Gen 3 butterfly keyboard

[Queen6]

Yesterday I called Apple to arrange for a service. My history with butterflies so far:

December 2016 - purchased MBP 15
May 2017 - keyboard starts failing - sticky keys (topcase replaced in August)
November 2017 - keyboard starts failing - sticky keys (topcase replaced in December)
December 2017 - keyboard start failing right after service - dead key (replaced in January 2018)
May 2018 - keyboard starts failing again - sticky keys (Apple replaces entire laptop with a 2018 model)

January 2019 - occasional double key presses start creeping up


And they told me they've never heard of keyboard failing before and this most probably is a software issue.

This should be a reminder to everyone that good hardware and services can be quite short lasting if the wrong person is in charge. Apple is just a shadow of what it was 5 years ago in terms of user experience.

This is what pisses me off most with Apple, they should simply "own it" 3 years in and the Butterfly Keyboard remains to be a disaster, yet every single Apple rep will preach the same song despite extended warranty "We've never heard of a keyboard failing before" at very best it's insulting, at worst a blatant lie.

Apple needs to gain some perspective and stop treating it's customer's like idiots, especially it's professional user base while it still has one Samsung screwed up massively with the Note and the battery issue, equally they "owned it" and as a result gained respect. I can never imagine Apple having any such humility, it would far rather it's customers suffered, while bathing in it's own false hubris...

FWIW I don't own or use any Samsung product outside of SSD's

Q-6

 

[navaira]

Me: where are all those people who kept posting about how there are no keyboard issues?

And they told me they've never heard of keyboard failing before and this most probably is a software issue.

Ah, they got jobs at Apple.

 

[dannynjoni]

Wow I came in here because Apple just replace the keyboard on my 2017 MBP and I'm very impressed with the better performance I've noticed instantly!

But then I see many of you have had their replacement keyboard starting to fail on them. That's very discouraging. I do hope mine continues to feel and behave as awesomely as it has so far. I've had it for about an hour though, so I have no idea except to see what others are going through. Makes me wonder if I should sell it while it feels so new and just go with my iPad Pro and an iMac. :/
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This is what pisses me off most with Apple, they should simply "own it"

Q-6

I just had my 2017 MBP into the Apple Store for the keyboard issue. Also the paint was already coming off of some of the keys. They readily took in in for full replacement of the entire upper case of my laptop including new battery. Apparently this keyboard replacement program also runs for 4 years from the date of your MBP no matter how many times you might have to bring it in (hopefully only once, if at all). Although I've been pretty disappointed in the lack of quality with regards to the new design, I'd be hard pressed to say at this point that they're not "owing" it.

The 3rd gen butterfly keyboard (which I believe is what they replaced mine with after comparing with the newest model at the Apple Store) feels MUCH better to me as I type on it now. It's much more responsive/accurate (so far) and enjoyable to type on. I just hope it keeps feeling this way!

 

[537635]

Wow I came in here because Apple just replace the keyboard on my 2017 MBP and I'm very impressed with the better performance I've noticed instantly!

But then I see many of you have had their replacement keyboard starting to fail on them. That's very discouraging. I do hope mine continues to feel and behave as awesomely as it has so far. I've had it for about an hour though, so I have no idea except to see what others are going through. Makes me wonder if I should sell it while it feels so new and just go with my iPad Pro and an iMac. :/
[doublepost=1552156618][/doublepost]


I just had my 2017 MBP into the Apple Store for the keyboard issue. Also the paint was already coming off of some of the keys. They readily took in in for full replacement of the entire upper case of my laptop including new battery. Apparently this keyboard replacement program also runs for 4 years from the date of your MBP no matter how many times you might have to bring it in (hopefully only once, if at all). Although I've been pretty disappointed in the lack of quality with regards to the new design, I'd be hard pressed to say at this point that they're not "owing" it.

The 3rd gen butterfly keyboard (which I believe is what they replaced mine with after comparing with the newest model at the Apple Store) feels MUCH better to me as I type on it now. It's much more responsive/accurate (so far) and enjoyable to type on. I just hope it keeps feeling this way!

Once you've had your topcase replaced several times... bringing the computer to service, waiting days or weeks and getting a new battery + keyboard doesn't feel that great anymore. It a big hassle. Not something you'd expect from a laptop this expensive.

 

[maflynn]

Not something you'd expect from a laptop this expensive.

Exactly the point I want to make. Apple wants to sell these as premium products then they ought to deliver on this promise.

