Microsoft Announces Surface Book i7, Desktop PC 'Surface Studio,' and Windows 10 Creators Update

[maflynn]

Microsoft is finally doing what they should have done 20 years ago and copy the Apple model.

20 years ago, Apple was struggling, they had a non multi-tasking operating system, that crashed if you loaded extensions in the wrong order, and ran on the PowerPC platform. They were losing marketshare and had a lack of direction.

I don't think that's something anyone should copy.

 

[cardfan]

The Studio is targeted at the 2D artist market. Such people normally buy Wacoms or if they can afford them, Cintiqs. The Studio looks to one up both of those with a single device, assuming the drawing experience is as good as Wacom offers.

If you're not an artist then the Studio is of no relevance to you.

Yep, my daughter loves to draw and loves her 300 dollar wacom with her PC. I'm not convinced that drawing on the screen is a better experience (your hand is in the way, pen is slower, etc). Perhaps eventually.

 

[maflynn]

just looks like a display with a laptop sized box at the foot....

To me it looks like a ginormous tablet, and was waiting for Panos to disconnect it from the base and walk around with it

Im being completely serious
[doublepost=1477571720][/doublepost]

I'm not convinced that drawing on the screen is a better experience (your hand is in the way, pen is slower, etc).

I'm not an artist, so forgive my ignorance, but how different is drawing on the screen vs drawing on paper? the demo that was showed off, seemed like it as just like paper.

 

[dotnet]

My iMac with the giant bezels and large chin feels so old and outdated.

Really? I'm sure this has been pointed out on the next 50+ pages I haven't read, but the bezels look about the same, and the chin has been replaced by a pizza box underneath.

 

[maflynn]

Really? I'm sure this has been pointed out on the next 50+ pages I haven't read, but the bezels look about the same, and the chin has been replaced by a pizza box underneath.

You're right, the initial images had me thinking it had thinner bezels, but I stand by my comments on the chin. You need a strong base, so the pizza box doesn't bother me at all.

 

[9081094]

Having bought Apple phones, tablets, mutiple towers ( at the same time for my work), powerbooks etc etc - when I saw the Msoft presentation I smiled in a way that I haven't for years regarding the Apple ones. Here is a company trying something new, going out on a limb, doing something different.

The 'puck' may or may not be amazing - probably not for a non- graphic user - but it brought a smile of delight. I have not had that experience with Apple for years and years - even as a watch1 owner.

The Surface 3 i bought was quite terrible during the first year - clearly as a tablet it sucks due to a lack of apps. And as a computer it's not brilliant - there is still an issue with scaling and Windows 10 is still not as friendly as Mac Os.

Butttt - I feel far more friendly towards Microsoft than Apple - because it seems like they are listening to their customers whereas Apple seem like they are atuck in the arrogant attitide of knowing what is best.

My Surface Pro 3 has evolved, year on year, and has been given new capabilities - when has Apple ever released an improved product like the new Surface pen and made it backwards compatible?

My MacbookPro has been wonderful - but has regressed year on year due to the software - which year on year has deleted options and facilities.

I got a real kick and buzz from Microsoft's event - I may not use the new Surface Pro's facilities , but I really appreciated the new ways they are thinking.

It seems like Apple are stuck in a rut of offering the absolute bare minimum to customers and telling their customers what they should want rather than what they do want.

I really really hope there is something 'magical' unveiled tonight. Really. Because that's why I spent twenty years buying every single Apple product that was ever released. My pessimistic view, based on leaks etc, is that once again the only thing Apple now cares about is how to extract as much money from their loyal faithful as they can get away with.

I am guessing that I am not the only 'ex' apple fanboy to vote with my wallet and say not anymore.

Perhaps the most damaging thing for Apple, if anyone in this company ever listened to people such as myself and everyone else on this forum, is that I am not simply 'voting with my wallet'. I have had a change of heart. Apple somehow won my heart - and now (as stupid as it sounds for a technology company), they have broken it.

The good news is - looking at Microsoft, and Lenovo, and the Chinese smartphone manufacturers - I feel confident that I will be OK, in a way that I wouldn't have done even three or four years ago. So, I feel like "I" am fine, and wonder if "Apple" will be - not without "me" but without millions of people like me who fell in love with them and now feel like it is time for a 'conscious uncoupling'

Very well said. Couldn't say it better

 

[cardfan]

To me it looks like a ginormous tablet, and was waiting for Panos to disconnect it from the base and walk around with it

Im being completely serious
[doublepost=1477571720][/doublepost]
I'm not an artist, so forgive my ignorance, but how different is drawing on the screen vs drawing on paper? the demo that was showed off, seemed like it as just like paper.

I'm not an artist either...but a wacom is just more natural to use for me. I don't exactly want to use the 28" space as a table so to speak that my arm rests on while using a pen (along with kb and mouse). The wacom sits on desk in a natural writing position. Comfort matters. However, I did buy one so we'll see (moreso for the screen quality).

