iFixit Finds 2019 MacBook Pro Keyboard Has 'Subtle' Changes to Membrane Cover and Switches

[hotdwag]

I must be the small case where I haven't had major issues. Got the MBPesc when it first released in 2016 and haven't had any major issues with my keyboard.

However, I'm not a fool and realize it's a statistics game. I would love to buy a new MBPro 2019, though spending that much money on something with such a possible quality issue is too much. In 4 months if there are no issues present with the minor changes, might be worth it... However, can't see anyone purchasing a 2019 right now unless they absolutely need.

 

[anshuvorty]

My guess is that an additional 0.5mm would suddenly create screen breakage problems. The tolerances for modern electronics are such that minute changes will create more problems. As it is, you see imprints of the keyboard on the screen. Another half millimeter and the added pressure on the screen would break it. Until Apple redesigns the entire laptop, they will stay with the same keyboard with only minor tweaks.

The good news is that Apple uses the same designs for about 4 years, so the next version should be that 16” MBP with micro-LED that Ming-Chi Kuo talked about. Will it have a new keyboard? My guess is yes. They have to in order to avoid four more years of bad press.

If Apple wasn't as rich as it was today, it wouldn't be able to afford 4 years of bad press and bad publicity about a key product in its product stack. In a different time and different era, you would've seen Apple address this issue ASAP, IMHO.

This just goes to show how the financial aspect of a company can leverage its decision making, if not directly, but indirectly, as seen here....sigh...

 

[WolfSnap]

And Apple is so confident about the fix that they already included the 2019 MBP in the repair program...what a joke...
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They did already...LOL

You're complaining that Apple is warranting their keyboard for 4 years?? So, car manufacturers who offer increased warranty's for their drivetrain does it only because their drivetrain sucks?

Seems like if I know something will last a good long time, I can ALSO offer a really long warranty -- doesn't cost me extra to do it, since I know it's a great design.

 

[Dave-Z]

actually Windows ruff said.

I know this is an Apple-centric forum, but I do wish people would quantify their comments about Windows.

I've been using Windows 10 since the beginning of the year and haven't had any issues. There are a lot of updates, but it's like that with other operating systems, too. iOS just had two releases this month. I run several Linux servers and those routinely have patches and security updates. About the only operating system I have used (I don't anymore) that ever seemed to differ updates was macOS, where I would read about vulnerabilities only to have Apple sit on releasing updates.

Edit: I should add that with Windows I usually only have to reboot once a month. Even then it happens during times when I'm not using the computer (Windows let's you specify hours you're not using the machine specifically, or in the latest release can monitor the hours you use and figure out when it's best). Updates are applied automatically and I don't even notice most of the time. (Unlike iOS where I literally have to stop everything I'm doing to apply the update.)

 

[linxy33]

If Apple wasn't as rich as it was today, it wouldn't be able to afford 4 years of bad press and bad publicity about a key product in its product stack. In a different time and different era, you would've seen Apple address this issue ASAP, IMHO.

This just goes to show how the financial aspect of a company can leverage its decision making, if not directly, but indirectly, as seen here....sigh...

This.
Its becomes more and more clear their iPhone is their beloved child and the Mac is their stepchild that ended up in jail.

 

[oldmacs]

because issue has been overblown by the media which has affected sales and the macbook brand

So apple quietly redesigns the keyboard multiple times for no reason?

If it was simply an over blown story then apple’s response would be different.

 

[oneMadRssn]

If that's indeed the case then why don't they update the old keyboards? (Apple uses them for repairs)
It's so easy to change the dome material with the new material, cost is negliable.

I think Apple said they could update the 2018 MBP keyboards, and may do so when servicing them. However, I think the older (gen1 and gen2) butterfly keyboards can't be updated because the pre-membrane (gen3) design had different dimensions for the key frames and domes.

 

[mikethemartian]

You're complaining that Apple is warranting their keyboard for 4 years?? So, car manufacturers who offer increased warranty's for their drivetrain does it only because their drivetrain sucks?

Seems like if I know something will last a good long time, I can ALSO offer a really long warranty -- doesn't cost me extra to do it, since I know it's a great design.

It’s not the “only” reason but often times it is the reason when you look at settlements from class action suits.

