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it's 2007 all over again with the X
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DNichter
macrumors G3
It needs to be be in view of your face as one of the posts above show. For me, if I am looking at my phone for something, it will be able to see my face.
[doublepost=1508520770][/doublepost]
I think you would have to use tap to wake or raise to wake before Face ID tries to find you. It's not going to just keep looking for you while the screen is off.
roeiz
macrumors 65816
i really really hope they manage to control the battery drainage with raise to wake
or any other screen alert that works with FaceID.
i had to shut it off on the 6S+ it just killed the battery.
it needs to somehow be far far better in conserving energy AND handling the FaceID
DNichter
macrumors G3
No problems on my 7 Plus so I think the X will be fine. It has a larger battery to account for Face ID also.
Touch ID works 99.9% of the time for me (and everyone I know). I admit there are extreme situations with people fresh out of a hot tub, wearing gloves, suffering severe finger trauma, etc. where it doesn't, but it's as close to flawless for me as any electronic device feature I've ever had (and as a "nerd", I've had a lot).
Enter "Face ID". I'm certain, because I have faith in Apple, that it will work 95% of the time or better. That's awesome. Were it not for Touch ID, I'd be super excited.
But there IS Touch ID.
So why are any of us excited about a "new" feature that replaces a feature literally no one was complaining was "broken" or "insecure" prior to the X incorporating a replacement (out of necessity, but that's an entirely different argument...)?
What is it going to do SO much better than Touch ID that I'll say "wow, that really made my life easier"???
I haven't heard anyone explain that, just a bunch of spin about how cool the tech is and how well it might work. That's great, but I already HAD something that worked just fine, was super fast, and I could use WITHOUT having to look at my phone, with my eyes open, and hope I'm not on stage about to demonstrate it...
What is so great about Face ID? Not in general, but compared to Touch ID???
Enter "Face ID". I'm certain, because I have faith in Apple, that it will work 95% of the time or better. That's awesome. Were it not for Touch ID, I'd be super excited.
But there IS Touch ID.
So why are any of us excited about a "new" feature that replaces a feature literally no one was complaining was "broken" or "insecure" prior to the X incorporating a replacement (out of necessity, but that's an entirely different argument...)?
What is it going to do SO much better than Touch ID that I'll say "wow, that really made my life easier"???
I haven't heard anyone explain that, just a bunch of spin about how cool the tech is and how well it might work. That's great, but I already HAD something that worked just fine, was super fast, and I could use WITHOUT having to look at my phone, with my eyes open, and hope I'm not on stage about to demonstrate it...
What is so great about Face ID? Not in general, but compared to Touch ID???
roeiz
macrumors 65816
they change it not because it's not working. they think FaceID is the next step.
i also think so (well, any kind of futuristic face rec.)
DNichter
macrumors G3
I think the benefit is that it it will almost make biometric security invisible to the user. Maybe not at first, but as it evolves and improves, the user will just use their phone and not even have to think about the security aspect. On top of that, I think they’ll be able to use the security feature for some next level stuff that we may not even know yet. The X not showing your messages or notifications until it sees you looking at the phone is a good example of that. They may be able to do some pretty cool things with that level of interaction just from a glance. Next, it’s more secure. That’s an obvious improvement. Lastly, it allows them to get rid of the home button that was essentially holding them back from going all screen and taking that next step in iPhone design. This is the first major change to the front of an iPhone since 2007. They couldn’t do that without Face ID working as reliably as Touch ID.
How was Touch ID "not working"? Can you find me anything from a reputable source indicating it was having ANY issues at all (i.e., not a one off forum user complaining about it, but a real issue that was widespread)?
And how is it "more secure"? Because Apple says so? They plucked a number out of thin air, with no supporting research provided, and that makes it "more secure"?
I really want to know. What makes it "more secure" beyond Apple "saying so"? Because my point remains: OF COURSE THEY WOULD. They aren't going to go on stage, and say "hey everybody, we failed at getting Touch ID under the screen, so we came up with an alternative called Face ID so we could launch on time... it's not better, it's just... different!". They are going to try to hype the crap out of it, so they can SELL it.
The "not displaying messages" problem is actually made worse with Face ID, as unless someone has access to my hand they won't be seeing my messages. An accidental glance, on the other hand (literally) and someone could be seeing something I don't want them to. Is that "better"??? Really?
And how is it "more secure"? Because Apple says so? They plucked a number out of thin air, with no supporting research provided, and that makes it "more secure"?
I really want to know. What makes it "more secure" beyond Apple "saying so"? Because my point remains: OF COURSE THEY WOULD. They aren't going to go on stage, and say "hey everybody, we failed at getting Touch ID under the screen, so we came up with an alternative called Face ID so we could launch on time... it's not better, it's just... different!". They are going to try to hype the crap out of it, so they can SELL it.
