Hey Apple...Adobe has learned its lesson! We want Flash

[Nishi100]

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPod; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/532.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/4.0.5 Mobile/8B117 Safari/6531.22.7)

Apple won't put it on any of their iDevices, not because of power consumption, or it being slow, but, with flash you can get games (compete with app store - Apple didn't introduce the app store, as an alternative to flash games, they did it so that they can make money), videos, FULL films online (compete with iTunes) and music from YouTube (some are not available on the mobile YouTube site.)

It's like Blu ray; Steve doesn't put Blu ray in their machines because of the complex rights (well, it may contribute a little); but, because it'll compete with iTunes.

 

[BaldiMac]

You re really playing hardball but it is good thing, because those who see this and are not fanatics will just see how desperate it gets.

Here, it is not an investigation of Apple's conducts?

The Commission launched two investigations into Apple in the spring. One was into "country of purchase" rules which restricted the ability of consumers to claim repairs under warranty if they were not in the same country as when they bought their phone.

The second investigation centred on Apple's insistence that iPhone app developers only use Apple's own development tools, to the potential detriment of third-party makers of development tools. Apple lessened these restrictions earlier this month.

Apple resellers will now offer repairs regardless of where in the European Union or European Economic Area you bought your handset.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/09/27/apple_competition_ends/

I never said there wasn't an investigation. I said that Macs were not a monopoly subject to antitrust regulation. I'm not sure why you keep bringing up these other things.

When are you going to respond to my posts with the facts that you promised.

I can take that. There are 2 thing I can take and totally agree with:

1/ Adobe has been lazy on the mobile market, taking a wrong direction with Flash Lite too early. If anything, Apple's conduct motivated Adobe to deliver. They got the lesson, trust me they did... now let's see what Apple does, that will tell us whether their were hiding corporate agenda behind excuses or if they were truly protecting their users from bad experience.

2/ Developers, there are a lot of us... Like A LOT and not all of us are good... That is one of the issues, Flash is great because it is very powerful and like any very powerful tools, it is not so good in the wrong hands.

However Adobe is not responsible for that. It is up to the end user to boycott websites that are not well developed, no matter what it was developed with.

And Adobe is responsible for LSOs. They choose to continue to ignore a user's preferences to allow cookies and other local storage. And up until the latest version have continued to hide the settings to control LSOs from the user.

 

[s15119]

No. No. No. I have no need of Flash on my phone. No need at all. Apple is taking the correct path, promoting HTML5 and leaving Flash at the wayside.

 

[GaresTaylan]

I have one site that I visit semi regularly that requires flash. If I go to it, I use skyfire. I'd rather flash stay away otherwise.

 

[flexengineer]

The site only has 17 comments (half by himself).

Are you talking about my blog? I do not see any comment from you.

I never said there wasn't an investigation. I said that Macs were not a monopoly subject to antitrust regulation. I'm not sure why you keep bringing up these other things. When are you going to respond to my posts with the facts that you promised. And Adobe is responsible for LSOs. They choose to continue to ignore a user's preferences to allow cookies and other local storage. And up until the latest version have continued to hide the settings to control LSOs from the user.

Can you quote me, where did I say it is an investigation of Mac? I said FTC and EU are investigating Apple for anti trust violations but you have been trying to confuse everybody by answering non sense to every single of my replies and you are trying to drawn the fish in the water. You will stop before I do, I can tell you that much.

Facts, again click page 1 and check my posts, I do not want the admin to kick my butt again because I repeat myself. I think everyone got it, that what matters.

I cannot comment on LSO, I do not even know what that is, and I am not an Adobe fanatics, I am not saying Adobe is all white and pretty. I have seen a lot of article claiming Apple is in trouble with personal identification of phones tho. Once again, not my field, I am not a lawyers, I carry a professional liability insurance so if I do something wrong with MY apps, sue me.

Now, could you document your claims? Because you are a lot of work for me but you do not show much sources other than your head.

I have one site that I visit semi regularly that requires flash. If I go to it, I use skyfire. I'd rather flash stay away otherwise.

