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Lion Clean Install Requires Snow Leopard Disk?

"Oh no! It will take me an extra step when I need to restore my hard drive! It will take an extra half an hour! Sure I rarely need to do this but I don't like this! I might switch to Windows!" - Concern troll #1

"Oh no! I am still running Lion! I'm really interested in Lion but now I have to pay $58 instead of $29 to upgrade? I'm going to use Windows! Who is with me?" - Concern troll #2

And on and on.

1. This is probably a bogus rumor.
2. When the rare time comes along that you need to install the OS again on a new HD it is no big deal if SL needs to be installed first.
3. The talking point that SL has no upgrades is absurd. There are not many cosmetic upgrades but the 10.6 runs better. And for the low price it is worth it to have the latest, best running version of X.
4. People who didn't upgrade to SL are probably not interested in upgrading to Lion. If they are the cost is a little more. Deal with it. Many software companies do this. Your upgrade cost reduction is dependent on the version you own. And the extra cost here is minimal.
5. Most of the people complaining here are regulars who you know from their history have no intention of running OS X.
 
JohnDoe98 said:
There is simply no evidence to this affect whatsoever. Quite the contrary, as evidenced by the developper previews.
Click to expand...

I said simply. The method for making your own DVD/flash media isn't obvious, and clearly isn't intended or will be supported by Apple.
 
There are four groups of people on this forum:

1.) Cult of Apple folks who would stand in line to drink Steve Jobs' magical piss if they could.

2.) People who have being using Apple products for years, but are all around technology connoisseurs. This includes IT folks. The people who are willing to use what works for the job no matter what technology it is.

3.) Casual Apple users who prefer OS X over Windows.

4.) People who came to Mac land because they loved their iPhone, iPod, iPad etc.

The only people that think this is even remotely acceptable are in group number one: Like LTD

Apple has become the evil machine from 1984. They are no longer even remotely close to being an organization that helps you break away from the collective world they're ten times worse than Microsoft could ever be.

This release is going to have horrible market penetration and might just be Jobs' unfortunate last failure as CEO. The iCloud stuff and not being able to have your own cloud based capabilities through a Time Capsule like setup is another. iCloud is a great consumer gimmick it's dead on arrival for business users

Who gives a crap if the final release is the same as the DP's and bootable installer is able to be made??? I am going to do that I am in the tech business. My neighbor isn't. My neighbor is also not going to go out and spend $30 on one OS to have to immediately spend $30 on another. I know ten people personally that are still running Leopard because they saw no added benefit to Snow Leopard. To not be able to buy or download the release let alone install it is probably one of the biggest pretentious f##k you moves this company has ever pulled.

This walled garden BS has gone way too far and I hope they choke on the slow adoption rates.

Time for a new leader.
 
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sclawis300 said:
Pretty sure you were not even the first person to post it, and if you were, then there was definitely the same post between your initial one and then your complaint about no one sharing your concerns. So no, it is not lost on me.
Click to expand...

Not that it matters other than to put an end to your trolling, but yes, I was the first to post it. The other post mentioning it, you will notice, is timestamped somewhere between 1-2 minutes before my 2nd post on the subject, which incidentally is how long it would have taken me on my 3G connection to go back and find my first post in order to quote it and then post my update, effectively making the timing of my second post and the other post you are referring to the same.

All I was asking was whether or not this seemed strange to anybody else - your smartass responses were neither required nor constructive - just ill-informed and unnecessary.
 
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ri0ku said:
Not many people especially in todays financial times will be wanting to spend all that money on a new mac just to get Lion.

It is a potential 30% losing interest in bothering to upgrade if they have to go through those steps and even waste $30 to get an operating system that will allow them to install the newer.
Click to expand...

What are you talking about?

Go tell these yahoos to buy SL for $29 in the Apple Store. A new Mac?
 
miografico said:
There are four groups of people on this forum:

1.) Cult of Apple folks who would stand in line to drink Steve Job's magical piss if they could.

2.) People who have being using Apple products for years, but are all around technology connoisseurs. This includes IT folks. The people who are willing to use what works for the job no matter what technology it is.

3.) Casual Apple users who prefer OS X over Windows.

4.) People who came to Mac land because they loved their iPhone, iPod, iPad etc.

