Gen 3 butterfly keyboard

[Queen6]

First Mac and 1 week in use, 2017 NTB, already occasionally keys little bit stuck. My solution is to keep the Mac upside down and blow some air between the keys, which 'solves' the problem. As more as I am reading about this it seems like the 3rd gen is even worse, since it will be impossible to blow debris out because of the condom thing.

But seriously, how is is possible to release a product and not even test something simple as the keyboard?? Does Apple test MacBooks only in clean rooms?

Simple inadequate qualification and greed, coupled with corporate arrogance that Apple can do no wrong, when in reality Apple is as fallible as any other, if not more so these days...

Only thing Apple expects it the customer's to be "lined up" money in hand when a new product launches, and it's ever more showing it's hand.

Q-6
[doublepost=1543750336][/doublepost]

Testing? Waste of money !

Long as it looks nice and thinner, that's all that really matters. Performance and reliability Mac users need not worry about such trivia, be assured Apple will **** it up one way or the other so no need to worry

Q-6

 

[natif09]

When I picked up my laptop - I've asked the guy if its the same type of keyboard, he replied "not, its a newer version like in 2018 model".

From the personal experience - it feels different to type ("more softer") maybe because it's new.

Interesting and quite surprising !

 

[Jinx Mac]

I had 2015 15" and upgraded to 2018 15", I still like 2015 better than 2018 one, but what is a trillion dollar company going to do.... well whatever they want. It is no longer trying to get customers, they can do whatever they want and people will still buy. But I live in a dorm, and there is always dust and crumbs on my keyboard, and surprisingly only my w key repeats every now and then (barely noticeable). I kind of like the touch bar, but the keyboard hurts my hand now when i type for extended periods of time. If you are worried, I'd say buy a keyboard cover.

I bought a keyboard coveer when I gott my 5th MBP and as you can seee it didn't make onee iota of a differencee. What started with an occasional annoying 'e' keey sticking quickly tturrned intot thee "e,w,r,t,s and d" sticking and has rendered tthis computter unusable. I was going to buy a 2015 MPB and now I'm justt pisseed...I paid close to $2k for tthis computer. Ttthis is tttottally unacceptable and even more so thatt they refuse tot admit and deal with this problem.
[doublepost=1543774307][/doublepost]

I have also owned all three, and agree with your basic assessment. I will be selling my 2015 rMBP in part because I've come to prefer the new keyboards, which is actually a big surprise to me...

I wouldn't sell it untill youu haveee hadd a good amount of time with your 2018 MBP KB. I havee had 5 2018 and every singlee one has a faulty keeyboard - All witht repeating keeys within a month of owning the machine. Also, I am meticulous with my computteers...No crumbs here, just a faulty piece of hardware.

 

[newellj]

I wouldn't sell it untill youu haveee hadd a good amount of time with your 2018 MBP KB. I havee had 5 2018 and every singlee one has a faulty keeyboard - All witht repeating keeys within a month of owning the machine. Also, I am meticulous with my computteers...No crumbs here, just a faulty piece of hardware.

I appreciate the problems that others have had. I've had only one problem since April with my 2017 rMB, and that was quickly solved with no further issues.

 

[Jinx Mac]

Lawsuits for what? The e key not working? You Americans sue for anything and everything if you don’t get your way.

Not everyone is having issues with the keyboards. The people who have issues complain but the majority of us don’t go out of our way to tell people that their keyboard work as satisfied customers don’t broadcast in Internet forums.

You are trolling, right? You actually think thattt it's okay tto sell machineees that you know full weeel don't work? I am on my 5th MBP and all 5 have keeyboards that tare unuseable. Yes, Applee deeserves to be sued, AGAIN.
[doublepost=1543774593][/doublepost]

I appreciate the problems that others have had. I've had only one problem since April with my 2017 rMB, and that was quickly solved with no further issues.

