Marco Arment Argues the 2012—2015 MacBook Pro is 'Best Laptop That Has Ever Existed'

[Patriks7]

As an owner of a 13” late 2013 model, can’t say I disagree with him. Has all the ports I could need without any dongles and is more than plenty fast enough for my usage. Only thing I have noticed, battery life is slowly decreasing, but that’s to be expected after almost 4 years of constant use.

 

[travelsheep]

I love all these "professionals" complaining about Apple providing 4 versatile standard ports in a laptop. I love having the option to do whichever I want within all the ports.

Correction: You have the option to connect whichever adapter you want, which in turn will connect to whichever device you want.

 

[rafark]

I've not owned a MacBook but they all look exactly the same since 2008 to me.

 

[simonmet]

Have had 17" MacBook Pro, Now have both 15" 2012 and 15" Latest with TB: I like the Touch Bar the best. The guy simply doesn't know what he is talking about. The only thing stood out in the article is him complaining of lack of ports and connectivity. People like him still rent Blue Ray DVDs.

Hate to be pedantic but Blu Ray is objectively better than any streaming service or online store that I’m aware of, except for convenience. If you want quality, 50 GB + discs is where it’s at.

 

[Rogifan]

Still waiting for someone to explain why this comment from Marco is newsworthy.

 

[AZ63]

As long as Macs had USB-A ports there would be no incentive to make a USB-C device.

And to that I say so what.

 

[manu chao]

dongle for SD cards, ethernet different hdmi dongles because they simply do not work for the same screens + all the stuff i could assume were already at destination and ready to plug in.

The SD card situation is the only real exception (nothing needed before, now something is needed). But the post I was replying to didn't mention it, so I assumed that it wasn't important for that person. Needing to buy new cables is different from having to deal with a larger set of cables. And you already needed an Ethernet adaptor with the 2012-2015 MBPs.

And your insistence on (a) using dongles and (b) apparently calling cables dongles is to bias the reader. Using dongles can save money (USB-C to USB-A dongle + existing Lightning cable vs USB-C to Lightning cable) but by presenting it as the apparently only solution, you are misleading the audience. A dongle is something the results in a two-part connection, a cable creates a one-part connection.

The only way to never having to buy new cables as new interface standards come along is to always keep all ports that ever existed on the computer. You can very well blame Apple for being expensive (both for the computer and the new cables), but you cannot blame Apple for 'having' to use dongles. Using dongles is largely a choice (to save money).

 

[MacBH928]

I have the 2015, I bought it in 2017. I still have to find a use USB-C, Nothing I bought or use uses this port including my iphone 7. Meanwhile I enjoy the HDMI, USB-A, and magsafe connection. I see 0 problems with this laptop other than you can't replace RAM, HDD, and battery. I guess if it dies, it dies.

 

[Kulfon]

So even though it is possible to have same nimber of cables, the cost of connecting is higher now because you have to purchase additional cables, which were provided by Apple previously.

I acknowledged that you most likely have to get new cables, but once they are purchased, you don't need a larger number of different cables [to carry around with you] than what you needed before (you might need more depending on how many different older peripherals you have).

 

[tubular]

A month ago I bought a 15" MacBook Pro Retina With Actual Ports And Without Damned Touch Bar, out of fear it will be the last real laptop Apple makes.

 

[M.PaulCezanne]

“We sold 5.4 million Macs during the September quarter”

And they’d sell even more if they’d just listen to their customers for once.

 

[joiwomcow]

From the financials: number of units sold was up 10%, revenue was up 25%.

Thanks! my bad.

 

[vmachiel]

I love Marco to death, but I wish he would just stop already. I get it, you don’t like the new MBP. But he does his work on the iMac anyway. There is already a iMac pro coming, and a Mac Pro beyond that.

Apple is not stupid, and will design a better keyboard with the next iteration. The USB-C world takes time. Just move on.

 

[manu chao]

So even though it is possible to have same nimber of cables, the cost of connecting is higher now because you have to purchase additional cables, which were provided by Apple previously.

You also have to purchase a brand-new laptop which by some calculations is more expensive than the previous one. Getting a couple of new cables (maybe for a total of $100) is just part of the package.

