Epic Games, Spotify, and Tile Form 'Coalition for App Fairness' to 'Fight Back' Against Apple

[kingsapo]

Good for them. I can't understand why so many people are against this. More money is good for developers, and competition is good for consumers.

 

[Achiever]

Pictured: their first publicity photo.

 

[realdangerdan]

I don't disagree. But this won't solve the fundamental problem. Let's say that Apple reduces the tax to 10%. But how would that prevent a company like Epic from claiming that it's still too much? As long as they can spin a convincing story (having million of underage customers who are easily manipulated helps), the actual tax amount doesn't matter much.

Free market also applies. It isn’t a tax it’s a mark-up. If you don’t want to pay it, don’t sell in the market. However there’s definitely a monopoly discussion to be had, this isn’t an easy one, but the upper hand is firmly with Apple.

 

[Rogifan]

There are blatant mistruths on the App Fairness front page. For example, "For most purchases made within the App Store, Apple takes 30% of the purchase price. No other transaction fee — in any industry — comes close."

Let's list other companies that charge a similar fee for similar overhead: Google, Steam, Amazon, UberEats, Sony, Microsoft, Nintendo, GrubHub, eBay+PayPal, and the list goes on, I am sure.

Another example, "If consumers want to use a modern mobile device, Apple levies a tax that no one can avoid. No competition, no options, no recourse."

Unless the Apple tax now extends to the billions of Android phones out there, this is ridiculous on its face. While I content that Apple and it's ecosystem are superior (in large part due to the App Store and it's walled garden), to say that Android-based phones are not a modern mobile device and that Apple has no competition is being willfully ignorant, at best.

Well they used the words “transaction fee” which could mean the credit card processing. Honestly I think Apple should separate credit card processing/refunds from app review, App Store maintenance, rent seeking. And for those that choose to use their own payment system they don’t pay for that component.

Maybe these companies that founded this self-serving coalition ought to invent their own phone and own ecosystem? If they don't like the T&C let leave and lose those lucrative $$$.

I’m sorry but this is a really lazy argument. So anyone that has an issue with a big tech company should make their own phone, start their own social media network, their own search engine? And big tech companies can never be in the wrong? Absurd.

 

[Stevez67]

AT&T, Verizon and T-mobile should start asking Apple for 30% of their revenue, you would be OK with that right? I mean, they build it and Apple is leeching of them.

Except, ISPs customers are the ones who buy the Apple devices. No devices, no customers for ISPs. And the ISPs don't make devices.

 

[0924487]

Proton mail is behind this too? I'm really surprised

 

[majordude]

Dear coalition, YOU set the sale price, Apple takes 30% of that. If you want more money, RAISE the price of your app!

 

[Mescagnus]

Hahahahaha. So funny. Can't wait for Apple to crush these morons and put them out of business.

I think that with this course of action, the companies in the coalition will destroy themselves.

 

[ginkobiloba]

Epic and Spotify leading this "coalition" is straight out of a comedy. Spotify, universally panned for its continous efforts to pay artists as little as possible, including creating fake artists on its playlists so that 100% of revenues goes directly to them, is complaining about fees from another company that is giving far more than they really deserve.

Hilarious. 😂

 

[Mescagnus]

Well, not Spotify for sure, it's still the one leading the streaming music race. Not that Apple would mind ousting the competition from its platform, but I'm sure the users would mind plenty.

Leading, but not profitable. So not a sustainable business.

 

[PickUrPoison]

If all major apps go into the coalition and pull theirs, you think it's go well for Apple?

They’re free to pull their apps 🤷‍♂️
Number that will: zero.

 

[zackkitzmiller]

That's one bitter, miserable bunch of people. I bet their parties are *such* fun!

Having gone to a Spotify HQ party.. Yes. They are quite fun.

 

[leman]

Free market also applies. It isn’t a tax it’s a mark-up. If you don’t want to pay it, don’t sell in the market. However there’s definitely a monopoly discussion to be had, this isn’t an easy one, but the upper hand is firmly with Apple.

Exactly. Marketplaces that make money by charging the seller are a common business model. Why Apple is the one to get the most backlash from it is really beyond me.

