International 4G iPad Models Will Work on AT&T, Not on LTE in Home Countries

[craznar]

Maybe the problem here is that Americans accept hspa+ and dc-hspa as 4G and in Europe we don't?

Because (from what I have read) full '4G' is supposed to operate fully over TCP/IP (including voice calls).

Whilst 42Mbps data is damned fast for 3.5G (as Telstra calls it), it still uses traditional methods for voice.

So even if you count DC-HSPA etc as 4G, it isn't FULL 4G.

 

[KPOM]

Because (from what I have read) full '4G' is supposed to operate fully over TCP/IP (including voice calls).

Whilst 42Mbps data is damned fast for 3.5G (as Telstra calls it), it still uses traditional methods for voice.

So even if you count DC-HSPA etc as 4G, it isn't FULL 4G.

And this is relevant to the iPad how?

Also, there is no official voice standard for LTE yet, though VoLTE seems to be emerging as a de facto standard.

 

[KPOM]

If the AT&T and Verizon models both use LTE over the 700 MHz band, then why does there need to be two different versions?

I thought one of the biggest advantages of LTE is that we wouldn't have to worry about the GSM/CDMA separation in the US anymore.

They use different frequencies within the 700MHz band, only a small part of which overlaps. Plus, AT&T also uses the 2100MHz band, which Verizon does not use. Also, as has been pointed out, when LTE is not available, AT&T reverts to HSPA+/UMTS in the 850 and 1900MHz bands, while Verizon reverts to CDMA EVDO in the 850 and 1900MHz bands.

Also, since there is no official voice standard for LTE yet, our incompatible 3G voice networks will survive for quite a while.

 

[justperry]

Also don't forget, the WI-FI version has no GPS (just like the iPad 2) but the "4G" models do.

Sorry to awake you from your dream but it does NOT have GPS, it has Assisted GPS which is by no means as accurate as normal GPS.

http://www.apple.com/ipad/specs/
Edit : As Geko29 ↓↓↓ points out I am wrong.

So many people complaining about not having LTE while DC-HSDPA is plenty enough for >95% of the people.
It's more than enough for streaming, and it's not like a desktop computer where people want fast internet because they download (illegal) stuff.
In a couple of years we have LTE Adv and even then there will be people complaining it's not fast enough, then what is?

 

[taran420]

so wait, If i buy an ipad 3 4G in Canada, it will work fine without any restrictions on AT&T network, right? just making sure since I want to buy some a gift and they will use it on AT&T

 

[geko29]

Sorry to awake you from your dream but it does NOT have GPS, it has Assisted GPS which is by no means as accurate as normal GPS.

http://www.apple.com/ipad/specs/

This is like saying "your car does not have a diesel engine, it has a turbodiesel, which makes a fraction of the power and is less efficient". Both statements are absolute hogwash, for the exact same reason.

"Standalone" or "Autonomous" GPS operation uses radio signals from satellites alone. A-GPS additionally uses network resources to locate and utilize the satellites in poor signal conditions.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assisted_GPS

If what you are implying were true, the iPad 2 3G would be incapable of getting a location fix with the radios turned off or the SIM card removed. But alas, it works just fine in both cases, as well as in the middle of nowhere when no wireless signal of any kind is available.

But I guess I dreamed all this.

 

[justperry]

This is like saying "your car does not have a diesel engine, it has a turbodiesel, which makes a fraction of the power and is less efficient". Both statements are absolute hogwash, for the exact same reason.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assisted_GPS

If what you are implying were true, the iPad 2 3G would be incapable of getting a location fix with the radios turned off or the SIM card removed. But alas, it works just fine in both cases, as well as in the middle of nowhere when no wireless signal of any kind is available.

But I guess I dreamed all this.

I was wrong, sorry for that, not until now I read more about it I realized that Assisted GPS is GPS with the assistance of cell towers, I always thought/assumed that Assisted GPS was relying ONLY on cell towers and was far less accurate.

Thanks for clarifying

 

[apolkowski]

Obsolete data

It's not the commitment anyone's questioning, it's the actual state of affairs. Right now, the UK, France, Switzerland, Belgium, Netherlands, Italy, Spain, and Portugal are only in the deployment phase. It sounds like DT in Germany is just about where AT&T was a few months ago (i.e. not very far along).