It's remarkable that people complain about the need to use 'dongles' when their actual complaint is not the having to deal with the dongles but that they require extra monetary expenses. And even here, a price increase of the computer by $100 might raise some eyebrows but would hardly start a riot. But a $100 outlay for new cables does cause quite a ruckus.
[doublepost=1510843946][/doublepost]

I have the 2015, I bought it in 2017. I still have to find a use USB-C, Nothing I bought or use uses this port including my iphone 7.

Neither does your iPhone 7 sport a USB-A, or any kind of USB-B (mini, micro) port. Nor did any of your peripherals sport a USB-A port (or at all likelihood a mDP port). The problem is not whether a device sports a USB-C port, the only real problem for most is whether the device (or the computer) shipped with the cable needed to connect the device to the computer.

Raising the price of the computer by $29 would hardly be noticed. But if a user has spend $29 to buy a USB-C to Lightning cable, that is totally out of the question.

 

[cocoua]

Touch bar sucks, having multiple dongle SUCKS

There are some real advantages into be bravo like removing the cd which nobody is using or almost everybody, but forcing ALL the user to buy dongles for every need is insine.

Forcing ALL PRO users to looking at the keyboard to use the F keys, or other functions (hidden and ready to discover! Play with the bar, have fun finding out what silly thing you can do and memorize them all!) after several years training ours brains and hands not to look at the keyboard anymore is like WTF???!!!!

People at work was like WOW with the touchbar first weeks, now they are missing their old keyboards and complaining every day. Execp my mom, she really likes it!

Now this is why I bought a desktop Hackintosh last month instead of upgrade my 2012 rmbp after 21 years using apple portables as main computer

 

[KPOM]

And to that I say so what.

USB-C is better. It’s reversible, delivers more power (faster charging), smaller, and supports faster transfers when Thunderbolt 3 is added.

 

[mrzz]

He’s an idiot...I’ve listened to their ATP podcast and it’s just non-stop complaining.

Sure, some people don’t like the new MacBook Pro models for various reasons and that’s fine. My advise would be, move on. Either buy a $1700-2000 computer or not. Feel lucky you have the ability to do so. We’re living in the greatest era in humankind and he’s complaining about a keyboard, ports and minutiae.

You are definitely not a target group of these machines.

 

[KPOM]

It is only 50% true. If you but a 2017 mbp and iPhone x, there is no cable in the box of either devises that allows to connect. To be accurate, please add "additional cable that you need to purchase"

Remember the idea is that you don’t need to connect your iPhone to a computer anymore. Sure it’s quicker to sync music files, but entirely optional.

 

[turbineseaplane]

And don’t get me started with Ethernet

Wi-Fi is everywhere and his great, and makes particular sense on a notebook.

You know what else is everywhere?
USB-A connections.
Whether it's thumb drives or printers or external devices on and on.

It will be literally forever, if ever, before USB-C is on all those kind of devices across all matter of environments.

Surely it would not have killed Apple to put one of those ports on natively still and make their pro laptop so so so much more convenient for a lot of people a lot of the time.
[doublepost=1510848047][/doublepost]

Wellllll.... I think I can be considered a fan of the ATP.fm podcast. I've been listening to it for as long as it runs, and have listened to John's show and Marco's show at 5by5 before that.

However, for the last year or so, the podcast definitely has a complaining aspect to it. So much so, that they've addressed it at least twice, defending it on the show.

So if you simply read this article, it does indeed read like a comparison. But if you take it together with the ATP.fm podcast, it's part of a long string of complaints and rants. By the way, I'm not the only one who thinks so. Jason Snell (podcaster, writer for MacWorld), also mentioned in one of his podcasts that he sometimes skips parts of ATP.fm, when they start complaining.

I have to be honest but that shows me that the podcast is filling it's intended role.
An article or blog post should be more well reasoned and thought out.

One of the best things about podcasts is you get more off-the-cuff conversation, opinions, innuendo, tone of voice and really just get more of the person versus a structured/written article.

But again if people don't like that they don't have to listen so everybody's happy.

I love the complaining because I completely agree with it and if there's one thing the apple ecosystem needs it is less slobbering suck ups…

So many of the podcasts out there are unlistenable because they literally can't seem to find anything wrong with anything Apple does.

 

[KPOM]

Wi-Fi is everywhere and his great, and makes particular sense on a notebook.

You know what else is everywhere?
USB-A connections.
Whether it's thumb drives or printers or external devices on and on.