 

[Rogifan]

I think that the 30% tax is their biggest issue. I have always thought it was too much. Surely at even 15%-20% Apple would still make a ton of money.

Amusing how Apple is lauded for thinking different and not doing what everyone else does yet when this discussion comes up the first thing apologists say is well everyone else charges 30%. And what consumers pay for devices never seems to come up in the discussion. An iPhone 11 Pro starts at $999. Are we really to believe that NONE of the retail price of an iPhone goes towards supporting the App Store? Seriously?

God forbid Apple take a leadership position here and make changes that would get regulators off their backs. I guarantee you any changes the EU or US government make will be way worse than what Apple could do that would still make them money and be good for consumers and developers alike.

 

[PlayUltimate]

Wouldn't it be fully within Apple's rights to completely shut down the app store and just create and publish any apps their customers might need?

I have posited a similar contention: Apple shuts down the App Store completely and signs exclusive deals with specific app developers that become Apple-branded (Costco brands, Trader Joes) or buys the developer outright/signs to a consignment deal. There is no way that Apple will allow their App Store to be completely open. IMO, the current App Store is better than any software distribution option that previously existed. (Marketing = free disks with computer mags.)

 

[ruka.snow]

Coalition for GIVE US MORE MONEY

 

[Rogifan]

Hypocritical to say the least. Should be free. That’s what they think they should pay Apple

Well that’s what Netflix pays Apple. And Facebook, Instagram and any other app that doesn’t have to use IAP. Why should Netflix not have to use Apple’s IAP by Epic does?

 

[Mescagnus]

Excellent. Now I have a handy list of companies not to spend my money on

I'm closing a Spotify account because of this, too, and switching to Apple One. The Houdini App makes transferring playlists an easy breeze.

Never had any Epic games, so I couldn't care less about Epic Tim's crusade. Never had any Tiles either, but I will get a bunch of AirTags.

 

[Kmad86]

I think Spotify is a better option than Apple Music and I have been with them since day one. However, today that ended.

They’re all greedy, hard to say apple is the bad guy here, and trying to tell apple what they should charge when companies like Epic sell digital dances and clothes...

 

[Unregistered 4U]

This.... this is the coalition they put together? Like, they waited until now because they felt they finally had the HEAVY HITTERS they were looking for?

Less like the Legion of Doom, more like the Ministry of Pain.

 

[Polaroid]

Dear coalition, YOU set the sale price, Apple takes 30% of that. If you want more money, RAISE the price of your app!

Exactly, Youtube do this, £15 premium via in app and if you spay via their website it’s £11. You get a choice and they follow rules they agreed to.

 

[aid]

Exactly, Apple has spent BILLIONS and many years developing and producing an Eco system that is safe, secure and comprehensive. Should they NOT be paid for their work? If you don't like it, there is another eco system down the street to go play on (Android, or Windows mobile). Or better yet, spend the time and money and build your own eco system, then you can do anything you want on it.

For this, I will NEVER buy another EPIC product again, ever.

Yes, Apple should be paid for their work - but they shouldn't be paid for the work of others.

Really, there should be a charge levied by Apple (or Google) for the distribution of the app itself - a charge that reflects the work that Apple/Gogole are actually performing – not a blanket 30% charge on whatever product or service is provided through the App Store.

Contrast with a real physical market – the market owner doesn't take a percentage of a stores takings; instead they charge a rent for each stall; with larger more prominent stalls attracting a higher rent.

Apple should be paid for what they deliver; not what the App developer delivers.

 

[Kmad86]

And tile is just mad because it’s likely a better product is about to compete with them.

 

[willyx]

So Apple should drop the 30% to 27-28% and let other credit card processors compete for the 2-3% payment processing fees?

Apple has the volume to offer very competitive rates for payment processing, good luck trying to undercut them.

No, Apple should compete on charging for payments what other platforms do. 30% is for payment processing.

 

[dguisinger]

That reminds me, must delete epic games account... done! Haven’t touched it in ages, only had free games, didn’t give any of my real info because I didn’t trust them. their store didn’t do developers any good from my lack of purchasing. Spent lots more in Apple App Store.

That showed them