Can you beelive that I am actually jealous tthat you have only had onee probleem with your Mac? ;-)

 

[Falhófnir]

Did a quick bit of Christmas shopping this morning, and had a play with a 2018. I'm hoping Apple really does move to touchscreen/ haptic keyboards in 2020 at this point. At least that's a clear line in the sand where I can say I'm done with MacBooks being my primary machines. The thing is I really do like MacBooks, and I think it's going to take something like that to really decisively rule them out in my head. As of now I'm still hoping they'll tweak and fine-tune this KB to 'acceptable' grade, but really, why am I? Even if they fix the reliability problems, I still don't really like how it feels to type on. "It's usable" is about the pinnacle of enthusiasm I can muster for it. That's not going to change unless they completely ditch it. Well, I guess 4 versions of this keyboard in 4 years says it all really, doesn't it?

2015 - Gen 1 launches with the MacBook, it's near unusable with little discernible feedback for a key press
2016 - Gen 2 launches with the pros, real issues with sticking/ repeating/ failing to register begin to come to the fore
2017 - Gen 2 rev. launches with the new machines in June - basically a minor tweak to the design that maybe (?) helps a little
2018 - Gen 3 launches with the membrane to reduce dust ingress - quite literally a bandaid fix as the underlying issue remains.

Honestly with this I feel like the kind of stupid shallow kid that's hopelessly in love with the beautiful, highly strung diva that's clearly no good for him

 

[mmmatei]

I got a MBP 15' 2018 in September. A couple of days ago I've sent it back to Apple repair because of double lettering. Very frustrating, especially when you do a lot of writing on a brand new +2000$ machine.

Just my luck, my first Apple laptop and it's a keyboard faulty one.

If the problem comes again, I'll sell it and buy a Surface Book. I like macos more than Windows, that's for sure, but this type of hardware issues are unacceptable for that price.

 

[Jimmy James]

The keyboard is the sticking point for me (pun intended).

I’ve come to grips with the price and USB-c ports. I accept that the pricing in my country will make me bleed and I’ve got to use dongles. But reliability is not something I willingly sacrifice at any price let alone a premium.

I was gearing up to spend money but I’m continuing with a very old machine until Apple sorts this out.

 

[newellj]

You are trolling, right? You actually think thattt it's okay tto sell machineees that you know full weeel don't work? I am on my 5th MBP and all 5 have keeyboards that tare unuseable. Yes, Applee deeserves to be sued, AGAIN.
[doublepost=1543774593][/doublepost]
Can you beelive that I am actually jealous tthat you have only had onee probleem with your Mac? ;-)

Yes. I have a mixed history with these KBs going back to 2015, lots of posts here. I am surprised that I'm now comfortable with these, and have even come to prefer them. I will say that I wouldn't own one of these without AppleCare (though I always used to buy it anyway, and have never had a Mac where I didn't get at least my money back on the cost of AppleCare).

It's sort of like being hit by lightning. If it happens, you're toast, and it's no comfort that a thousand other people have never had it happen.
[doublepost=1543856461][/doublepost]

Did a quick bit of Christmas shopping this morning, and had a play with a 2018. I'm hoping Apple really does move to touchscreen/ haptic keyboards in 2020 at this point. At least that's a clear line in the sand where I can say I'm done with MacBooks being my primary machines. The thing is I really do like MacBooks, and I think it's going to take something like that to really decisively rule them out in my head. As of now I'm still hoping they'll tweak and fine-tune this KB to 'acceptable' grade, but really, why am I? Even if they fix the reliability problems, I still don't really like how it feels to type on. "It's usable" is about the pinnacle of enthusiasm I can muster for it. That's not going to change unless they completely ditch it. Well, I guess 4 versions of this keyboard in 4 years says it all really, doesn't it?

2015 - Gen 1 launches with the MacBook, it's near unusable with little discernible feedback for a key press
2016 - Gen 2 launches with the pros, real issues with sticking/ repeating/ failing to register begin to come to the fore
2017 - Gen 2 rev. launches with the new machines in June - basically a minor tweak to the design that maybe (?) helps a little
2018 - Gen 3 launches with the membrane to reduce dust ingress - quite literally a bandaid fix as the underlying issue remains.

Honestly with this I feel like the kind of stupid shallow kid that's hopelessly in love with the beautiful, highly strung diva that's clearly no good for him

2015...I figured that the Gen 1 KB would be ok for me, since I was pretty fast and accurate on the iPad virtual KB. I was -so- wrong. So, I hope you're not right about moving to something that's non-physical in the future. I liked the old chicklet KB a lot. Gen 1 was unusable for me. Gen 2 and 3 give me enough physical motion to make typing easy and accurate. I just don't see that happening with a non-physical/virtual kb. Purely my $0.0005.

