I do not understand the 'notch' angst at all.

[inscrewtable]

Now you're going to put up insulting posts about my mother?
Really? Can't take someone who disagrees with your opinion and have to scoop down to childish yo mama type of posts?

On your second point, right so we have screen all the way under the sensors and where to the sensors go? 'Above the screen' you chirp, but that is exactly what apple have done, that is why they phone is 19.5:9 and the Samsung is 18:9, then Apple used the space on either side of the sensors that they placed above the screen for extra screen with multiple uses.

When I say the sensors do not take up display because they are on top of the 18:9 ratio on the Samsung, that is not an opinion, it's a simple empirical fact. It certainly is an opinion for you to say that you don't like the look of the X, that's fine, I don't disagree with what you like, but it's not a matter of opinion to say that no screen has been covered up, screen has been added.

 

[jamesrick80]

On your second point, right so we have screen all the way under the sensors and where to the sensors go? 'Above the screen' you chirp, but that is exactly what apple have done, that is why they phone is 19.5:9 and the Samsung is 18:9, then Apple used the space on either side of the sensors that they placed above the screen for extra screen with multiple uses.

When I say the sensors do not take up display because they are on top of the 18:9 ration on the Samsung, that is not an opinion, it's a simple empirical fact. It certainly is an opinion for you to say that you don't like the look of the X, that's fine, I don't disagree with what you like, but it's not a matter of opinion to say that no screen has been covered up, screen has been added.

Samsung is 18.5:9. All of the other Android ripoff vendors are 18:9

 

[inscrewtable]

Samsung is 18.5:9. All of the other Android ripoff vendors are 18:9

And Apple is 19.5:9 which accommodates the sensors, with some of the extra space used for screen on either side.

 

[jamesrick80]

And Apple is 19.5:9 which accommodates the sensors, with some of the extra space used for screen on either side.

Yeah they did that for the Ears......remove the ears and you will have a 18:9 display

 

[iSayBoourns]

Yeah they did that for the Ears......remove the ears and you will have a 18:9 display

Why? Do you want the status bar info moved back onto the main portion of the screen? Taking up space in an app that can be used for the apps content instead.

And you don’t need to remove the ears to have a 18:9 display. It’s already there, below the notch, down to the bottom of the device.

 

[inscrewtable]

Yeah they did that for the Ears......remove the ears and you will have a 18:9 display

I just pulled the line drawing off the Apple 'specs page' and into photoshop, the readings I got are 252 on the X axis and 522 on the Y axis which works out as 2.07:1 so that would make it 18.63, let's be generous then and call it 9:18.5

 

[subjonas]

Why? Do you want the status bar info moved back onto the main portion of the screen? Taking up space in an app that can be used for the apps content instead.

And you don’t need to remove the ears to have a 18:9 display. It’s already there, below the notch, down to the bottom of the device.

Personally I’m not about removing the ears, I just want them and the sensor housing to be hidden, by making the ears permanently black. They are useful for displaying the status bar but I see no other purpose, except to distract from content, cause UI complication, and power wasted pixels. Unfortunately, Apple appears to want the ears to always be visible except when watching a minimized video.

 

[iSayBoourns]

Personally I’m not about removing the ears, I just want them and the sensor housing to be hidden, by making the ears permanently black. They are useful for displaying the status bar but I see no other purpose, except to distract from content, cause UI complication, and power wasted pixels. Unfortunately, Apple appears to want the ears to always be visible except when watching a minimized video.

It would be a waste of effort to make the screen go to all 4 corners just to then simulate a bezel with black pixels.

Also “when watching a minimized video” is not a minimized video. It’s watching it at its correct aspect ratio.

I don’t think I’ve ever heard of people complain that their 70+ inch tv doesn’t use the full screen when watching just about every movie.

 

[inscrewtable]

Personally I’m not about removing the ears, I just want them and the sensor housing to be hidden, by making the ears permanently black. They are useful for displaying the status bar but I see no other purpose, except to distract from content, cause UI complication, and power wasted pixels. Unfortunately, Apple appears to want the ears to always be visible except when watching a minimized video.

And this is really the entire argument about the so called ears, to hide them or not to hide them, and really it's a non argument because that can be done in software at anytime, and so it's just a matter of style. Some like it some don't how many fall into each camp out of tens of millions of people is anybody's guess, however it's a sure bet that most of the 50 million who buy it won't care one way or t'other. Yet despite this tiny style point it has set the interwebs aflame.
[doublepost=1508392459][/doublepost]

I don’t think I’ve ever heard of people complain that their 70+ inch tv doesn’t use the full screen when watching just about every movie.

