New Displays at MacWorld?

[iW00t]

Then vote with your wallet and do not buy any DVDs, while writing to the studios to tell them why you don't.

Your letter will be round filed.

Meanwhile they will just start crying when their sales drops further and put the blame on "piracy", using it as an excuse to push for legislation mandating some form of taxation or levy on Internet access subscription fees, CD and DVD writers, hard drives, ethernet cables, computers, and portable music players.

You can never win.

 

[mediababy]

OK.. real question now.

Who cares about isights?

Does anyone really do video chats?

I think maybe try it once for grandmas to talk to grandchildren for the novelty. Maybe online flirting. Photobooth fun for 5 minutes when you get a mac.
Regular chat clients seem to do the job.

So far have never been compelled to want to see who I am talking/chatting with.

The idea of a cam on a cellphone is a whack idea too. Like I want to photo report exactly where I am all the time, by a suspicious girlfriend/wife.

Plus now that we know the Feds can turn on a cell microphone when it is turned 'off', do I really what to invite possible unwanted video surveillance in my home?

Before someone says cover the camera or disconnect it from the Internet constantly. I think I will just live without it.

If I ever need it I will hook up my Sony HD cam.

 

[uNext]

isight built in on a so called "pro" product?

Come on, how beneficial can this really be? I have a macbook pro c2d
i hardly use the built in isight. I probably used it for maybe max 3 minutes
then back to the back of the list it went.

It seems to me like the people requesting or wanting such integration
are the 1% of apples share that strictly deal with apple based on design or cool factor and completely disregard the important principles of computing and performance. I much rather have 1 apple display that stands out in both performance offering and workflow ethics then to have a display with added unneeded peripherals (LIKE A BUILT IN ISIGHT)

I have yet to meet 1 professional who is excited about the idea of having a worthless camera mounted on the display (not even touching megapixel land)

just my opinion dell and apple displays are the same where as dells while cheaper tops the apple display and apple charges a premium for it.
Bring your lcd display to 2007 specs with needed high def accross the line, add more connection options etc.

 

[Surreal]

Yebut, how much can an aluminum housing really cost? Except for that, the Apple and Dell displays are basically the same. They use the same panels (from LG, last I heard). Except for small differences in inputs/outputs, what's the difference? Dell actually has a new 30" coming out very soon (if it's not out already) that beats Apple specs at a lower price. Sure, the plastic housing appears cheaper but for so-called "pro" use, it's a better display.

They don't use the same panel.Here is a very long Post saying the same thing.

the only thing i want from apple are more connections, (just ONE Component in would do) but i think that would make for lower quality image without a hike in price. a large amount of the problems with the dell screen seem to be connected to the the screen's DSP.

tiem will tell if that dell 30" is "better" for pro use. i am in the market for a 24". before my research i considered the dell 2407 a better value. but a bit of forum crawling led me away from the dell and toward the gateway. then the gateway was released. now i wait for the NEC.

better is not always in the numbers.

 

[iDave]

When mass-produced, I don't think built-in iSight cameras cost much more than adding an extra USB port. We're talking about something like a cigarette lighter in a car; you get one whether you use it or not. It's not that big of a deal.

I think Apple is trying to make cameras ubiquitous. When everyone has one, then more will use them. Of course not everyone will. I think the idea of a camera in a cell phone is pretty silly but they're everywhere.

 

[Meemoo]

Hhmm, Apple displays with iSights would mean iChat for Windows.

iChat A/V for Windows with bonjour brings Macs and PCs even closer together!

 

[iDave]

They don't use the same panel.Here is a very long Post saying the same thing.

Looks like an interesting thread. I'll read it all when I get time.

There's no question that there are some quality issues when comparing displays. Apparently the Dell 24 and the Apple 23 are quite different. And one might also expect to pay a slight premium for an Apple product. But whoa, the premiums Apple currently charges for their displays are excessive. I'm looking at the Apple 30" model which is currently $1999. The only 30" refurbished Apple offers is last year's model for $1699. Dell sells their nearly equivalent 30", usually on sale for about $1250. Dell sells the exact same model refurbished at $1050. What would you do? What should I do?

 

[Surreal]

^^^^
yeah. the apple "premium" wouldnt bother me so much, if i could hook up my wii.

the dell and gateway screens are actually fine for 'the average' person. i just like buying the best possible, because i end up finding out the differences. (although some of those early problems are deal breakers for anyone-banding)

 

[Maccus Aurelius]

So as it stands now, 65% of members on here either already have an iSight or think this is a bad move vs 32.3% thinking its good. Ouch.