 

[zen]

Is there somewhere for users to actually file a complaint with Apple about the keyboards? A friend of mine has a 2017 MBP and the keyboard is still malfunctioning, despite being "serviced" at an Apple store three times now.

Is there an Apple email address to use, or a web form?

 

[alex00100]

I just got a 2016 MBP keyboard replaced and I really feel like they put gen 3 keyboard in, it sounds completely different. Can anyone confirm that or is that my imagination?

 

[Falhófnir]

I just got a 2016 MBP keyboard replaced and I really feel like they put gen 3 keyboard in, it sounds completely different. Can anyone confirm that or is that my imagination?

Not completely impossible - does it have the stretched option symbol?

 

[SDColorado]

Is there somewhere for users to actually file a complaint with Apple about the keyboards? A friend of mine has a 2017 MBP and the keyboard is still malfunctioning, despite being "serviced" at an Apple store three times now.

Is there an Apple email address to use, or a web form?

You can fill out a webform here for Feedback on the MacBook Pro. I am not sure if "Bug Report" or "Other" is the more appropriate choice.

 

[KarmaRocket]

IMHO, best way to get Apple to notice is voting with your wallet. Money seems to be the only language Apple seems to understand these days.

I don't have any issues with my 2018 MBP (560X). Doesn't mean I don't think they could have made a better machine for the price I paid. Hopefully things will change before it gets worse, but Apple really needs to wake up.

 

[ignatius345]

Purely anecdotal, but I was killing time in the Apple Store yesterday while they fixed my phone, and opening up the Notes app on several of the MBPs and new Airs, there were notes from people testing out the keyboard and typing about how bad it felt to type on. It *could* have just been the same person, but on at least one of the notes it seemed like a series of people typing and saying more or less the same thing...

 

[SDColorado]

Purely anecdotal, but I was killing time in the Apple Store yesterday while they fixed my phone, and opening up the Notes app on several of the MBPs and new Airs, there were notes from people testing out the keyboard and typing about how bad it felt to type on. It *could* have just been the same person, but on at least one of the notes it seemed like a series of people typing and saying more or less the same thing...

Happy to know that I am not the only one that does that kind of thing hahaha

 

[537635]

Purely anecdotal, but I was killing time in the Apple Store yesterday while they fixed my phone, and opening up the Notes app on several of the MBPs and new Airs, there were notes from people testing out the keyboard and typing about how bad it felt to type on. It *could* have just been the same person, but on at least one of the notes it seemed like a series of people typing and saying more or less the same thing...

Great timing! Was traveling yesterday and visited an Apple Store. I wanted to compare the keyboards and moved from laptop to laptop and tried out how they feel. Instead of that I noticed (in a very short time I was there) that keyboard was broken on 3/6 demo laptops.

rMBA - double ee-s
rMB - enter key didn't work
rMBP 13 - double tt-s
rMBP 15 - seemed fine
rMB (gold) - seemed fine
rMBA - seemed fine

I own a rMBP 15 (got replaced after 18 months of having the 2016 in service all the time because of the stupid keyboard)... I guess this will go on.

 

[Chancha]

Purely anecdotal, but I was killing time in the Apple Store yesterday while they fixed my phone, and opening up the Notes app on several of the MBPs and new Airs, there were notes from people testing out the keyboard and typing about how bad it felt to type on. It *could* have just been the same person, but on at least one of the notes it seemed like a series of people typing and saying more or less the same thing...

I remember back in 2016 the 1st day touch bar model demos became available, I did the exact thing in my local Store. Thinking I was alone, but fast forward to just last week I was checking out the new MBA for the 1st time, opened Notes.app, there were already 3 auto-saved notes with apparently 3 other individuals thinking and doing the same before I did.

 

[ignatius345]

Great timing! Was traveling yesterday and visited an Apple Store. I wanted to compare the keyboards and moved from laptop to laptop and tried out how they feel. Instead of that I noticed (in a very short time I was there) that keyboard was broken on 3/6 demo laptops.

rMBA - double ee-s
rMB - enter key didn't work
rMBP 13 - double tt-s
rMBP 15 - seemed fine
rMB (gold) - seemed fine
rMBA - seemed fine

I own a rMBP 15 (got replaced after 18 months of having the 2016 in service all the time because of the stupid keyboard)... I guess this will go on.