 

[Queen6]

I just had my 2017 MBP into the Apple Store for the keyboard issue. Also the paint was already coming off of some of the keys. They readily took in in for full replacement of the entire upper case of my laptop including new battery. Apparently this keyboard replacement program also runs for 4 years from the date of your MBP no matter how many times you might have to bring it in (hopefully only once, if at all). Although I've been pretty disappointed in the lack of quality with regards to the new design, I'd be hard pressed to say at this point that they're not "owing" it.

The 3rd gen butterfly keyboard (which I believe is what they replaced mine with after comparing with the newest model at the Apple Store) feels MUCH better to me as I type on it now. It's much more responsive/accurate (so far) and enjoyable to type on. I just hope it keeps feeling this way!

Apple replaces like with like, so even a replacement has a higher than average chance of failure. That's not "owning it" it's "passing the buck" and once the warranty is up who's going to drop $700 to fix a jammed key? For some the solution is simple, selling out before that point in time, so someone has to deal with it...

Problem is a long as people keep giving Apple a free pass for poor design & value we well never see a decent product, let alone the cost of this keyboard fiasco. Lets face it we the consumers are ultimately going to bear the cost, as in no shape or means is Apple simply going to absorb it.

The bigger question here is why is Apple seemingly incapable of getting it right in the first place? I'm very confident the cost of adequately qualifying the keyboard in the first place would be fraction of the cost in repair. Prices keep increasing yet the quality if falling doesn't strike me as a deal I want to get into....

Q-6

 

[dmillar74]

I have a 2016 MBP. I just sent it in for a keyboard replacement. I already had it repaired once for the keyboard and now it has to go in for a full replacement due to spongy keys. I was assured I would have an extra year after my Apple care if there are any other issues. That is pretty depressing. My 2007 MacBook Pro lasted 10 years and I replaced it due to it just being slow. Seems like this MBP won’t last nearly as long.

 

[Queen6]

I have a 2016 MBP. I just sent it in for a keyboard replacement. I already had it repaired once for the keyboard and now it has to go in for a full replacement due to spongy keys. I was assured I would have an extra year after my Apple care if there are any other issues. That is pretty depressing. My 2007 MacBook Pro lasted 10 years and I replaced it due to it just being slow. Seems like this MBP won’t last nearly as long.

As it's a design issue there's little can be done about it, unless Apple redesigns the keyboards which is highly unlikely given the 3rd generation is still unreliable and Apple continues on the same trajectory.

Price of these notebooks will tumble once the 4 years grace period is up and people start finding themselves on the end of a $700 repair for a computer over 4 years old...

Q-6

 

[maflynn]

Seems like this MBP won’t last nearly as long.

Agreed, and that was the major reason why I personally chose to move on from Apple. Why spend almost 3k when its only going to last a few years when I can spend a lot less for a better built laptop

 

[dannynjoni]

Agreed, and that was the major reason why I personally chose to move on from Apple. Why spend almost 3k when its only going to last a few years when I can spend a lot less for a better built laptop

Can you name a better built laptop than the current MBP? I’m seriously curious.
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Once you've had your topcase replaced several times... bringing the computer to service, waiting days or weeks and getting a new battery + keyboard doesn't feel that great anymore. It a big hassle. Not something you'd expect from a laptop this expensive.

Yeah. I get that. If feels great right now, but the purchase of this laptop has been a little underwhelming for what I spent. It’s still an amazing laptop in a lot of ways though and I don’t really want to get rid of it. Still want to see how this one behaves and not get too drawn into the drama of keyboard-gate.

You know, back in the day I wouldn’t have felt so lucky to have the battery replaced. Only reason I am is because of how difficult they are to replace now. Kinda B.S. now that I think of it. :/

 

[537635]

Can you name a better built laptop than the current MBP? I’m seriously curious.
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If I say previous MBP, will you judge me? Not that I would buy it today. But in terms of build quality...

 

[buran-energia]

Agreed, and that was the major reason why I personally chose to move on from Apple. Why spend almost 3k when its only going to last a few years when I can spend a lot less for a better built laptop

You had the 2018 one and returned it?

 

[dmillar74]

Does anyone think that the new MacBook Air with the Gen 3 keyboard will fail like this?

 

[537635]

Does anyone think that the new MacBook Air with the Gen 3 keyboard will fail like this?

It's already failing... see the subforum next to this.

 

[c0ppo]

Can you name a better built laptop than the current MBP? I’m seriously curious.

Any laptop with a working keyboard?
You see, the keyboard on a laptop is the main input device

 

[navaira]

Can you name a better built laptop than the current MBP? I’m seriously curious.

