Hands-On With Apple's New 16-Inch MacBook Pro

[MrGuder]

I am not sure if somebody has already posted this video, but I liked it:

It compares the 15-inch and the 16-inch models side by side. You can see the differences in size and display, the sound and even the internals. It is the most illustrative review I have found so far.

Apple Insider also made three videos, one comparing them both, one specifically for the keyboard, and one comparing some of their features:

This guy who took over Apple insider talks way too much and too much video is of him and not the product.
Regarding sound, the wave forms look almost identical they both sound the same to me too loud. The new keyboard is still much louder than the 2015 MBP.

 

[Detnator]

I'm baffled by the way some people think that because they don't need a feature (like SD slots or physical function keys) then nobody needs that feature and thus it should be expunged for everybody, let they suffer the appalling ignominy of having a computer with a slot or key that they don't use.

Personally, I like the sound of the touch bar (but I'm using an iMac at the mo', so it will have to wait until I upgrade to Catalina and can use an iDevice). However, I'm also aware that there are people who spend all day pounding a particular pro application and have memorised the function keys. They could have found room for both - especially as nobody was asking for the trackpad to be made even larger than the largest-in-the-business one in the pre-2016 MBP.



I'm not one of those pros. However, I've got a phone that takes SD cards. I've got 4 Raspberry Pis that take SD cards. I've got a Fire TV that takes SD cards. I've got a module in my Eurorack synth that takes SD cards. Other people have GoPros, dashcams etc. that take SD cards. You can get low profile fit-and-forget SD cards that are perfect for (say) storing a music or photo library on without wasting fast SSD.

Sure, there are adapters. Know what's better than needing an adapter? not needing an adapter! Know what the downside is of having a (tiny, cheap) SD card reader in your laptop that you don't use? None!

I don’t think anyone is saying “just because I don’t need it no one needs it”. We’re just challenging your “downside ... None!” statement. That statement is blatantly false.

There is a downside. It takes space. So do all the other “missing” ports. So do socketed RAM and SSD. So does a thicker keyboard. And all the other things people here are complaining about.

If Apple catered to ALL those things then this thing would either be twice the size and weight it is, or it would seriously compromise what cooling, battery life, and other specs.

Why on earth can’t you people understand that??

The thing is, in Apple’s target market, the things Apple has kept in are the things the vast majority of Apple’s target market want.

The things Apple has left out are the things that only a small minority want more than the other things.

But with TB3/USB-C, almost all of those things are still available externally, so those people are still catered to, even if slightly less conveniently.

The alternative to that slight loss of convenience for those relative few are compromises the rest of us don’t want.

Of course the other alternative is to just leave out macOS, and if you do that then there are countless other options available to you. Perhaps one of those would better suit your needs, especially since it seems the vast majority of your accessories are already alternatives to Apple.

 

[theluggage]

Where in the comment was it stated that nobody needs SD slots or physical function keys?

Your first sentence:

I’m baffled by the Touch Bar hate and “no SD card” agony.

...completely dismisses the opinions of anybody who wants these things, and the only justification you provided was that you didn't want them. You might as well have said "Nobody".

 

[skaertus]

This guy who took over Apple insider talks way too much and too much video is of him and not the product.
Regarding sound, the wave forms look almost identical they both sound the same to me too loud. The new keyboard is still much louder than the 2015 MBP.

You are right. I prefer the other video, which is way more concise. But at least Apple Insider made some videos comparing the two side by side, which is something MacRumors is yet to do.

 

[MrGuder]

You are right. I prefer the other video, which is way more concise. But at least Apple Insider made some videos comparing the two side by side, which is something MacRumors is yet to do.

Many of these reviewers don’t want to say anything negative of a Apple product for fear of backlash from Apple.
You won’t find a video of a 2015 MBP comparing keyboard noise to the new 16” MBP. Most of these reviewers are hung up on key travel. Yes there is more key travel but the 16” still exhibits just about the same loud/clacking keys as the 15” 2016, 2017 and 2018 MBP.

The 2015 15” MBP was nearly silent typing on it and was really nice experience.

I currently have a 2017 15” MBP and before buying it I tried several refurbished 2015 MBP from Apple store. I enjoyed the keyboard more on the 2015 but the smaller footprint, better speakers and screen quality of the 2017 won over.