Then you are not visiting a Flash website, but just a website with a Flash video stream, because Skyfire is the biggest scam in the history of iPhone, You cannot see Flash, period. Apple sucks a bit more money out of you to pretty much see Youtube embedded videos that are free for everyone else.

Skyfire can't display games, nor applications. It only takes Flash video from somewhere, send it to their server, transcode it and then send it back to you. That is a lot of bandwidth and overhead just to once again play video from Youtube embeds everyone sees in full for free, with all the features of the player which you can't have on Skyfire no more than on Safari. And who pay for that overhead? You.

 

[kdarling]

I think iOS devices would be in more trouble if more in-browser Flash games played well on the competition. There are a few, but the majority aren't compatible with mobile phones. Too many are hardwired to a physical laptop/desktop keyboard and mouse.

The same incompatability goes for many current HTML5 websites and games, unfortunately. Most assume the ability to mouse hover, and the ability to hold down an image "button" on the screen. Neither is normally possible on mobile browsers.

(Well, except a touchscreen like the clicky one on the Storm could in theory do hovers if you didn't press down.)

Mobile users are still the red-headed step visitors of many websites.

 

[Sec102row1]

RIP Flash

It's funny how Apple has turned their backs on a company that quite frankly had much to do with the early success of the Mac. I am a professional web developer and graphic designer. I've been using a Mac for about 20 years. Had Apple not been the "go to" or "industry standard" in the graphics and publishing industry early on, they would have never survived the 1990's when the company was facing extinction. Adobe made much of this possible. Industry standards Photoshop and Illustrator ran on Macs, and every ad agency or design house worth a damn were 100% Mac environments. Quark was the only other player before (Adobe again) came through and crushed them with InDesign.

If it wasnt for the ad/design industry keeping Apple alive, the iPod and iMac would have never become realities. Imagine that?

However....

Back to the point. It's all about money folks. Apple doesn't stand to profit from Flash. They have a vested interest in HTML 5. Simple.

The same way Apple has written their own version of Java all these years (very poorly I may add), they want their own port of Adobe Flash that Adobe won't budge on. So Steve dropped the axe.

I've developed for Flash for years. I hate it. It was the only game in town that did what it did. It just NEVER did it great. Run Flash on a MBP, hear those fans yet? Check your activity monitor. Yuck. Run a Flash movie in Safari. Is it choppy yet? Flash is a hog, and again, it always has been. We accepted it because we had to.

The technical backend of HTML5 is gorgeous. It will win. And once all of the people attached to terrible Flash based web games get over it, the faster it will die and go away. Isnt that what we are talking about here? What other Flash experience do you want? In 2011, it BETTER not be a full flash website... every major video streaming site has ported over from Flash... and AJAX and PHP have taken care of dumb actionscript processed web forms. So unless you must have Farmville or other nonsense flash games, you really DONT NEED FLASH.

Steve and co have always been ahead of the curve. The same way you will NEVER see a blu-ray drive in a Mac, you will NEVER see an Apple supported Flash player.

Simply put, if you want dinosaur technology, don't go Apple.

 

[flexengineer]

I've developed for Flash for years. I hate it. It was the only game in town that did what it did.

And once all of the people attached to terrible Flash based web games get over it, the faster it will die and go away. Isnt that what we are talking about here? What other Flash experience do you want?

Have you reached any descent level with Adobe Flex? Most of the time coders who do not like Flash are not qualified on Flex, which is a serious learning curve but it is going to lead the way for a long, long time!

Saying Flash is just game is absolutely insane! I have 2 Fortune 100, 3 Fortune 500, several game changing startups among my clients and in addition to the fact I never developed one single game in my entire career, I can guarantee you that there is no way you can develop those apps with anything else than Flash.

I start a new contract at VMware in San Jose next month, the largest Flash application ever built, to administrate all their enterprise class virtualization products which are use by 100% of Fortune 100 and 92% of Fortune 500.

Ignorance or lie by omission will not take you anywhere.

 

[applebook]

So everyone who disagrees with you is ignorant, is a liar, and is stupid?

Maybe someone else needs a "time-out."

Personally, I think Apple should allow Flash as an option on iOS devices, if for no other reason than to prove that Adobe is crap.