They would if it was an Apple made screen and there was a forum dedicated to it!

 

[subjonas]

Also “when watching a minimized video” is not a minimized video. It’s watching it at its correct aspect ratio.

I did realize minimized wasn’t the best term but I wasn’t sure what else to call it and still be clear. I think you’re right, “correct aspect ratio” is better, but it’s also not perfect because you can have correct aspect ratio without notch interference, and theoretically you can have a larger correct aspect ratio with notch interference since the smaller view leaves black on the top and bottom of the picture as well as the sides. I guess that’s not programmed in as an option though. Hope that all made sense. (Edit- This is kind of what I was talking about with UI complications.)

Regarding the ears, we’ll just disagree. That’s fine.

really it's a non argument because that can be done in software at anytime

But it won’t because Apple. And that’s the issue.
Edit- Did you happen to see the developer guidelines? A section says “Don't mask or call special attention to key display features. Don't attempt to hide the device's rounded corners, sensor housing, or indicator for accessing the Home screen by placing black bars at the top and bottom of the screen. Don't use visual adornments like brackets, bezels, shapes, or instructional text to call special attention to these areas either.” It’s an interesting read even as a non developer. But anyway it shows that Apple specifically wants the ears to show.
https://developer.apple.com/ios/human-interface-guidelines/overview/iphone-x/

 

[iSayBoourns]

I did realize minimized wasn’t the best term but I wasn’t sure what else to call it and still be clear. I think you’re right, “correct aspect ratio” is better, but it’s also not perfect because you can have correct aspect ratio without notch interference, and theoretically you can have a larger correct aspect ratio with notch interference since the smaller view leaves black on the top and bottom of the picture as well as the sides. I guess that’s not programmed in as an option though. Hope that all made sense.

You can’t have correct aspect ratio video with notch interference. The video would be cropped and you would lose out both left and right sides and top and bottom too I believe.

 

[subjonas]

You can’t have correct aspect ratio video with notch interference. The video would be cropped and you would lose out both left and right sides and top and bottom too I believe.

I don’t think you lose out on top and bottom, just sides.

I think that’s true, having correct aspect ratio with notch interference isn’t an option, but I mean theoretically it’s physically possible, and that confused terminology for me, is all I’m saying. Right now, the cropped version expands the video all the way to the top and bottom and cuts off the excess on the sides. The non-cropped 100% visible version fits everything into the screen by shrinking the picture and putting black bars on the top and bottom of the picture, just like traditional rectangle screen phones do, but then it shrinks the picture further and puts black on the ears/side in order to not see the notch. So the third option would be to only put black bars on the top and bottom, none on the sides. It would be correct aspect ratio, and bigger, but the notch would cover the video. It’s obvious why Apple doesn’t have this as an option. It wouldn’t be a satisfying look, and too many options would confuse. But anyway that was why I wasn’t sure how to be clear in my terminology while being accurate. And my deeper point is that this is what I meant when I said that the notch causes UI complications.

 

[inscrewtable]

I did realize minimized wasn’t the best term but I wasn’t sure what else to call it and still be clear. I think you’re right, “correct aspect ratio” is better, but it’s also not perfect because you can have correct aspect ratio without notch interference, and theoretically you can have a larger correct aspect ratio with notch interference since the smaller view leaves black on the top and bottom of the picture as well as the sides. I guess that’s not programmed in as an option though. Hope that all made sense. (Edit- This is kind of what I was talking about with UI complications.)

The most common aspect ratios used today in the presentation of films in cinemas are 1.85:1 and 2.39:1OK, so with a 1:1.85 ratio the "notch" (otherwise known as the sensor area) doesn't matter. Now to address your other point, say you are watching a move in the other popular ratio of 2.39:1 here we have black top and bottom. Now if you were watching this on any flagship Android phone you'd still have space top and bottom whether it was a Samsung at 18.5:9 or the other Android phones at 18:9 you still not be using the full depth. Now if the movie is shown on the iPhone X and it is sized to not slip under the screen sensors then guess what, you'll be watching it on a ratio of 18.5:1 which is exactly what you get if the bezel was extended on both sides of the sensors.