 

[theluggage]

If Apple catered to ALL those things then this thing would either be twice the size and weight it is, or it would seriously compromise what cooling, battery life, and other specs.

No it wouldn't. Unless you're talking about some straw man machine that has RS232, VGA, Ethernet, optical drive, PCMCIA, full-size parallel port and other things people stopped complaining about* 10 years ago. So don't accuse me of saying things that are blatantly false.

The 2012-2015 wasn't "twice the size or weight" of the 2016 version. It was about 10% heavier and about 0.1" thicker. It had HDMI, USB-A, Micro SD, MagSafe, a larger battery than the 2016 and more key travel than even the new 16". The thing that compromised cooling and battery life was Apple's "if thin is good, thinner is better" decision in 2016.

Edit (* maybe not stopped wanting/needing - but you have to draw the line somewhere and ethernet/VGA are from an even older and chunkier generation of connectors than HDMI/SD/USB-A)

 

[fishmoose]

I need to pull the trigger on a new computer within a month. Honestly the 16” is overkill for my use case and a 13” MBP would suffice for now. But I can’t justify spending money on the 13” with the keyboard issues when the reason I need a new computer is because I’ll need to type a lot the coming months. The upside with the 16” is that I’ll be able to keep it longer than the 13” I suppose, even though the cost is higher. Decisions, decisions.

 

[ksnell]

You don't need to use the Touch Bar, and a one-ounce dongle doesn't "negate ... portability."

But feel free to avoid it based solely on principle.

I avoided it based on lack of functionality and got a ThinkPad. I won't be going back anytime soon - the keyboard is second to none and unlike some I do heavily use the Function keys so they are a requirement.

 

[Kilibee]

While I'm using my current SD-Card Slot mostly for cameras, this is actually the use case where many modern cameras become better and better, and in fact, my camera allows direct USB-C Connection, so that's not a primary issue for me anymore.

However, SD-Cards are used a lot in scenarios of older devices, where alternatives are rare, and they are a very convenient storage for transferring image output, or move a lot of data on a small and robust medium, that fits in most machines…

 

[iamBrian]

I went to try it out and the keyboard felt much better. I was hoping Apple would also see the light and offer a non-touch bar option, but I'm not surprised it's still there and non-negotiable. I see people saying that it's a professional machine for people to make money on, so I feel the need to break down how it does the opposite for me.

I use function keys a lot while retouching photos and I actually rest my ring and middle finger on my left hand right on the key row when working. To give a little glimpse into how I work in certain cases, I open a file in Photoshop, hit an F-key shortcut that performs a batch process to prep the file for editing, then I make some selections, hit another batch process f-key, make some adjustments, and then hit another f key to save the file and return to bridge to browse and open the next file which repeats the process. I may have to do this process for 500-1000 photos, and my attention is on the screen the whole time.

Now, with the touch bar, I can't rest my fingers on the top bar because a touch is a key press. If they had force touch in the touchbar that could allow you to set a sensitivity level for an actual press, that could be a compromise, but it doesn't. My hand has to travel up and above the touch bar, and then I have to look to make sure I'm tapping the right spot. The added action of having to move my hand more, and having to look away from the screen to perform actions added around 3 seconds of time per image when I had to use a 15" MBP, which doesn't seem like a whole lot, but if you are editing 1000 images you have added 50 minutes of time which has effectively lowered your wage by an hour.

The contextual features that you get with the touch bar make it seem cool and more capable, but when you factor having to look away from your work and make sure you're hitting the right thing, there are few cases where it is more efficient than existing keyboard shortcuts that are tactile and don't divert attention.

 

[Vjosullivan]

But with TB3/USB-C, almost all of those things are still available externally, so those people are still catered to, even if slightly less conveniently.

Having only T3 ports does have theoretical advantages but any such advantages are entirely negated when Apple's own cables are not up to the job ...

 

[sarge]

So you’re carrying around thousands of dollars worth of camera equipment and accessories, and a laptop, and one more adapter is a big deal?

Right. Ok.

Apple, please don’t put SD back into the MBP just for him when most of the rest of us don’t want it taking space that can be better used for cooling, more battery, or countless other things.

BWM, please please please eliminate the gas powered hybrid engine from your lineup and force everybody into EV battery technology only. Better cooling, better torque, reduces CO2 by 20%. So what if your range is less than 300 miles or7-28 hours of Level 1 to recharge, you'll get there eventually.

