Jony Ive "hears" your macbook criticism

[SteveJUAE]

But at the same time they are using RAM thats significantly more expensive than the standard socketed DDR4 RAM (not to mention that there is no socketed standard for LDPPR3) etc. etc... I am sure if would be cheaper for them to have one TB3 controller with 2 ports and then the usual US3/HDMI, since those are already supported by the chipset.

I am certainly not arguing against the fact that Apple tries to optimise manufacturing costs, I am arguing agains simplistic analyses. For instance, lets look at glued in components. Is it a measure to reduce costs, or a measure to reduce the form factor and increase battery capacity? I have a strong suspicion that the later was the actual goal here. Of course, the are things like soldered-on SSDs, which are rather puzzling.

IMO, all this repairability debate can be ended swiftly if Apple publicly introduces subsidised repair costs for RAM/SSDs on these new laptops, which make them competitive to DYI approach. High costs of repair are a problem for private customers, thats true. Not so much for companies though, they can easily amortise the expenses.

We are on the same page with this one but lets not make any mistake if it's better and it costs more we are paying for it, there are no freebies here

As for gluing in (eg batteries) my simple guesses are:

it's a lot more expensive to machine attachment points on the case etc than gluing. Gluing also facilities easer upgrades for future battery shapes/sizes, how much space is saved gluing over mechanical fixing maybe marginal but potentially allows for a larger cell(s), Gluing may of contributed to the overall rigidity giving further savings and slimmer design. I'm sure there are more both for and against

Individuals high cost of repair are more emotive but I'm sure companies are equally concerned but from a different perspective

 

[PhoneI]

As I said, the fact that someone thinks something is ok doesn't mean that it's actually ok

And just because somebody says its not OK, doesn't mean it's not OK.

 

[turbineseaplane]

Did the thread title get truncated for anyone else?
Should read:

Jony Ive "hears" your macbook criticism & doesn't care

 

[Foolmetwice]

Call me crazy... but I’d prefer the older style/bigger MacBook Pro to come back. They should at least have the option open— at least for us poor slugs who don’t have great WiFi, reliable Bluetooth devices, or money to burn on a dozen new dongles.
I just downgraded to a 2012 MBP from an 11” 2014 MacBook Air. (Long story short— I sold the newer Mac to pay to upgrade my kid’s Retina MBP to one with more RAM/ bigger SSD.).
Aside from the optical drive quirks, I really like the sturdiness of the design. Honestly, I don’t travel with a laptop, and if I need to go online when I’m out, I use my iPhone. While I could probably use a desktop, I don’t want my computer tied down to one desk. I value durability/sturdiness, the ability to upgrade the SSD, fixability, longevity, etc. over lighter laptop weight.
To make myself sound even crazier— I actually value having an internal optical drive. I use my MacBook Pro instead of a TV/DVD player to watch movies. Used DVDs and CDs are super cheap, and I still use them. Saved files on DVD and USB flash drives don’t get skunked as they do on external hard drives or mysteriously disappear as they seem to on clouds. There are still a lot of movies out there that aren’t available as digital downloads... and an internal optical drive is one last device to drag around... If someone with an old MBP doesn’t need the optical drive, they can install more memory... The old USB ports are still useful, and the SD cards, obviously.
I’d love it if they’d develop a classic style MBP— a “retro” or “remake”. They can advertise on Mac longevity.
The only reason I don’t bother getting a different brand laptop is that other brands nearly always become useless after two years. At least the macs hold their resale value and don’t get infected with with every virus that comes down the pike. I’m not loaded, so an Apple product that doesn’t break down and has resale value costs less in the long run than cheaper alternatives.
There’s obviously something attractive about the old MBPs when people are spending a grand+ on upgraded 2011 17” MBPs on eBay.

 

[/V\acpower]

Call me crazy... but I’d prefer the older style/bigger MacBook Pro to come back. They should at least have the option open— at least for us poor slugs who don’t have great WiFi, reliable Bluetooth devices, or money to burn on a dozen new dongles.
I just downgraded to a 2012 MBP from an 11” 2014 MacBook Air. (Long story short— I sold the newer Mac to pay to upgrade my kid’s Retina MBP to one with more RAM/ bigger SSD.).
Aside from the optical drive quirks, I really like the sturdiness of the design. Honestly, I don’t travel with a laptop, and if I need to go online when I’m out, I use my iPhone. While I could probably use a desktop, I don’t want my computer tied down to one desk. I value durability/sturdiness, the ability to upgrade the SSD, fixability, longevity, etc. over lighter laptop weight.
To make myself sound even crazier— I actually value having an internal optical drive. I use my MacBook Pro instead of a TV/DVD player to watch movies. Used DVDs and CDs are super cheap, and I still use them. Saved files on DVD and USB flash drives don’t get skunked as they do on external hard drives or mysteriously disappear as they seem to on clouds. There are still a lot of movies out there that aren’t available as digital downloads... and an internal optical drive is one last device to drag around... If someone with an old MBP doesn’t need the optical drive, they can install more memory... The old USB ports are still useful, and the SD cards, obviously.
I’d love it if they’d develop a classic style MBP— a “retro” or “remake”. They can advertise on Mac longevity.
The only reason I don’t bother getting a different brand laptop is that other brands nearly always become useless after two years. At least the macs hold their resale value and don’t get infected with with every virus that comes down the pike. I’m not loaded, so an Apple product that doesn’t break down and has resale value costs less in the long run than cheaper alternatives.
There’s obviously something attractive about the old MBPs when people are spending a grand+ on upgraded 2011 17” MBPs on eBay.

