You didn't know your money that you used to buy the iPad went to the engineers? Shocking.
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Gurman: Redesigned Magic Keyboard to Accompany New iPad Pro
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Yup, this would signal the beginning of the end for Apple.
I really don’t see Apple ever going for dual boot, now that they’ve shed Windows. If for no other reason, they simply seem to always want to provide an “always on, always ready” UX. Rebooting goes against that.
Maybe they can figure out a non-disjointed way to switch modes. But until then I think they'll only offer separate specialized devices.
There also has to be sufficient demand to make the effort worth it for Apple to attempt such a solution. As far as people who actually need macOS and iPadOS on a big portable screen, it may just be too small of a demand. It seems the iPadOS portion is usually more of a want than need, as most everything can be achieved on a MacBook or an iPhone. Or sometimes a smaller iPad is better suited. There are plenty of exceptions of course, especially when needing the Pencil. But again I think it’s small enough of a demand for both OSes on one device that Apple is able to ignore it for now. Although I don’t think they are completely ignoring it, as iPadOS has gotten more macOS functionality over the years.
Ultimately who knows what Apple will do, but I wouldn’t bet on dual boot.
Lenovo Tab Extreme manages to pull this off. You get less coverage on the back. Seems to be the only way this can work
I thought everyone knew that moolah's just fuelin' Cook's yacht fund. For real, I'm actually shocked.
It’s gonna end up being a Microsoft Surface Book isn’t it?
I always loved this old Vaio though, maybe they can make an unholy marriage of that and an old Magic Keyboard.
I always loved this old Vaio though, maybe they can make an unholy marriage of that and an old Magic Keyboard.
Current version has a backlit keyboard. So I’d expect that to continue at least.
Here’s the exact quote from the article:
the updated version of the Magic Keyboard for iPad will offer a larger trackpad, addressing criticisms of the current model, and "makes the iPad Pro look even more like a laptop than the current setup”
It’s really just saying the larger trackpad on the MK will make the iPad look more like a laptop. Nothing mentioned or implied about the OS.
Or were you referencing a different quote?
We’ll see. I wrote Cook an email ~5 years back or so calling out similar enough to what you’ve mentioned upstream. I didn’t get nor did I expect a response but went into a fair amount of detail as ‘a day in the life’ type of story, transitioning n/out of modes and inputs as I’d use a ‘merged device’ for work and home. I figured it was worth a shot anyways
There are a few issues though - Apple has managed to convince ‘many’ of us that we need both laptop(or desktop/mini/…) and iPad, which is very good for their bottom line/$,if possibly not as good for consumers. Personally I’d use a ‘touch Mac’ much like I used a Surfacebook at work - 80% of the time non-touch but extremely useful for collaborative design and white boarding, preferably with Pencil support.
MacOS has higher overhead from base system services and I suspect the existing iPad Pro might not be up to the task thermally over time. I’d be willing to take a thicker ‘base’ (assume like MK but thicker) to add additional battery to the mix along with power and a TB port, and also ok running the AS M-chip underclocked or at fewer cpu/gpu cores if need be if it meant otherwise having full macOS (which now already can run ios apps..). They could do something like an iPad ‘Ultra’ along with MK ‘Ultra’ with the MK also allowing for additional storage - all kinds of ways Apple could make $ off of it, but at some point it would cannibalize mac sales. Depending on implementation and pricing, I could see giving up my near-top-of-line MBPs, probably replaced by a future Mini Pro as the ‘for most day work with higher compute’, still ‘dock’ the ‘iPad Ultra’ and use as an additional screen and for markup and design sessions, then having it be the sole ‘portable’ mac ‘computing device.’
It will be interesting to see where it goes. Not everyone has bought into Pencil usage, and not everyone would want something like mentioned. As it stands today, some very specific types of users can use an iPad ‘for everything’ and not have a mac of some type but there’s no possible way developers, engineers of various types, and those in various other jobs could replace their macs with an iPad ‘today.’
Meh. I will believe it when I see it at this point. And I am not holding my breath.
It didn’t happen with M1 or M2 iPad Pro models. I am not convinced it ever will at this point.
Love these "hot takes". Never cease to entertain me! I do agree with you though, iPad is a dumpster fire. It's neither an amazing tablet or a decent laptop. It's a gimped, oversized phone. I'd love to love my iPad Pro more.
AS macs can now run IOS and iPadOS apps, so doubt it would be via dual boot, but perhaps a type of ‘profile’ fast-switch mode. I wrote a bunch n a different post in this thread I’m not going to repeat, but certainly it’s far from a foregone conclusion to see any real ‘convergence’ or we then have iPad OR Mac, which could get messy for Apple’s bottom line.
I’d be pretty happy if they enabled pencili support on the MBP trackpad while they’re sorting how to keep positioning iPads as ‘computers’ but ‘not enough to impact mac sales.’
It may not be wild but I don’t think likely for the time being. I think sharing the same chip is just one of a couple major obstacles. The main obstacle I see now is how Apple can make a non-disjointed way to switch “modes”. I don’t think they would make a device that had separate OS apps that you can’t instantly switch between (ie. no rebooting) and that would also require switching input methods.