Now if you say but if the sensors were not there then you'd have a 19.5:1 ratio and while you'd still have black top and bottom the image would be slightly larger. Now this begins to get a bit silly because if you removed the sensors and had all screen then the phone would have to be bigger to accommodate the sensors then Apple would put screen on both sides of the new sensor like it currently is, then you'd say again they should have all screen and this would continue forever until by the time the phone was 4 foot long you'd begin to realise there's a bit of a problem with this line of thinking!

To put it another way you are simply asking for a 19.5:9 screen ratio instead of the 18.5:9 that you get if you don't include the sensor area, but then you may as well say to Samsung, 'hey you made the screen ratio 18:5 why don't you make the phone taller and make it 19.5:9. Can you see this there is no validity in claiming the sensors take up screen space. Of course they do. Just like every other phone. However Apple has removed the bottom bezel unlike everyone else so really everyone should be complaining that Samsung, LG, Xiaomi and Pixel, should have folded the display under the screen and removed the bottom bezel like Apple have done.

 

[44267547]

I agree with OP. Yeah everyone has an opinion but it's damn annoying. And some of us can forsee after its released people will get used to it and stop ranting. So what's the point. It's human nature to state your opinion but it's also human nature to adapt and get used to things.

Once this iPhone X releases on November 3, their will be many threads where everybody will be agreeing the Notch isn't as obtrusive as they thought it would have been. But their will always be endless rants on why Apple should meet everyone's expectations when it comes to hardware designs. Tech forums are more of a place complain for some, but it doesn't change reality.

 

[inscrewtable]

I
Edit- Did you happen to see the developer guidelines? A section says “Don't mask or call special attention to key display features.

Yes I've posted a link to them elsewhere to show that no one will be losing anything, but then we are right back to the real "problem" of the ears on both sides which is that some people don't like it, and that's fine, other people do like it, it can only be one or the other. But people are getting into a bit of a lather about it because they are then changing the argument from one of personal taste about whether the ears should be blacked out to a different and erroneous argument that the "notch" or sensor array could be all screen and that is a ridiculous argument for reasons that I've posted above in #214

 

[subjonas]

The most common aspect ratios used today in the presentation of films in cinemas are 1.85:1 and 2.39:1OK, so with a 1:1.85 ratio the "notch" (otherwise known as the sensor area) doesn't matter. Now to address your other point, say you are watching a move in the other popular ratio of 2.39:1 here we have black top and bottom. Now if you were watching this on any flagship Android phone you'd still have space top and bottom whether it was a Samsung at 18.5:9 or the other Android phones at 18:9 you still not be using the full depth. Now if the movie is shown on the iPhone X and it is sized to not slip under the screen sensors then guess what, you'll be watching it on a ratio of 18.5:1 which is exactly what you get if the bezel was extended on both sides of the sensors.

Now if you say but if the sensors were not there then you'd have a 19.5:1 ratio and while you'd still have black top and bottom the image would be slightly larger. Now this begins to get a bit silly because if you removed the sensors and had all screen then the phone would have to be bigger to accommodate the sensors then Apple would put screen on both sides of the new sensor like it currently is, then you'd say again they should have all screen and this would continue forever until by the time the phone was 4 foot long you'd begin to realise there's a bit of a problem with this line of thinking!

To put it another way you are simply asking for a 19.5:9 screen ratio instead of the 18.5:9 that you get if you don't include the sensor area, but then you may as well say to Samsung, 'hey you made the screen ratio 18:5 why don't you make the phone taller and make it 19.5:9. Can you see this there is no validity in claiming the sensors take up screen space. Of course they do. Just like every other phone. However Apple has removed the bottom bezel unlike everyone else so really everyone should be complaining that Samsung, LG, Xiaomi and Pixel, should have folded the display under the screen and removed the bottom bezel like Apple have done.

Huh? I think you might be responding to someone else’s arguments. I don’t care what aspect ratio the X is or movies are or any of that. The only reason I brought up video at all was because I was saying when the video is completely in view is the only time the ears are hidden. I want the ears hidden but not because I think it will increase video size. I know that’s all trade offs.

 

[inscrewtable]

Huh? I think you might be responding to someone else’s arguments...

Yes my post to you does answer a general complaint. It was just that you quoted me saying they could clip the ears and black it out in software and you said they won't do that. I was basically saying it really doesn't matter at all.

 

[mrklaw]

I do think one thing Apple needs is a 'zoom up to but not past the notch' mode. So that you can get the most 'usable' use out of video without getting it covered by the notch.

with the increased number of longer aspect ratio phones coming out, they need to look at smarter zoom options. Most content that is eg 2.35:1 is still encoded within a 16:9 video. The black bars are encoded into the video. So any smart zoom should try and analyse the black bars and zoom to maximise screen space used, without cropping any of the active video content.