It will be literally forever, if ever, before USB-C is on all those kind of devices across all matter of environments.

Surely it would not have killed Apple to put one of those ports on natively still and make their pro laptop so so so much more convenient for a lot of people a lot of the time.
[doublepost=1510848047][/doublepost]

I have to be honest but that shows me that the podcast is filling it's intended role.
An article or blog post should be more well reasoned and thought out.

One of the best things about podcasts is you get more off-the-cuff conversation, opinions, innuendo, tone of voice and really just get more of the person versus a structured/written article.

But again if people don't like that they don't have to listen so everybody's happy.

I love the complaining because I completely agree with it and if there's one thing the apple ecosystem needs it is less slobbering suck ups…

So many of the podcasts out there are unlistenable because they literally can't seem to find anything wrong with anything Apple does.

Had they put one of those ports people still would have complained. “I need a hub to connect my iPhone and [insert peripheral here] at the same time”.

And there were plenty of posts back in 2012 about how it was dumb of Apple to require a dongle to use Ethernet since gigabit wireless wasn’t available (and still isn’t “everywhere”).

 

[PickUrPoison]

Wi-Fi is everywhere and his great, and makes particular sense on a notebook.

You know what else is everywhere?
USB-A connections.
Whether it's thumb drives or printers or external devices on and on.

It will be literally forever, if ever, before USB-C is on all those kind of devices across all matter of environments.

Surely it would not have killed Apple to put one of those ports on natively still and make their pro laptop so so so much more convenient for a lot of people a lot of the time.

If you’ve got a lot of USB devices, what good is one USB-A port going to do you? You’ll use a USB hub, so plug it into the 2017 MBP USB-C port. With a cable.

Yes, the port has a different connector that uses a different cable. Yes, it will supply that USB hub with 10Gbps of USB3.1 Gen 2 bandwidth.

Will the 2015 USB port do that? Isn’t the previous generation actually much worse?

 

[KPOM]

.

Steve Jobs:
When you’re a carpenter making a beautiful chest of drawers, you’re not going to use a piece of plywood on the back

And that's exactly what Apple has been doing for a while now, little pieces of plywood everywhere and products that goes nowhere. You mention the watch and it's a good example of a product under Cook, very nicely polished surface but underneath it's a different story of a processor with no battery running an OS glued together from unseemly parts of dubious origin.

I don’t understand that comment. The Watch crams a lot of technology into a small space and lasts a lot longer than Apple claims. The AirPods are an engineering beauty. They are the best wireless air buds I’ve ever used for calls.

 

[turbineseaplane]

If you’ve got a lot of USB devices, what good is one USB-A port going to do you?

I'm concerned with when I'm on the go and need to plug in a USB-A device - It's a lot.

Docked situations are a whole different discussion for me.

Way too many people here are excited about USB-C potential and specs when many of us are concerned with stuff we do with our notebooks, on the go, daily (as in I used the USB-A port on my 2015 2x this morning).

 

[smacrumon]

Getting rid of MagSafe was a dumb idea. It's a piece of simple technology that really just works. It's complete idiocy that an alternative magnet connection was not incorporated into current MacBooks. Again dumb move, Apple. Not providing at least one USB is also complete trouble. Please fix this.

Favorite line from the piece: "a time when Mac designs celebrated personality, humanity, and whimsy".

 

[KPOM]

I wonder how many complaints in this thread would go away if Apple bundled something like this with the MacBook Pro. I have it and it works great.

https://www.amazon.com/QacQoc-Alumi...d=1510854042&sr=8-4&keywords=qacqoc+usb+c+hub
[doublepost=1510854654][/doublepost]

Getting rid of MagSafe was a dumb idea. It's a piece of simple technology that really just works. It's complete idiocy that an alternative magnet connection was not incorporated into current MacBooks. Again dumb move, Apple. Please fix this.

Favorite line from the piece: "a time when Mac designs celebrated personality, humanity, and whimsy".

There is a Griffin USB-C cable that works similarly, but I agree an Apple design would be nice. That said, I can see why they got rid of the separate MagSafe port and proprietary cable. Apple MagSafe power cords are notorious for fraying over time. I think it's because Apple didn't want to use heavier gauge wire because it would interfere with the operation of breakaway feature (it would require a stronger magnet).