The only people that think this is even remotely acceptable are in group number one: Like LTD

Apple has become the evil machine from 1984. They are no longer even remotely close to being an organization that helps you break away from the collective world they're ten times worse than Microsoft could ever be.

This release is going to have horrible market penetration and might just be Job's unfortunate last failure as CEO. The iCloud stuff and not being able to have your own cloud based capabilities through a Time Capsule like setup is another. iCloud is a great consumer gimmick it's dead on arrival for business users

Who gives a crap if the final release is the same as the DP's and bootable installer is able to be made??? I am going to do that I am in the tech business. My neighbor isn't. My neighbor is also not going to go out and spend $30 on one OS to have to immediately spend $30 on another. I know ten people personally that are still running Leopard because they saw no added benefit to Snow Leopard. To not be able to buy or download the release let alone install it is probably one of the biggest pretentious f##k you moves this company has ever pulled.

This walled garden BS has gone way too far and I hope they choke on the slow adoption rates.

Time for a new leader.
Click to expand...

How can you possibly think Lion will fail because you download it from the Mac App Store? You click ONE BUTTON and it's downloaded! You don't have to drive anywhere, you don't have to order it and pay for shipping. You don't pay tax on it, and it's discounted!
 
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ten-oak-druid said:
5. Most of the people complaining here are regulars who you know from their history have no intention of running OS X.
Click to expand...

No, I don't know, care to explain?

I would like to add that some countries, including Canada and New Zealand to name two, have very small bandwidth caps, either in the whole country or parts of the country. Those people will be a bit more reluctant to upgrade.
 
JohnDoe98 said:
Its called precedent. No mac has sold without a recovery disk. And the new MBAs come with USB disks. What on earth makes you think things will change? There is simply no evidence for it. Nothing Apple said suggests otherwise. They said from the beginning Lion will be through the MAS or pre-installed on purchased computers.
Click to expand...

Seriously???????? Precedent states that OSs are available for purchase on physical media. Everything Apple has said suggests otherwise. pre-installed with a recovery partition, no where does it say with a recovery disk.
 
Cougarcat said:
I said simply. The method for making your own DVD/flash media isn't obvious, and clearly isn't intended or will be supported by Apple.
Click to expand...

Sorry, I missed that subtle point of yours. So yes, for the average consumer there is no simple recovery in the event of total HDD failure. They must first install SL with their recovery disk, then upgrade to Lion (unless they buy their computers with Lion pre-installed, since it'll come with a recovery disk). The size of this population is so insignificant Apple obviously feels it is no worth the cost of distributing Lion on DVDs. I quite agree with them. Seems like it would be a waste of resources that would onky dirve up the overall cost of Lion. Their current distribution method seems quite good.
 
ten-oak-druid said:
What are you talking about?

Go tell these yahoos to buy SL for $29 in the Apple Store. A new Mac?
Click to expand...

Read the post above that one -_- the guy before me said people are likely to go buy new macs for the upgrade.

Thats why i said thats unlikely
 
I am with Steve on this. The OS should be like electricity. Just there to run apps. Who cares how and what it is. Spend more time outside and less time tinkering with restoring OS. I have used macs for 10 years, upgraded my main Mac 5 times, and I keep the same stuff from one machine to next without issues. I had to boot from cd one time to get into time machine to recover a bad drive. Also, ever since my iPad I only use my main macs 4 times a month. I run my company on my iPad.

One more thing. Get rid of Mac osx completely and replace it with iOS 5. Stupid to support both operating systems
 
KPOM said:
If you purchase an upgrade DVD for Windows 7, you need to "rely on a previous version" of Windows to do a clean install (or go through a confusing double-installation), so this isn't that much different.
Click to expand...

Note that the Win7 upgrade disk is cheaper than the full version. If a bare metal install is important to you, get the full disk.

There are also some suggestions here for using the upgrade disk to do a clean install.
 
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BS retarded rantings. Show me the figures on the downloadable purchased copies of Windows 7 I highly doubt it's even 20% of the overall total of units sold.
 
JohnDoe98 said:
Seems like it would be a waste of resources that would onky dirve up the overall cost of Lion. Their current distribution method seems quite good.
Click to expand...

If they simply added a button in the installer, "Create Bootable Lion Media..." it would be a lot better.
 
miografico said:
There are four groups of people on this forum:

1.) Cult of Apple folks who would stand in line to drink Steve Job's magical piss if they could.

