You watch that video and you don't know whether to laugh or cry.
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Gen 3 butterfly keyboard
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You watch that video and you don't know whether to laugh or cry.
I've been using computers for decades and have never ever heard of keyboards failing like this. What's even worse it seems Apple is going to take literally years just meet the same level of reliability the previous design once offered.
Apple should just beef up the mechanism and make the dam notebook a fraction thicker. Apple's obsession with being the thinnest is little more than an exercise in diminishing returns now.
People can say what they like about other brands, equally I seriously doubt the reliability of the keyboard is factor in their purchasing decision.
At this point in time one can only conclude that Apple is deliberately building in obsolescence into it's products, which removes much of the perceived value...
Q-6
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As someone who studied material science in uni, I suspect most of their woes could be fixed by using thicker and stiffer metal domes.
However, in this case the keyboard would likely become too stiff for normal typing.
However, in this case the keyboard would likely become too stiff for normal typing.
So did I, equally business is business, and purchasing a notebook for professional use that is inherently flawed make zero sense...
Q-6
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It would also likely impact the already overly fragile Butterfly mechanism. Until mass manufacturing process can catch up, the keyboard is likely to remain inherently flawed due to a poorly executed design, coupled with inadequate testing.
Q-6
Given it’s only depressing a maximum of 0.5mm there probably just isn’t enough rebound force. They could keep the butterfly mechanism and increase travel to 0.75-1.0mm and that would probably make all the difference for a minimal trade off in depth. Would allow a bit more key dampening for more comfortable strokes too.
Yes, just 1mm would do - and Apple is failing to realize this. Why don't they research these forums where people are giving them the exact feedback they need?
I'm pretty sure they have all the feedback they need. They're just not ready to release the improved design because I suspect it would require a complete chassis redesign or at least major changes to their tooling.
If you look at Apple's historical product lineup, they usually come up with a new chassis every 4-5 years. They're probably going to keep the current extremely shallow butterfly keyboard untiil the next generation of MBPs is ready to ship. Then they will introduce a new keyboard with longer key travel as one of its major selling poiints
Edit: those "i"s are driving me crazy. That's why I don't want to buy another laptop with a butterfly keyboard.
If you look at Apple's historical product lineup, they usually come up with a new chassis every 4-5 years. They're probably going to keep the current extremely shallow butterfly keyboard untiil the next generation of MBPs is ready to ship. Then they will introduce a new keyboard with longer key travel as one of its major selling poiints
Edit: those "i"s are driving me crazy. That's why I don't want to buy another laptop with a butterfly keyboard.
We can but hope!I'm pretty sure they have all the feedback they need. They're just not ready to release the improved design because I suspect it would require a complete chassis redesign or at least major changes to their tooling.
If you look at Apple's historical product lineup, they usually come up with a new chassis every 4-5 years. They're probably going to keep the current extremely shallow butterfly keyboard untiil the next generation of MBPs is ready to ship. Then they will introduce a new keyboard with longer key travel as one of its major selling poiints
Edit: those "i"s are driving me crazy. That's why I don't want to buy another laptop with a butterfly keyboard.
Be aware: Earlier or later you will get these problems for sure (bet?) – maybe at the wrong place at the wrong time when you need your MBP urgently...
Truth be told, though, if I didn't use macOS only apps, or simply Mac apps I paid for already I would now be brainwashing myself into loving Windows. And it might still happen, because a similarly specced Windows laptop would cost me €1000 less, and that is a LOT of money to spend on Win software
This would be the worst deal possible
Well barked, thumb up!
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...because this is not the only problem this butterfly mechanism is creating – the other kind of typing failure (no response) are cause by dust and dirt coming inside (earlier or later even with this membrane) and other electronical reasons, too.
A redesign is indispensable !
Apple should jump
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I test drove the MBA and MB. Its performance doesn't measure up to the MBP or iPad Pros. MBPs are not in-scope due to the butterfly keyboard issues.
I also test drove some Windows machines; while the hardware was nice, Win 10's organization/layout is cumbersome and and not intuitive.
I did look at some Chromebooks and a Pixelbook but I don't trust Google with my information. In addition, the hardware specs weren't impressive.
I ended up ordering the new iPad 12.9 with a keyboard and Apple Pencil. For my use case, this fits the best.
I also test drove some Windows machines; while the hardware was nice, Win 10's organization/layout is cumbersome and and not intuitive.
I did look at some Chromebooks and a Pixelbook but I don't trust Google with my information. In addition, the hardware specs weren't impressive.
I ended up ordering the new iPad 12.9 with a keyboard and Apple Pencil. For my use case, this fits the best.
Is 12" MacBook less problematic than the 13" MBP?
If it is, this implies that heat is indeed a major factor when it comes to butterfly keyboard failures.
If it is, this implies that heat is indeed a major factor when it comes to butterfly keyboard failures.
No, MB is the same mess as with MBP and new MBA 2018
That is my understanding too.
Listening to the financial results conference call for Q4 2018, I noticed that the latest survey of US consumers from 451 Research indicates customer satisfaction ratings of 98% for the iPhone X, 8 and 8 Plus combined.
They also mentioned that the most recent consumer survey measured iPad customer satisfaction ratings of 96% for both the iPad and iPad Pro.