 

[MarkB786]

I need to pull the trigger on a new computer within a month. Honestly the 16” is overkill for my use case and a 13” MBP would suffice for now. But I can’t justify spending money on the 13” with the keyboard issues when the reason I need a new computer is because I’ll need to type a lot the coming months. The upside with the 16” is that I’ll be able to keep it longer than the 13” I suppose, even though the cost is higher. Decisions, decisions.

{deleted} I did not read your post closely enough.

 

[SeattleMoose]

Brought back the ESC key, kept the headphone jack, and got rid of that butterfly keyboard. They did keep the "touch bar" but the other features still make this a win!!!

 

[Metrosey]

Having only T3 ports does have theoretical advantages but any such advantages are entirely negated when Apple's own cables are not up to the job ...

Personally, I'd rather have all TB3/USB-C than odd ports. At the end of the day, attempting to unify everything to TB3/USB-C would be a great benefit for consumers, meaning we don't require independent one use ports. However, attempting unification within any sector, specially the technology industry is rather difficult.

 

[Donoban]

"Ever since the iPhone replaced the digital camera there is no need for most people to have an SD slot. "

Lol!

For selfies and super quick photos of random stuff, it sure has replaced the digital camera. For serious, important photos that you actually care about.....NOT.

you left out the actual point of his comment. You’re a serious photographer, you’re already carrying around a lot of **** in your bags. A 100gram dongle ain’t making your life inconvenient.

I freaking can’t stand this guy that does the Mac rumours reviews. Tell me what you think in the comments after I’ve ranted for a few mins of my opinions.

for improvement, consider the purpose of the video. Currently as it stands, this video is purely to get more clicks - ref your call To action for the viewer to leave comments. Instead, what if your reviews were not to get clicks but instead summarise all the new features in 3 mins. Whatever you decide but put yourself in our shoes. No one cares about your opinion, well not really and most don’t care about leaving comments.

 

[StandInsideM]

Is it important to buy before the tariffs kick in Dec 15th?

Do you think the price for us as the consumer will go up then?

 

[Metrosey]

Is it important to buy before the tariffs kick in Dec 15th?

Do you think the price for us as the consumer will go up then?

No, I doubt it will go up in price, however, next year's one will likely be higher in price.

 

[theluggage]

you left out the actual point of his comment. You’re a serious photographer, you’re already carrying around a lot of **** in your bags.

Strange logic. However much stuff you have to carry around, having to carry around more stuff is never better.

At the end of the day, attempting to unify everything to TB3/USB-C would be a great benefit for consumers, meaning we don't require independent one use ports.

...its great in theory. In practice - as you said yourself - it's not that simple. You end up with lots of apparently identical plugs, sockets and cables with very different uses and capabilities. You end up with cables that can charge at 85W but only carry USB 2.0, others that can do 40GB/s Thunderbolt but can't charge or carry USB and others that can do everything... You end up with a TB2 to TB3 adapter (mentioned in the video) that doesn't deliver power, that will drive a Thunderbolt display but not a "USB-C" or DisplayPort display. You replace passive HDMI cables with active DP-to-HDMI converters (...but if HDMI alt mode takes off there will be yet another type of USB-C to HDMI cable) and even the 'straight' USB-C to DisplayPort cables (unlike the old TB2 'legacy display' mode) actually have to have extra electronics in them to work (ever wonder why the DP end of the cable gets warm?).

Good luck explaining the difference between TB3 and USB-C cable to a non-techy consumer (esp. after the local pedant has given them the not-even-wrong 'USB-C is just the connector' speech) let alone the difference between USB-C DisplayPort Alt Mode and the Thunderbolt DisplayPort streams - or explaining whether this is a USB-C or Thunderbolt 3 hub (Ans: 'yes' for a given value of 'yes')... and USB 3.2 and USB 4 haven't even hit the market yet...

On the other hand, most people learned the art of putting differently-shaped and coloured pegs into matching holes before they could walk or talk...

 

[cocoua]

The only benefit of upgrading your own RAM is saving money buying third-party RAM. But people who can afford a $3k+ computer are unlikely to want to tear open their own computer to save maybe 5% of the purchase cost. On the other hand, those same people place a premium on the slimmest, lightest laptop possible, which is precisely what soldering RAM allows.