 

[Diorama]

The so called notch? Call it whatever you want, but it is a cut out from the screen for goodness sakes. Either make it a permanent bezel, keep the ears for battery and wifi signals only or be really innovative and put all the sensors under the screen so there is no cut out or no permanent bezel. Apple had 3 options which would have made almost everyone happy, yet these incompetent clowns went and cluster farked it by choosing a fourth, and the worst, by cutting out a section of an oled screen. Lol seriously what were they thinking? Oh if I don't want my video being blocked by the cut out (is that better?) I just minimise the video. What's the point? Bad enough I'm already going to lose width being a Plus owner, now I gotta shrink my content because of the cut out, or the notch or whatever you want to call it. Worst flaw I''ve ever seen on an iphone followed closely by the protruding camera lense from the 6 onwards and the visible antenna lines.

I think you’re having trouble understanding, they have not cut an area out of the screen. They have cut extra screen into what would be the bezel area on all (all) other phones.

 

[upandown]

Omg, the screen isn't a rectangular shape. Everything is different and uncomfortable.

Devices like these are still so new compared to what we will see in our life time. You're not going to survive if you can't handle a little, outside the box.. Pun intended.

 

[Raist3001]

The notch isn’t really cutting into the screen. What we have in the “ears” is an extension of the screen that would otherwise just be a boring forehead bezel we’ve had since forever (and what most phones still have even when slimming bezels)
View attachment 726148

As you can see, the line represents the normal forehead bezel. The ears are an extension of the typical screen. Moves status info off the screen we would normally have to use.

You know this post really made me understand that the ears are actually an extension of the screen. Aesthetically, the notch is an acquired taste. But i fully believe once we all have the X in hand, we will realize we were worried over nothing.

 

[Tozovac]

Has any bezel-less fan & notch-basher yet removed every photo/painting in their household from their frames and re-hung (or taped) it back up sans frame, for a true bezel-less notch-less experience? Just curious!

Boy I wish at least 1/2 as much energy put into notch-gate would be put into raising pitchforks & torches for Apple to return some intuitiveness & prettiness of design back into their iOS to make whatever fills the ears to be nicer-looking, regardless of the bezel & screen shape.

[doublepost=1508431789][/doublepost]

The notch isn’t really cutting into the screen. What we have in the “ears” is an extension of the screen that would otherwise just be a boring forehead bezel we’ve had since forever (and what most phones still have even when slimming bezels)
View attachment 726148

As you can see, the line represents the normal forehead bezel. The ears are an extension of the typical screen. Moves status info off the screen we would normally have to use.

iSay, iSayBoourns, I finally agree with you on something. This was my first reaction upon seeing the screen. Like McDonald's french-fries at the bottom of the bag that fell out of the paper container -- having them is better than not.

 

[IGotOne]

It's easy: All things being equal, would you rather have the notch or not?:

If you think it's an appealing design choice I personally think you're out of your mind, but hey, free country and it's your opinion. Enjoy the notch.

If you hate it, and wish they had just waited until they were able to incorporate Touch ID under the screen (which would have, at minimum, led to a smaller notch for fewer components) I agree with the sentiment, but Apple REALLY wanted to launch this thing in 2017 (ten year anniversary, of course), so some compromises were made.

It's not so hideous that it will stop most people from buying it, and while there are certainly people that will claim to like it, I will continue to have a hard time believing it would be their choice if there was a true "all screen" (or lesser notch) option instead. It's fine to like the only option we were given instead, but that doesn't mean you have to love the notch just because they had to rush something less attractive to market.

The notch is ugly. I'll still buy it anyway. Apple gets richer...

 

[mrklaw]

What is this magic phone that can embed cameras and IR emitters under a screen?

Putting an ultrasonic fingerprint reader is one thing because that doesn’t need light to work. But a camera is pretty much impossible to hide without some amazing breakthroughs

 

[MEJHarrison]

I don’t think I’ve ever heard of people complain that their 70+ inch tv doesn’t use the full screen when watching just about every movie.

You need to visit a home theater forum sometime. There are actually people out there with that opinion. They don't care if they loose picture. They don't care if the picture is distorted to fit 16:9. That care that they paid $$$ for their TV and they damn well better see every pixel lit up.

They're the reason that we had widescreen and fullscreen movies for years. And they're the people who will expand their movie to fill the screen and then complain about the notch.

Trust me, they're out there.