2.) People who have being using Apple products for years, but are all around technology connoisseurs. This includes IT folks. The people who are willing to use what works for the job no matter what technology it is.

3.) Casual Apple users who prefer OS X over Windows.

4.) People who came to Mac land because they loved their iPhone, iPod, iPad etc.

The only people that think this is even remotely acceptable are in group number one: Like LTD

Apple has become the evil machine from 1984. They are no longer even remotely close to being an organization that helps you break away from the collective world they're ten times worse than Microsoft could ever be.

This release is going to have horrible market penetration and might just be Job's unfortunate last failure as CEO. The iCloud stuff and not being able to have your own cloud based capabilities through a Time Capsule like setup is another. iCloud is a great consumer gimmick it's dead on arrival for business users

Who gives a crap if the final release is the same as the DP's and bootable installer is able to be made??? I am going to do that I am in the tech business. My neighbor isn't. My neighbor is also not going to go out and spend $30 on one OS to have to immediately spend $30 on another. I know ten people personally that are still running Leopard because they saw no added benefit to Snow Leopard. To not be able to buy or download the release let alone install it is probably one of the biggest pretentious f##k you moves this company has ever pulled.

This walled garden BS has gone way too far and I hope they choke on the slow adoption rates.

Time for a new leader.
Click to expand...
I'm number 4! :eek:
 
benthewraith said:
No, I don't know, care to explain?
Click to expand...

Sure

I recognize the posters stirring up a frenzy with lies about this subject. I've read their posts on other threads. They are not interested in the least in Apple products. Trolling is just a fun thing for them to do.

And then you have other posters taking the out right lies and drawing "conclusions" about Apples's future.

My favorite is the story that supposedly if you do not own SL you will have to buy a new Mac to upgrade! LMAO.

As for Canada's bandwidth issues then Apple has to decide whether to deal with that or not. That is their call. But that is another topic. If you want to debate point I was making then don't go changing the topic to score a point on the original.
 
sclawis300 said:
Seriously???????? Precedent states that OSs are available for purchase on physical media. Everything Apple has said suggests otherwise. pre-installed with a recovery partition, no where does it say with a recovery disk.
Click to expand...

Right, Lion, alone, does not come with a recovery disk. You need to make your own. But Lion purchased with a computer, in that case are you seriously suggesting Apple will not give a usb disk along with it? Granted Apple has not said anything about recovery disks for new computers but that is because they haven't said anything about the new computers that come with Lion pre-installed.
 
ri0ku said:
Read the post above that one -_- the guy before me said people are likely to go buy new macs for the upgrade.

Thats why i said thats unlikely
Click to expand...

Oh

That is an absurd suggestion to do that just for the OS.

radiogoober said:
How can you possibly think Lion will fail because you download it from the Mac App Store? You click ONE BUTTON and it's downloaded! You don't have to drive anywhere, you don't have to order it and pay for shipping. You don't pay tax on it, and it's discounted!
Click to expand...

The concern trolls like you are responding to are taking the outright lies on the subject and "coming to conclusions" about Apple's future. I'm still laughing.
 
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HyperX13 said:
One more thing. Get rid of Mac osx completely and replace it with iOS 5. Stupid to support both operating systems
Click to expand...

No thanks, pass. None of the software I use runs on IOS, and I prefer traditional keyboard and mouse input over touch screens.
 
Cougarcat said:
I said simply. The method for making your own DVD/flash media isn't obvious, and clearly isn't intended or will be supported by Apple.
Click to expand...

Right click Lion Installer > open one folder > see a .dmg image, open it in disk utility and burn it.

Done.

Unless you haven't burned a single dvd from your computer before, there's nothing hard about doing this.

Whether or not it's supported by Apple is important, although I cannot think of a single instance that this would actually cause any trouble.
 
1 spare hard disk and Superduper or Carbon Copy Cloner ftw? You could clean install SL and then Lion on top in case you ever need a clean copy of Lion.

Incidentally, I may or may not* have just got this email reply from Steve Jobs:

----
To: 'Steve Jobs'

Dear Mr. Jobs, if you disagree with anything Apple do will one get labelled a 'cry baby' on MacRumors?

Porco

---
To: 'Porco'

yep

Sent from my iPhone

----

*yes, this one.
 
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