What are you actually looking for ? There is a scientific explanation at post 166, and subjective reactions posted throughout this thread confirming the problem.
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iPhone 12 Is iPhone 12 still using PWM OLED?
- Thread starter changguangyu
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But you DO have time to write long winding questions, and trolling by your own admission?
(By the way it was literally just a few posts above yours.)
Alright anyway, have a good read of this thread - you'll find everything you need.
If I do write a long winding post, it is not in one sitting lol. And yeah, I sometimes troll you guys, for two reasons. 1 out of boredom, and 2 because some of the posts here, even though we are enthusiasts, just beg for it. But hey, call me what you will. I don't mind, and probably wont take offence.But you DO have time to write long winding questions, and trolling by your own admission?
(By the way it was literally just a few posts above yours.)
Alright anyway, have a good read of this thread - you'll find everything you need.
Thanks.
What the hell are you talking about 😀
I didn't even know about these issues before I got an OLED.
Same probably goes for most users as the X was the first to use OLED.
Well I preordered the Mini. Fingers crossed that it will be OK, I think it will be a fantastic phone in every way- but I am just worry about any effects from the PWM.
According to Notebookcheck, it looks like the most shallow flicker is actually around 50% brightness, so I hope setting it there and then using reduce white point to keep it dark enough not to fry my sensitive eyeballs will make it usable.
According to Notebookcheck, it looks like the most shallow flicker is actually around 50% brightness, so I hope setting it there and then using reduce white point to keep it dark enough not to fry my sensitive eyeballs will make it usable.
It isn’t, there’s clearly flicker in CNET’s hands-on video.
I’ve had a bunch of android phone’s that have oled screens and every single one hurt my eyes I took them all back within a week, I bought the iPhone 12 last week and my eyes were constantly watering, felt like my retinas were burning, and it gave me a weird dizzy feeling just looking at it, took it back within 3 days and went back to my iPhone 11, I hope these phone makers fix this problem
We give Apple too much credit with their products. Apple only designs the product and uses technology that is available to them, engineered by others. Samsung is the reason these OLED panels use low frequency PWM.
I have hated Samsung ever since I learned in early 2000s that they produce the first batch of a TV model (LCD at the time) with their better panels produced in South Korea and then after the first batch is out (and all of the TV reviewers have had their say) then they switch to their crappy panels built in Mexico, completely different quality. All with the same model number. Samsung is a shady company.
LG Display, on the other hand, makes the best panels. Of course, they have lower-end stuff -- even Mercedes has their A-Class line of vehicles -- but their mid- to premium- panels are the best on the market. (i.e. LG OLED TVs, LG UltraFine 5K monitors, etc.)
I'm not letting Apple off the hook... we have all notified them of this issue since iPhone X was released and they have done nothing. Apple does not care about us.
Computer monitors used to use PWM (some crappy ones still do, but it's rare), and then people complained and now computer monitors are PWM-free ("flicker-free"). This is just a damn shame.
I have hated Samsung ever since I learned in early 2000s that they produce the first batch of a TV model (LCD at the time) with their better panels produced in South Korea and then after the first batch is out (and all of the TV reviewers have had their say) then they switch to their crappy panels built in Mexico, completely different quality. All with the same model number. Samsung is a shady company.
LG Display, on the other hand, makes the best panels. Of course, they have lower-end stuff -- even Mercedes has their A-Class line of vehicles -- but their mid- to premium- panels are the best on the market. (i.e. LG OLED TVs, LG UltraFine 5K monitors, etc.)
I'm not letting Apple off the hook... we have all notified them of this issue since iPhone X was released and they have done nothing. Apple does not care about us.
Computer monitors used to use PWM (some crappy ones still do, but it's rare), and then people complained and now computer monitors are PWM-free ("flicker-free"). This is just a damn shame.
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Notebookcheck says that it doesn’t use PWM at 100% brightness, although I don’t think it’s truly flicker-free based on videos I've seen.
I tested one with another camera, it flickers from 0 - 100%, but the depth is 100% only when the brightness is lower than around 45%, so keep the brightness higher than 45% might help.
What kind of scientist? A scientist can be an expert of agriculture, space, Ophthalmology and the list goes on and on. Just because you are a scientist does not mean you can invalidate the opinion of others who are really affected by PWM. PWM is real and it is not pseudoscience at all. Until and unless a scientist says something which is verifiable and authentic, it does not have more weight than the opinion of others who are not scientists.
It’s not a problem so to speak. It’s a cheap way to control screen brightness. There is a way to make oled screens that don’t use pwm, but it costs more so Samsung and others done utilize it.
I suffer from pwm myself, and I’m not holding my breath that this will ever be fixed until we move on to new tech. I’m hoping micro led won’t use pwm, but I haven’t looked into it. For now, the issue only concerns such a small amount of users that it won’t be addressed. These companies aren’t losing money, therefore they have no incentive to “fix” the issue. I personally have completely moved on from the hobby of buying phones every year. I can’t use the new ones, so it sucks the enjoyment out of it.
Even removing my interest in phones from the equation, as a parent whose children are now being educated exclusively via Zoom on iPads, I am concerned that they are all battling eye fatigue and frequent headaches.
If tech doesn’t have to hurt like this, and it’s all due to penny pinching, all of us relying on these displays for our education and livelihoods need to sort this out with Apple and other companies. I also need to sort this out with the school administration but that’s another uphill battle.
The first step is trying to get this issue recognized by experts. My ophthalmologist seems completely unaware. He didn’t seem to care when I brought the subject up. He seemed to think it is something for a neurologist to be concerned with. The problem is, I see my ophthalmologist annually, but I have seen a neurologist only a handful of times in my life, and it was pretty damned hard to get a referral on one kind of insurance I used to have. Most people never see one.
For awareness to happen and for the necessary evidence to be collected and studied, we need to reach a certain critical mass of people reporting to their doctors, so that the medical profession starts caring, then legislators, employers, schools and so forth.
Apple won’t really know what direction to go, themselves. They don’t have any data to consult. Most of what we seem to know seems to be coming from these grassroots discussions. And we see how well that’s going over with people not experiencing this for themselves.
FWIW, I think Apple have tried to address the problem. I can use the 11 Pro and 12. I couldn’t look at their older OLED displays at all. They do change the “formula” from year to year trying to get better aesthetic results and fight burn-in. I think it is hard for them to chase those goals without throwing us pwm sensitive customers off balance. I have had watering stinging eyes on my 12 Pro and 12, coming from the 11 Pro. I’m adjusting. But I discovered a new wrinkle with the new displays is that I get sort of a pressure headache wearing my glasses while watching videos on my 12. It may be due to my lenses being polarized. I never noticed that problem on my 11 Pro display. So while the displays are as gorgeous as ever, maybe more so, they’re different from last year’s in some way.
A: Yes
Test-Apple-iPhone-12-Smartphone-Apple-Handy-mit-5G.499652.0.html
It's actually slightly worse than 11 pro which is 290 hz. Unsure if this is just 12 though.
Test-Apple-iPhone-12-Smartphone-Apple-Handy-mit-5G.499652.0.html
It's actually slightly worse than 11 pro which is 290 hz. Unsure if this is just 12 though.
Probably just the refresh rate being captured. The only design reason for PWM is to modulate panel brightness. At 100% it's not needed, not even wanted, by definition.
Well that would explain my eyes watering yet why I’m not going into full blown migraines.
actually it does flicker at 100%, the peak brightness is way higher when the phone is in bright ambient light, the 100% in settings is not really 100%