 

[smirking]

I must be the small case where I haven't had major issues. Got the MBPesc when it first released in 2016 and haven't had any major issues with my keyboard.

No, you're in the majority. Most people aren't having issues with the keyboard. There are a handful of MR posters who have every reason to complain as they managed to get one lemon after another, but most of the peanut gallery don't even own a butterfly key model of laptop. They're just being part of the echo chamber.

With that 4 year keyboard replacement in place, I would not hesitate a moment to pick up a new MBP. If the keyboard fails, I get a new battery and by the 4 year mark, you're almost certain to need a new battery. I would almost hope for a keyboard failure given this arrangement.

I'm on my second MBP... I had minor keyboard issues with the 2016 that sorted itself out. The 2018 that I'm using now hasn't had a hiccup at all.
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Seems like if I know something will last a good long time, I can ALSO offer a really long warranty -- doesn't cost me extra to do it, since I know it's a great design.

I think they're doing it so anyone who has any hesitation based on what they've heard won't be so hesitant. A four year warranty on any part is awesome, especially when that warranty comes with a free brand new laptop battery, which you are surely going to need at some point. I'm lovin this arrangement.

 

[joeswamp]

If Apple wasn't as rich as it was today, it wouldn't be able to afford 4 years of bad press and bad publicity about a key product in its product stack. In a different time and different era, you would've seen Apple address this issue ASAP, IMHO.

This just goes to show how the financial aspect of a company can leverage its decision making, if not directly, but indirectly, as seen here....sigh...

This is a very good point. When companies get big and successful, they also tend to get complacent and stop listening to their customers. Then they enter a long slow decline, then they go down hard. Think of the end of DEC or GM before the bankruptcy.

 

[ls1dreams]

I'll let someone else guinea pig these, thanks Apple.

Really just feels like they don't want to invest in the tooling to completely fix this until they release their next gen body style. Likely will be 2020 based on previous cycles.

 

[mikethemartian]

Microsoft and HP don't have computer in their name..

HP didn’t start out as a computer company. The true original part of HP made test equipment and was spun off and renamed Agilent around 1999 and again spun off and renamed Keysight about five years ago.

 

[genovelle]

What’s interesting is that according to other reports the failure rate of the previous design was actually higher. I have an issue with the concept of a repair score. For instance iPhone got low score because it did not have an easily removable battery. But I can tell you from personal experience in dealing with other phone before iPhone including the Palm Treo Smartphone, the removable battery was the cause of device failure and it didn’t take years.

 

[smirking]

When companies get big and successful, they also tend to get complacent and stop listening to their customers.

One problem with that statement... Apple got successful by not listening to their customers. Steve Jobs was said to be a Henry Ford type who didn't have much love for focus groups.

 

[Analog Kid]

If Apple wasn't as rich as it was today, it wouldn't be able to afford 4 years of bad press and bad publicity about a key product in its product stack. In a different time and different era, you would've seen Apple address this issue ASAP, IMHO.

This just goes to show how the financial aspect of a company can leverage its decision making, if not directly, but indirectly, as seen here....sigh...

I'm sorry, are you saying that because Apple is rich, they don't care if the sell products anymore?

 

[Count Blah]

My god. Looking back, those non-Retina MBPs were disgusting. Thick and Heavy. Jesus

I’m still sporting my 2012 15” cMBP w/ 16 gigs of RAM and 1tb SSD. As long as I don’t do anything graphically intensive, it still gets it done. Granted it’s parked and hooked up to a monitor. For heavy lifting, I have a PC. It’s an awesome setup that works great for me.

One man’s trash is another man’s treasure.

 

[genovelle]

Great!

Now fix the problem where the F-keys turns into a cumbersome OLED display and all the ports seem to vanish. Once the Esc/F-keys are working again and USB/SD slots reappear we're back to a working laptop!

F-keys are useless to 90% of customers. Power users are the only ones using them as most use a click device to control software. I have 3 macs with SD slots two are 9 years old and have never had a card in them. Old USB ports rarely get used too. This is something Apple knows from use data.

 

[petvas]

My 2018 15" MBP's keyboard seems to be holding up well...then again, I baby my equipment so that could have something to do with it.

My dilemma now is, should I take advantage of having my keyboard replaced now before it conks on me or just keep it going?

You can't as long as your keyboard works flawlessly. You can take advantage of the repair program when your laptop does indeed require a keyboard related repair.