 

[Abazigal]

The Studio is targeted at the 2D artist market. Such people normally buy Wacoms or if they can afford them, Cintiqs. The Studio looks to one up both of those with a single device, assuming the drawing experience is as good as Wacom offers.

If you're not an artist then the Studio is of no relevance to you.

Which also appears to be a very niche market. For better or worse, Apple seems to have gone mass market. Each of its products are designed to easily sell millions in the very least without even trying, and I don't think a specialized iMac variant will have the same appeal.

I have read somewhere that Apple might update their trackpads to support the Apple Pencil. Seems like a more economical and accessible solution than tacking on a very expensive touchscreen.

 

[cwwilson]

It's going to take a heck of a presser today to top what Microsoft just did. These computers look amazing.

 

[anthorumor]

That Surface Studio advert - all I can say is wow!
The music is in perfect sync with the video (of course, it's a cover to suit, and WHAT A COVER!), and best of all, no British voiceover with words such as 'magic', 'unapologetic', 'only Apple can do this', and 'sand-blasted aluminium'.

 

[Dubberton]

These look really nice. Hopefully this high end line is still around to compare when I decide to get a new laptop.

 

[hsotnicam8002]

MS is getting really good at this.



Might want to pay the doctor a visit.

Dr Robot?

 

[Pilgrim1099]

Which also appears to be a very niche market. For better or worse, Apple seems to have gone mass market. Each of its products are designed to easily sell millions in the very least without even trying, and I don't think a specialized iMac variant will have the same appeal.

I have read somewhere that Apple might update their trackpads to support the Apple Pencil. Seems like a more economical and accessible solution than tacking on a very expensive touchscreen.

Even if it's a niche market, the creative industry is wide and varied for such computers like the Surface, Wacom, iPad Pro, and so on to be used. Not just artists, but also for commercial work such as advertising, layout design, architecture ( Surface Creative is perfect for that industry ), CAD, interior design, fashion design, game design ( yes, those guys at small or big name game publishers such as Rare, Ubisoft, Blizzard, Valve, EA and etc.. use them for 3D modeling, textures, etc ), comics illustration and so on.

You'd be surprised at how many illustrators or graphic designers use the Cintiqs professionally out there, despite how expensive they may be and I'll bet some will jump at the new Surface PC.

The 'drafting table' model for the Surface PC is the right idea and that's how it should be done. I have an old school drafting table here that's lasted me more than 20 years and still going strong. I know how important it is to draw with table at an angle for posture and comfort reasons. Microsoft and Wacom have it right when it comes to an adjustable angle depending on the person's height and arm length.

 

[Queen6]

Yeah, a thinner and lighter 15" with OLED bar isn't exactly what I want to hear about. I want to hear premium. I really wanted to hear 17" laptop with full kb but instead they seem to be downgrading the kb to the one used on the inferior macbooks. Most likely i'll just keep using the 15" MBP i have and wait and see where Apple goes with it. First gen is always buggy.

Still, there's not much out there I'd want in PC land either for a laptop. I didn't care for the Surface or surface book. But I do like the Studio PC although I'm cringing at the PC that's built in. I'd rather buy the monitor part separately.

Just waiting to see what happens today. Had my eyes on the Surface Book for some time, now that MS has boosted graphic performance & battery life the Surface Book is really moving up the ranks. Apple seems to be stuck with the basic clamshell notebook concept, ever fearing a two in one or touchscreen implementation will eat into IOS devices which Apple have more control of and better margins. The days of producing the best products I fear are gone as is innovation with Apple locked into its current paradigm...

IMHO unless there is some of the old magic today, the trend of Mac sales dropping will only continue if not deepen, Apple is offering too little, at too high a price...

Q-6

 

[JDGwf]

I can't be the only one thinking, 'if only it didn't run on Windows...'

vs Windows 8.x I'd completely agree. Windows 10 still has its flaws, but it's the best Windows yet.

Every OS has its annoyances: macOS has it, Linux has it, Windows has it. Right now macOS has the least amount of annoyances for me, but I'd be willing to adapt since there's a company out there who seems to be willing to adapt to the computer professional.

 

[pietrov]

The Surface Studio is what the iMac should have become years ago. and it's absolutely beautiful. Sadly, rather like the iMac, it's also horribly underpowered.

Does rather show how Apple have completely lost interest in innovation in the pro sector though. Ive and co should look carefully at the Surface Studio and learn.

Come on Sakurambo-Kun, Ive and co have to take care of the next Christmas tree...

 

[mkeeley]

Yep, my daughter loves to draw and loves her 300 dollar wacom with her PC. I'm not convinced that drawing on the screen is a better experience (your hand is in the way, pen is slower, etc). Perhaps eventually.