5%??? It looks like you habe been too much lost in the apple ecosystem, RAM and SSD in macbook pro can reach 1/3 of the price, you can have good quality RAM and super fast EVO SSD (worse tech though than apple’s SSD ) for 1/2-1/4 of their offer (depends on the quantity)
Old macbooks and ibooks cost the same and people where happy opening them to add ram, but those machines processors lasted just 2-5 years as tech evolved very fast, 7 years ago i t doesnt, so you can edit 4K today with a 7 years old computer (as I do) and manufacturers need something to force you updating devices, in iphone is camera and battery, in macs is ram and ssd

please, this is like thewar in middle east petrol countries, dont lie yourself about thin-thick devices (who cares about 1inch thicker imac????)

 

[v3rlon]

But they do though. Portability is about having something that's clean, simple, and doesn't require additional components in order for it to function.
[automerge]1573860342[/automerge]

That's what's so annoying though. Why? Why are they not coming back? The SD card is the most modern and common storage medium for image acquisition. Pro photographers aren't taking pictures with their iPhones and AirDropping them to their Macs. So if Apple's going to slap a "Pro" moniker on their products, then they ought to actually make them tailored for real pros, not just hipster iPhone photographers.

They are not coming back because they are NOT the most modern storage medium. See compact flash/XQD cards (which require an even bigger slot than SD cards) which are faster and more reliable. See micro SD which offers the same capability in a smaller package.

They are NOT the most modern method of transferring images. That would be WiFi/Bluetooth.

Heck, assuming your camera is almost as new as this MacBook, odds are you could just use a USB-C to USB-C cable that conveniently came with your MacBook or your camera to connect to your camera directly to your MacBook and transfer the images FASTER than a USB2 speed SD Card reader.

It simply isn't that much trouble to plug in a reader when you need an SD card. Even as a professional, what percentage of the time are you using an SD card reader compared to everything else? 3%? If that. So if the other features are 5% faster, its still a win.

If you didn't upgrade your camera, then don't upgrade your Mac and let it run as long as you can make money. SD cards are going away.

Apple was right about the Floppy drive going away, USB ports replacing serial/parallel/keyboard/mouse, about Firewire (video and audio users only), the DVD drive, and the headphone jack. They are also right about SD cards.


Apple makes mistakes, yes. But, they have an excellent track record of bailing on connectors we no longer need. They are right about the SD card.

 

[gugy]

Speak for yourself. Not all of us. Some of us prefer the soldered RAM and SSD for reasons that have been flogged ad nauseum here for years already.

You are then the minority that likes to not be able to update down the road and pay the premium prices Apple charges. lol

 

[jlocker]

I don’t think anyone is saying “just because I don’t need it no one needs it”. We’re just challenging your “downside ... None!” statement. That statement is blatantly false.

There is a downside. It takes space. So do all the other “missing” ports. So do socketed RAM and SSD. So does a thicker keyboard. And all the other things people here are complaining about.

If Apple catered to ALL those things then this thing would either be twice the size and weight it is, or it would seriously compromise what cooling, battery life, and other specs.

Why on earth can’t you people understand that??

The thing is, in Apple’s target market, the things Apple has kept in are the things the vast majority of Apple’s target market want.

The things Apple has left out are the things that only a small minority want more than the other things.

But with TB3/USB-C, almost all of those things are still available externally, so those people are still catered to, even if slightly less conveniently.

The alternative to that slight loss of convenience for those relative few are compromises the rest of us don’t want.

Of course the other alternative is to just leave out macOS, and if you do that then there are countless other options available to you. Perhaps one of those would better suit your needs, especially since it seems the vast majority of your accessories are already alternatives to Apple.

People forget that the old keyboards on the Macbook Pro machines use to touch the screen getting oil from your hands from the keys and leaving marks on the screen. And people wanted a thin lid, with a flush display. You can not have it all, your fingers have natural body oil.

 

[kobefan234]

is the FaceTime camera better than the 2018 MBA ?

 

[Ael_MR]

You are then the minority that likes to not be able to update down the road and pay the premium prices Apple charges. lol

The people paying a premium for Apple products aren't exactly the same ones keeping their machines 10+ years. Does it even make sense to upgrade a laptop especially when the cpu and video will be outdated well before then?