The best thing they ever did is remove the optical drive.

Sorry, but you are just refusing to move forward. Optical drive are slow, clunky, unreliable, heavy, big, loud and break all the time.

 

[SteveJUAE]

The best thing they ever did is remove the optical drive.

Sorry, but you are just refusing to move forward. Optical drive are slow, clunky, unreliable, heavy, big, loud and break all the time.

Lets not get carried away with western trends billions in the world simply cannot afford to pay $1-300/mth on streaming, data packages and cable etc and rely elsewhere for their media consumption

CD's/DVD's are still very much alive let alone for those with massive legacy collections

Whilst I'm happy they are gone from most laptops these days I still occasionally use my superdrive for some box sets I own
[doublepost=1513066732][/doublepost]

I’d love it if they’d develop a classic style MBP— a “retro” or “remake”. They can advertise on Mac longevity.
The only reason I don’t bother getting a different brand laptop is that other brands nearly always become useless after two years. At least the macs hold their resale value and don’t get infected with with every virus that comes down the pike. I’m not loaded, so an Apple product that doesn’t break down and has resale value costs less in the long run than cheaper alternatives.
There’s obviously something attractive about the old MBPs when people are spending a grand+ on upgraded 2011 17” MBPs on eBay.

This is a bit of a fallacy macs fare no better after 2-3 years than any other like for like laptop. High 2nd had value is more of a US phenomenon elsewhere it can be the opposite. There are pro's to having 2 or even 3 new current laptops covered by warranty etc opposed to one mac over the same period that you hope lasts, of course there are negatives but based on $ only a single mac option is a complete gamble if not more so with newer rMB and MBP with little serviceable parts

 

[HerbertDerb]

Lets not get carried away with western trends billions in the world simply cannot afford to pay $1-300/mth on streaming, data packages and cable etc and rely elsewhere for their media consumption

CD's/DVD's are still very much alive let alone for those with massive legacy collections

Whilst I'm happy they are gone from most laptops these days I still occasionally use my superdrive for some box sets I own

I agree with @/V\acpower. If you really need DVD drive, then you can just plug in external one.

In todays tech, space in laptops are premium. Even if Apple would make the MBP thicker, they would have to sacrifice somewhere (Most likely in battery size) to make room for that "huge" reader. And in 2010 decade, internal DVD-drives are no longer relevant.

 

[SteveJUAE]

I agree with @/V\acpower. If you really need DVD drive, then you can just plug in external one.

In todays tech, space in laptops are premium. Even if Apple would make the MBP thicker, they would have to sacrifice somewhere (Most likely in battery size) to make room for that "huge" reader. And in 2010 decade, internal DVD-drives are no longer relevant.

Please read my post re " Whilst I'm happy they are gone from most laptops these days"

I use an external superdrive my point is on the comment on refusing to move forward using DVD's etc

 

[Smeaton1724]

As the owner of a 13'' Macbook Pro 2015 16GB RAM, 512GB SSD, I feel the few things of improvement would have been less bezels (or bigger screen) and the removal of the SDXC slot for 1 or 2 USB-C Slots. The subsequent introduction of Thunderbolt 3 on the 2016 models is par for the course anyway and so would the eventual upgrade in screen quality HDR and resolution 4K.

The introduction of the Touch bar, the removal of mag safe and the x4 USB-C ports just kill any prospect of me upgrading my 13 to either a new 13 or 15. for the foreseeable future, if anything I'm looking at 15'' 2015 refurbished for that bit more power. As for the 2018 design I'd happily take a machine that had 2 USB 3, 2 USB C and no touch bar, I could do without mag safe.

 

[jerry70450]

As the owner of a 13'' Macbook Pro 2015 16GB RAM, 512GB SSD, I feel the few things of improvement would have been less bezels (or bigger screen) and the removal of the SDXC slot for 1 or 2 USB-C Slots. The subsequent introduction of Thunderbolt 3 on the 2016 models is par for the course anyway and so would the eventual upgrade in screen quality HDR and resolution 4K.