The "not displaying messages" problem is actually made worse with Face ID, as unless someone has access to my hand they won't be seeing my messages. An accidental glance, on the other hand (literally) and someone could be seeing something I don't want them to. Is that "better"??? Really?
flat five
macrumors 603
i think you'll have to use faceID for a week or so then go back to using touchID... then you'll see that touchID is broken 😉
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The only time I’ve spent playing with an iPhone X was about 10-15 minutes in the hands-on area after the event, and I did not get a chance to try Face ID. But I spent time — both officially, as a member of the media, and unofficially, as a friend — with several Apple employees who are already carrying an iPhone X as their daily-use phone, and from what I observed and from what they told me — and again, several of these employees are engineers, not PR or product marketing folks — it just works. You don’t have to think about it. According to them, you get used to not thinking about it very quickly, and when you go back to a Touch ID device, it feels broken that you have to touch the button to unlock the device.
https://daringfireball.net/2017/09/iphone_x_event_thoughts_and_observations
---------------------------
[doublepost=1508534085][/doublepost]
The only time I’ve spent playing with an iPhone X was about 10-15 minutes in the hands-on area after the event, and I did not get a chance to try Face ID. But I spent time — both officially, as a member of the media, and unofficially, as a friend — with several Apple employees who are already carrying an iPhone X as their daily-use phone, and from what I observed and from what they told me — and again, several of these employees are engineers, not PR or product marketing folks — it just works. You don’t have to think about it. According to them, you get used to not thinking about it very quickly, and when you go back to a Touch ID device, it feels broken that you have to touch the button to unlock the device.
https://daringfireball.net/2017/09/iphone_x_event_thoughts_and_observations
---------------------------
there are preferences which determine what info is available to see/use on an unlocked phone:
Settings-> TouchID & Passcode-> Allow Access When Locked (toggles)
or
Settings-> Notifications (allow or disallow per app or global)
depending on your preferences, i could see or access a lot of things on your locked touchID based phone.. with or without your hand or explicit permission..
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DNichter
macrumors G3
Haha remember, it’s a phone. Deep breaths. Also, the same people that made Touch ID also made Face ID. The biometric security feature you know and love, has been deemed inferior by the exact same people that created it. That should give you all you need to know. Or not. You can also just be a hard no to Face ID and you will never buy an iPhone after the 8. That’s cool too.
It is what, sleeker? That in fact is not a pro or a con it's just a descriptor. However let's just say for the sake of the argument that 'sleeker' is indeed a good characteristic with regard to aesthetics.
With regard to the above that is only about design, it is not about functionality. Functionality is obviously the most important characteristic in any product this is used a lot. Having said that, that does not mean that one cannot sacrifice a bit of functionality for a good design depending on a particular situation. For example, Samsung and others have elected to put a fingerprint scanner on the back of the phone. This is better for the main design of the phone, but it does sacrifice a bit of functionality but it's not a critical sacrifice just a slight inconvenience.
I would say this is a perfectly acceptable sacrifice of function for the sake of form. It's not a decision that I agree with but it's still an acceptable compromise. It is not a compromise that Apple would make because it's not very pretty and it's also more awkward, what would be in Apple's mind a lose/lose situation. In Samsung's mind it's a win/lose situation with regard to form/functionality.
However objectively this cannot be said for the downward curved sides of the Samsung Galaxy. The reason for this is that the fingerprint scanner is only in use for mere seconds, perhaps dozens of times a day, still it's a trivial amount of the overall time that a phone is used. But the screen on a modern smartphone's primary purpose is not just to dial numbers, it's a major part of what the phone does. From viewing video, photos, or playing games, it is the primary focus and interface.
This is why I would argue that the sacrifice of downward curved sides that actually are part of the screen's content are a functionally bad design decision, due to the very simple fact that both sides of the phone will always have glare and reflection down at least one but more likely both sides of the phone. The only time this would not occur would be using the phone in a dark room.
None of the flagship phone manufacturers have gone down this route, even though amongst the non iOS phones the competition is solely down to the hardware as they all run, apart from some tweaking, a flavour of Android. They all see what Samsung has done, and none of them feel it's a good enough compromise to make, even though Samsung is the most profitable non iOS smartphone.
I do not hear any people who like Android, wishing for Google, LG, Xiaomi, Essential, Huwaei, HCT etc to adopt this design decision. And there will come a time maybe as soon as next year, when Samsung will go back to a flat display because you know it makes sense.
Below is an 'official' photo produced by Samsung.
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iSayBoourns
Suspended
It is what, sleeker? That in fact is not a pro or a con it's just a descriptor. However let's just say for the sake of the argument that 'sleeker' is indeed a good characteristic with regard to aesthetics.
