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Gen 3 butterfly keyboard

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This is what was replaced by Apple. Good thing is 5-7 days ended up being much quicker. Dropped it off on Saturday and had it back today - Tuesday.
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I finally got around to typing on the Butterfly Keyboard as I was walking by the Apple Store and decided to give it a try. What I found is that it's okay. There is enough positive feedback and I was able to type reasonably well. I obviously didn't spend a lot of time typing on it. I use an external keyboard about 90% of the time so keyboards are less of an issue for me than those that always use the built-in keyboard. But I could use the butterfly keyboard - if it were reliable. And it's far from certain to me that it is. I also don't like the touchbar as I'm an emacs user and I need a physical escape key. I guess that I'd have to go with a 13, Air or MacBook to avoid the touchbar.

I hope that Apple fixes all of the MBP problems in June or I will be using 2014/2015 MBPs for a very long time.
 
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pshufd said:
I finally got around to typing on the Butterfly Keyboard as I was walking by the Apple Store and decided to give it a try. What I found is that it's okay. There is enough positive feedback and I was able to type reasonably well. I obviously didn't spend a lot of time typing on it. I use an external keyboard about 90% of the time so keyboards are less of an issue for me than those that always use the built-in keyboard. But I could use the butterfly keyboard - if it were reliable. And it's far from certain to me that it is. I also don't like the touchbar as I'm an emacs user and I need a physical escape key. I guess that I'd have to go with a 13, Air or MacBook to avoid the touchbar.

I hope that Apple fixes all of the MBP problems in June or I will be using 2014/2015 MBPs for a very long time.
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The reliability of the butterfly keyboard will always be a question, but the fact that you use an external 90% of the time should help.

I gave my wife my 2016 and she does the same, so far so good for her.

My luck with the 2018 models has not been so good however.
 
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I've had multiple MacBook and MacBook Pro models with all generations of the butterfly keyboard ...

With the release of the repair program for 2016-17 models, and assuming they place the 2018 model in that program at some point based on the same issues it appears to have ... I'm wondering if Apple will at some point attempt to re-design the replacements (like a "gen4-fixes_everything-backwards compatible to gen1 version") they're using on all of the butterfly models and offer this as a replacement option under AppleCare or the extended repair program.

Not sure if that's even possible, considering they haven't been able to get it right after three generations ... but we can only hope(?)

I just picked up yet another MacBook, this time a 15" i9/32GB/Vega 20/1TB. Very impressed with it so far, including the keyboard. It's very tactile, even feels a little "stiffer" than the 13" 2018 model that I picked up in August of last year but this could be due to wear on the 2018 keyboard. The manufacture date on this new one is 2-11-2019.

Note with all the MacBooks I've personally had since 2015, along with hundreds that I support at work, I've yet to have any issues with any of them except for one 2016 model that was defective out of the box... Excuse me while I go find multiple large pieces of wood to knock on.

Nick/WP
 
BuCkDoG said:
When they replaced the "top case" on my previous rMBP, it included a new trackpad, keyboard, and battery so I was more than content with it.
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Don't they have to replace the battery, since its cemented onto the top case? As for trackpad I thought it was more modularized in the 2018 to allow the removal of the trackpad, i.e., no need for a new trackpad during keyboard repairs.
 
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maflynn said:
Don't they have to replace the battery, since its cemented onto the top case? As for trackpad I thought it was more modularized in the 2018 to allow the removal of the trackpad, i.e., no need for a new trackpad during keyboard repairs.
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Yes that's correct but I was referring to my older 2012 model. The newer models won't get the full treatment as compared to the others but it depends on what model of 2016-2018 you have where this is accurate.
 
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Queen6 said:
IMHO Apple should be compelled by a court of law to provide the hardware as advertised. Apple has systematically done this over and over replacing poorly designed components with exactly the same.

When this happens Apple's only concern is itself, with customers left with the same problem. Until Apple is punished in a meaningful way no doubt it will continue this poor behaviour...

Q-6
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This is a problem across all industries honestly. Companies replace products with the same flawed parts until the warranty expires and washes their hands of the problem. My Samsung fridge has had 4 ice maker replacements and they just keep cycling out the same flaws ice maker.

What we need is a lemon law that forces manufacturers to buy back the product after a certain number of failures for the same flaw. Similar to what we have in the automotive space. It is unrealistic that Apple (or any manufacturer) will redesign a product that has such a short model lifecycle (~1 year) unless a safety issue was discovered, but that shouldn't force a consumer to live with a device they know will fail.

That being said, doesn't Apple offer a goodwill gesture that is similar to this? I haven't yet had my MBP fail on me, but when I used Dell they would replace the whole machine if you had 3 or more failures for the same reason under warranty as it was a lemon. Would surprise me a lot if Apple doesn't do the same.

With Dell you did have to explicitly request it though... Otherwise, they would keep you on the warranty wheel as that was cheaper.
 
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LogicalApex said:
This is a problem across all industries honestly. Companies replace products with the same flawed parts until the warranty expires and washes their hands of the problem. My Samsung fridge has had 4 ice maker replacements and they just keep cycling out the same flaws ice maker.

What we need is a lemon law that forces manufacturers to buy back the product after a certain number of failures for the same flaw. Similar to what we have in the automotive space. It is unrealistic that Apple (or any manufacturer) will redesign a product that has such a short model lifecycle (~1 year) unless a safety issue was discovered, but that shouldn't force a consumer to live with a device they know will fail.

That being said, doesn't Apple offer a goodwill gesture that is similar to this? I haven't yet had my MBP fail on me, but when I used Dell they would replace the whole machine if you had 3 or more failures for the same reason under warranty as it was a lemon. Would surprise me a lot if Apple doesn't do the same.

With Dell you did have to explicitly request it though... Otherwise, they would keep you on the warranty wheel as that was cheaper.
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I agree it's not solely Apple, although it's making a habit with the 15"MBP. What I think should apply is that the company should be forced to reimburse, not replace like with like over and over. You can bet that all would be a lot more careful in the design stage. In my experience same as others Apple only does what it's legally obliged too, if no "lemon law" it will just keep repairing until the warranty runs out.

Where I'm based Apple doesn't even have a return policy, so if you get a Lemon, your stuck with it and Apple's looping repair process.

Q-6
 
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turbineseaplane said:
"Eco Apple" sure knows how to design things for easy repairs and minimal waste!

Keyswitch issue on a single key?

"Replace entire top half of the computer, including the battery."
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I think Apple should be pushed to respond to this much harder.
The whole "Eco" idea is just a cr@p bag if they create so much unnecessary waste.
Without even mentioning the economic loss the owners have to cover
for no reason at all (except the thinnest obsession).
 
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dmillar74 said:
Replaced battery too by the way the invoice reads. Looks like the entire top assembly which may include the touchpad too. Have to look closer at it though.
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The top case assembly is the Aluminum case on the top that holds the keyboard, trackpad, and the battery which is glue to it. It's the same for all retina MacBook pros.
 
turbineseaplane said:
"Eco Apple" sure knows how to design things for easy repairs and minimal waste!

Keyswitch issue on a single key?

"Replace entire top half of the computer, including the battery."
Click to expand...

I think that Apple attempts to control waste by installing a removed top half of a MacBook Pro that is under repair and installing it on the next MacBook Pro being repaired (i.e. recycle the failures) :).

Why else would some people have continuous problems while other have no problems ?
 
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