mac Pro Parts Made in China: 'Make Them in The USA, No Tariffs!'
- Thread starter MacRumors
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
Back in the day China would lease soil to US so they could setup the Jeep car seat factory which would be recognized like part made in the US.
This. It' never going to work in US, it's done and gone. I always fondly remember the story about Mac Pro manufacturing in Texas where the owner of potential plant was doing errands himself to get enough screws. I don't want to stir crap here, but factories will never, ever return to US and honestly, they shouldn't.
I’m not sure how many Canadians are here on MacRumors, but I want to share my thoughts as both a Canadian and a Chinese person.
The tariffs imposed on Canada and China are deeply offensive to me, especially as a Chinese Canadian. I know there are people here who don’t have a favorable view of China, but as someone who loves both Canada and China, it’s hard to ignore the impact of these actions.
The constant talk about Canada becoming the 51st state of the U.S. is upsetting to many Canadians, and it’s certainly offensive to me. It’s not a joke to us.
Even though there’s a rare acknowledgment from Mr. Trump that these tariffs will hurt Americans too, the push for Canada to become part of the U.S. is still there. But let me make it clear: there is absolutely no chance that Canada will ever become the 51st state.
The tariffs imposed on Canada and China are deeply offensive to me, especially as a Chinese Canadian. I know there are people here who don’t have a favorable view of China, but as someone who loves both Canada and China, it’s hard to ignore the impact of these actions.
The constant talk about Canada becoming the 51st state of the U.S. is upsetting to many Canadians, and it’s certainly offensive to me. It’s not a joke to us.
Even though there’s a rare acknowledgment from Mr. Trump that these tariffs will hurt Americans too, the push for Canada to become part of the U.S. is still there. But let me make it clear: there is absolutely no chance that Canada will ever become the 51st state.
This is much more simple.
US is not an Empire because it is still an element of the British Empire and US flag clearly manifests its colonial status. Even if Canada becomes the 51st state it will mean that the British Empire became bigger.
Fleet is still being even if the British like to "verbalize" that they are a "vassal state" of the US.
You think you are some kind of expert thinking you know what Americans want? Google, Meta are also outsourcing all their jobs to Asia nowadays and Americans do want to keep their $800.000 per year jobs in the country. If this trend of outsourcing keeps up, everybody will be working at McDonalds no matter how "good you think are".
And OpenAI and Meta is paying people in Africa $12/hour for data preparation, for something that used to be a $25/hour job in the USA. So these won't be $7/hour jobs, considering companies spend more in Africa then that.
Yep. Like when Walmart and AT&T got all those massive tax breaks. They kept it all and also laid off staff.
Didnt macdonalds open a fully automated macdonalds in texas? which is effectively a giant vending machine.
Given their way, no one would be working at macdonalds
Yeah, look, guessing I know more about economics than you do... especially seems you just proved my point in your last comment. Companies paying African's $12/hr now instead of paying Americans $25/hr - You can bet your Capitalistic dollar that if those companies are forced to bring the jobs back to America, they will still be paying $12/hr, not $25... Or, they will pass the extra cost on to Americans.
My math is not wrong... The majority of Americans do not want to work in a factory for $7/hr - or do data entry for $12/hr. So whilst there's more than physical product manufacture at play, as you mention - the end result in the same. If you force the companies to employ Americans - either prices go up, or the level of lifestyle of Americans goes down.
In fact... Who'd want to be American anyway.
Hey Americans - come to Australia and get free healthcare and mostly free education. You'll love it here; promise. Especially if you're from California. Don't join Canada. (Sorry Canada) Come to Australia.
It wasn't fully automated from TFA, it sounds like they automated the ordering and final delivery with people prepping the food in the back.
I suspect the back of store will not be automated fully for a while, for several reasons:
1. If a robot stops working properly the whole line could shut down, whereas a human can easily intervene and keep things working while fixing the problem. Even something as simple as unclogging. ketchup nozzle is not easily automated.
2. Robots may be cheaper long run but have a higher up front costs and you can't just send some home on slow days, you are still paying for them.
3. Odd special orders would not be straightforward. A human can handle an order of fries with no salt by simply scooping up fries and putting them in a container and then salting the rest. A robotic system would need to be designed to allow dispensing before and after salt addition, as well as properly sequence the rest of the order to ensure everything is ready at the right time so you don't get hot fries but a cold burger.
Can it be done? Sure, with fewer staff no doubt; but it will be a while before the human element is gone.
A country cannot operate in 'open market' conditions and then be told to build products in the country to prevent tariffs because there will always be countries that will build the same products and do so cheaply and have those cheaper products along side more expensive home made products. The UK is a classic example of this. Successive governments opened up market conditions making it easy for companies from other countries to compete for business within the UK. Suddenly everything that was being made in the UK became expensive because companies in other countries around the world was producing the same products but at a fraction of the cost that the UK makers were doing. The UK government made the mistake of allowing all these cheap products into the UK with successive UK prime ministers saying 'competition will benefit the UK'. Actually all it did was cause UK companies to either shutdown or leave to setup in countries where it was cheaper to setup and manufacture their products. Now the UK no longer has an industry because it's all gone abroad or closed down and cheaper products brought in instead.
Therefore unless Trump stops competing products from entering the US there is no point in companies setting up in the US because what ever they produce will always be more expensive than what is being imported into the country and consumers seeing identical products are not going to buy the expensive one, they will always buy the cheaper one and if no one buys the expensive one the company goes out of business. Which is what has been happening in the US, companies closing down because they cannot compete with the cheap products that are coming from China and elsewhere.