– sent from my Lenovo Yoga C930

(we do not talk about non-Apple trackpads)

 

[dmillar74]

It's already failing... see the subforum next to this.

This looks really bad. I think I may be making my move back to a windows laptop replacement. Pretty sad.

 

[maflynn]

You had the 2018 one and returned it?

I sold it and got a Thinkpad.
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Can you name a better built laptop than the current MBP? I’m seriously curious.

Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme - Superior keyboard that is spill proof, 4k touch screen, i7 8850H processor, GTX 1050-TI GPU, upgradeable ram, user replaceable battery, two M.2 mvne ssd

I get better performance, with lower heat on the thinkpad then on the MPB. Thanks to frequent sales, I got a 4k/1TB/32GB configuration with a 3 year warranty for 2286. If I were to get a similarly configured MBP, that would have cost me 4,300 dollars.

So in the end, I have a faster laptop that doesn't throttle, which has a keyboard that doesn't require a repair program, user replaceable components for about 2,000 less then what Apple would have charged me. So based on about every metric that I use (cost, performance, upgradablility) The Thinkpad wins out.

 

[BuCkDoG]

I sold it and got a Thinkpad.
[doublepost=1552252304][/doublepost]
Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Extreme - Superior keyboard that is spill proof, 4k touch screen, i7 8850H processor, GTX 1050-TI GPU, upgradeable ram, user replaceable battery, two M.2 mvne ssd

I get better performance, with lower heat on the thinkpad then on the MPB. Thanks to frequent sales, I got a 4k/1TB/32GB configuration with a 3 year warranty for 2286. If I were to get a similarly configured MBP, that would have cost me 4,300 dollars.

So in the end, I have a faster laptop that doesn't throttle, which has a keyboard that doesn't require a repair program, user replaceable components for about 2,000 less then what Apple would have charged me. So based on about every metric that I use (cost, performance, upgradablility) The Thinkpad wins out.

After watching some reviews of your laptop, I will have to agree with you on this one. I have been a long time Mac fan however that Lenovo Thinkpad Extreme is the real deal in build quality, specs, and pricing. I personally will continue too buy Macs and be satisfied, but if anyone is looking for an alternative, this is probably the way to go.

 

[buran-energia]

I sold it and got a Thinkpad.

Keyboard problem?

 

[maflynn]

Keyboard problem?

No, not yet at least. My thinking was that it would be better to sell this machine sooner then later as I'd get the most for it now then later. After using the MBP for a few months, I had serious doubts about the durability. Unlike my 2012 rMBP which was an awesome laptop, I just didn't feel I'd get many years out of it. Instead of sitting on pins and needles, I got a machine I felt I could count on.

 

[Glockworkorange]

I’m sure I’ve made a few posts in this here sub singing the praises of the 2018 MBP keyboard...that all changed earlier this week when my “d” key became stuck.

The Apple Store told me They’d need to send the machine out for 7 to 10 days and they’d need to replace the whole top casing.

Screw the 2018 MBP keyboard.

 

[BuCkDoG]

I’m sure I’ve made a few posts in this here sub singing the praises of the 2018 MBP keyboard...that all changed earlier this week when my “d” key became stuck.

The Apple Store told me They’d need to send the machine out for 7 to 10 days and they’d need to replace the whole top casing.

Screw the 2018 MBP keyboard.

Are you serious? Damn man this is not good at all. I just ordered my 2018 and I really was hoping to not hear this. I think personally its that region of the keyboard I guess because most people are not having the problem with the "D" key specifically its more of the "E" key that has this issue but seeing how they are right next to each other, Im assuming it has to be a design defect or something. Please keep me updated on this. How did it happen? Did it happen when the machine got hot?

 

[Queen6]

Any laptop with a working keyboard?
You see, the keyboard on a laptop is the main input device

Exactly or it's little more than an expensive doorstop...

Q-6
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Does anyone think that the new MacBook Air with the Gen 3 keyboard will fail like this?

Guaranteed in time as the design is fundamentally flawed and Apple these days seems perfectly fine with such poor quality & low expectations. Maybe Apple will fix it for the 4th gen, or maybe Apple just doesn't care until sales numbers are significantly impacted...

Q-6

 

[dmillar74]

On my 2016, it was the “Q” that wasn’t working correctly. They fixed it last year. Then just yesterday I brought it to the Apple store for the Space Bar, Option, and Command key. I don’t use my MacBook Pro that often as it sits in a sleeve that also is in my bag. Mine is in for a full keyboard replacement. 5-7 days too.