Agreed; that's why I think Apple could take an approach of the keyboard forcing you to use Mac OS mode once connected. It solves the non disjointed way to switch; but does not give the user much customization (which Apple loves to do). Who knows, either way - hopefully we can have a solid mesh between Mac and IOS somehow in the future.
Yeah Macs being able to run iPad apps is as far as Apple has been willing to go toward convergence so far (and technically much more feasible than the other way around as a more versatile OS can support a more restricted app than the other way around).AS macs can now run IOS and iPadOS apps, so doubt it would be via dual boot, but perhaps a type of ‘profile’ fast-switch mode. I wrote a bunch n a different post in this thread I’m not going to repeat, but certainly it’s far from a foregone conclusion to see any real ‘convergence’ or we then have iPad OR Mac, which could get messy for Apple’s bottom line.
I’d be pretty happy if they enabled pencili support on the MBP trackpad while they’re sorting how to keep positioning iPads as ‘computers’ but ‘not enough to impact mac sales.’
Pencil support on trackpad seems very possible and shouldn't rock any boats IMO, but on the other hand it wouldn't appease anyone wanting touch.
I’m not sure how the profile switch thing would work, or if it’s necessary, but I think more likely than dual boot would just be macOS as is but on a MacBook with touch/Pencil support to better use the iPad apps, or possibly just Pencil support which should work well on both Mac and iPad apps. The MacBook would of course need to be a convertible or slate (thicker than current iPad Pro for thermal reasons). But not sure how likely this all is.
Yeah, 60+ million in 2022… pretty sluggish.
I know a lot of companies that WISH their sales were that sluggish
That's your view. Meanwhile, people with actual work to do that doesn't always require the power of their Mac would love to travel lighter and use the iPad to do it. I use the iPad for sketching diagrams, light email, light word processing, etc.
My iPad Air can get me 90% of the way there for things I need to do while out and about. I'm currently a MacBook Pro + iPad user because there's a fair bit of stuff I just can't do on the iPad. Not for any particular technical reason other than artificial product segmentation. My 256 GB Air is basically the same hardware spec internally as the baseline M1 MacBook Air, which is still on sale.
If that was less of a thing, I'd be an iPad + Mac Studio user instead.
Key things I want from iOS:
- ability to let specific apps run in the background (e.g., terminal sessions)
- better external display support
But it would still have to reboot each time, right? I think the problem then would be that it would become a bigger decision for the user to connect to or disconnect from the keyboard. Not sure Apple would go for that UX. It seems they want people to be able to quickly go from tablet to keyboard and back.
I mentioned in post #175, the most obvious disjointed way would be to forego iPadOS and just keep the apps which macOS runs, and just have a MacBook hardware change.
(Edit- the post numbers have changed quite a bit so #175 is no longer accurate. Not sure what post it was now)
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I would pay way more for an iPad Ultra that has a Magic Keyboard that when I snap it onto the iPad Ultra it allows me to choose to run iPadOS or MacOS. And when no keyboard it just runs iPadOS.
Have to improve other things like 50% thicker, bigger battery, better display, bigger display, and two cameras in the bezel. Do not put a damned notch on it. Nor a dynamic island.
Give me that and make it in the free world and I say it’s worth 3x a standard iPad Pro.
You might want to ask yourself, 'Do I know everything about everything?' and if the answer is no, you might want to tone down the attitude. There is a possibility, you don't know the answer either, no matter how well informed you may feel. My educated guess, is that Apple have invested more time, money and energy into determining the ideal requirements for a tablet, then anyone in this discussion and if they deem a trackpad is worth the engineering effort, there is probably good cause for it.
So you probably read my ‘deeper dive’ on convergence above, and I’d be a purchaser for various reasons, but when it comes to a ‘touch macbook’, my MBP is docked with external displays, kb, mouse a lot of it’s time, and having pencil support on the ‘bigger than older Wacom tablets’ trackpad, or even next-gen standalone magic trackpad (ideally both) would be pretty useful to me, and might manage to even sell more future-magic-trackpads and pencils. I partially ignore the trackpad entirely when at my home office desk because I have the MBP screen sitting next to my display, but I’d absolutely be adding a magic touchpad to my desk then and be using it on trackpad on the MBP when mobile.
On the ‘profiles,’ if the ‘future iPad Ultra’ were running macos, the profile switch would be more akin to a window manager or extended ‘theme’ at that point, like a desktop switcher of sorts, at worst starting/stopping a handful of services but macos at it’s core/kernel/…
Of course it is.
iPad Pro 12.9 + keyboard weighs more than a MacBook Air and about the same as the 13-inch MBP. Also it's top heavy where typing while on the lap is wobbly. Bad experience.
Never said Pencil was a bad idea.
I can travel lighter than an iPad Pro 12.9+keyboard and do light email/word processing much faster than you can I bet. Multitasking is far better on the Mac. Talk about "actual work".
My MacBook gets me there 100%.
Hell no - a keyboard forcing MacOS would be a disaster. Think of this use case - on my iPad 9th Gen, I have plenty of work apps that have access to my internal work network through VPN. This isn't really possible on MacOS. I like using those work apps (think stuff like Outlook, Word, Teams, etc) with a keyboard. I also like using Notes, Word, etc on iOS with a keyboard.