BTW, Flash takes up quite a bit more resources than it should on Windows 7 too. Maybe it is Adobe that is inept at programming after all. Apple has a better programming track record than Adobe.

 

[anonymous guy]

Steve and co have always been ahead of the curve. The same way you will NEVER see a blu-ray drive in a Mac, you will NEVER see an Apple supported Flash player.

Simply put, if you want dinosaur technology, don't go Apple.

How is blu-ray "dinosaur" technology?

Apple will not successfully uproot Netflix in the movie/streaming media market if their attempts with Apple TV is any indication.

 

[flexengineer]

So everyone who disagrees with you is ignorant, is a liar, and is stupid? BTW, Flash takes up quite a bit more resources than it should on Windows 7 too. Maybe it is Adobe that is inept at programming after all. Apple has a better programming track record than Adobe.

Saying Flash is only games can't be anything else than ignorance or lie.

As far as performance is concerned:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=geK7geL3I40

Problem solved, let's all make peace and bring Flash on iDevices. Otherwise, Apple will be saying loudly "we were full of crap when we made our customers believe we banned Flash because of performances"

Apple programming? Let me laugh... the only real professional software they have is Final Cut and they bought it!! Steve only dreams to take over Adobe but professionals know better.

Actually, it's polemic, but I would not be surprised if all the drama would be because Adobe said no to an acquisition offer from Apple, I can totally see Steve Jobs ego going woohoo and make him get back at us! Call me crazy, but we saw already with Microsoft. I said polemic, don't attack me on this, it's what I think with no proof at all! I am just saying...

 

[applebook]

How is blu-ray "dinosaur" technology?

Apple will not successfully uproot Netflix in the movie/streaming media market if their attempts with Apple TV is any indication.

BRD has never taken off and will likely become a fringe format. It doesn't really benefit Apple to support it at all, having to write a player and reaping no financial gains aside from the initial BRD drive sale.

 

[applebook]

Yeah, iLife is awful and so is a tiny piece of software called OS X, which alone surpasses anything that Adobe has ever done or bought.

Ios4 isn't too shabby either, but I dont expect trolls to agree.

 

[flexengineer]

Yeah, iLife is awful and so is a tiny piece of software called OS X, which alone surpasses anything that Adobe has ever done or bought.

Ios4 isn't too shabby either, but I dont expect trolls to agree.

LOL you meant Linux right? All what Apple does basically is to make things pretty. That, they know how.

What is iLife? Probably something going on in the Mac world I guess. We are talking industry standard like After Effects, Photoshop, Illustrator and you bring iLife... I'm done taking software, Adobe has nothing to prove, Apple did not prove anything.

Adobe has of the world's best software rocket scientists, Apple will NEVER compare when it gets to software applications for the pro.

 

[applebook]

As far as performance is concerned:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=geK7geL3I40

but I would not be surprised if all the drama would be because Adobe said no to an acquisition offer from Apple, I can totally see Steve Jobs ego going woohoo and make him get back at us!

Thanks for video --it made for a great laugh.

"back at us"? So you accidentally admit that you DO work for Adobe? One making such statements would have to be some sort of Adobe fanboy or employee.

LOL you meant Linux right? All what Apple does basically is to make things pretty. That, they know how.

I think that I gave you more credit than I should have. Apparently, you are one of those ignoramuses who confuse terms like Linux and UNIX.

Anyway, welcome to my ignore list. I have no time for raving fanboys.

Was iOS also a copy of Linux too? I won't be reading your response. If the mods want intelligent discussion, they should spare the rest of the forum from having you see your threads too.

 

[flexengineer]

"back at us"? So you accidentally admit that you DO work for Adobe? One making such statements would have to be some sort of Adobe fanboy or employee.

Us the millions of flash developers. I do not work for Adobe, they hire me from time to time as a consultant but they need me more than I need them really.

I am an Adobe Flex advocate, period. Adobe as a company? I do have much of an opinion, they're cool, I get what I need and they deliver what I want. What I want is the best for my clients, when someone else will deliver that I will kiss Adobe good bye. I have been waiting for 7 years now. See my resume below since I am an Adobe employee now! I mean really? You got that where? Top of your head?