I think it's a really nice experience compared to a tablet.

 

[jerryk]

My wife is a Graphic Designer and after showing her this, I think she may be moving away from her Mac next upgrade.

My daughter does assets for the gaming industry and is looking at getting one.

 

[Popeye206]

Clearly this computer is not aimed at most people who just need something for email and social media. Its called a "Studio". It is aimed squarely at creative professionals or those aspiring to be.

If you are a creative professional then the top spec Studio, at a little over $4000 is an absolute bargain. There is nothing else like it. As someone wrote earlier, a cabby will happily pay $50,000 for his "tool". $4,000 for the tool that enables you to earn a good living is negligible.

My degree is in art and graphic design. Now, I have not done illustration professionally for over 25 years (showing my age), and I still do like to paint and draw from time to time. I do see the appeal to an illustrator or fine artist, but I don't see many professional artists giving up their Macs for something like this. It just seems to be a very narrow market they're trying to appeal to. I'm guessing because for most others, having a giant touch screen has little advantage.

Again, maybe I'm showing my age and I do feel like I'm getting set in my ways as I'm finding a lot of new "innovations" these days to be more fluff than necessary. It's been a LONG time that I've seen a new gadget that I've said "i got to have one of those" or were blow away with excitement. Probably the last thing that had me excited is when Apple introduced the concept of "Apps" for the iPhone.

 

[mkeeley]

vs Windows 8.x I'd completely agree. Windows 10 still has its flaws, but it's the best Windows yet.

Every OS has its annoyances: macOS has it, Linux has it, Windows has it. Right now macOS has the least amount of annoyances for me, but I'd be willing to adapt since there's a company out there who seems to be willing to adapt to the computer professional.

Matter of opinion. It feels cobbled together and is inconsistent to me. Windows improved every release up to windows 7 then it started to go down hill again.

I can't see going back. For a start I would miss finder thumbnails for all graphic file types I use, quick view without having to go through a menu and automator. Very nice hardware but just can't imagine downgrading to an inferior os experience.

 

[jerryk]

Right now, Cupertino is just a circus full of clowns and obnoxious people, cooking recipes for teenagers.

Nothing new. Apple employees has always been that way. I can remember them in the 80s being arrogant as their company sank into 280 and bookstores opened in the parking lot at 1 Infinity loop to keep the doors open.

 

[mkeeley]

My degree is in art and graphic design. Now, I have not done illustration professionally for over 25 years (showing my age), and I still do like to paint and draw from time to time. I do see the appeal to an illustrator or fine artist, but I don't see many professional artists giving up their Macs for something like this. It just seems to be a very narrow market they're trying to appeal to. I'm guessing because for most others, having a giant touch screen has little advantage.

Again, maybe I'm showing my age and I do feel like I'm getting set in my ways as I'm finding a lot of new "innovations" these days to be more fluff than necessary. It's been a LONG time that I've seen a new gadget that I've said "i got to have one of those" or were blow away with excitement. Probably the last thing that had me excited is when Apple introduced the concept of "Apps" for the iPhone.

Look at the price of a large cintiq, not much cheaper than this.

 

[ccurzio]

Windows 10 still has its flaws, but it's the best Windows yet.

Windows 2000 Professional was (and is) the best Windows yet. It's been all downhill from there.

Windows 10 is only slightly better than Windows 8, which is god-awful compared to Windows 7, which was a slight improvement over the disastrous Windows Vista, which replaced Windows XP which was pretty much just Windows 2000 with a goofier UI, better DirectX support, and the introduction of that awesome product activation feature.

 

[vladi]

Meh.

Windows is still trash.

Cintiq style screens are only popular in a niche market.

Also Wacom has tablets that are used, which are way more comfortable.

No one in the professional industry uses Windows unless its the 3D industry.

So is macOS, both are relics of the past that keep on going like gas fueled vehicles.

You make it sound like Cintiq is a bad thing while in reality it is very comfortable even when browsing internet. Big touchscreens are a good thing, much better than small screens and a lot more comfortable. Leave it to Apple to tell you how touchscreens are bad on the desktop just because they did not put a fraction of investment into macOS to make it usable with touchscreens, instead they give you four finger gesture trackpads. Which brings me to a point where would you rather draw on screen or on a trackpad?

Windows is used equally as Mac in photography, graphic design, video editing, audio editing and motion graphics. Its only Linux that is limited with the offer of software and it's most predominantly used for VFX pipelines. macOS is only crippled in CAD market and 3D GPU rendering.

 

[andreyush]

It's amazing how Apple influenced all the brands by going premium. Microsoft ,Huawei, Samsung, HP and many others now are making expensive, simple designed premium products because Apple influenced so much . You guys must admit this. Look how Hp, Sasmung and Microsoft evolved in design, advertising, price etc. They have not copied but have adopted the same strategy.