Even if we agree with the idea of eliminating the Iranian terrorist regime, starting a flat stupid war that has no realistic plan to "eliminate the Iranian terrorist regime" makes no sense. Unilaterally starting an unnecessary war is not "leading."
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Iran Reportedly Warns Apple is Among Potential Targets
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jon9091
macrumors 6502
You mean like when Trump tried to take credit for the booming economy in January 2024…when Biden was President?
The_Gream
macrumors 6502
I understand what your saying, but a treaty with a bully is just a not going to last.
Iran, according to western nations and the Middle Eastern nations, has been a hostile entity since the regime took over. Expect no one has had the spine to go in there as a collective whole and kick their teeth in.
I DO NOT agree with how Trump and his administration have handled this situation, but if we are going to blame anyone, it’s the administrations that came before his that have allowed a regime of tyranny (they are willing to kill thousands of their own citizens as well others) that should be blamed.
At the end of WWII, the American administration and/or Congress decided to stop supporting our Chinese allies. The Chinese had been in a civil war before the Japanese took over, and our Allie’s focused on fighting the invaders which worn them down while the communists hide. We stopped supporting, and the Communists won.
Jump forward to the Korean War, the US Military government of Korea (South Korea) was winning and almost had the whole peninsula. Guess what, those communist Chinese leaders sent their soldiers over into Korea to support the North. Yet, the US military was ordered to not attack the Communist soldiers because the politicians back home don’t want a war with China. That situation nearly cost our Korean allies the war. Here we are, what, 70 years plus later and still no peace.
All history has shown to me is this: That people who have the ability to stand up to bullies, generally don’t, and the suffering that comes from it lasts for generations.
Teddy Roosevelt, coined the phrase, “speak softly and carry as big stick”
Politicians have been speaking softly since 1979 with the Iranian regime, and nothing has ever come it but additional lives being lost on all sides.
Maybe you’re too young to understand that world. Here’s a starter:
The son also rises: Mojtaba Khamenei's reported European empire
Investigations have traced a reported €400m European property empire — including luxury hotels in Frankfurt — to associates of Mojtaba Khamenei, the newly elected Ayatollah.www.euronews.com
During the Cold War the Kremlin leadership was also laundering money out of the Soviet Union and buying up hotels and expensive property in the West.
There are people who think these are “adversaries” who “resist capitalism”.
They are not. They are capitalists themselves, of the worst and most primitive kind. They use religion for mass slaughter, mass child abuse, mass stock market manipulation, mass theft and mass surveillance. Even the most evil in the West do not compare to the evils that happen under a genuine theocratic dictatorship.
Right but that still doesn’t clarify which regime.
The_Gream
macrumors 6502
Biden took credit for the last round of COVID stimulus that Trump tried to get pushed through durning his first term, but the democrats pushed back on. So when those checks did come finally, it looked good for Biden and the Democrats.
Just saying, each side likes to take credit for what the other group does positively, but when it’s a negative they are all about pointing fingers.
Historically, most things a Presidential administration work to get done durning their first term don’t come to fruition until the following term (which could be them or someone else).
However it is pretty clear who the bully is in 2026, and it definitely is not Iran. Iran did not break the treaty, a bully USA POTUS broke the treaty.
[Note: I am no Iran supporter. I am just a citizen appalled by really stupid actions by a POTUS.]
To know why Iran is what it is today is to have a little grasp of a tiny bit of history, just a little effort will do very nicely.
theconversation.com
Excerpt from above and this should be a well known fact for ALL.
"The British- and American-backed plot to overthrow Iran’s prime minister in 1953 laid the groundwork for the 1979 Iran hostage crisis and decades of hostility with the U.S. that have now culminated in a war launched on Iran by the U.S. and Israel".
Or do a search for U.S. history with Iran also Eisenhower war quotes, you know or should know his history to the U.S.😀
Decades of hostility between Iran and the US were preceded by a little-remembered century-long friendship
Many Americans only know the history of anger and tension with Iran. But an archaeologist who has spent 45 years focusing on Iran says it is worth recalling the time when the countries were friends.
theconversation.com
Excerpt from above and this should be a well known fact for ALL.
"The British- and American-backed plot to overthrow Iran’s prime minister in 1953 laid the groundwork for the 1979 Iran hostage crisis and decades of hostility with the U.S. that have now culminated in a war launched on Iran by the U.S. and Israel".
Or do a search for U.S. history with Iran also Eisenhower war quotes, you know or should know his history to the U.S.😀
Madhatter32
macrumors 68000
Yeah sure ... what do you care if New York gets eviscerated as promised by the terrorist regime in Tehran? It's not your people.
Mrkevinfinnerty
macrumors 68040
Madhatter32
macrumors 68000
That is not the stated goal though. The actual objective is to remove Iran's nuclear and long range ballistic missile capability (which Iran has proven it has). USA definitely leading per usual. I am genuinely surprised that people seem to be living under a rock for the last 47 years.