Certainly, over the next 1-2 the situation will improve dramatically, just as it has here over the past year, but by then Apple will have released additional updates. Now that they have dropped the numeric naming scheme there might be more frequent minor updates to do just that. I also wouldn't be surprised if the next iPhone has more frequencies.

This is not true in regard to Poland. We have two providers actively promoting LTE, which covers around 22% of population with the speed up to 100mb/sec. Just google LTE Poland to see coverage. So not only US.

 

[meatballs]

The Samsung Galaxy Tab 8.9 works on the LTE network here in Sweden but the upcoming flagship tablet will not. Apple #FAIL.

 

[Pandakopanda]

According to the german site:

Das neue iPad unterstützt schnelle Datennetze auf der ganzen Welt – bis zu 4G LTE.(2)

(2) Datentarife separat erhältlich. Die 4G Abdeckung ist nicht in allen Regionen verfügbar und abhängig vom Anbieter. Nähere Informationen sind beim jeweiligen Mobilfunkanbieter erhältlich.

What I get out of this text is that the iPad supports 4G in certain regions in Germany. If that isn't the case, this text for me is a bit disingenuous; they should say the 4G is only supported in the US+Canada or not mention it at all.

LTE is not a feature if you can't use it in your own country.

 

[Anghammarad]

I was wrong, sorry for that, not until now I read more about it I realized that Assisted GPS is GPS with the assistance of cell towers, I always thought/assumed that Assisted GPS was relying ONLY on cell towers and was far less accurate.

Thanks for clarifying

Wow. Someone actually admitting that he was wrong. A rare bird indeed on an internet forum. Thumbs up to you sir.

(and no, I am not being sarcastic)


On, the subject of LTE in Europe, or indeed the whole world outside of NA, I think that this may well be Apple's biggest mistake in several years.

 

[teena77]

According to the german site:

What I get out of this text is that the iPad supports 4G in certain regions in Germany. If that isn't the case, this text for me is a bit disingenuous; they should say the 4G is only supported in the US+Canada or not mention it at all.

LTE is not a feature if you can't use it in your own country.

The iPad3 does NOT support LTE in Germany (in NO region, wrong frequency) (iam from germany)
and yes, they should change the text bec iam sure that other companies will sue Apple Germany bec this is simply wrong.

But the text itself (youre right) is unclear if it means that LTE + Germany is meant in combination or more a "LTE OR Germany"

and as i mentioned here a few Times. There is LTE nealy everywhere in the countryside in germany now and cities are starting to now BUT LTE does not mean UMTS/HSDPA is also available.

So in most Regions in the Countryside this means LTE OR GPRS

 

[Ramchi]

Will it work in 3G Networks in India?

I don't know this new iPad works with 3G network since in India we don't have 4G yet( not expecting any soon). I can consider buying the LTE model if this is the case otherwise contend with WiFi model

 

[garybUK]

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9B179 Safari/7534.48.3)

It's astounding the ignorance and sheer arrogance of some of the posts coming from the US posters in here, yes we don't have widespread deployments o LTE here but when it is next year, the iPad is redundant. People would be wise to skip this version. This is a major major fail by apple to only support us non globally agreed frequencies bad bad move

 

[kstswe]

No. There IS no 4G in Europe really, and that's their problem, not Apple's.

http://techcrunch.com/2009/12/14/4g-mobile-network-sweden-teliasonera/

rest my case ...

 

[theluggage]

Well, they call HSPA+ "4G" here in the US

Well, here in the UK, they don't. 4G == WiMax or LTE - and the bit I quoted from the UK website shows that Apple know that. There's no "live" 4G coverage yet (they've had a frack-up with the bands used by digital terrestrial TV) but there may well be in the reasonable lifespan of a new iPad.

Also here in the UK, the Advertising Standards Agency tends to base its rulings on how a typical consumer would interpret the advert, not the legal interpretation of the small print. The standard is "misleading" not "false". The current description on the "buy" page of the US store is "iPad with WiFi and 4G" which would definitely lead a customer to believe that it would work on 4G when it becomes available.

Apple are a huge company with regionalised websites - they should be capable of getting this right.

 

[kstswe]

I'm not sure you are aware of this, but there are under 10 million people in Sweden. There are cities in the world with more people than your entire extremely fine country.

Nobody has ever said that LTE hasn't been deployed in a few isolated pockets in Europe, but it hasn't yet been made available to the bulk of the population. And yes, the entire nation of Sweden IS an isolated pocket. In contrast, LTE is available today to the majority of Americans.

few people, lot of land to cover ....