I think that I gave you more credit than I should have. Apparently, you are one of those ignoramuses who confuse terms like Linux and UNIX. Was iOS also a copy of Linux too? I won't be reading your response. If the mods want intelligent discussion, they should spare the rest of the forum from having you see your threads too.

Yes I do su*k at Unix and Linux and all that stuff, can't be good at everything...

http://www.linkedin.com/in/flexdesigner

 

[CylonGlitch]

Explain that to the FTC, maybe you are smarter than them. Also, give a call to the European Commission to let them know, they might fly you over for a lecture.

If you challenge me on the fact Apple is being put together for anti trust violation, JFGI.

When your device is 90% of the market it is not your device anymore it is THE market.

I ask you for ONE, ONE legitimate source that shows that Apple has 90% of the phone, or the much smaller Smart Phone market.

Before the iPhone came out, RIM and Microsoft had almost 100% of the Smart Phone market. I don't see you, or anyone else, bitching that THEY were the market. Besides, they weren't. When you create a market, of course they are the market AT THAT TIME but that is because they took the risk to create the market. That is why you risk it, you try to reap the rewards before your competitors catch up and try to carve out a big of niche as possible before that happens. SOMEONE has to create a market.

Apple has most of the tablet market (which is quite tiny compared to laptops, or phones but that is only because the competitors have taken a long time to get it out the door -- this is rapidly changing). In the next 12 months the Android tablets will take a large share of the "market" because there are only two real competitors.

So what is FORCING developers to HAVE to develop for iOS? They could write for RIM, or Android, or WinCE; why not. Symbian OS has the largest market share so why not go develop for them?

Smartphone Wiki Page
Symbian Q3 2010  36.6%
Android Q3 2010  25.5%
Apple iPhone Q3 2010  16.7%
RIM Q3 2010 14.8%
Windows Mobile Q3 2010 2.8%
Linux Q3 2010 2.1%
Other Q3 2010 1.5%

I'm assuming that the FTC and EU would at least do a simple google search and find out these pieces of information instead of acting like someone who thinks they know everything on anonymous forums.

The investigation is only about the Apple tools where Apple required that you HAD to use XCode to write apps for iOS. Again, no one was forcing anyone to write for iOS. source

Apple is more pissed at Adobe because of all the years where there Mac platform was overlooked by them for Flash. Now when they are coming into their own, has something people really want, and FINALLY Adobe agrees to support them. Well, guess what, they are still pissed, and thus doing what they can to "punish them." Is this smart or the best for the users? No, but I can see why they are doing it. Adobe should have gotten off their ass earlier but they didn't. Apple should have gotten off their ass but they didn't. Both have acted like idiots and not really thinking of what is best for the end user.

 

[flexengineer]

I ask you for ONE, ONE legitimate source that shows that Apple has 90% of the phone, or the much smaller Smart Phone market.

I'm assuming that the FTC and EU would at least do a simple google search and find out these pieces of information instead of acting like someone who thinks they know everything on anonymous forums.

I am getting tired of people faking not getting it. I said 90% of APPLICATION MARKET, application, those thingy youy install on a phone or run in a browser. 90% of APPLICATION MARKET.

Why don't you just google it?

http://www.google.com/search?ie=UTF...vclient&gfns=1&q=apple+90%+application+market

http://www.google.com/search?ie=UTF...ropean+commission&spell=1&fp=9bef8cda26d1a6ec

You fanboys are really parasites sometime!

 

[flexengineer]

Was iOS also a copy of Linux too? I won't be reading your response. If the mods want intelligent discussion, they should spare the rest of the forum from having you see your threads too.

How can I have missed that (sorry admin, will not do again).

No it is not a copy of Linux, however:

"The ‘Apple’ co-founder Steve Wowzniak admitted that the company had collaborated with a very well known Japanese electronics company in 2004, with the goal of creating a new phone to rival any known to man."

http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal...s-android-will-beat-the-iphone_100461911.html

 

[CylonGlitch]

You fanboys are really parasites sometime!

You are the only one being a jerk calling people names and such. Most people are being logical.