You really need to read your history books, especially relating to Iran! If all this is actually true, why isn't the world grateful? This is an illegal war and the US is committing war crimes by attacking civilian infrastructure and civilians. The US and Israel have isolated themselves for the family of mankind.
jon9091
macrumors 6502
You’ll have to pick a lane…people say that the third round of Covid Stimulus checks are what ignited the rise in inflation. So, if you’re saying that Trump tried to push them though…then the rise in inflation was his fault. BTW, the previous two rounds of checks were delayed because Donnie insisted that they have his name on them.
And Dozy Don is the one to wake everyone up? He couldn’t even keep his eyes open through a 5-minute camera appearance.
steve62388
macrumors 68040
The stated goal? That’s changed more times than trump’s position on tariffs.
How Trump's stated reasons, goals and timeline for Iran war have shifted
President Donald Trump and his top officials have offered shifting objectives and reasons for the U.S.-Israeli war on Iran, which critics say shows a lack of planning for the conflict and its aftermath.
Madhatter32
macrumors 68000
History books ... good grief. Stop with the propaganda please. The Iranian regime is pure evil by almost any measure. It has been plain to see for anyone paying attention for the last 47 years. But if you pick up a newspaper, you would know that the Iranian Regime you love so much murdered 36,000 innocent Iranian protestors in the street in a matter of ten days. It was one of the biggest massacres of civilians since WWII. It is using cluster munitions against civilian populations. So spare me your empty talk about "war crimes."
magicschoolbus
macrumors 68030
The Iran war was going to happen eventually regardless of who was president.
The_Gream
macrumors 6502
100% agree that Trump is a spoiled brat and bully.
The fact that nether Congress or the Supreme Court seem do be doing anything about it though, speaks a lot louder to me than the rants of a man-child.
Durning his whole tariffs poop show, if every other leader in the world had just kept on trucking and ignored him like they should have, the only people who would have been ultimately hurt by it would have been the American people.
Yet, nearly every leader retaliated like the morons they are.
I think only the new Mexican president, whatever her name is, called Trump’s bluffs and threats. Notice how, Trump has pretty much left Mexico allow in his whole war on drugs?
A war crime is a war crime regardless of who commits it. Be it Iran, Israel or USA.
One don’t get a pass just because another does it.
And you can spare us your right-wing talking points. Condemning one crime doesn’t mean you’re condoning the other criminal. We don’t make excuses for criminal behavior just because we voted for him.
Madhatter32
macrumors 68000
Using a primary source, Pete Hegseth himself, which he has repeatedly stated for anyone willing to listen, the goals of the US operation are as follows:The stated goal? That’s changed more times than trump’s position on tariffs.
How Trump's stated reasons, goals and timeline for Iran war have shifted
President Donald Trump and his top officials have offered shifting objectives and reasons for the U.S.-Israeli war on Iran, which critics say shows a lack of planning for the conflict and its aftermath.www.reuters.com
Objectives: A four-part strategy to militarily cripple Iran's ability to act against U.S. or allied interests.
- Destroy Offensive Missiles: Neutralize existing missile arsenals.
- Destroy Missile Production: Raze the infrastructure used to produce missiles and drones.
- Destroy Naval and Security Infrastructure: Target Iranian naval forces and security apparatus.
- Deny Nuclear Capability: Permanently ensure Iran cannot develop or possess nuclear weapons.
You need to go farther back than 1979. As I say, read your history books. It's American history as well, as you will find out.
And don't make accusations like "the Iranian regime you love so much" when that's patently untrue ... I do not think you will find anyone one this forum who supports the recent or past massacres carried out by the regime against their own people.
The US has a track record of attacking other countries (think Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan) and it has rarely turned out well for either the citizens of those countries or the US.
Absolutely. All governments are corrupt no exceptions. All politicians are nonces out for themselves and misusing tax payers money.
As for religion there should be a global ban on all religion. Just shut down and demolish all churches, synagogues, mosques etc. Amazing how much influence it has in society considering it’s just made up gibberish that never happened.
Madhatter32
macrumors 68000
Yes, it is Iran that is commiting war crimes .... eggregious war crimes no less. That's apparently okay with you. So, not sure what you are going on about with your left-wing talking points.
The_Gream
macrumors 6502
The whole Covid 19 thing was all in the last year of Trumps first term of 2020. Biden inherited the mess from Jan 2021 to Jan 2025
Personally I don’t really care who pushed and pulled. The fact that I was working 60+ ish hours a week while other people set at home making more money is what pissed me off.
Place I worked for couldn’t find help, cause government was paying people more to sit at home. Money should have gone to the people working in those so called ‘essential’ businesses, and even more to the real essential workers.
Yes, Donald Trump likes to put his name on everything. Wish I was independently wealthy, I would run for President and my whole campaign would be to use my own money to take his name off of stuff. Oh, I would also actually put my money where my mouth is and focus on fixing the problems in the USA; like Flint Michigan’s water.
Oh man! If the DUI hire said it, it must’ve been true and well thought out. He proved his expertise on national security once already with the Signal chats. You’re not instilling much confidence here with that.
Also, what you’re implying was, we shouldn’t be listening to or believe anything the “commander-in-chief” says but the alcoholic he appointed?
Not one person here said they’re okay with Iran’s atrocities and that includes you. Stop reading between the lines that are not there.