Personally I'll be really peeved off if they replace the displays now. If they were releasing new displays they should have done it at the same time as the Mac Pro was launched since now thousands of customers who bought ACDs at the same time as their Mac Pros will be peeved off at the rapid replacement. I know its been a few months since the Mac Pros were released but having hardware being replaced just four months or so after you've spent £1500 on a display isn't very nice, nor is the value drop that would happen. I don't mind as much if they make them brighter or whatnot but I'll be upset if my display looks 'old' in a month's time. Sure its to be expected that things get replaced but not so soon after the launch of the system with which said display is usually purchased. Hopefully some of you can read some sense into my ramblings here!!

I don't think many people would feel the burn from that, since the image quality of the new displays probably won't overwhelm anyone relative to their present ones. People who have the soon-to-be replaced displays will be just as productive with them. The one thing that may annoy many would be a drastic price drop. I want one, as I'm sure the people that dropped their dollar for the present line up do, but I'll bet they'll feel ripped off all of a sudden.

 

[OdduWon]

iMedia Experience (iME)

isight built in on a so called "pro" product?
Come on, how beneficial can this really be? I have a macbook pro c2d
i hardly use the built in isight. I probably used it for maybe max 3 minutes
then back to the back of the list it went.

It seems to me like the people requesting or wanting such integration
are the 1% of apples share that strictly deal with apple based on design or cool factor and completely disregard the important principles of computing and performance. I much rather have 1 apple display that stands out in both performance offering and workflow ethics then to have a display with added unneeded peripherals (LIKE A BUILT IN ISIGHT)

I have yet to meet 1 professional who is excited about the idea of having a worthless camera mounted on the display (not even touching megapixel land)
just my opinion dell and apple displays are the same where as dells while cheaper tops the apple display and apple charges a premium for it.
Bring your lcd display to 2007 specs with needed high def accross the line, add more connection options etc.

Perhaps there will not be a so called "pro" display, but a more computer like display.Seperate from the redesigned ACD?

There was a patent a while back about a touch bezel screen thought to be an iPod model. Dont remember if it had isight built in of not. If there is to be an iNtelligent AD then it will have the isight like the imac.... But separate from the imac line? this seems redundant, why not just mac an iMac mini? Isight will still be separate.

As for it's usefulness, there will be improvements to iChat in leopard and beyond, so it's only a matter of time before video chat is mainstream, with phone technology progressing the way it is now. It may become the next big thing in communication. I mean even Linksys went and pulled a "chocolate", and laid down a suit of "iPhones" to try capture market before apple shows there hand. I think they are trying to slow them down, or maybe they think if they play the holiday releases, they can obsolete the apple launch models and cause the apple team to go back to the drawing pad. Funny , if they think apple is playing catchup, they have probably surpassed the functionality of the most modern cell phone. They are spending time desinging it for our iLives not to become friends with our iPocketBooks.

also there will must be an external isight, Why?...Because if "iTv" is the same size as the mac mini, and there will be a iChat in the new front row, then there is only three options for an iSighted system,
1) A said external isight.
2) a camera in a mac mini.( or remote iSighted steaming Mac)
3) or an "iMac mini"

how else can we have photobooth on our tv?

just a thought, FIREWIRE is good for apple, in that, most PC's don't have a Firewire port, and this would boost new computer sales from switchers. But if you have a Mac Mini, do you have to spend a $149 to get it on your HDTV???

What will be setup for a Mac media center in the Living space?
"i" series display+Mac mini+itv+HI-FI Pods= Mac Media center?

 

[davepoint]

You know there's a lot of heated discussion going on here over something no one actually knows is going to happen (be it isights or if they even update the ACDs at all....) unless someone does have some confirmed info??

oh...and Merry Christmas

 

[klaus]

I don't know if it actually means anything, but it seems the displays now stand at "Shipping in 3 days" in Belgium and the UK. I'll check other stores right now, the US still reflects 24 hour - shipping.

Update :
Netherlands, also 3 days shipping
Canada , 1-2 days shipping.

Seems like there is something coming.

 

[~Shard~]

You know there's a lot of heated discussion going on here over something no one actually knows is going to happen (be it isights or if they even update the ACDs at all....) unless someone does have some confirmed info??

oh...and Merry Christmas

You must be new here. Welcome to MacRumors. We discuss rumors here - sometimes passionately. Do you get it now?

Merry Christmas to you too.

 

[cube]

Oh, and if HDCP bothers people that much, or if you want to hook up your BluRay player to a non-HDCP display, there are HDCP filters on the market that make this possible. They're pricey (about $450), as they have to transcode the signal, but there's no visible quality loss. ...For the most part, these devices are only useful to people who want to connect an HDCP protected source to an older monitor... So the electronics industry is turning their back to the existence of these devices... For now.