Therefore unless Trump stops competing products from entering the US there is no point in companies setting up in the US because what ever they produce will always be more expensive than what is being imported into the country and consumers seeing identical products are not going to buy the expensive one, they will always buy the cheaper one and if no one buys the expensive one the company goes out of business. Which is what has been happening in the US, companies closing down because they cannot compete with the cheap products that are coming from China and elsewhere.
Which is the consumers own fault. They complain about US companies shutting down but buy the cheaper imported stuff. A long as consumers flock to the cheapest price the cycle will continue, and companies will move production out of China to the next lower cost country as China's costs increase.
Part of the goal of the tariffs is to foster more manufacturing and manufacturing jobs in the U.S. and the purchase of more U.S.-produced goods. One of the reasons many foreign companies have built or plan to build factories in the U.S. is to avoid tariffs and other trade restrictions. In the auto industry, for example, many foreign companies have factories in the U.S. including BMW, Honda, Hyundai, Kia, Mazda, Mercedes-Benz, Nissan, Toyota, and Volkswagen. It's unlikely as many foreign companies would build factories in the U.S. if not for tariffs.
Of course, there can also be other incentives for building factories in the U.S. Tariffs are, or should be, just one tool for fostering U.S. manufacturing and related jobs.
Any motivation for Tariffs is fully undermined by this wildly erratic behavior & disloyalty towards allies and friends
What businesses want and need more than anything is stability and relationships they can trust will be there -- especially in manufacturing endeavors which require massive capital investments on longer time horizons
Trump is nuking all of that
Last edited:
100% correct, we the consumers are to blame because we are always demanding cheaper prices which puts local companies out of business because they cannot produce cheaper products than their competitors can that are in other countries. Opening up a countries 'market' to allow companies to be more competitive has had the adverse effect of what governments wanted because they cannot compete with products that can be made cheaper in other countries. If Trump wants companies to build stuff in the US then he is going to have to stop cheaper products from coming into the US.
The problem with the Tarrifs Trump just put in place is that most auto companies (at least in the rust belt) are so integrated with their Canadian divisions that this is guaranteed to drive up prices... This is going to take time to disaggregate, just slapping on random tariffs without a plan to actually disentangle the industries is just ridiculous.
I think many of you are confusing what the traditional goals of tariffs are with what the goals of this administration are in using tariffs. Outside of the COVID spike, unemployment has been around 4% for years. Many low paying jobs aren't being filled. We haven't had a problem creating jobs in the US in more than a decade, especially under Democratic administrations.
Tariffs are currently being used as a cudgel to threaten other countries to do what this administration wants. Primarily to benefit already rich. See the recent deportation spat with Colombia as an example. Of course, immigration is another area where people blame immigrants for taking our jobs despite the fact that we have low unemployment and trouble filling low paying jobs.
This...
And erratically placing tariffs on them isn't going to help one bit
And erratically placing tariffs on them isn't going to help one bit
The purpose of tariffs can be multifaceted and U.S. tariffs against our "allies and friends" are nothing new. For example, prior to CUSFTA (with Canada) and later NAFTA (with Canada and Mexico), there were plenty of wide ranging tariffs between the U.S., Canada and Mexico. That didn't mean we were enemies or didn't have largely good relationships. The U.S. has historically had tariffs with plenty of allies and friends including EU countries, Japan, etc.
The hope is that trade negotiations can lead to desirable outcomes. For example, Clinton threatened to put a huge 100% tariff on luxury Japanese cars in the mid-1990s if Japan didn't make concessions such as allowing more American cars and car parts into Japan. Japan agreed to various U.S./Clinton requirements.
Trade tensions between friends and allies are nothing new but as the saying goes, "it's not personal, it's business."
Time will tell how the Trump tariff situation plays out.
My friend, the way Trump is going about this is not a "negotiation" and not only is not in the spirit of good relationships, it is actively damaging them, enormously, in real time.
It's erratic and irresponsible to act this way out of the blue
This is not adult behavior
Trump is a bully and an ignoramus .. if you think he's acting with a sense of controlled purpose towards an outcome, with respect, it feels a little naive about who the man is and what he actually "knows" about anything this complex
Well said re: Trump
...and this is probably accurate too
...and this is probably accurate too
Sure, but again, you're speaking about tariffs in general while ignoring the actions of the current administration. "Maybe something good will happen that this administration has not detailed in any way" isn't a real argument.
They claim Canada and Mexico are taking advantage of us (under the trade agreement that 45 negotiated.) In reality, it's about getting concessions on immigration, "to save American jobs" (that Americans do not want or need.) So why not fix our own immigration system? Because keeping it broken is how they keep getting elected.
BOLD: I whole heartily agree with this. For way to long the rest of the world has looked towards the US and it's administration to solve all of the worlds problems, it cannot. There are far to many corrupt governments, lazy government and incompetent governments in the world and Trump is basically saying enough is enough. Mexico fails to solve it's drug cartel problems, so does many other countries that have drug cartel problems. China, well we all know about China. The EU comes for criticism because many EU countries do not give enough funding towards a combined EU military force. The last time Trump was in power this was something he was not happy with and told the EU it needs to improve it's military capability meaning ALL EU countries are to meet it's quota on military spending which many do not.
In my opinion what Trump is doing it right. The US has told other countries they need to improve on various things and if they do the US will continue to support and help them BUT the countries must show that they are improving or trying to improve and when they don't the only thing the US has in it's arsenal to get these countries to do what is right is to hit them with tariffs because nothing else seems to work. Why should the US help or support countries that refuse to help themselves.