Yikes. That's disturbing.

Yesterday was the first time I'd been to an Apple Store in a while, and I noticed more stuff amiss.

- I tried playing music through a HomePod, and it seemed like AirPlay was fighting between two nearby HomePods, and one nearest me would cut in and out.

- Every single Mac had a persistent error message about some network-related thing. Dismissing it just made it pop up again. This was on a dozen Macs.

- then I hear about your encountering half of the laptops in your store with defective keyboards...

All small stuff individually, but those stores have always been very clean and orderly and it's pretty weird to see obvioiusly malfunctioning hardware and software in an Apple Store.
[doublepost=1544051031][/doublepost]

I got a MBP 15' 2018 in September. A couple of days ago I've sent it back to Apple repair because of double lettering. Very frustrating, especially when you do a lot of writing on a brand new +2000$ machine.

Just my luck, my first Apple laptop and it's a keyboard faulty one.

If the problem comes again, I'll sell it and buy a Surface Book. I like macos more than Windows, that's for sure, but this type of hardware issues are unacceptable for that price.

If you like MacOS, I would heartily recommend any of the pre-butterfly switch Macs -- particularly the last batch of MacBook Pros (2015?) before the redesign.

 

[SDColorado]

Great timing! Was traveling yesterday and visited an Apple Store. I wanted to compare the keyboards and moved from laptop to laptop and tried out how they feel. Instead of that I noticed (in a very short time I was there) that keyboard was broken on 3/6 demo laptops.

rMBA - double ee-s
rMB - enter key didn't work
rMBP 13 - double tt-s
rMBP 15 - seemed fine
rMB (gold) - seemed fine
rMBA - seemed fine

I own a rMBP 15 (got replaced after 18 months of having the 2016 in service all the time because of the stupid keyboard)... I guess this will go on.

Keyboard Service Program Gen 3 here we come

I remember back in 2016 the 1st day touch bar model demos became available, I did the exact thing in my local Store. Thinking I was alone, but fast forward to just last week I was checking out the new MBA for the 1st time, opened Notes.app, there were already 3 auto-saved notes with apparently 3 other individuals thinking and doing the same before I did.

I have done it in Pages before as well, just because that is what someone else left open. Next time you are in check both

 

[natif09]

It is a shame, this issue alone has cost Apple my purchase and potentially many other peoples.

+1
I'm even thinking about buying an old maxed Air... Same CPU perf as the new one (even more thanks to the i7 ?), and a working keyboard...

I finally found an early 2015 MacBook Pro 13", "maxed" version (i5 2.9, 16G, 512G), brand new (non-refurbished), blister packed (so never activated serial).
I should even benefit from the full legal warranty period.
Quite lucky, but what a mess, totally non-sense to have to buy a 2015 machine in (let's say) 2019 !

 

[Plutonius]

I finally found an early 2015 MacBook Pro 13", "maxed" version (i5 2.9, 16G, 512G), brand new (non-refurbished), blister packed (so never activated serial).
I should even benefit from the full legal warranty period.
Quite lucky, but what a mess, totally non-sense to have to buy a 2015 machine in (let's say) 2019 !

It's worse for Mac Pro users.

We end up buying used 2009 - 2012 Mac Pro computers.

 

[rutrack]

It's worse for Mac Pro users.

We end up buying used 2009 - 2012 Mac Pro computers.

Wasn't there meant to be a release/surprise for Mac Pro users this year? Or iMac Pro is what they meant by "Professional workstation" ?

 

[Plutonius]

Wasn't there meant to be a release/surprise for Mac Pro users this year? Or iMac Pro is what they meant by "Professional workstation" ?

The iMac Pro was a separate release.

They have been talking for some time about a modular Mac Pro and maybe it will happen next year.

 

[c0ppo]

They have been talking for some time about a modular Mac Pro and maybe it will happen next year.

If Apple wanted to make a 'modular' MP like the old good ones, it would be out already. Just choose components, and release them. I'm afraid that by modular it will be something like trashcan, but with tb3 ports to 'expand' the device and possibilities. Or something similar. But locked down as usual. Meet the new Apple