The filter you're talking about is not available anymore because it's not allowed to exist, and its keys could be revoked anytime.

And HDCP doesn't stop you from doing just that... Even with HDCP, you can mass transmit and broadcast.

I don't think you can broadcast with HDCP, as there is a 3-phase authentication and key exchange involved.

 

[davepoint]

You must be new here. Welcome to MacRumors. We discuss rumors here - sometimes passionately. Do you get it now?

Merry Christmas to you too.

Sorry - it's just I've been waiting so long for them to properly update these bloody things that I don't want my hopes dashed again

 

[Digital Skunk]

Yebut

Yebut, how much can an aluminum housing really cost? Except for that, the Apple and Dell displays are basically the same. They use the same panels (from LG, last I heard). Except for small differences in inputs/outputs, what's the difference? Dell actually has a new 30" coming out very soon (if it's not out already) that beats Apple specs at a lower price. Sure, the plastic housing appears cheaper but for so-called "pro" use, it's a better display.

Perfectly understandable, but remember that it is also the designg of the case as well. I have seen the Dell displays and cable placement is horrible. Now imagine that times two or three. Now you have a crap load of cables and you have no clue where each one goes. Not only that, but their USB downstream is separate from their USB upstream and they are on either side of the monitor. The case is wider on the Dell than the Apple and Firewire is something that every professional uses.

Not that I am trying to prove anyone wrong or right... just saying that the Dells cater to a different market than the ACDs. I choose an ACD for the Firewire ports which I know I would need. I use all of the ports on the back of my monitor so paying the extra $300 was worth it to me. Not to mention that is looks nice on my desk next to my G5.

On the other side of the conversation though. My next monitor may be a Dell if they put Firewire in them and make the cords in the back look a lot better. That is unless Apple makes a monitor with Firewire 800 on the back or it.

 

[~Shard~]

Sorry - it's just I've been waiting so long for them to properly update these bloody things that I don't want my hopes dashed again

Yeah, I know where you're coming from. Such is the wonderful world of technology - hop on and enjoy the ride with the rest of us!

 

[Spanky Deluxe]

Perfectly understandable, but remember that it is also the designg of the case as well. I have seen the Dell displays and cable placement is horrible. Now imagine that times two or three. Now you have a crap load of cables and you have no clue where each one goes. Not only that, but their USB downstream is separate from their USB upstream and they are on either side of the monitor. The case is wider on the Dell than the Apple and Firewire is something that every professional uses.

Not that I am trying to prove anyone wrong or right... just saying that the Dells cater to a different market than the ACDs. I choose an ACD for the Firewire ports which I know I would need. I use all of the ports on the back of my monitor so paying the extra $300 was worth it to me. Not to mention that is looks nice on my desk next to my G5.

On the other side of the conversation though. My next monitor may be a Dell if they put Firewire in them and make the cords in the back look a lot better. That is unless Apple makes a monitor with Firewire 800 on the back or it.

Agreed. The Dell's sure are good value and I like their multiple video connections in the sub 30" range, however, I really like the aluminium and the high quality finish on the ACDs. I have to admit if I were in the market for a 23/24" screen I would be sorely tempted with the Dell although I hear the 23" ACD has a better panel. The price and analogue connections on the Dell would be lovely though. For me, when it came to buying I wanted a 30" screen. I'd been using a 30" screen before but it was an LCD TV with a quarter the resolution, I wanted more pixels and didn't want to lose screen size so I saved the pennies and skimped on the RAM and graphics card on my Mac Pro to get the extra money.
The advantages of the 30" Dell are that it is cheaper, has a three year warranty and well, that's it. Its disadvantages are that it has a plastic casing that doesn't match the look of the Mac Pro and I think it lacks firewire. In my case though, I was eligible to the Higher Education discount here in the UK off Apple stuff so the Apple screen was only a hundred bucks or so more expensive than the Dell. Its covered by the three year applecare of my Mac Pro too so in the end I was paying only a little extra for the aluminiumness and I absolutely love it.
Had I had to pay full price for the ACD, would I have still chosen it over the Dell?? Hell yes. Its only in the sub 30" range where I would have faltered.

Right now I don't really see how they can improve on the ACDs apart from incremental updates in the brightness and contrast. The resolutions used are at the forefront of current technology and are pushing the limits of DVI. Only HDMI 1.3 provides the extra bandwidth for higher resolutions and these are currently unavailable in mass quantities for the screen sizes involved.