The introduction of the Touch bar, the removal of mag safe and the x4 USB-C ports just kill any prospect of me upgrading my 13 to either a new 13 or 15. for the foreseeable future, if anything I'm looking at 15'' 2015 refurbished for that bit more power. As for the 2018 design I'd happily take a machine that had 2 USB 3, 2 USB C and no touch bar, I could do without mag safe.

USB a will not make a return. Maybe Apple will put in more thunderbolts ports lol

 

[turbineseaplane]

USB a will not make a return. Maybe Apple will put in more thunderbolts ports lol

Never say never - I see normal USB-A (USB3) ports on the back of that brand new iMac Pro.

 

[Queen6]

Never say never - I see normal USB-A (USB3) ports on the back of that brand new iMac Pro.

Although I'm not a fan of desktop all in one's the iMac Pro is certainly a step in the right direction for Apple, I just hope Apple applies the same methodology to it's notebooks, offering at least one high performance system that's usability is not butchered for the sake of being pointlessly thinner and the fashion conscious..

Q-6

 

[turbineseaplane]

Seriously, that image above should be the "buffet" they chose from on a 2018 15" MBP

I'll take the headphone jack, SD slot, and any combo of "some" USB-A and USB-C.
Would love HDMI, but I don't think it'll come back sadly.

 

[Ries]

Seriously, that image above should be the "buffet" they chose from on a 2018 15" MBP

I'll take the headphone jack, SD slot, and any combo of "some" USB-A and USB-C.
Would love HDMI, but I don't think it'll come back sadly.

I'd like the glowing logo and magsafe also.

 

[turbineseaplane]

I'd like the glowing logo and magsafe also.

I'd like those too - Just don't think either are coming back.
I think they'll make a magsafe solution on their own USB-C cable/power adapter before the MagSafe port itself ever comes back...but even that is probably a pipe dream.

Apple lives in this fantasy of providing "all day battery life" and thus no longer sees things like MagSafe as having a role since they don't think you should have to plug it in save for at night (which anyone using their MBP knows is a farce of course)

 

[Smeaton1724]

USB a will not make a return. Maybe Apple will put in more thunderbolts ports lol

In the Touchbar models I don't expect it back, sadly, they are the future just like the iPhone X is for those that want to feel they live in the future. However like sales will show the majority for a long period are happy to spend a lot of money on the norm. Surely there is space within the Apple ecosystem to have a line of 13 and 15 Pro's with currently standard features, standard keyboards and a range of modern ports, for want of a better name a 'Macbook Pro SE' loosely based off the 2015 design.

 

[jerry70450]

Actually I just started thinking about it. Is the side of the MBP itself thick enough to contain a USB A port anymore!?!? I think they'll have to redesign the thing if they add it on.

 

[Naimfan]

Good.

The new one is too thin - I'd welcome a return to the 2015 form factor.

Actually I just started thinking about it. Is the side of the MBP itself thick enough to contain a USB A port anymore!?!? I think they'll have to redesign the thing if they add it on.

 

[gobikerider]

Good.

The new one is too thin - I'd welcome a return to the 2015 form factor.

Keep dreaming, Apple may add more USB C ports and maybe...maybe a sd card slot but they are not going to re-add/redesign the MacBook to add USB-A back.

 

[Naimfan]

Keep dreaming, Apple may add more USB C ports and maybe...maybe a sd card slot but they are not going to re-add/redesign the MacBook to add USB-A back.

Typical pigheaded arrogance . . . I really do want to throw this toy out the window.

 

[CmdrLaForge]

All I want is a 100% reliable keyboard and not just for 2-3 years but for many years. Non reliable keyboard on a laptop is a no-go.

 

[Macintoshrumors]

I'm really excited Ive is back. can't wait to see what he has planned for the Mac lineup.

 

[kelso7]

Typical pigheaded arrogance . . . I really do want to throw this toy out the window.

Wait until I’m outside of the window to catch it, I’m in desperate need of a new MBP, but student loans.

 

[cambookpro]

The only thing I really miss is the SD card slot. I realise I'm perhaps not a "super pro" user - I do use Xcode and Photoshop daily, Illustrator, After Effects and Motion a few times a month and FCP maybe a few times a year, but my sole computer is a 13" MBP and I never feel like I'm pushing it very hard.

I love the smaller form factor, and I don't really miss MagSafe - although it was great, I've found the ability to charge from either side to honestly be more useful. The screen is beautiful also. If Jony Ive does hear the criticism, I also hope he hears from the people who really enjoy the new MBPs as well.

 

[Fishrrman]

RE:
"I see normal USB-A (USB3) ports on the back of that brand new iMac Pro."

They are "a" form factor, but they're probably USB3.1 gen. 1 at the very least.
More likely, USB3.1 gen. 2 (up to 10gbps).