With regard to the above that is only about design, it is not about functionality. Functionality is obviously the most important characteristic in any product this is used a lot. Having said that, that does not mean that one cannot sacrifice a bit of functionality for a good design depending on a particular situation. For example, Samsung and others have elected to put a fingerprint scanner on the back of the phone. This is better for the main design of the phone, but it does sacrifice a bit of functionality but it's not a critical sacrifice just a slight inconvenience.
I would say this is a perfectly acceptable sacrifice of function for the sake of form. It's not a decision that I agree with but it's still an acceptable compromise. It is not a compromise that Apple would make because it's not very pretty and it's also more awkward, what would be in Apple's mind a lose/lose situation. In Samsung's mind it's a win/lose situation with regard to form/functionality.
However objectively this cannot be said for the downward curved sides of the Samsung Galaxy. The reason for this is that the fingerprint scanner is only in use for mere seconds, perhaps dozens of times a day, still it's a trivial amount of the overall time that a phone is used. But the screen on a modern smartphone's primary purpose is not just to dial numbers, it's a major part of what the phone does. From viewing video, photos, or playing games, it is the primary focus and interface.
This is why I would argue that the sacrifice of downward curved sides that actually are part of the screen's content are a functionally bad design decision, due to the very simple fact that both sides of the phone will always have glare and reflection down at least one but more likely both sides of the phone. The only time this would not occur would be using the phone in a dark room.
None of the flagship phone manufacturers have gone down this route, even though amongst the non iOS phones the competition is solely down to the hardware as they all run, apart from some tweaking, a flavour of Android. They all see what Samsung has done, and none of them feel it's a good enough compromise to make, even though Samsung is the most profitable non iOS smartphone.
I do not hear any people who like Android, wishing for Google, LG, Xiaomi, Essential, Huwaei, HCT etc to adopt this design decision. And there will come a time maybe as soon as next year, when Samsung will go back to a flat display because you know it makes sense.
Below is an 'official' photo produced by Samsung.
You can’t see a side bezel if it’s covered up by a reflection 90% of the time. It’s trickery to make it look “bezel less”.
Zune55
macrumors 65816
Releasing first is super important, look how MSFT capture the market share by releasing windows first. Problem is apple cant hide its designs from samsung bcos they buy parts from samsung. Samsung knows in advance what apple is working on and they release their phones to compete with apple. Also releasing first make apple’s technology dated. If samsung hadn’t released s8 line which i bought bcos of edge to edge display i would have bought X. Now the itch to buy edge to edge display is gone becos of Samsung. When i went to Bestbuy i saw s8 line and saw that beautiful design which must be apple’s idea i bought it. I couldn’t wait longer for X to come in November when apple’s design in the form of samsung was already available. Apple better release first if not then they need to hide their design & ideas from samsung.
Gathomblipoob
macrumors 603
I was plugging for OS/2 in the 1990s.
Disclaimer: This is intended as a serious reply. Thank you.
Zune55
macrumors 65816
Gathomblipoob
macrumors 603
I was hoping for OS/2's success.
Disclaimer: This is intended as a serious reply. Thank you.
Kulfon
macrumors 6502a
Surely you're joking.
That iPhone X looks so good in comparison to the S8. What’s with the giant bezels on the S8 models? Not very bezeless!
iSayBoourns
Suspended
Yes, it was definitely meant as sarcasm. It’s terrible design that the sides are nearly always covered by a reflection, essentially blocking content and if not looked at dead on, warps your content (during he rare time you can even see what’s on the sides)
To clarify the premise of this thread see the video below, and replace 'it doesn't have a keyboard' with 'it's got a ridiculous ugly notch' and you'll get the gist of why I'm saying it's like 2007 all over again.
We have a very capable phone, it will do interwebs, it will do cyber it will do myspace...
We have a very capable phone, it will do interwebs, it will do cyber it will do myspace...
Christ, Ballmer was genuinely the worst CEO of all time.
“This ‘mobile’ fad will blow over I’m sure”
“This ‘mobile’ fad will blow over I’m sure”
the future
macrumors 68040
This, a million times this. The S8 actually has a double side bezel. The „official“ pictures (renders) do not show the first, regular black, physical bezel but hide it under the second, additional glare-bezel (that, as a „bonus“, distorts the screen content because of the curvature). This is a really despicable example of form over function, but it wowed the android lemmings and even a number of macrumors folks and mods.
Thank god for Jony Ive and his team; the X design is stunning and honest, just the best possible smartphone design right now, in 2017. Sometime in the future the iPhone will indeed be 100% screen, but we‘re not there yet and I guess it‘ll take quite a bit longer than people hope/expect.