Strangely, there was no mention of the customer satisfaction ratings for the Mac line!
https://451research.com
They also mentioned that the most recent consumer survey measured iPad customer satisfaction ratings of 96% for both the iPad and iPad Pro.
Strangely, there was no mention of the customer satisfaction ratings for the Mac line!
https://451research.com
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That may also correspond to this decision as well...
Apple won’t disclose how many devices it sold, starting next year
http://a.msn.com/01/en-us/BBPfmUq?ocid=se
I understand its their business and their decision but I do find it a tad shady and unhelpful to consumers and stock holders alike.
I finally got my 15inch MBP and I dont like the keyboard :-( The only hope now is it wont give up on me. But it seems to be designed with such tight tolerances that we need a lot of hope. A keyboard undergoes lot of abuse and dust/dirt during its lifetime, and needs to be sufficiently rugged to withstand such environment. Sadly, apple has forgotten basic common sense when they decided to put these fragile keyboards.
Last night I was reading about others' problems with this keyboard. Some people mentioned that the Canned Air (TM) and slamming keys were enough to "fix" it. So I applied quite some TLC to the space bar.
After it registered twice four times today again... I found a skin for Windows that makes it look almost like macOS. Grinding my teeth, I will buy a Windows license for Scrivener or install macOS in VirtualBox (Scrivener isn't exactly CPU-intensive). Adobe CC isn't platform-specific. As for touch bar, I've been laughed at in another thread for saying this, but I will miss it – I configured it with BTT exactly how I wanted it.
Yes, Win 10 October update killed a lot of computers including *deleting their Documents folders*. Yes, I think File Explorer looks gross. No, I can't afford to own a laptop that might require repair at any random moment because keyboard will stop working.
I wrote to Apple Executive Relations again, but truth is, there's very little they can do for me bar perhaps giving me a free Macbook Air. Right now Apple no longer produces any portable computer that I would trust when it comes to typing a lot, and I am not spending 1000 euros on 2017 Air when for 2000 I can have a Yoga C930 convertible with 4k screen, i7 CPU, 16 GB RAM, upgradeable 1 TB SSD, 2x Thunderbolt 3 to use all the USB-C I bought for the Macbook Pro (har har). I know I will spend a lot of time fighting Windows, probably discover that I missed 10 macOS apps that are totally necessary for my productivity, etc. But I won't constantly worry that I'll be on a deadline and right that moment "E" will stop registering altogether.
On the plus side, I won't spend much time on Macforums, and that will definitely increase my productivity, perhaps saving me almost enough time to fight Windows' bugs!
After it registered twice four times today again... I found a skin for Windows that makes it look almost like macOS. Grinding my teeth, I will buy a Windows license for Scrivener or install macOS in VirtualBox (Scrivener isn't exactly CPU-intensive). Adobe CC isn't platform-specific. As for touch bar, I've been laughed at in another thread for saying this, but I will miss it – I configured it with BTT exactly how I wanted it.
Yes, Win 10 October update killed a lot of computers including *deleting their Documents folders*. Yes, I think File Explorer looks gross. No, I can't afford to own a laptop that might require repair at any random moment because keyboard will stop working.
I wrote to Apple Executive Relations again, but truth is, there's very little they can do for me bar perhaps giving me a free Macbook Air. Right now Apple no longer produces any portable computer that I would trust when it comes to typing a lot, and I am not spending 1000 euros on 2017 Air when for 2000 I can have a Yoga C930 convertible with 4k screen, i7 CPU, 16 GB RAM, upgradeable 1 TB SSD, 2x Thunderbolt 3 to use all the USB-C I bought for the Macbook Pro (har har). I know I will spend a lot of time fighting Windows, probably discover that I missed 10 macOS apps that are totally necessary for my productivity, etc. But I won't constantly worry that I'll be on a deadline and right that moment "E" will stop registering altogether.
On the plus side, I won't spend much time on Macforums, and that will definitely increase my productivity, perhaps saving me almost enough time to fight Windows' bugs!
This may give insight as to why they made that decision: https://iphone.appleinsider.com/art...dly-wrong-in-guessing-apples-q4-mac-shipments
Looks like other companies aren’t providing as much information as Apple are, and some analysts are apparently misusing the data they provided, making Apple appear worse than they actually are.
See you on the Darkside
W10 takes more setting up, after that you can just forget it about and let the OS work in the background.Q-6
Thanks, but will Apple's move to not report unit sales, change what Gartner and IDC report? I think the issue may be that we'll only have those highly inaccurate figures to go on. I was unaware that others like Dell or HP don't report those figures.
That's the decision that I ultimately came to as well. I just don't trust these new machines for the long haul. Additionally, I feel that once they are out of warranty that an expensive repair is on the horizon. I don't have the confidence I once did in Apple to provide a dependable and relatively trouble-free experience. The "it just works" mantra seems to have been set aside for "It's just thinner."
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Either way it looks like investors have taken fright - Apple is officially no longer a $1T company... personally I’d welcome Wall Street shifting their attention and moving onto the next big thing and hopefully leaving Apple under less pressure to wring every last penny out of their customers
This is exactly it. The whole point of me buying this MBP was to make it my only computer and use it for years. It's not going to happen, and that's just it.
No. You had better at least have a Plan B computer because you will probably be sending it off for several weeks waiting for a top case replacement at some point. If it isn't your only computer, you can work around that. If it is, that's a problem.