Thanks for pointing out NOTHING. I asked for ONE source that shows that they have 90% market share, for [as you want] Applications. Looks like Apple only has only 9 iPhone apps, and 8 iPad apps on the App Store. Out of millions of apps, that isn't really close to 90%.

Your "google searches" listed ONE "91% market share of Laptops over $1000". Ok, but that doesn't talk about Apps or anything else.

Your google search for FTC EC investigation doesn't talk about 90% anywhere. And even gives the link that I posted, that it is about them stopping Adobe from using Flash to write applications.

So, let me understand. Apple creates a device on a whole new OS and puts out tools to write apps for it. They then prevent others from writing tools to put apps on it. THAT is what the FTC/EC investigated, nothing else. Apple backed down, but it does makes a bit of sense that they were trying to stop it because they want to protect the OS and they cannot be 100% sure of that if someone else is writing the compiler / interpretator.

I have said, over and over again, I would prefer that Flash was an option, and it should be. I am no Apple Fanboy, I just use what fits me the best. I don't use Flash because I have found it does cause a lot of problems for me (on any OS that I've used it on). If you can't continue polite conversation, and listen to others instead of what you want to hear, maybe taking a break is the thing to do. Besides it is against the TOS of the forum to create hostility.

 

[applebook]

We can all plainly see who the parasidic troll is here...the one spreading absurd conspiracies and inventing numbers and revising history. What should we expect from someone who thinks Darwin and OS X are Linux? LOL

 

[flexengineer]

Looks like Apple only has only 9 iPhone apps, and 8 iPad apps on the App Store. Out of millions of apps, that isn't really close to 90%.

I do not know what you are talking about, we are talking about application market and you are talking about Apple's few applications, like I would be dumb enough to say 90% for a dozen apps?

Are you able to use Google? Sorry I just sent what you should have been looking for without checking the results.

Apple responsible for 99.4% of mobile app sales in 2009 (Updated)
http://arstechnica.com/apple/news/2010/01/apple-responsible-for-994-of-mobile-app-sales-in-2009.ars

I let you do the research for 2010, if you can't find let me know and I will search for you.

Your google search for FTC EC investigation doesn't talk about 90% anywhere. And even gives the link that I posted, that it is about them stopping Adobe from using Flash to write applications.

There was a join investigation by both European Commission and FTC. EU does not give a damn about Apple and Adobe, they are American companies therefore it is the FTC duty to figure it out.

So, EU only constrained Apple to cut the crap with the development TOS because it affects European developers and competitors. When Apple complied, they dropped the investigation.

Now, FTC did not drop. If there was nothing, they would drop, right? But this is the thing, the FTC never comment so we will only know the result when the investigation is over, either because the dropped or because they move to a formal investigation or because they take sanctions.

Wired, in a moment of genius journalism, find a legal way to force FTC admit there is an investigation:

FOIA Denial All But Confirms FTC Probe of Apple’s Anti-Adobe Rules
http://www.wired.com/epicenter/2010/08/ftc-apple-adobe-foia/

Did FTC Probe Cause Apple to Change App Rules?
http://www.wired.com/epicenter/2010/09/ftc-apple/


Now, either you believe me that both those investigations were triggered by Adobe, or you Google it, but I can't prove it... I just know it. I never talk about what I do not know.

 

[mKTank]

We can all plainly see who the parasidic troll is here...the one spreading absurd conspiracies and inventing numbers and revising history. What should we expect from someone who thinks Darwin and OS X are Linux? LOL

Darwin is UNIX. OSX is UNIX. Linux is, yes, UNIX.

Get it?

 

[applebook]

Darwin is UNIX. OSX is UNIX. Linux is, yes, UNIX.

Get it?

You do, but the Adobe sympathizer doesn't.

 

[flexengineer]

Darwin is UNIX. OSX is UNIX. Linux is, yes, UNIX. Get it?

Thank you, I did not know, I will try to remember. It's something I never used in my career, I only administrate Windows server in the cloud and never had to go in the guts of my MacBook, which I like very much! What I know is that Apple is very good at building on top of good stuff and taking credit for it all.