 

[puuukeey]

DRM​

bah humbug. get everyone addicted to the standard then set the DRM token.

 

[JackAxe]

The Dell and Apple 30" LCD are the same, but when it comes to everything else, this is where the Dell gets "cheap" and skimps on components to meet a lower price point.

When the Apple and Dell were compared, the Apple scored way higher in color. You're paying for a SWOP certfied screen with a better color gamut, plus just all around higher quality components when you buy Apple's displays. Dell's screens are tailored more for the budget crowd that reads lots of text on a Window's PC.

I need to clear up something about contrast ratios, since Dell leaves there's at the factory setting, which is generally higher than Apple's displays, even when using the same panel. A higher contrast ratio, at least for desktop LCDs, blows out the lighter color values, where as if the CR is to low, the darker values get lost. This is why Apple originally released the 30" at 400:1, which is the version I've been using for 2 years now. This setting for years has been the sweet spot for color with LCDs, because it displays the widest color gamut.

A higher contrast is better for LCD TVs, or rooms that are overly bright, but for color work, or anything most of us Mac peeps do artwise, it has been an overkill with adverse effects.

I can't speak for some of these newer LCD techs on the marke though, like the LED, or even LCD lit LCDs from NEC. I'm not sure how they're effected by higher contrast ratios, which for screens like Plasmas as an example, is a good thing.

Amyway, I'm sure I'm not alone in wanting a higher rez screen. I'm hoping Leopard's resolution independent GUI, means Apple will be releasing a 200 PPI screen, this would be absolutely great for Painter. I've wanted a screen of this rez ever since IBM released one a few years back, but the price, color spotting and horridly slow response time kept me from making an investment. And 2 DVI cables, blah...

<]=)

 

[iDave]

...Amyway, I'm sure I'm not alone in wanting a higher rez screen. I'm hoping Leopard's resolution independent GUI, means Apple will be releasing a 200 PPI screen, this would be absolutely great for Painter...

Don't count on 200 ppi. It would cost a fortune. I'm hoping for displays at around 130 ppi without any price increase; hopefully a price drop, but I'm not counting on that either.

 

[Mac Fly (film)]

People with PPC laptops who don't have iSights may end up wanting a stand alone iSight, and if the stand-alone is abolished, Apple would pretty much slap pre-macbook people in the face.

Something I think people fail to see, is that a line must be drawn in the sand. If Apple thinks all-in-one is the way to go, then they must make sure they fully convince everyone they are right. When Apple killed the floppy drive from All their Mac's, most of the world thought they were crazy, in hindsight though.. they were not only not crazy, but they were right to do it, it was a good move. I suspect judging from past experiences with Apple killing things, they usually have insight that's hard to pinpoint in the present moment.

 

[longofest]

Update 2: Story Disputed, moved to page2

Update 2: Since our posting of this story, we have received a few claims that the story was purposely falsified. Our original sources were anonymous (as stated in the story) and therefore it is hard to verify the claims, however they do raise doubt as to the legitimacy of the original submissions.

 

[Mac Fly (film)]

Probably been mentioned earlier but does anyone think that with the rumour that they will have HDMI input it might mean these will be more 'living room' screen as opposed to desk screens. PCs and Macs don't really use HDMI in my experience, it tends to be AV components, games consoles etc.

With the launch of the iTV in January and Steve making quite a bit about the move into the living room this might make sense no?

I have no doubt that Apple is working on TV's, but I don't think we will see them at Macworld. Apple likes the all-in-one, so. I think they'll come out at Macworld 2008, they will have iTV inside, a small flash hard drive, and a DVD player built-in. It's inevitable IMO. Then or before then, we'll see the Apple TV service.

 

[AppliedVisual]

The filter you're talking about is not available anymore because it's not allowed to exist, and its keys could be revoked anytime.

That's funny, I know of three manufacturers off the top of my head who are making them. Or is this like all those Macrovision filters that "never existed"?

I don't think you can broadcast with HDCP, as there is a 3-phase authentication and key exchange involved.

...Well that all depends. HDCP is copy protection for an uncompressed, digital data stream. Such as what comes out of an HD satellite receiver for display on another device. HDCP propegates or continues down the device chain only as far as the first device to end HDCP propegation. You can't technically broadcast with HDCP -- or I suppose you could, if you could come up with a way to truly broadcast an uncompressed DVI signal. The bi-directional authentication supports multiple downstream pathways for splitters, switches, etc.. Theoretically, this would be unlimited... The next thing you'll probably tell me is that DVI/HDMI splitters with HDCP support don't exist either...