 

[joeswamp]

One problem with that statement... Apple got successful by not listening to their customers. Steve Jobs was said to be a Henry Ford type who didn't have much love for focus groups.

Apple got successful by surprising and delighting their customers with great original designs. When products were hated by customers (e.g. the hockey puck mouse) they used to get rid of them quickly.

They didn't use focus groups for strategy but that doesn't mean they didn't listen to customers.

 

[genovelle]

I’m still sporting my 2012 15” cMBP w/ 16 gigs of RAM and 1tb SSD. As long as I don’t do anything graphically intensive, it still gets it done. Granted it’s parked and hooked up to a monitor. For heavy lifting, I have a PC. It’s an awesome setup that works great for me.

One man’s trash is another man’s treasure.

For a portable they are pretty heavy. I have a 2010 that I had to go to buy an air for school because it was just much to drag around all day.

 

[JronMasteR]

How can you fail at a keyboard... multiple times...

 

[pmau]

My god. Looking back, those non-Retina MBPs were disgusting. Thick and Heavy. Jesus

I have two of them here ... 2009 and 2011.
The 2011 has a 17" display that still looks amazing and does not stutter because it drives less pixels.
No, not the NVIDIA one, the AMD one. I forgot what it was:

THIS: https://support.apple.com/kb/sp646?locale=en_US

It still is a great machine. I owned a Retina MBP 2012 with full specs, dedicated GP etc.
It died of water damage.

I have never paid a dime for a MacBook and I will not unless Apple changes the design.

 

[coolfactor]

good

now, when will we see that all glass haptic keyboard?

I think that would be horrible! typing on a flat surface would be a nightmare, haptic or not. But hey, anything is possible! Maaybe if the glass surface had indentations for the keys, then you still have that reassurance that your fingers are in the right place, but then what's the point since the keys would be restricted to physical locations, defeating the whole purpose of a dynamic keyboard layout.

There is research into surfaces that can change shape dynamically, and that's what would be needed for a true all-glass keyboard replacement, not just a display-like keyboard.
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How can you fail at a keyboard... multiple times...

I don't know why people fail to understand this. It's a new design, not a 30+ year old design. It's going to take trial and error to get right, just like earlier keyboards did. The difference is the thinness. Old keyboards could use big, chunky, physical switches that were easier to build and had greater movement to ensure up-and-down operation. These new keyboards are extremely thin, use tiny parts, yet need to offer the same experience. It takes tremendous engineering. Yes, Apple has failed to deliver perfection on selling products, and that's a shame, but not unrealistic. Nobody can be perfect all the time. I say lighten up.

 

[JronMasteR]

When I bought my first laptop, the 17" MBP 10 years ago, I was just amazed by how amazing it was. It was so far ahead compared to anything else on the market.
Now, It's just an overpriced piece of trash... Failing keyboard, overheating hardware, extremely bad warranty terms. And Mac OS is also getting worse...
I'd not buy any mac in its current state
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I think that would be horrible! typing on a flat surface would be a nightmare, haptic or not. But hey, anything is possible! Maaybe if the glass surface had indentations for the keys, then you still have that reassurance that your fingers are in the right place, but then what's the point since the keys would be restricted to physical locations, defeating the whole purpose of a dynamic keyboard layout.

There is research into surfaces that can change shape dynamically, and that's what would be needed for a true all-glass keyboard replacement, not just a display-like keyboard.
[doublepost=1558728758][/doublepost]

I don't know why people fail to understand this. It's a new design, not a 30+ year old design. It's going to take trial and error to get right, just like earlier keyboards did. The difference is the thinness. Old keyboards could use big, chunky, physical switches that were easier to build and had greater movement to ensure up-and-down operation. These new keyboards are extremely thin, use tiny parts, yet need to offer the same experience. It takes tremendous engineering. Yes, Apple has failed to deliver perfection on selling products, and that's a shame, but not unrealistic. Nobody can be perfect all the time. I say lighten up.

Seriously??? You are going to defend Apple on this one? A company that designs a keyboard that does fail because of a bit of dirt beneath the cap?
And no, the old keyboard was not "a 30 year old design".

 

[Crowbot]

Nurses with long nails is disgusting and unsanitary.

True but you try doing something about it. I couldn't