The fourth largest country in Europe, Sweden has an area of 449,964 square kilometers (173,731 square miles), slightly larger than California.

http://www.nationsencyclopedia.com/economies/Europe/Sweden.html#ixzz1ohzvjOtP

 

[Neil McRae]

Well, here in the UK, they don't. 4G == WiMax or LTE - and the bit I quoted from the UK website shows that Apple know that. There's no "live" 4G coverage yet (they've had a frack-up with the bands used by digital terrestrial TV) but there may well be in the reasonable lifespan of a new iPad.

Also here in the UK, the Advertising Standards Agency tends to base its rulings on how a typical consumer would interpret the advert, not the legal interpretation of the small print. The standard is "misleading" not "false". The current description on the "buy" page of the US store is "iPad with WiFi and 4G" which would definitely lead a customer to believe that it would work on 4G when it becomes available.

Apple are a huge company with regionalised websites - they should be capable of getting this right.

totally correct http://www.apple.com/uk/ipad/features/ could get apple into a lot of trouble in the UK if it doesn't support LTE at 800/2600/1800

The page in Germany is the same and one would assume it would work with Voda or Telekom's LTE networks. I am open minded, until we see what chipset is used it could be that with software update those bands could be supported.

Neil.

 

[theluggage]

So many people complaining about not having LTE while DC-HSDPA is plenty enough for >95% of the people.

Its more a matter of principle - if Apple gets away with selling this as "4G" when its only 4G in the US and/or because they're using the corrupted US definition of "4G" then every other mobile device manufacturer will follow suit and, when LTE does roll out in a year or so, its going to be hell on wheels figuring out which products are compatible.

Yes, I'd be more than happy with DC-HSDPA at the moment, but when 4G arrives I'd expect an "iPad with WiFi and 4G" bought in the UK to work.

 

[BiteMyApple]

In contrast, LTE is available today to the majority of Americans.

Well, I'm not American but I do live in New York. LTE might be available in NYC, great. But the fact of the matter is, as of today, when I go visit my family in law in New London, CT, I never - ever - get 3G. Let alone 4G, let alone LTE.

EVEN for Americans, LTE-ready devices such as the new iPad aren't such a great deal as of today. I would definitely skip this version of the iPad if my needs required more than the wi-fi model.

 

[profets]

Its more a matter of principle - if Apple gets away with selling this as "4G" when its only 4G in the US and/or because they're using the corrupted US definition of "4G" then every other mobile device manufacturer will follow suit and, when LTE does roll out in a year or so, its going to be hell on wheels figuring out which products are compatible.

Yes, I'd be more than happy with DC-HSDPA at the moment, but when 4G arrives I'd expect an "iPad with WiFi and 4G" bought in the UK to work.

While I myself personally hate the term '4G', I don't think they'll have an issue describing hspa+/dc-hspa as 4G since the ITU has gone and defined it that manner.

Aside from that - has there been hspa+ products in europe marketed as "4G"? Or has all that nonsense been moved outside of north america?

----------

so wait, If i buy an ipad 3 4G in Canada, it will work fine without any restrictions on AT&T network, right? just making sure since I want to buy some a gift and they will use it on AT&T

Yes, no problem there.

 

[hkechoes]

A disappointed customer in Hong Kong. Even though Hong Kong now is in the list of the first-batch new iPad availability list, will start selling it in 16/3, the Store web site only lists the wifi model for pre-order. No mention about anything for 4G model except a 'coming soon' icon.

That make me (a iPad 1 user with 3G connection plan) sad, I sorely need the upgrade but without a cellular model available for now. What I want is just they sell the wifi+4G model and I am happy to use it with my 3G data plan.

 

[MacBH928]

What use is buying LTE iPad, when it won't work with the LTE in my country?
You know there are people outside the united states of america

 

[profets]

What use is buying LTE iPad, when it won't work with the LTE in my country?
You know there are people outside the united states of america

It's still useful on hspa+ and dc-hspa I would think. And for all the other reasons people use iPads besides the cellular option.

I get it though, sucks seeing LTE in the US and not anywhere else. But when did purchasing Apple products become totally about specs? I'm still somewhat surprised that Apple added 3 faster cellular options on the iPad and people are upset that only 2 out of the 3 will work in their country.

 

[Hardtimes]

Wait so, this new iPad only fully works in Murrika?

I'll stick to my iPad 2 then.